Wii U Speculation Thread of Brains Beware: Wii U Re-Unveiling At E3 2012

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BurntPork said:
After N64 and GCN, would it really be shocking?
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Yes. Both N64 and GCN offered substantially higher storage than their precedessors, and the limits of DVD9 have been widely known for a while.
 
Gravijah said:
Yes, if Nintendo released a console in 2012 that used discs similar in size to DVDs, it would be shocking.
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You mean like releasing a console in 2012 that doesn't play DVD or Blu-Ray, and doesn't have a built-in HDD?
 
BurntPork said:
You mean like releasing a console in 2012 that doesn't play DVD or Blu-Ray, and doesn't have a built-in HDD?
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Nintendo doesn't market their consoles as media centers. They are game consoles. Also, the Wii U supports portable HDDs, doesn't it? That's much cheaper and convenient than a built in HDD.
 
BurntPork said:
After N64 and GCN, would it really be shocking?
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No, it wouldn't have shocked me, but the chances of Nintendo going blu-ray was slightly higher in most peoples eye. Nintendo may make some weird decisions by they're not completely stupid. One of the biggest complaints amongst Multiplat developers is the X360's disc limitations.
 
BurntPork said:
You mean like releasing a console in 2012 that doesn't play DVD or Blu-Ray, and doesn't have a built-in HDD?
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Again, an HDD would make sense for MMOs. I don't know why you say we necessarily will end up without one. I am sure Nintendo thought about that before announcing that DQX will be on WiiU, or thought of what any MMO maker would say to them about this precise issue.
 
BurntPork said:
Okay, how about this.

After the 3DS fiasco, Nintendo is afraid that people will assume that Wii U's price will be cut within six months (Iwata said something that strongly supports this), so it only makes sense that they would want to price it correctly at launch. Nintendo can't survive in the console space with just the core audience; they need casuals, and I don't think that casuals will buy a $350 console, especially in this economy. Both Sony and MS had to deal with very slow starts this gen, so it would be foolish to launch even higher than they did this gen, so $299 is a very likely target for the low-end SKU. You're implying that all three of them will ignore the state of the economy, and they deserve to fail if they're that stupid.

$269-299. It will be priced in that range, no matter how weak or powerful it is.It won't be a cent more, and if it is I won't buy it because it will flop.
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Now you're making sense. I would still disagree and say that the next gen machines can't afford to launch that low. If we look back to the sixth generation, which is fairly analogous to how this one seems to be shaping up with all three consoles by the same three companies on a similar plateau, then we shouldn't expect Sony and MS to have cheaper offerings than Nintendo. At the same time, I can't see Nintendo launching the Wii U a cent lower than $300, knowing that they like to make a profit at launch. I still fully expect Nintendo to have the cheapest console of the three at $349.99, with Sony and MS both launching at $399.99
 
Kenka said:
Again, an HDD would make sense for MMOs. I don't know why you say we necessarily will end up without one. I am sure Nintendo thought about that before announcing that DQX will be on WiiU, or thought of what any MMO maker would say to them about this precise issue.
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They've already said that there's no built-in HDD and that USB HDDs can be used.

OrangeGrayBlue said:
Now you're making sense. I would still disagree and say that the next gen machines can't afford to launch that low. If we look back to the sixth generation, which is fairly analogous to how this one seems to be shaping up with all three consoles by the same three companies on a similar plateau, then we shouldn't expect Sony and MS to have cheaper offerings than Nintendo. At the same time, I can't see Nintendo launching the Wii U a cent lower than $300, knowing that they like to make a profit at launch. I still fully expect Nintendo to have the cheapest console of the three at $349.99, with Sony and MS both launching at $399.99
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I guess we'll see. I think Nintendo knows they have to take a small loss this time around, though, especially since they are with 3DS.
 
BurntPork said:
After N64 and GCN, would it really be shocking?
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The way I see it, Nintendo has been consistantly "1 behind" in terms of hardware. When PS1 and Sega CD were on CD, they used cartridges. PS2 and Xbox on DVD, they used those mini discs. PS3 on BD, the 360 was kinda the exception since they stuck with what they used last gen... but yeah. I expected Nintendo to use a "bluray." I wonder if Sony will try a new format or just make a faster/larger BD.
 
phosphor112 said:
The way I see it, Nintendo has been consistantly "1 behind" in terms of hardware. When PS1 and Sega CD were on CD, they used cartridges. PS2 and Xbox on DVD, they used those mini discs. PS3 on BD, the 360 was kinda the exception since they stuck with what they used last gen... but yeah. I expected Nintendo to use a "bluray." I wonder if Sony will try a new format or just make a faster/larger BD.
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The formats Nintendo used back then, were actually great for the consumer. Short loading times were good times.
 
phosphor112 said:
They highly gimped everything else because of it. Sound and graphical assets really suffered.
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N64 was so different to PS1 the comparison is hard to make, but the gamecube was a beast compared to PS2.
 
BurntPork said:
The 25GB disc was a tough call, knowing Nintendo, and the asymmetrical play style was a bit out there. They also correctly predicted that there wouldn't be a built in HDD.
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Upgrading from DVD to single-layer Blu-Ray, very freaking easy prediction. Asymmetrical gameplay, Nintendo *announced* that on day one of E3. That was the day they announced that systems would only support one touchscreen controller, but multiple Wii Remotes.
 
Dreamwriter said:
Upgrading from DVD to single-layer Blu-Ray, very freaking easy prediction. Asymmetrical gameplay, Nintendo *announced* that on day one of E3. That was the day they announced that systems would only support one touchscreen controller, but multiple Wii Remotes.
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Actually, I believe there's an article in the OP of this thread where a Nintendo rep said that the whole thing of only being able to use one tablet controller at a time is just a misconception. Edit with link incoming...


edit- INCOMIIIIING!!!
Read here.

"Let me correct something that is a misconception," Ryan began. "We said that the Wii U system will come with one Wii U controller, but we haven't said that you can only use one Wii U controller. The fact is that if the developer makes a game or an experience that uses more than one, then anything is possible."
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OrangeGrayBlue said:
Actually, I believe there's an article in the OP of this thread where a Nintendo rep said that the whole thing of only being able to use one tablet controller at a time is just a misconception. Edit with link incoming...
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It's gotta have some crazy horsepower or be able to do extremly high bandwidth over wireless. It already takes a lot to do a "WiDi" solution with very little latency.
 
zoukka said:
The formats Nintendo used back then, were actually great for the consumer. Short loading times were good times.
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Yes, as far as the consumer and the games were concerned, they were superior. But they weren't for developers and publishers, which cost them third party support.
 
OrangeGrayBlue said:
Actually, I believe there's an article in the OP of this thread where a Nintendo rep said that the whole thing of only being able to use one tablet controller at a time is just a misconception. Edit with link incoming...
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It wasn't a misconception, Nintendo announced it. When Miyamoto was then asked about it, he said they would have to do some tests to see if two touchscreen controllers on one Wii-U would be possible, for if one Wii-U owner brought his controller to another Wii-U owner's house (since there would be no other possible way for a Wii-U owner to obtain two controllers). He was very clear about it, it wasn't something you could misunderstand.

I take Miyamoto's word over a Nintendo PR guy who admits he doesn't know what's going on at Nintendo.
 
Dreamwriter said:
Upgrading from DVD to single-layer Blu-Ray, very freaking easy prediction. Asymmetrical gameplay, Nintendo *announced* that on day one of E3. That was the day they announced that systems would only support one touchscreen controller, but multiple Wii Remotes.
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Uh... Kotaku said the single screen + multi remote thing well *before* E3, they had genuine info from somewhere. The amount of flash is unconfimed but may not be fixed yet anyway.
 
Graphics Horse said:
Uh... Kotaku said the single screen + multi remote thing well *before* E3, they had genuine info from somewhere. The amount of flash is unconfimed but may not be fixed yet anyway.
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Actually, all Kotaku said before E3 was people with screens could play against people with Wii Remotes, which is also a very easy thing to guess at when you have a system that can use both Wii Remotes and touchscreen controls (considering the existing system lets you play games with one person using Wii Remote, other person using Classic Controller). Not hard-hitting news at all. Now, if they had heard that a system would only support one touchscreen controller at launch, THAT would be big news. But no, that didn't come out until the first day of E3.
 
BurntPork said:
You mean like releasing a console in 2012 that doesn't play DVD or Blu-Ray, and doesn't have a built-in HDD?
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Fair enough point, but it's a more obvious choice to have 25GB Blu laser discs over the others you mentioned.
As far as I'm concerned, having the memory expandable via an external HD isn't a massive problem, and many people already own dedicated blu-ray/DVD players anyway.
Yet the disc size is imperative if Nintendo are to be a serious contender next gen.
But a lack of blu-ray/DVD playback seriously sucks
 
Dreamwriter said:
Actually, all Kotaku said before E3 was people with screens could play against people with Wii Remotes, which is also a very easy thing to guess at when you have a system that can use both Wii Remotes and touchscreen controls (considering the existing system lets you play games with one person using Wii Remote, other person using Classic Controller). Not hard-hitting news at all. Now, if they had heard that a system would only support one touchscreen controller at launch, THAT would be big news. But no, that didn't come out until the first day of E3.
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Kotaku deserve their unreliable reputation, but I don't think it's clever to dismiss everything they said as a lucky guess. Nintendo themselves seem to be a bit confused over the multiple controller issue, so it's hard to know what 'hard-hitting news' they could come out with which was consistent with the official mixed message.
 
Dreamwriter said:
It wasn't a misconception, Nintendo announced it. When Miyamoto was then asked about it, he said they would have to do some tests to see if two touchscreen controllers on one Wii-U would be possible, for if one Wii-U owner brought his controller to another Wii-U owner's house (since there would be no other possible way for a Wii-U owner to obtain two controllers). He was very clear about it, it wasn't something you could misunderstand.
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Duly noted.





For shits and giggles, I'd like to look at the three zelda tech demos that have happened in the past (N64, GCN, Wii U) and see what we can infer about the Wii U capabilities based on that.

Zelda 64 1995 Spaceworld demo

NDuyk_JmUmk457.jpg


With maaaaybe the exception of those sparks of light, everything about the N64 version ended up being better. Geometry, textures, and animation were all vastly improved on by the time OoT was released.


Zelda 2000 GCN Spaceworld demo

zeldaspaceworld.jpg


In every way, from textures to lighting to poly count, Twilight Princess usurped this demo.


If those demos are anything to go by, the Wii U demo, which is already incredibly impressive on it's own, will still fall short of what Nintendo actually produces for the console. I realize this has been mentioned before, but I think it's worth tossing into the conversation again. Anyone who wouldn't be blown away by playing that Wii U demo, in addition to some other finishing touches, have standards that are far too high if you ask me.
 
antonz said:
Yeah exactly. I can see Nintendo footing the extra cost for 28nm specifically cause it makes reaching their case goals etc far more possible.

NEC is part of the 28nm alliance with IBM etc too
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Right. Once I found out NEC was a part of that, it made the idea of Nintendo using it more palatable for me. The only thing we need now is the press release, because you know they will release one. That would also explain why AMD didn't make that announcement in their press release.

blu said:
1T-SRAM might be inevitable if WiiU is serious about BC.

Due to the SRAM-like nature of the tech, this kind of memory allows for SRAM-like random-access times (read: very low latency). If software and/or TMUs are counting on the fact they can fetch a value from main mem (not cache) within relatively few cycles, you cannot achieve the same effect just by up-clocking some other type of higher-latency DRAM. So your BC becomes less perfect (read: some timings will suffer).

Of course, the one thing about memory is that it can be perfectly usable outside of BC scenarios as well.
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Yes. This is what I was looking for. :)

Dreamwriter said:
It wasn't a misconception, Nintendo announced it. When Miyamoto was then asked about it, he said they would have to do some tests to see if two touchscreen controllers on one Wii-U would be possible, for if one Wii-U owner brought his controller to another Wii-U owner's house (since there would be no other possible way for a Wii-U owner to obtain two controllers). He was very clear about it, it wasn't something you could misunderstand.

I take Miyamoto's word over a Nintendo PR guy who admits he doesn't know what's going on at Nintendo.
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We've already debated this twice before and you're still holding on to the same thing.
 
I can see them pricing it anywhere from 249.99 - 349.99. I do think it's going to come packed in with some kind of game, and I REALLY hope that they're going to include a Wiimote+ and Nunchuck in the box as well.
 
Sooo... who are these people and why should we care about how wrong they are? Is it just in general how overly expectant they are of what the new consoles will offer?
 
OrangeGrayBlue said:
Sooo... who are these people and why should we care about how wrong they are? Is it just in general how overly expectant they are of what the new consoles will offer?
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Yeah pretty much. I know it's not really relevant to us here at GAF, but I found it funny how confident these people are. One of these guys was talking like he'd heard it form nintendo himself. Understandable though, considering he's probably 12.
 
Ubermatik said:
I know it's not really relevant to us here at GAF, but I found it funny how confident these people are. One of these guys was talking like he'd heard it form nintendo himself. Understandable though, considering he's probably 12.
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12 gigglebytes.
 
I'm trying to figure out why on earth one of the posters would *PM* a link about Nintendo's announcements for RAM in the Wii U rather than just post it.
 
Smiles and Cries said:
oh Ubermatik, why did you spread that madness it will end up on some silly fansite as fact now
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I've created a monster!

OrangeGrayBlue said:
That reminds me of this detailed analysis from a professional industry insider regarding the graphical capabilities of Nintendo's forthcoming Wii U console.
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This is brilliant.

I especially like it when he quotes "360p" output, messes with his hair and goes on to talk about the Nintendo DS whatever it's called.
 
phosphor112 said:
Unless you expect it to be utter shit, you're delusional. Especially with these claims of 28nm, etc. This isn't Sony or MS who can subsidize their costs, they need to make at least a tiny profit margin upon release. I expect a 350 - 400 release cost.
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With all the money Nintendo are sitting on they certainly can, the question is if they want to. Historically, systems that were loss leading for a significant part of their lifetimes have made notably less money overall than systems sold at a profit early.

I think they'll take a small loss on the hardware initially. Nothing insane like the PS3, Xbox or even X360, but more in line with what they're doing on 3DS.
 
Jokeropia said:
With all the money Nintendo are sitting on they certainly can, the question is if they want to. Historically, systems that were loss leading for a significant part of their lifetimes have made notably less money overall than systems sold at a profit early.

I think they'll take a small loss on the hardware initially. Nothing insane like the PS3, Xbox or even X360, but more in line with what they're doing on 3DS.
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I agree with this. I'm sure nintendo now understand that one of the big draws to the wii was the price.
 
people and their expectations...

they want power, power and more POWER.

Best thing would be if it had 24 gig of ram. a 32 core super processor and liquid hydrogen cooling...

now let's calm down a little.

I may be in the minority, but why don't I care so much about the specs like other people?

maybe because those other people are expecting nothing short but R-E-A-L-I-T-Y!

yes, there MUST be enough power in the next WiiU to depict reality in it's truest form, or people will be dissapointed.

I myself don't give a shit, since I don't long for hyper-realistic graphics.

Everything looks really good already on HD Consoles. I only own a Wii as a current gen system and am really satisfied with what I'm seeing there.

If the Wii U has as much power as the PS360 then it'd be completely set for the next 5+ years.
 
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