Wii U Speculation Thread 2: Can't take anymore of this!!!
- Thread starter ClovingWestbrook
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jump_button
Banned
Just think of MMO
they will never have to stop
ps yeah that dont stop some hard core's I know
they will never have to stop
ps yeah that dont stop some hard core's I know
-Pyromaniac-
Member
that game was amazing.
bgassassin
Member
No.
$249 is not going to happen with the components going in the consoles. No need to even consider it as an option.
And I say $299 sold at a bigger loss because after the 3DS fiasco and the fact that the 360 and PS3(and perhaps the original Wii when regarding the non gamers) will satiate the majority of console gamers till the Sony and MS successors come out I think Nintendo knows that it is time to take some big risks.
$299 is an attractive price for new tech and if I was Nintendo I would look at it from the Long term perspective. Cheap hardware, which will increase the user base, and Nintendo can make their money back from Software and likely a number of accessories. And then drop the price again when the new systems come out around a year later.
But more than likely I am way off and it will actually be sold for $399 for profit because Nintendo is still stupid.
Selling at a bigger loss is asinine from a business perspective and one of the main problems with the console market now. Like I said the 3DS situation will more than likely keep it from selling at $400. Those satisfied with 360 and PS3 are essentially irrelevant because they will wait for PS4 and Xbox3 before reacting to what Nintendo might do. So there's no need to take "big risks" for no legitimate reason.
Just because $299 is attractive (and I agree with that), doesn't make it feasible either.
ReyVGM
Member
My reply was to this:
"Also, that Gamecube looks fantastic in that picture. Like a real powerful device. "
Not about the games. Learn to read please.
No, the press release by IBM clearly stated that the Wii U's CPU would be produced on 45nm for its launch in 2012. Why would they even say anything about production processes of pre release units?
What's stopping Nintendo from using 32nm is 32nm not being ready at the guys and girls who are making it.
Also: $299 at a loss. Believe.
Why not?
When the slim/remodelled versions of consoles get released, do developers have to udpate their dev kits?
pieatorium
Member
Yeah I think 299 is the lowest possible to see as a launch price for any of the next consoles and if anyone does hit that price point it might be Sony.
WiiU has the tablet controller pushing it's production costs a little higher than what a barebones console would be, as well as most likely a pack in game for the controller to show it off and "value add" to the box.
NextBox 720 Fusion will have a kinect in there and kinect sports or something from the get go upping the cost in the same way the tablet does for the WiiU.
PS4? gonna be a console, Move or whatever new funkyness they have in store will be sold seperately and they have recent history of selling at cost/loss with both PS3 and Vita.
Just my thoughts.
WiiU has the tablet controller pushing it's production costs a little higher than what a barebones console would be, as well as most likely a pack in game for the controller to show it off and "value add" to the box.
NextBox 720 Fusion will have a kinect in there and kinect sports or something from the get go upping the cost in the same way the tablet does for the WiiU.
PS4? gonna be a console, Move or whatever new funkyness they have in store will be sold seperately and they have recent history of selling at cost/loss with both PS3 and Vita.
Just my thoughts.
The first batch of production (if they are Nextbox CPUs) would be for devkits, hence being produced well before the console is released. They'd also use it as a test run to work out any kinks in the manufacturing process before moving on to full scale production.
I just can't see 28nm happening for the GPU. The risk of production problems wouldn't be worth the potential benefit. It'll probably be 40nm or 32nm, hopefully the latter.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
I don't think they will include the wiimote. That was a wii thing that will remain an optional accessory for their WiiU generation. Don't think they'll push so hard as to bundle it. The UPad is their new direction.
bgassassin
Member
That doesn't sound anything like you originally said. You made it sound like the CPU in the final dev kits (e.g. the ones that came out) would be at 45nm, and the console to be released later on would be 32nm. That's not the same as what you just said in this post.
On top of the controller and pack-in just looking at CPU, GPU, and memory, Nintendo can easily go over $200 just for those three alone.
Count me in the 349$/ train.
The Wii started at 250$ and back then, most of the people though it was too expensive (and have bet on 199$). But there was Wii Sports with it.
Since then, Nintendo hardwares always came with a strong offer regarding free software. Wii Sports, Wii channels, Mii Plaza and other Mii tools, AR games, Excite Bike... Even if 349$ seems overpriced for a Nintendo hardware, especially after the 3DS history, what will be in the box will be worth taking into consideration.
Drawing app, video conference, Internet and TV apps on the Upad à la Apple/Google TV or whatever connected TV, even New Super Mario Bros Mii can be a candidate for the first packaging.
Oh, one other thing: Don't expect precise release date and price at E3. We didn't get that for the Wii and the 3DS at E3s. 5 month prior to launch is too much time. Usually, we discover the price with some online retailers spoilers, a couple month before launch.
Same for the official release date PR. Anyway for you Americans you already know it will be somewhere in November, before Thanksgivings. There will be no surprise.
The Wii started at 250$ and back then, most of the people though it was too expensive (and have bet on 199$). But there was Wii Sports with it.
Since then, Nintendo hardwares always came with a strong offer regarding free software. Wii Sports, Wii channels, Mii Plaza and other Mii tools, AR games, Excite Bike... Even if 349$ seems overpriced for a Nintendo hardware, especially after the 3DS history, what will be in the box will be worth taking into consideration.
Drawing app, video conference, Internet and TV apps on the Upad à la Apple/Google TV or whatever connected TV, even New Super Mario Bros Mii can be a candidate for the first packaging.
Oh, one other thing: Don't expect precise release date and price at E3. We didn't get that for the Wii and the 3DS at E3s. 5 month prior to launch is too much time. Usually, we discover the price with some online retailers spoilers, a couple month before launch.
Same for the official release date PR. Anyway for you Americans you already know it will be somewhere in November, before Thanksgivings. There will be no surprise.
Nah... I don't know about the CPU, but the GPU is looking to be of very modest size and the RAM isn't of very large capacity, even for GDDR5 if that's it. The entire motherboard shouldn't add up to much more than $150.
bgassassin
Member
I think you're underestimating the costs of these components. You're talking Wii-level with that amount.
$80 for the CPU and GPU after customizations (you're forgetting eDRAM), and $40 for memory already puts that at $200. And I think I'm kind of being modest with that.
Would be pretty nice, but I don't see them including the Wiimote at $300, sadly.
I think you're right on the pack-in, though. My expectation has been that we're going to see a low-key collection of mini games with a focus on asymmetric multiplayer. It would be a sensible move from Nintendo. One of the great successes of the Wii Sports pack-in strategy for Nintendo was the "viral" effect. For at least a year after launch, whenever you went to a party in a house/apartment/dorm which had a Wii in it, the Wii would unquestionably come out for a few games of Wii Sports. Nintendo basically had their customers advertising the system to their friends at every opportunity. They aren't going to be able to replicate the success of Wii Sports on the Wii U, but they might be able to replicate some of the "viral" factor it had. Any bundled collection of mini-games will inevitably be casual-friendly, but they don't seem to be aiming for a firmly casual user base right out of the gate like they did with the Wii, so they won't push any pack-ins as a big selling point, just as a bit of added value.
I know this sounds a bit strange when talking about a game which is basically hide and seek, but I actually think that Chase Mii really could be a sleeper hit. It has just the right things going for it:
- It's a pack-in (hopefully)
- It's a new experience (almost nobody played Pac-Man Vs)
- It's immediately accessible
- It requires friends to play with
- It involves lots of shouting
The last one might sound a bit strange, but to be honest I think it's the most important one. If you're playing as the toads, you're only going to be successful if you communicate with each other (the fact that the map was divided into coloured quadrants was to facilitate this, e.g. "He's going into blue"). With even the slightest hint of competitiveness (or alcohol), people are going to get pretty loud pretty quickly. Why is this important? Because vocalisations get people emotionally involved in the game, which results in more vocalisations, and more emotion, etc. and you get a virtuous cycle which draws everyone in.
Throw in some more maps (varying in size, complexity and time limit), and you've got a great party game which could get people selling the system to each other a lot like Wii Sports did.
Of course, there is the issue of how many controllers it requires, but if Nintendo do bundle a Wiimote, and people have two more lying around from their Wii then you've got a very good setup for it. We'll also have to see what Nintendo does to get it working well with just two players.
I think, since Nintendo has already shown at least two of their own games using Wiimotes, that they'll pack one in for good measure. Despite the Wii being backwards compatible, they never actually showed anybody playing a game with a GC controller, because obviously there were no games made with the GC controller as anything more than an option. But it's different for the Wii U, and also necessary to demonstrate asymmetrical gameplay like Chase/Find Mii.
Thunder Monkey
Banned
I'd be shocked if Nintendo went over $299.
I'd also be shocked if it doesn't have a Wiimote and chuk in the box as well.
I'd also be shocked if it doesn't have a Wiimote and chuk in the box as well.
I'll modify my expectations upwards to $350 far more readily than I'll doubt the inclusion of the remote. I see it as the only viable method of ensuring that the input continues to see some level of mainstream support. They can't rely on extant remotes because too many of them don't support M+, and they can't rely on optional accessory sales for all of the usual reasons.
Thraktor said:
Yes, that's almost exactly what I had in mind. I really don't know what they can do for a Wii Sports analogue, but it would be nice to have something along those lines. Nintendo's average launch selection has usually been two titles on launch day; U could do worse than to launch with "Wii Arcade Sports" and "NSMB U&Mii", with something mid-budget yet exciting for the enthusiast/upmarket consumer following shortly thereafter. Not necessarily F-Zero exactly, but something that fills a similar role.
Interesting that you mention it could be a "sleeper hit" but then want it to be some killer app associated with the hardware. Wii Sports was not a sleeper hit, it was a cultural phenomenon. Find Mii / Battle Mii are best suited as games in some type of party package that Nintendo can market as such. The last thing they want to do with a $300 dollar machine is tighly brand it with a hide and seek game. Especially a machine they want to attract enthusiasts equally (or more so) than the casual players.
Nintendo is not introducing a new dimension of play here (motion gaming), but they are introducing a much evolved control mechanism fusing interesting features together (touch / tablet screen and standard control). Their best course of action would be to begin the system with a balanced first and third party line up.
Additionally have demos and videos of these products loaded (and downloadable) on the system. And package in some interesting applications and casual tablet games (checkers, drawing, chess, solitaire). That is a winner.
Considering the size of Wii Play on disc, you definitely have a point that the software pack-in could certainly come in the form of preloaded software and free downloads. Pre-loaded stuff so that everybody gets something to play out of the box, and free downloads to motivate people to get the console online.
I really do think that the Wii Sports series has at least one big seller left in it, even though it definitely shouldn't be expected to do much to move consoles on its own.
I really do think that the Wii Sports series has at least one big seller left in it, even though it definitely shouldn't be expected to do much to move consoles on its own.
Error. Does not compute.
snowdog1971
Banned
Try buying the Official Lens Cleaner mate. Should solve your problem with DL discs. ;o)
Forsaken82
Member
I don't consider it to be not a legitimate reason. And again, Taking a loss in the beginning isn't necessarily a bad thing in the long term, and the long term could be significant depending on when the new systems actually do finally release. Risk is important, especially in such a competitive industry.
But yes I do agree, that perhaps it isn't necessarily the best business decision upon first thought. But like i said, it is entirely possible to recover the loss, especially given the potential long term benefits from next gen software and accessories sales. And besides, this is all conjecture anyways. No one knows how much this system will cost to sell or manufacture anyways. For all we know, they could sell it for $399 and still be selling at a loss.
I probably should have been clearer. The reason I called it a sleeper hit is because I don't expect Nintendo to advertise the game in any meaningful way. As I said, Nintendo wants to branch out to a wider audience this gen, so they're not going to launch the console with a big focus on a casual pack-in like Wii Sports. But that doesn't stop them including a few mini-games like Chase Mii, whether pre-installed or on a disc, as a bonus without giving them prominent placement on the box or anything like that. The 3DS included a few mini-games to show off the system's features without making a big deal about them, and I'd expect Nintendo to do the same with the Wii U.
AceBandage
Banned
Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing are both getting DLC...
Wii U...
AceBandage
Banned
SO you think they'll only do DLC on the 3DS?
There's good DLC and bad DLC. Nintendo has done good DLC with Animal Crossing, so we can hope they work from there.
But what makes you think Chase Mii would be an effective thing? From what Nintendo showed us. Which of these do you think will be more effective.
Scenario 1:
The Wii U comes installed with popular board games like Chess, Othello, Checkers, Solitaire. You can play these games on your high definition television, or play them on your tablet while watching television. You can turn the tablet into a virtual chess board and play against your significant other. Or perhaps you play poker/checkers/ etc online while watching the giants game.
Scenario 2:
Chase Mii or Battle Mii are shovelwared into the system like "AR Games" and Face Raiders were on the Nintendo 3DS.
Now. Both scenarios. Which do you think will have more overall appeal? Which will become an everyday thing? Which might actually be the smartest blue ocean strategy ever for Nintendo?
*sobs* I'm not alone.
AceBandage
Banned
Because we've weeded out most of the people that don't know anything about how tech works over the past year.
brochiller
Member
In their defense, the original Cafe threads were riddled with posts speculating that the next Nintendo console's online service would be powered by Steam. The wild speculation will slowly fade away in time.
-Pyromaniac-
Member
AceBandage
Banned
It'll support both Origin and Steam, but it won't be powered by either.
Nintendo will never give up that kind of power on their system.
Nintendo will never give up that kind of power on their system.
brochiller
Member
As long as Nintendo can deliver an integrated friends list and voice chat, I'm game.
AceBandage
Banned
I don't see why they can't...
The 3DS has an integrated friends list.
Voice chat is up to the developers, though (was shown for Ghost Recon on the Wii U, however).
Fourth Storm
Member
I'm still holding to $299. And who knows, Reggie is probably combing these boards smiling and nodding to himself w/ everyone mentioning $350 as an acceptable price tag, so knock it off! haha Maybe for some systems it is, but this is a Nintendo console. As in, even if they are trying to widen their userbase to appeal more to core gamers, kids and casuals are still number one on their radar.
They'll release it at $299 without a pack-in or Wii Remote/nunchuck. Waste of money to include considering how many are already in people's homes. $299 will net you only the console and controller with hopefully some demos available on the eShop from day one. And they'll launch w/ Mario Mii and Wii U Sports as retail titles, which guarantee them enough profit to make up for the loss on hardware. Don't expect an HDMI cable either...
They'll release it at $299 without a pack-in or Wii Remote/nunchuck. Waste of money to include considering how many are already in people's homes. $299 will net you only the console and controller with hopefully some demos available on the eShop from day one. And they'll launch w/ Mario Mii and Wii U Sports as retail titles, which guarantee them enough profit to make up for the loss on hardware. Don't expect an HDMI cable either...
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