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[schuelma]

But strong hardware and streamlined engines come with their own advantages that can lessen the burden of development, decrease the need for meticulous engine tweaking, and actually speed up development work, thus saving time and money.

I'm sure you know more about this than I do, but this just strikes me as something people say at the start of every gen and it rarely actually happens.

 

[tkscz]

Game budgets are a weird thing. It's not simple a case of "better looking game = more expensive". Budget comes down to two things: production costs, and advertising.

Production costs can be influenced by numerous things that aren't necessarily tethered to hardware power. For example, I may wish to have a tremendous amount of recorded dialogue in my game, as well as cinematics to tell the story. Hiring script writers, voice actors, cinematic directors, cinematic animators, sound editors, recording equipment and more is costly and time consuming, and thus a lot of money can be eaten up by these kinds of things.

Most 'expensive' games are expensive because there's so much work put into making the games. They're 'big' games. Lots of features, lots of intricate directing and animation, lots of audio, lots of everything. It's less about how detailed individual assets are and more about how many of those assets need to be made.

The funny thing is that stronger hardware can, in theory, lead to cheaper development when certain parts of game designed become streamlined and easier to control. On dated hardware rigging up a complex and gorgeous looking environment for a cinematic might require collaboration between programmers and artists as they try and 'fake' how good the scene will look will maintaining optimisation. Lots of custom assets in lighting, shadows and lots of custom code specifically for making that particular scene look the way it does. On stronger hardware we might be able to render all of that in real time, allowing the artists to single handedly take the reigns as no programming, engine or custom asset hurdles are introduced.

Streamlining the development process aims to give developers more control and flexibility over their working environment. This is one aspect of Unreal Engine 4 Epic is really pushing. They want to give artists and designers the freedom to experiment and work on game code, testing it as they play and seeing accurate flowcharts of a game's functions, without having to compile the code and jump through hoops just to see if their level looks right, or that character animates correctly, or that encounter is balanced and fun to play.

Big budget blockbusters will still cost a stupid fortune, probably moreso next generation than now for the same reasons that Hollywood blockbusters are expensive. But strong hardware and streamlined engines come with their own advantages that can lessen the burden of development, decrease the need for meticulous engine tweaking, and actually speed up development work, thus saving time and money.



But again this is dependant on not what the Wii U is, but what position the Wii U has in the market. Those same smaller scale shock horror games can be made for the Xbox 720 and PlayStation 4, and if those consoles have a decent market penetration with a healthy software market. Same goes for PC. It doesn't need to be one or the other, blockbusters versus low budget. Platforms can sustain both quite comfortably.

If the Wii U can sustain a software environment for games with lower budgets then sure, we'll probably see a lot of games like that coming to the platform. But if they sell like arse, much like they often did on the Wii, developers wont give a shit as they can make their money easier elsewhere.

This only makes me miss the days when games were simple.

 

[schuelma]

If the Wii U can sustain a software environment for games with lower budgets then sure, we'll probably see a lot of games like that coming to the platform. But if they sell like arse, much like they often did on the Wii, developers wont give a shit as they can make their money easier elsewhere.

Here is the problem as I see it- those lower budgeted/lower marketed titles do not succeed on their own. You need the big tentpole titles to drive a userbase that creates a market for those types of titles. Id Wii U isn't getting big budget titles, lower tier stuff isn't going to sell.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

The increase of costs in game development are directly proportional to the increasing fidelity of assets.

Every textured model is a cost. The more detail, the higher the cost. The more asset variety, the higher the cost. More time needed.

Given the demands of tech oriented gamers I think it's way too simplistic to think that just because asset production isn't likely to change in the coming generation that people won't expect more.

I'd expect budgets to go up significantly. Not because the tech itself is some new unmanageable beast, but because you've gotta fill 4 gigs of RAM instead of 512MB.

 

[Hoodbury]

I'm sure you know more about this than I do, but this just strikes me as something people say at the start of every gen and it rarely actually happens.

Agree. I think the basic premise is that if you would make a game that would run on the 360, but make it using nextgen engines for a next gen console, it could be cheaper.

But the thing is, when devs get their hands on these new engines and tools and these new more powerful consoles, they want to add more and more bells and whistles which end up making the costs go up.

Things may get easier, they may get quicker, they may get more polished and bug free, but things rarely get cheaper.

 

[lwilliams3]

While I wouldn't take the Tekken producer's comments as "good news," it is true these comments shouldn't be blown out of proportion. He does say that the game is progressing and seems confident it will turn out well.

Still, that Tekken ran into a hiccup with the CPU does not bode well for more complex games. I wonder if it might be net code related.

Posters who mention that the future is in GPGPU have a fair point, but we must remember 2 things: a) We don't know how much better that feature will run on WiiU over a standard R700. It should hopefully be up to modern standards, but it's all speculation at this point. b) Next generation ports may very well not prove to be easier than ports from this generation, since Orbis/Durango will likely be using quad core CPUs (assuming Durango uses a full 4 for OS/apps, which who knows) with SMT, OoOE, and clocked higher. Games will be developed with those specs in mind, and porting those down to a tri-core with no SMT and low clocks will not prove easy.

According to blu, a nice amount of local GPU memory would have boosted the effectiveness of GPGPU functions for the original R700 design, so the eDRAM in the Wii U will help it on that regard. It is true that we don't really have any other info on the design changes that Nintendo and AMD from the R700 base, but it has been hinted by several insiders that it's "more modern."

For your second point, that will be depend on what their CPU cores are based on, as StevieP already elaborated on.

 

[EatChildren]

I'm sure you know more about this than I do, but this just strikes me as something people say at the start of every gen and it rarely actually happens.

The results are easier to see in the indy scene than the big budget scene. The latter is really just increasing project scope along with development streamlining. But the indy scene has access to development tools and engines unlike anything they've had before.

This is kinda what I was getting at when I said you don't need to spend big bucks to make a game look incredible any more. You won't get smaller budget games on the same scale with the same production scope as big ones, but they can still look jaw dropping due to the power of modern hardware and flexibility of modern engines.

Here is the problem as I see it- those lower budgeted/lower marketed titles do not succeed on their own. You need the big tentpole titles to drive a userbase that creates a market for those types of titles. Id Wii U isn't getting big budget titles, lower tier stuff isn't going to sell.

Agreed. This is why PC is a hot market for low budget indy titles, as it has always sustained a market for games across the entire spectrum of development budgets. Microsoft did a pretty good job of cultivating an appealing market (in terms of the consumer end) with LIVE Arcade, and Sony has done okay with PSN.

As we move into the future we're going to see a lot of smaller developers focusing on digital over retail. The networking services and storage space is here to support it, and it allows them to cut out the middleman. It doesn't necessitate success, but it's more attractive than having to suck up to a money gobbling publisher just to get your game printed. A publisher that will screw you over by the end as you see bugger all cut from your game sales.

I hope Nintendo cultivate an environment like this.

 

[Steph_E.]

I disagree, the Wii wasnt sold with multiple wiimotes, yet playing with the family and friends was promoted. I think every game shown can be played on the gamepad. But, the real fun comes with getting as many players involved. So I think this compels people to buy, if necessary, more wiimotes. Same goes for Rayman and Mario.

In other words, those that do not have extra wiimotes, have a reason to buy them.

The difference is that Wii Sports was completely playable with one player only, and multiplayer was only an option, not a neccesity. From what I have read on GAF, some elements of Nintendoland require more than one player - or do I have that wrong?

"those that do not have extra wiimotes, have a reason to buy them" - does this not go against Nintendo's stated objective of not requiring people to buy additional controllers?

 

[I Stalk Alone]

In any case it looks like the Grinder was switched from FPS to a top down action shooter.... more of an XBLA or PSN class of title.

That was only for the PS360 versions, the Wii version remained as an FPS.

Maybe the wii u version is both. Assymetrical gaming ftw. One person playing it topdown as the zombies and the other playing on the big screen in fps mode.

Did you perhaps think that their code for the game is optimized for a deep-pipelined, heavily parallel and/or tri-core console (those are your 2 HD choices this gen to port from) with high clocks?

A 476fp runs at 1.6ghz and eats somewhere around 1w per core. It is impressive for what it does, is OoO and short-pipelined and is better for some tasks than a deep-pipelined 3ghz PPE. It will also be worse at some tasks. It's simply "different"

From the spec sheet the 476fp can run at up to 2.0ghz but more than 1.2watts per core compared to running at 1.6ghz but at 2.71 DMIPS per mhz it is a pretty efficient processor. The gamecube and wii cpu is 2.31 DMIPS per mhz on a single core. Something based on this architecture is something nintendo would go for.

The ARM Cortex A15 for reference runs at 20,000DMIPS at 4 cores and at a speed of a miserly 2.0ghz, this chip incidentally beats the xbox 360 gpu at 3.2ghz. The cortex a15 has an efficiency comparable to the IBM 476FP. I am not saying that the wii u cpu will have a fourth core dedicated to the OS that is unusable by devs and not included in the devkit specs. However, a lower clocked cpu with OoOE might pose problems in the short term with ports that have larger pipeline but with some clever thinking the problems will be easily mitigated. With built from the groundup games the story will be completely different with increased in performance efficiency compared to last gen evident from day one.

We still don't know if the cpu for wii u will be even more efficient than the 476fp but that would be a good starting point in having a console that can be pretty capable and perform much better than current gen and still run at 60watts TDP.

If the tekken guy is saying the cpu is clocked slightly under xenon at say 2.916ghz. (4x Wii cpu)and has an architecture like the 476fp then that is definitely a very handy cpu if wii and gc cpu's are to go by.

 

[vctor182]

Not sure if this is the right place to tell this but anyways...
I'm invited to attend the Wii U Gaming Lounge that will be held this weekend at San Diego, right next to the Comic-Con. My time slot is for this Sunday 10th 10 am - 2 pm.
I can bring up to three guests, one will be my wife and the other two won't be able to go... so, I got 2 spaces free and don't want them to be wasted. Who's up for a Wii U sneak peek?

We just need to get there together to check in and once you're in you can do whatever you like XD

 

[Roo]

Here's what I don't get though, isn't the next xbox/PS4 supposedly much more powerful than the Wii U?

Spoiler

Apparently they won't be as powerful as people thought they would be...

Spoiler

...or Wii U won't be as weak as people thought it would be

pick one

 

[jacksrb]

For my thinking ZombiU, Rayman Legends, Assassins Creed 3 and Aliens Colonial Marines are key to the U getting continued third party support. They're the only four third party titles that aren't old ports as far as I remember. Good sales for those titles will show publishers that they can't get away with releasing half-arsed crap on the console like they did with the Wii.

I can definitely see ZombiU not only selling over 1m but also being a system seller, same goes for Lego City and Aliens Colonial Marines too.

Just wanted to add that the sales of BLOPS2 (assuming), Madden, and Darksiders II will all be watched closely too.

 

[MDX]

And the ports just keep on coming...!


Farming Simulator 2013 heading to Wii U


http://www.pockett.net/n13868_PS_Vi..._les_PlayStation_Vita_et_tablettes_Windows_RT

 

[I Stalk Alone]

Spoiler

Apparently they won't be as powerful as people thought they would be...

Spoiler

...or Wii U won't be as weak as people thought it would be

pick one

Generational leap.

PS2 - PS3 20x
XBOX - XBOX360 10x

Hd twins are comparable in power.

Next gen = 8x PS3/XBOX360

Small leap compared to ps2-ps3 gen

I guess next gen apparently won't be as powerful as people thought they would be.

 

[Meelow]

Generational leap.

PS2 - PS3 20x
XBOX - XBOX360 10x

Hd twins are comparable in power.

Next gen = 8x PS3/XBOX360

Small leap compared to ps2-ps3 gen

I guess next gen apparently won't be as powerful as people thought they would be.

Rumors are stating that the PS4/720 are 4-6x more powerful than the PS3/360, I think a lot of people that are hyping up the PS4/720's power will be disappointed.

 

[Nibel]

Farming Simulator 2013 heading to Wii U

 

[JordanN]

Wait, why are people going apeshit over the Tekken comment guy? He only said clock speed, not cpu in general.

One can look at the 3DS clockspeed and say it's weaker than psp at face value but the damn thing eats it alive at every turn. Why, because the ARM11 technology obliterates the old ass architecture in psp.

Mhz has never been a reliable measurement of power.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megahertz_myth

 

[Meelow]

Wait, why are people going apeshit over the Tekken comment guy? He only said clock speed, not cpu in general.

One can look at the 3DS clockspeed and say it's weaker than psp at face value but the damn thing eats it alive at every turn. Why, because the ARM11 technology obliterates the old ass architecture in psp.

Mhz has never been a reliable measurement of power.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megahertz_myth

People also forgot about the PS3 CPU, it was very hard to develop for until devs started to figure out how to use it.

 

[Krauser Kat]

games like Lollipop chainsaw will probably barely cost any more to produce next gen as this gen since they already produced most of the high res models.

AAA budget games, they will dump tons of more dough to use everything they can.

 

[MadeInBeats]

Wait, why are people going apeshit over the Tekken comment guy? He only said clock speed, not cpu in general.

One can look at the 3DS clockspeed and say it's weaker than psp at face value but the damn thing eats it alive at every turn. Why, because the ARM11 technology obliterates the old ass architecture in psp.

Mhz has never been a reliable measurement of power.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Megahertz_myth

It was more the fact that he felt the need to mention it as something as an issue, something that's taking some time, and something that required 'creative' problem solving. That's just taking the article at face value.

 

[ASIS]

Spoiler

Apparently they won't be as powerful as people thought they would be...

Spoiler

...or Wii U won't be as weak as people thought it would be

pick one

The latter option, obviously. And I do realize that the Wii U won't be left behind on the technical side but that doesn't change the fact that it IS weaker than the competition. Regardless EC made it perfectly clear about the situation at hand.

Rumors are stating that the PS4/720 are 4-6x more powerful than the PS3/360, I think a lot of people that are hyping up the PS4/720's power will be disappointed.

But there are just as many "reports" that state the PS4 will be about 8-10x the power of its predecessors. Who to believe?

You know, i love the next gen hype and everything, but things need to calm down a bit and learn some details already

 

[10k]

Errr... my Zelda stuff is locked in a large treasure chest. No lie, haha..

Lol. Does it play zelda treasure chest music when you open it with a key?

 

[Meelow]

The latter option, obviously. And I do realize that the Wii U won't be left behind on the technical side but that doesn't change the fact that it IS weaker than the competition. Regardless EC made it perfectly clear about the situation at hand.


But there are just as many "reports" that state the PS4 will be about 8-10x the power of its predecessors. Who to believe?

You know, i love the next gen hype and everything, but things need to calm down a bit and learn some details already

I'll believe what I think Sony will do, if Sony makes the PS4 a cutting edge powerful console (even 8-10x is not cutting edge) and they price it at $400+ it can be very risky, I feel Sony really needs to make the PS4 profitable by day 1 because I really don't want Sony to make a huge mistake that could lead to no PS5, I want Sony to go back to there PS1/PS2 days, when they didn't focus on power.

 

[Rösti]

And the ports just keep on coming...!


Farming Simulator 2013 heading to Wii U


http://www.pockett.net/n13868_PS_Vi..._les_PlayStation_Vita_et_tablettes_Windows_RT

Well, Landwirtschafts-Simulator 2012 3D/Farming Simulator 2012 3D was released for Nintendo 3DS earlier this year. It was published by astragon Software GmbH. So it's probably just natural for them to have this series on Wii U as well, it ought to work really well controlling the machines utilizing the Wii U GamePad.

I searched for media on this upcoming game, but I didn't find anything that looked official. But I assume Wii U should be able to run that game quite nicely, I don't expect the upcoming Farming Simulator to feature Unreal Engine 4-level graphics.

And there's a demo available for the 3DS game: http://www.farming-simulator.com/demo3DS.php

 

[Meelow]

Well, Landwirtschafts-Simulator 2012 3D/Farming Simulator 2012 3D was released for Nintendo 3DS earlier this year. It was published by astragon Software GmbH. So it's probably just natural for them to have this series on Wii U as well, it ought to work really well controlling the machines utilizing the Wii U GamePad.

I searched for media on this upcoming game, but I didn't find anything that looked official. But I assume Wii U should be able to run that game quite nicely, I don't expect the upcoming Farming Simulator to feature Unreal Engine 4-level graphics.

And there's a demo available for the 3DS game: http://www.farming-simulator.com/demo3DS.php

The graphics for the game (3DS version) is actually not that bad, It would be so funny if this was the game to show off the Wii U's true power lol.

 

[JordanN]

Also, I think we can safely put the POWER7 speculation to rest. It's almost certain now that it was pure PR speak in reference to the 45nm process, eDRAM, and maybe some minor logic. If it was anything like a true POWER7 core, even at a low clock, we would not be hearing about these issues.

Point to a single non anonymous source that would contradict the above.

IBM has gone on record many times they're using their own power7 technology to help fuel the Wii U. I'm not sure what they would have to gain from lying (if not setting themselves up for severe business penalties).

 

[Glorified G]

I'll believe what I think Sony will do, if Sony makes the PS4 a cutting edge powerful console (even 8-10x is not cutting edge) and they price it at $400+ it can be very risky, I feel Sony really needs to make the PS4 profitable by day 1 because I really don't want Sony to make a huge mistake that could lead to no PS5, I want Sony to go back to there PS1/PS2 days, when they didn't focus on power.

Except they did focus on power, and they did sell at a loss. Sony's philosophy with all three consoles were mostly the same. The key outlier between those consoles and the ps3 is that the ps1/ps2 media disc drive wasn't more expensive than their gpu & cpu combined when it launched.

 

[Meelow]

Except they did focus on power, and they did sell at a loss. Sony's philosophy with all three consoles were mostly the same. The key outlier between those consoles and the ps3 is that the ps1/ps2 media disc drive wasn't more expensive than their gpu & cpu combined when it launched.

Well, a lot of that this gen was "look at these graphics", I view with Sony from the PS1/PS2 was that they made sure they where focusing on getting exclusive games.

 

[Fourth Storm]

Point to a single non anonymous source that would contradict the above.

IBM has gone on record many times they're using their own power7 technology to help fuel the Wii U. I'm not sure what would they have to gain from lying.

The leaked spec sheet which was confirmed as legit by various sources lists the processor as PowerPC, for one. The Green Hills software is another indicator that it's not a a POWER7 core.

They didn't lie. They said officially that it was an all new chip that used the tech in Watson. That applies to the process node and eDRAM. Then, there was the IBM employee on Twitter who said WiiU uses POWER7, but being Twitter, that must be taken with a huge grain of salt.

There's also the lingering possibility that they've included a modified VSX unit from POWER7 on core 1 (the one with 2MB l2 cache). My current hypothesis is that core is the one Nintendo will encourage programmers to use for the graphics thread and that large cache will make up for the slower clock relative to Xenon.

 

[JordanN]

The leaked spec sheet which was confirmed as legit by various sources lists the processor as PowerPC, for one. The Green Hills software is another indicator that it's not a a POWER7 core.

They didn't lie. They said officially that it was an all new chip that used the tech in Watson. That applies to the process node and eDRAM. Then, there was the IBM employee on Twitter who said WiiU uses POWER7, but being Twitter, that must be taken with a huge grain of salt.

There's also the lingering possibility that they've included a modified VSX unit from POWER7 on core 1 (the one with 2MB l2 cache). My current hypothesis is that core is the one Nintendo will encourage programmers to use for the graphics thread and that large cache will make up for the slower clock relative to Xenon.

Then what's the complaint? It's still based on a POWER7 in one form or another. There is no "true" version of it.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

Rumors are stating that the PS4/720 are 4-6x more powerful than the PS3/360, I think a lot of people that are hyping up the PS4/720's power will be disappointed.

What rumors? The most recent rumors I remember reading say the opposite. Nintendo fans constantly try to downplay the PS4 and 720's power, for obvious reasons.

 

[schuelma]

What rumors? The most recent rumors I remember reading say the opposite. Nintendo fans constantly try to downplay the PS4 and 720's power, for obvious reasons.

And you seem to have a habit of only coming into this thread to downplay the Wii U's power or pick fights.

 

[lwilliams3]

Point to a single non anonymous source that would contradict the above.

IBM has gone on record many times they're using their own power7 technology to help fuel the Wii U. I'm not sure what they would have to gain from lying (if not setting themselves up for severe business penalties).

Phrases like "POWER7 technology" and "packs the same processor technology found in Watson" always opened up the possibility that Wii U's CPU just picked up a few specific characteristics from the POWER7 series, like the eDRAM. POWER7 is a server-level CPU, so it was suggested a long time ago from more tech-savvy posters like brain-stew that such a chip will not be in the Wii U.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

And you seem to have a habit of only coming into this thread to downplay the Wii U's power or pick fights.

Pointing out something that's not positive about the Wii U = picking fights, apparently. Anyway, I came in here after reading the Tekken guy quotes so it's not like it's baseless downplaying.

 

[Meelow]

What rumors? The most recent rumors I remember reading say the opposite. Nintendo fans constantly try to downplay the PS4 and 720's power, for obvious reasons.

The rumors that is stating the Xbox 720 is 6x more powerful than the Xbox 360.

 

[Plinko]

Pointing out something that's not positive about the Wii U = picking fights, apparently. Anyway, I came in here after reading the Tekken guy quotes so it's not like it's baseless downplaying.

I'm curious, though--do you agree that you only seem to come in here after somewhat negative comments are made?

That's where the "picking fights" analogy comes from. When there's a piece of good news you're not rushing in here to talk about it.

 

[I Stalk Alone]

Will the wii u be 40nm or 32nm or 28nm? What do people think?

32nm seems to be the smart choice as it will save a lot on heat and is a matured process. 28nm might not be more cost effective compared to the heat savings you will get.

Not completely related but if the Wii u cpu is clocked slightly under xenon like say 2.916Ghz (4x wii) and the durango has been reported as being clocked 20% higher than the wii u cpu (oban rumours) then that would be around 3.5Ghz. Tekken guy might not be happy with next gen if this is the case haha. I hope people arent expecting 6ghz cpus as a next gen leap.

 

[StevieP]

CPU: 45nm. IBM confirmed that in their press release.
GPU: 40nm or 32nm, depending on what Oban is.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

The rumors that is stating the Xbox 720 is 6x more powerful than the Xbox 360.

To quote Nintendo-4life on the last page:
"But there are just as many "reports" that state the PS4 will be about 8-10x the power of its predecessors. Who to believe?"

I'm curious, though--do you agree that you only seem to come in here after somewhat negative comments are made?

That's where the "picking fights" analogy comes from. When there's a piece of good news you're not rushing in here to talk about it.

Has there been any good news lately? The hardware and its potential is, to me, the most important aspect of any console, as well the aspect I like to discuss the most. There hasn't been much of any good news on that front.

 

[I Stalk Alone]

I'm curious, though--do you agree that you only seem to come in here after somewhat negative comments are made?

That's where the "picking fights" analogy comes from. When there's a piece of good news you're not rushing in here to talk about it.

If you want to be a master you should be able to spin and downplay while picking fights especially when good news is said about the platform.

 

[Barack Lesnar]

The only good news I can recall of late is the nubs on the u-pad being replaced with proper analog sticks that stick out, which was a pretty big deal I guess.

 

[I Stalk Alone]

CPU: 45nm. IBM confirmed that in their press release.
GPU: 40nm or 32nm, depending on what Oban is.

You know i always wondered about this. Could the cpu have received a die shrink without any cost increases? Also what would be the thermal differences with having a 45nm cpu and say a 32nm gpu on the same board compared to having both on 32nm. What about size differences? I guess it really comes to cost per watt and cost per thermal output .

 

[Thunder Monkey]

To quote Nintendo-4life on the last page:
"But there are just as many "reports" that state the PS4 will be about 8-10x the power of its predecessors. Who to believe?"

No one using useless multipliers I can say that much.

 

[chris3116]

Has there been any good news lately? The hardware and its potential is, to me, the most important aspect of any console, as well the aspect I like to discuss the most. There hasn't been much of any good news on that front.

As for me, the most important aspect about a console is the games not the hardware. Hardware means nothing to me and should mean nothing to any gamers in this world. If you want that bad to discuss about hardware, go make a PC gaming where the technology will always evolve.

 

[Djamb3]

I will never, ever, understand those multipliers.

 

[lostinblue]

Phrases like "POWER7 technology" and "packs the same processor technology found in Watson" always opened up the possibility that Wii U's CPU just picked up a few specific characteristics from the POWER7 series, like the eDRAM. POWER7 is a server-level CPU, so it was suggested a long time ago from more tech-savvy posters like brain-stew that such a chip will not be in the Wii U.

It's not a stretch to say it's based on it, it probably is, makes more sense than going the other way around and adding the stuff it has to an older design.

It's like saying Xenos and CELL PPE is based on POWER4 (did a typo a few pages back, yes, I always confuse the 970/G5 architecture with Power5, when it's Power4). They're, yes; but achieving the same performance in cpu tasks is a dream for them and not due to clockrate at that.

It's certainly not the same CPU here. First off, there's no such thing as a 3 core Power7, and I doubt Nintendo is going with a 3 core configuration in order to have better yields (ie: having one core disabled).

It's probably lower clocked; worst case scenario 1.6/1.8 GHz. I'm betting probably more since these chips are officially clocked 3 GHz and up; these are not low voltage chips, or designed for scalar power consumption; and thus there's a curve of how low you can go and still reduce consumption). And they'll lack smt threads per core.

Going further than that with this CPU architecture (as in: messing with the actual innards to make them simpler) would be destroying it's performance advantages.

 

[Glorified G]

As for me, the most important aspect about a console is the games not the hardware. Hardware means nothing to me and should mean nothing to any gamers in this world. If you want that bad to discuss about hardware, go make a PC gaming where the technology will always evolve.

I wonder what your response be if one of the big 3 decided to go with n64 quality hardware at $399 each.

"Hardware means nothing! Go build a PC if you care about tech!"

 

[jerd]

I will never, ever, understand those multipliers.

What's not to understand?

720= 6x 360

Wii U= 2x PS360

My refrigerator= 3x My microwave, but only when the ice maker is turned off. That hurts performance.

It's human nature to want to quantify things, even when it is impossible to do so. Unfortunately, multipliers seem to be all people care about. Silly.

 

[DynamicG]

As for me, the most important aspect about a console is the games not the hardware. Hardware means nothing to me and should mean nothing to any gamers in this world. If you want that bad to discuss about hardware, go make a PC gaming where the technology will always evolve.

He'd be exposed as a troll if we were only talking about games, or he wouldn't even come in here. When discussing things like hypothetical CPU power, he can just drop a "Well that settles that. Just lol @ this. Pathetic. Slower CPU than hardware that released 7 years ago" and watch it all burn around him.

I kind of appreciate that he confessed to heading straight over here when he heard that news though. At least Heavy is honest about being that uncle that enjoys making vague news sound as negative as possible.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

I wonder what your response be if one of the big 3 decided to go with n64 quality hardware at $399 each.

"Hardware means nothing! Go build a PC if you care about tech!"

If it had awesome games I wanted I'd buy it. It's not $399 but I bought a DS at $149.

I have limited expectations of the hardware. If it can realize a vision and make a fun game it's powerful enough for that experience.

Some games need more power. For those experiences there's hardware out for that. And I'll buy them.

But hardware cannot make a game great. It can make a great game better, but the core game has to be sound. Otherwise polishing a turd.