Wii U Speculation Thread of Brains Beware: Wii U Re-Unveiling At E3 2012
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DaSorcerer7
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Truth101 said:
I'm not so bad.. :-(
First of all, Gabe Newell is someone I'd call a PR guy, and besides that he was probably comparing it to the Wii. (And don't get on me with that "seems to be" crap. That could simply mean that he doesn't have a dev kit and is guessing.)guek said:
Second, the only thing I can say from those quotes is that it's more powerful, which isn't what I'm curious about. I really want to know how much more powerful. It's nice to see that Peter Moore quote, though.
@you guys above:
Smiles and Cries
Member
Nintendo love or hate is always very vocal, let the juniors vent... It is a fact that Nintendo gives everyone some good reason to question things - freaking Shadow Ninja Company Limited.
Smiles and Cries
Member
BurntPork said:
Answer: Just powerful enough to be considered for a few downgraded ports and to be left behind by the PS4 and NextBox in 2014. Happy?
DaSorcerer7
Member
At this point we've heard plenty from various publishers and developers about Wii U. Whether at Nintendo's own press conference or in the days and weeks after E3 2011 ended, we've heard almost-universal praise and support from everyone from Irrational Games' Ken Levine to EA's John Riccitiello to Valve's Gabe Newell. Today we're hearing from a Capcom producer and designer.
Masachika Kawata is working on not one, not two but three Resident Evil titles for Capcom, overseeing the development of Mercenaries 3D and Revelations for the Nintendo 3DS as well as Raccoon City for the PS3, Xbox 360 and PC.
"... For me personally, I'd love to [develop a Resident Evil title for Wii U]. It's a very, very interesting piece of hardware," Kawata told CVG in an interview. "Whenever I see new game machines and their new possibilities get into my head, the ideas just start flowing. I'd absolutely love to make a Resident Evil on it. I really love the idea of being able to play the game even if my wife or my kids come and steal the TV. That's great, brilliant."
In the same interview, Raccoon City designer Kenji Matsuura echoed Kawata-san's comments. "As a game designer, when I see Wii U, my first thoughts are: 'Oh wow, I could do this or that, or what would happen if I try to make a game like X,Y or Z.' My motivation instantly goes through the roof and I want to try a lot of interesting new things. Nothing's been decided specifically for Resident Evil but it certainly would be interesting."
Support in the development community continues to grow. Will that translate into actual titles? Quality titles? Titles made by AAA teams? We likely won't know that for quite some time.
http://uk.wii.ign.com/articles/117/1179237p1.html
Masachika Kawata is working on not one, not two but three Resident Evil titles for Capcom, overseeing the development of Mercenaries 3D and Revelations for the Nintendo 3DS as well as Raccoon City for the PS3, Xbox 360 and PC.
"... For me personally, I'd love to [develop a Resident Evil title for Wii U]. It's a very, very interesting piece of hardware," Kawata told CVG in an interview. "Whenever I see new game machines and their new possibilities get into my head, the ideas just start flowing. I'd absolutely love to make a Resident Evil on it. I really love the idea of being able to play the game even if my wife or my kids come and steal the TV. That's great, brilliant."
In the same interview, Raccoon City designer Kenji Matsuura echoed Kawata-san's comments. "As a game designer, when I see Wii U, my first thoughts are: 'Oh wow, I could do this or that, or what would happen if I try to make a game like X,Y or Z.' My motivation instantly goes through the roof and I want to try a lot of interesting new things. Nothing's been decided specifically for Resident Evil but it certainly would be interesting."
Support in the development community continues to grow. Will that translate into actual titles? Quality titles? Titles made by AAA teams? We likely won't know that for quite some time.
http://uk.wii.ign.com/articles/117/1179237p1.html
walking fiend
Member
tech demos (Zelda and Japanese Garden) looked way better than best games on current gen. Do we need vague feedbacks after seeing those?
The amount of ligh sources, reflective surfaces and shadow quality is far better than anything I have seen on current gen consoles AND PC.
Take this Gustav guy, didn't he said that everything beautiful Nintendo showed were "RENDERED". It seems that he doesn't know what Zelda actually is anyway, or I missed Nintendo showing an RPG:
The amount of ligh sources, reflective surfaces and shadow quality is far better than anything I have seen on current gen consoles AND PC.
Take this Gustav guy, didn't he said that everything beautiful Nintendo showed were "RENDERED". It seems that he doesn't know what Zelda actually is anyway, or I missed Nintendo showing an RPG:
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
walking fiend said:tech demos (Zelda and Japanese Garden) looked way better than best games on current gen. Do we need vague feedbacks after seeing those?
The amount of ligh sources, reflective surfaces and shadow quality is far better than anything I have seen on current gen consoles AND PC.
Take this Gustav guy, didn't he said that everything beautiful Nintendo showed were "RENDERED". It seems that he doesn't know what Zelda actually is anyway, or I missed Nintendo showing an RPG:
Was it really? I mean seriously.
DaSorcerer7 said:
The positive statements are nice but not indicative of much in my opinion. I truly hope Nintendo has found the right balance with measured power and innovation with the wii u. Every statement from developers so far seem to fit in line with a console similar to the gamecube in my mind. Something that is powerful but in a measured fashion with an intelligent design that isn't intended to overwhelm or blow the doors off the place like the PS3. Of course we can assume its easier to develop for than the gamecube, which I remember people saying was quite an unusual machine.
If Nintendo is right that the majority of developers aren't interested in continuing the current gen trend of ballooning budgets and are more interested in leveraging to control inputs and UI's the wii u could actually become the happy medium for next gen development. Somehow this seems a little unlikely to me though.
walking fiend
Member
even if we try to avoid arguing over how beatiful the tech demos were, which will get quite subjective, as I said, from a quantitative point of view which is objective, I haven't seen a single game with that amount of lighting complexity, in ANY game. Correct me if I am wrong. And the screen shot I took, couldn't show particle effects (or whatever they are called technically)
This is a direct feed screen shot from LoS (which I believe is famed for beatiful lighting) for comparison:
Oppo
Member
(^^^ that's not a great example, I'd go more with a God of War 3 cave scene, with his blades lighting up the darkness)
You can't infer much from the lighting in the spider scene, as it's a one room environment, and a bespoke demo at that. You dont really know what's pre-baked, etc.
It was very nice artistically but there was nothing about that video that made me think it was a massive leap over what we have.
You can't infer much from the lighting in the spider scene, as it's a one room environment, and a bespoke demo at that. You dont really know what's pre-baked, etc.
It was very nice artistically but there was nothing about that video that made me think it was a massive leap over what we have.
PortTwo said:
Ya know in this thread and the many prior 100+ page wii u threads people have been tripping over themselves trying to define "massive", "significant", "dramatically" and how these terms apply to the wii u's graphical leap over the ps3 and 360. Here's what is all but confirmed, according to dev statements and blind sources, the wii u will be the most powerful console on the market when it is released, more powerful than the ps3 and 360 though we don't know by how much. Some say "BY FAR", some say "its different", others say they can't be sure because "the hardware isn't finalized". Getting picky over adjectives isn't gonna further anyone's case of better understanding the graphical power of the wii u anymore than pooring over blurry screenshots and off screen vids of tech demos will.
walking fiend
Member
it wasn't a "room" really (more like a church), but again, I haven't seen this kind of lighting in ANY game ANY kind of scene, as I said.
Of course it was a tech demo, but first we have seen Zelda tech Demoes before, and it is even without considering that it was first Nintendo HD experience. I believe Japanese Garden was arguably more impressive than Zelda.
(Although if I am not wrong, Spaceworld demo was 60fps while TP 30fps)
btw, is it ok to directly link images from sources like gamespot, i am still in my first hour of activity here 
Oppo
Member
artwalknoon said:
....ok? I'm not quite sure what your point is. You seem annoyed that people aren't suitably impressed?
I meant "room" as in interior environment, vs world environment with a moving sun, clouds etc.walking fiend said:
Not sure what to tell you, my reaction was "oh good, it looks like they'll catch up." I'm not going to quibble with your opinion, but I really can't see what's so special. Don't worry, if it's so powerful then surely in a year's time I will be opening my wallet.
Risk Breaker
Member
guek said:
You're seriously comparing the Epic demo with the Japanese Garden one? Okay.
There's so much bullshit going on from both sides of this "argument" it's ridiculous.
No, what has been shown so far doesn't look better than "everything on current consoles AND PC". Not even close.
No, what we have seen also doesn't indicate that the Wii U is slower or only very slightly faster than PS360. That seems quite unlikely. Though from all the comments and leaks it also seems unlikely that it will be as large a step above the current HD consoles as has been historically expected from a new console generation.
No, what has been shown so far doesn't look better than "everything on current consoles AND PC". Not even close.
No, what we have seen also doesn't indicate that the Wii U is slower or only very slightly faster than PS360. That seems quite unlikely. Though from all the comments and leaks it also seems unlikely that it will be as large a step above the current HD consoles as has been historically expected from a new console generation.
Haint
Member
walking fiend said:
I'm going to go out on a limb and say you have little to no actual experience with PCS360's "Best". Even ignoring the fact these were tech demos and we have no idea what may or may not have been pre-baked--by no stretch of the imagination did these demos even come close to surpassing what we've already seen in actual end products. The geometry/texture resolution and aliasing alone placed them multiple generations behind modern PC titles from a power perspective. Based solely on the E3 builds (I have no idea what final hardware will look like) you're just being ridiculous with these kind of claims.
you know the differences between tech demo and ingame yeah?walking fiend said:tech demos (Zelda and Japanese Garden) looked way better than best games on current gen. Do we need vague feedbacks after seeing those?
The amount of ligh sources, reflective surfaces and shadow quality is far better than anything I have seen on current gen consoles AND PC.
Take this Gustav guy, didn't he said that everything beautiful Nintendo showed were "RENDERED". It seems that he doesn't know what Zelda actually is anyway, or I missed Nintendo showing an RPG:
also that tech demo (the Zelda one) was nothing stunning from a technical standpoint
oh and look to the upgrade of Crysis 2 released today... counting that's ingame destroy pretty much the tech demos of the WiiU
anyway i think the console will have the 4850/4830-like raw power and the OGL 4.1 support with 1/1.5GBs GDDR5
the ideal for me (always in the optical way of the cheap/non cutting edge console) will be a 5770-like with maybe 2GBs
walking fiend
Member
I am, well was, a PC gamer until 2006 and transition from SD to HD never really happened to me in a way that I could feel it, and very few games has made me say "wow" because they were technically superior. Doom 3 was on of the few when. And I don't expect people saying wow after seeing Samaritan Demo, and again, I think most didn't say wow even when they saw Samaritan for the first time.
What is important, is that we adjust our reactions to our expectations. Seeing Zelda demo on next XBOX or PS wouldn't mean anything, the fact that is much more from what some expected from Nintendo after wii is what matters.
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As I said, I haven't seen something like that going in closed environments either. I believe they chose the cathedral because lighting shows itself much more in closed environments - reflective surfaces - compex and regular geometires as in gothic arcitechtures, you can't get much shadows and contrast in outdoor scenes (unless you want to put the characted under trees). Doom3 is exactly the same, they needed close environments to show the superior lighting.
anyway, another shot, look at the water and light reflection on the stone (btw, water effect is quite impressive in motion too)
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As i said, I haven't seen any game with that much lighting going on, I don't want to argue, cause I have NOT SEEN one. If I see one, of course I will change my mind. Either an screenshot or video will do it.
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did you bother comparing two zelda screenshots I posted?
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-resolution/aliasing/fps is something which can be, and is mostly, achieved soley through more brute power. I am not a troll trying to say that they could match PC in these terms. Neither cost nor power consumption will allow Wii U to peform on a similar level as a very high end or even a high end PC. let's say they are better than any game at 720P and no a-aliasing and 30fps.
- multiple generation? If I remember correctly, high end systems struggled to run Crysis on highest setting when it came out.
- texture/geometry is pretty impressive in Japane Garden demo. Geomtery/lighting is pretty impressive in Zelda demo by any standard as well, Zeda model is pretty much as good as a CG.
The petals are actual petals with geomteries going on.
Risk Breaker
Member
Light reflecting on wet stone, OMG!
Light reflecting on drops on face, OMG! (not sure if this one is from the actual game though but I believe it is from playing the demo)
And yes, I've seen the effect in motion. Nothing out of this generation.
PS: Even this from PDZ, lol.
Oppo
Member
walking fiend, have a look at the beginning of Castlevania: LoS
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xt_gubqJkdc
(720p for best)
I'd say that's comparable. If you think the bird demo blows that away, then I can leave it at a difference of opinion.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xt_gubqJkdc
(720p for best)
I'd say that's comparable. If you think the bird demo blows that away, then I can leave it at a difference of opinion.
Risk Breaker
Member
PortTwo said:
Yeah, perfect example. I was looking for a picture version of that.
lol seriously?walking fiend said:
from a geometrical standpoint the tech demo model of link destroy few times the TP one
and wait... i know your next question... why the tech demo's link looks so fucking ugly? because the 3d modeler at the time weren't so good, the same thing is why the models of SM64DS looks better than the N64 version
herzogzwei1989
Banned
Hopefully Wii U will be powerful enough to handle a port of the unreleased prototype Hi-Ten Bomberman, the first HD videogame: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KVoPogwVts
Lupin the Third
Member
Risk Breaker said:
Yeah, this is absolutely not at all what he said or did.
The global illumination effects in the nature demo were what impressed me. I don't remember seeing a whole lot of that kind of stuff on 360/PS3, especially not in demos from a year before they came out. Actually, I don't remember any demos from MS/Sony this long before launch. Let alone on under clocked hardware. I do remember the bullshots and CGI, though.
walking fiend
Member
Honestly, at first I was going to agree with him, but:
(it's the only bright enough scene I could find)
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And reflection in Tech Garden ston I mentioned is a combination of reflection from the actual surface of the water and the stone together, here is a different shot showing how some parts of the stone contributed to the over all reflection, it is mostly obvious in the video or in a gif (which I don't know how to make)
Oppo
Member
walking fiend said:Honestly, at first I was going to agree with him, but:
(it's the only bright enough scene I could find)
You took a shot while the lightning was going off, that's why it looks that way. Plus, I mean it's a user-submitted YouTube. It's compressed to hell. But it's what I could find quickly.
Could just as easily be a straight up projection map.
Look I don't think you're being disingenuous, I really don't. But this stuff, this early stuff that Nintendo showed, it just looked mostly like what we have. I think that is totally fine, especially if they want to hit a competitive price point with that big controller packed in. But it is what it is.
Well, it's recent and using some engineering magic, but the Frostbyte 2 engine from DICE is pretty wicked in its ability to light (Around the 0:50 mark, the city scene specifically) and not just reflect, but create radiocity (tech demo).walking fiend said:
My point is that we don't know enough about the hardware to make any judgements about how "powerful" it is at this point. The tech demos aren't enough to go off of, and comparing those to games currently on the market is a fairly useless exercise. The fact is developers working with the dev kits don't even know how "powerful" the wii u is. I check in every once in a while in this thread and I always seem to find people debating back and forth over about the wii u's graphical capabilities using very shoddy evidence.PortTwo said:
It doesn't matter to me if your impressed with the wii u or not my point is its simply too soon to say and people who are posting to the contrary are relying far more on perception than fact. There really isn't even enough info available to make informed speculations. Also my post you quoted mentions nothing about people being impressed or otherwise I only attempted to summarize what has been said about the wii u by developers on record. Personally I am not very impressed by the wii u but I'm not the kind of gamer to get too invested in potential graphical power.
walking fiend
Member
- the problem is not just with lighting, I couldn't point out geometry and texture in other scenes, since they were too dark to point out anything.
As I said, lighting shows itself best when the scenes are dark and every light source can dramatically change the scene, so that's why the video you linked looks very good (it acutally looks); dark scenes can hide many other shortcomings as well. But technically, there are not many light sources, particle effects, reflective surfaces and texture/geometry simply doesn't compare.
- screenshot I took from Zelda is of course from an off screen cam as well.
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I don't really know technical stuff, so sorry if I don't try to hold my ground there. But I can trust my eyes when it comes to judging simple stuff, and that's why I won't hesitate to change my opinion if I actually SEE something better.
I am genuinely not trying to defend the demos for the sake of just defending them, I am cause that is what I believe to be. I for one, don't want to buy a Nintendo console which is barely more powerful than 360/ps3; well, at least not as long as the difference in price is more than the difference the controller make.
walking fiend
Member
yes, but is has no reflective surface, no water, no particle effect going on, only 4 light sources, and is actually a room
(much much more smaller than the church). and there arent zelda fighting a DMC spider with bats watching I don't know what radiocity is
I don't know what tesselation is either (but it looks really good
did you watch that whole video? Did you see the smoke effects? Actually, a big bulletpoint of the Frostbyte 2 engine according to DICE is the ability for them to put in virtually unlimited light sources at no cost and still have alot of particle physics, destruction, etc.walking fiend said:yes, but is has no reflective surface, no water, no particle effect going on, only 4 light sources, and is actually a room
I don't know what radiocity is
but it looks really good
Radiosity is seen in the garden tech demo, no question though. It's essentially the phenomenon where if you light a colored surface, that surface will radiate the color of that surface. Tesselation, from what I understand is just the ability to scale polygons though working down with a tesselated pattern of polygons, but these are both things that are very much on the level of modern PCs.
Gram Negative Cocci
Member
walking fiend: you have no idea what you are talking about. No clue whatsoever.
Hero of Legend
Member
Posted yet? (This seems to be the general Wii U thread, I wasn't sure if this deserves its own thread):
http://nintendoeverything.com/68397/
Apparently Ubi Quebec is doing AssCreed Wii U, Montreal is the one that does the series normally, so could this be evidence towards it being a brand-new, exclusive AC game for Wii U?
http://nintendoeverything.com/68397/
Apparently Ubi Quebec is doing AssCreed Wii U, Montreal is the one that does the series normally, so could this be evidence towards it being a brand-new, exclusive AC game for Wii U?
Hero of Legend
Member
BurntPork said:
Shouldn't be a problem; PS360 get Revelations, Wii U gets its own game, no competition I'd think.
To me when projects in a main line series are handed off from the main dev team to a different dev team it usually means the side team is going to work on a port with new features or a remake of some sort. A full fledged, brand new triple A entry would probably be handled by the main team. I read this as troubling more than encouraging.Hero of Legend said:
DaSorcerer7
Member
BurntPork said:
There u go again ...being negative!
AceBandage
Banned
As long as it PLAYS like a normal AC game, and isn't completely neutered and is actually of good quality, then a spin off is fine.
A multiplat AC game comes out every year, though, so I'm worried that Wii U will end up with a spinoff of lower quality than the "real" one come from Montreal next year.Hero of Legend said:
Also, I really don't trust Ubi on Nintendo-exclusive ACs after AC: Lost Legacy (3DS) went vaporware before we got anything beyond a title.
Shut up. Please, just don't respond to my posts.DaSorcerer7 said:[/B]
There u go again ...being negative!
OR, they're working on a port. Actually, I would be very much for an AC 2 trilogy collection on the WiiU. Either way I'm good with it. I WOULD like to see a different setting than renaissance Italy though. Victorian England or France would be pretty cool...Hero of Legend said:
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