lunchwithyuzo
Banned
N64 had no problem selling 3rd party games, it's problem was getting them. N64 actually had pretty decent western support though, the big problem was Japan.
Wii U Speculation Thread of Brains Beware: Wii U Re-Unveiling At E3 2012
- Thread starter bgassassin
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Fair enough.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
given the proverbial house that Nintendo dropped on Sony with the Monster Hunter coup, you have to assume that they'll be trying to cook something equally as damaging up for the Wii U rather than something like Metroid (as nice as that would be.
I think if Nintendo are deadly serious then they'll have already thrown cash at a couple of big western devs for launch. The beauty of it is they could probably get away with paying for timed exclusives:
e.g. (AND I'M NOT SUGGESTING THIS IS HAPPENING) : Here Rockstar, here's 50m - we'd like GTA:V at launch, 6 months exclusivity then you can put out X360/PS3 version. Knowing full well that the X360/PS3 version technically could be weaker.
Naked Prime
Member
from my understanding a deal of the publisher/developer toward NCL has to do with their policies on varing things ranging from marketing, QA and develop support. These coupled with gap in the Wii's hardware, compared to MS & Sony, make industry grievances toward NCL understandable. Much like Sega, these issues stem from having a Nintendo of Japan calling all the shots and NOA being nothing more than a North American PR branch.
EDIT: Though I feel with the upcoming generation we will truly see the scalablity of these middleware solutions like Unreal, Frostbite, MT Framework, CryEngine etc.
EDIT: Though I feel with the upcoming generation we will truly see the scalablity of these middleware solutions like Unreal, Frostbite, MT Framework, CryEngine etc.
Duckhuntdog
Member
They are probably monkeying around with something. Though Nintendo can put a stop to that and give them something else to play with. I wonder if that is too subtle...
Nintendo's lack of an OS or movie studio did not cause their draconian licensing terms of the past. It didn't cause them to stick with cartridges or treat 3rd parties like second class citizens. Their success with the SNES and NES made them feel invincible and the just did not foresee or adapt fast enough too Sony or MS.
Yes, but they did that at the expense of a lot of the core gamers and lost mountains of third party software. It was great for them financially for the first few years and then their bubble burst.
They had a bunch of third party software and sales for a few years then it had a downturn?
That sounds like a normal console generation.
Waiting five years for the first drop to say their bubble has burst or the fad is over is a bit silly. They aren't un-selling Wiis. The Wii has also gone down in price only, and hasn't risen up. Eventually, you run out of people to sell consoles to. Nobody sane ever thought they'd be selling out the Wii forever.
He's not saying that they could do it. It's a hypothetical scenario and a hyperbole.
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
This is some hardcore history rewriting.
NES, SNES, N64 and GameCube were all high-spec machines. There's some major cognitive dissonance happening if you believe the Wii was Nintendo being stubborn instead of taking a massive risk.
Wii had better third party support than the GameCube.
Wii is still great for Nintendo as they're still making a profit on it and all their evergreen titles.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
I think you're letting how badly you want such a game cloud a more objective look at how important said game actually is. The best launch game Nintendo could release is the next Smash Bros and let a 3rd party handle the "dudebro" market. They can use moneyhats if needed, but Nintendo just isn't the developer for the mainstream hardcore market. Metroid and even Zelda don't grab the blood-thirsty casual gamers, which is really all the "dudebros" are. On one end of the casual spectrum you have soccer moms and tweenage girls who love nintendogs and wii fit; on the other end you have frat boys and middle school aged boys who think they're cool because they say curse words. Metroid doesn't really appeal to either group.
ThatObviousUser
ὠαἴÏÏιÏÏÎ¿Ï Ïαá¿Ï εἶ
I was thinking of something like this the other day.
2D, digital distribution-only console that is contained entirely in the wireless controller itself. Wireless dongle plugs into TV via HDMI, and boom. Could sell it for like $50 and make millions.
Who wants to be my investors?
Sounds great to me! Don't forget HD output.
Even though a console like that would be niche in today's market, since it would probably be cheap to manufacture and make and release games for they could probably do it and make a considerable profit off of it as well. My thought would in this case be that they released this console alongside their "regular" console and market it only to fans of retro games. But that wont happen ever
Yep, it makes so much sense it will never happen.
Neoriceisgood
Member
So it's 2012, this thing out yet or what?
I just remembered since the Wii-U is BC with the Wii i wonder what happens with save files for games such as MHTri and Brawl for people who have not modified their Wii (Actually this also applies to people who have modified their Wii as well), especially MHTri (I have no intention of putting in all those hours again to gain back everything i had in that game).
I'd say "add another zero", but even that wouldn't be remotely enough. In other words, it's impossible.
OrangeGrayBlue
Member
I don't see that happening either. That said, I can't help but feel like you don't actually know how much it costs to moneyhat a game or if you're even in the right ballpark.
GTA V will NOT be a Nintendo exclusive. Ever.
What Nintendo can do, however, is get Rockstar to support the WiiU version over the XBOX/PS3 counterparts, by promoting the better graphics, control scheme, online functionality etc.
An appearance at nintendo's E3 2012 conference also wouldn't go amiss, and could do a lot to promote the new console.
What Nintendo can do, however, is get Rockstar to support the WiiU version over the XBOX/PS3 counterparts, by promoting the better graphics, control scheme, online functionality etc.
An appearance at nintendo's E3 2012 conference also wouldn't go amiss, and could do a lot to promote the new console.
Smiles and Cries
Member
I'll settle for just having a GTA on WiiU
The Wii is the only console released in the history of our industry to go from beginning a gen selling hand over fist and generating record-breaking profits to ending the gen selling the least amount of units monthly, suffering poor software sales and non-existent 3rd party support. It's also suffering from a year-long drought that has been broken up by the release of only 1 notable game despite still being the undisputed market leader.
Granted, console gaming is still a relatively young hobby, but the Wii's unprecedented rise and fall within the same gen is a feat worth studying and the very definition of a bubble burst.
Nintendo got a lot right with the Wii, but as we're seeing now, they also got a lot wrong. And I think a lot of the blame can be put on Nintendo once again neglecting to create a healthy and competitive platform for 3rd parties.
If it were possible, Microsoft would have done it with GTA IV. Considering how GTA sells out of the gate and how little it would sell on a brand new system versus that system plus PS3 and 360, it's safe to say that it would cost several hundred million, if not a billion.
Smiles and Cries
Member
I totally sleepy insomniac agree with this
Nintendo I felt needed a huge lesson with the Wii for the lack of power and HD.
I really wanted them to fall hard on this one but they succeeded to continue to gloat about blue ocean. So as a fan I had to give them props they created something for non-gamers and retirement homes. It became huge with the mainstream and they were not bleeding money in HD like the other guys.
So what can be learned from the Wii is Nintendo does not have to listen to us fans.
But at the same time we can sit back and point if Wii had HD they would not be suffering such a huge downturn.
Here is the worry though.
The PS Move did not work at all for the PS3 audience. Sony did not find the move causing Wii's base to jump ship and go HD Waggle. It all comes back to games and support.
So I cannot say the Wii has a downturn now because it does not have HD as much as I can say it no longer has any support. I just hope all the lost support has been moved to WiiU
/need to go to sleep
I wasn't talking about specs. As I mentioned I think they had little choice but to go the Wii route as I think they just wouldn't have been able to compete with MS and Sony toe to toe given the tech, online, third party love and general high end nature of the business that the other two took. Both strategies would have been risky but as a gamer the one they took with Wii wasn't the one I wanted. It was stubbornness, bad research or just plain stupidity in my books that they released a console so far from the competitors it wasn't in the same universe. And I bet Nintendo in their arrogance would never have thought the Wii was going to essentially end up the "casual console". Iwata himself even said as much.
Sorry, I wasn't clear. By third party I was meaning the AAA third party western stuff that the Wii just didn't really see.
Also their bubble burst years ago, 2009 I think it was. Just look at the stock price. At that point it became quite apparent things were not going to go as well for them over the next few years. Yes, drops are normal as the cycle winds down but the Wii one has been pretty steep. MS managed to revive their console and give it a second life.
My ranting can essential be summed up by saying "I'm pissed off with Nintendo that the Wii was so low tech that it missed out on all the sumptuous 3rd party games of this gen and that I had to get another console to play them. That, I consider Nintendo's fault and I am not a happy camper". We can argue financials, Wii sales records and bathtubs of money for Iwata and his hoes, until the cows come home, but that doesn't fix the situation for me as a gamer and a Nintendo game fan. After a few generations now of Nintendo being stubborn and not a great third party home, then repeatedly saying how next time they will do better, then not, I'm becoming a little jaded. I don't think that's unjustified.
Anyway sorry for a minor derail.
Smiles and Cries
Member
So my Real Pic Jan. avatar helps people understand what GAF has cost me 
SONY has had western dev exclusives right?
Are we saying Nintendo cannot pull any exclusives worth a damn for the WiiU?
SONY has had western dev exclusives right?
Are we saying Nintendo cannot pull any exclusives worth a damn for the WiiU?
They could, the question is if they want to do that. They're probably going to ride the multiplatform release road for all that it's worth along with exclusives from publishers in Japan they have good ties with. Why would they develop a shooter to go up against Halo or Cod when pushing the right buttons at Capcom lands them Resident Evil 6 instead?So my Real Pic Jan. avatar helps people understand what GAF has cost me
SONY has had western dev exclusives right?
Are we saying Nintendo cannot pull any exclusives worth a damn for the WiiU?
I'm sure there's more games coming because Lego City Stories is also Wii U exclusive.
Smiles and Cries
Member
Did the Rabbids not jump ship to X360 or was I just dreaming it?
Ubisoft and exclusives can last you a year at most now with the SD to HD port barrier removed exclusive for WiiU seems that much harder unless the game is deeply uPad focused
you should pay a visit to that mgs3 3ds thread....
bigtroyjon
Member
LOL, GTA IV hasn't even brought in a billion dollars in revenue for Take Two lifetime(let alone profit), so the thought that it would take a billion dollar payment to make up the difference in sales between versions is one of the more absurd comments you've ever made on this board and that's saying something.
edit- Just looked it up and TTWO's market cap is 1.17 billion, yeah that's the most absurd thing you've ever said.
IceDoesntHelp
Banned
[Nintex];33929577 said:
More like a Nintendo exclusive (also heading to the 3DS)
Rather than money hat a GTA to the tune of several hundred mill, it'd be a lot cheaper to just work close with them, send some engineers over, give free kits and lots of support in exchange for a release. Maybe a bit of "incentive" if the game is already looking to launch about same time as Wii U in order to get it at launch.
Smiles and Cries
Member
don't get carried away slamming BP
GTA not being exclusive at any cost has more to do with Take Two's ego for mind share than anything else. They want it to stay a relavant big brand they need to keep it spread out like CoD and other huge brands. Even if the sales numbers do not match up spreading it around multiplatforms helps the big brand image
bigtroyjon
Member
Nintendo, Mircosoft or Sony could offer a 50% premium and buy controlling interest in the company for less than a billion dollars. It's beyond absurd to suggest that it would take more than the game costs to develop at a minimum and potentially up to a billion dollars to gain exclusivity.
TTWO is owned by investment banks and mutual funds, they don't give a shit about things like egos when it comes to decisions making financial sense.
DCharlie
And even i am moderately surprised
in that case, Nintendo or whoever would just go the extra and -buy- R*
Anyways, as i said - i DON'T believe it would happen however given the recent Nintendo related craziness regarding big exclusives i think "impossible" isn't a word you can use for anything any more.
The best Nintendo can do is do what MS is doing with Call of Duty. Foot part of the marketing bill, design limited edition consoles and fund some timed-exclusive DLC.
That's pretty much exactly what they did with Monster Hunter 3 in Japan and Layton in Europe.
[Nintex];33930911 said:
Yeah, but a) Layton isn't a franchise that appeals to a core market
b) Monster Hunter sees the majority of it's success in Japan, not abroad
c) Both franchises don't sell as well in North America as in Europe and Japan and thus
d) Nintendo need to promote their console with a game that's already well established to a western market and that appeals to core gamers that isn't as niche as a monster hunting open world RPG with heavy eastern influence, or a puzzle come riddle solving game that's aimed to a more casual demographic.
[Nintex];33930911 said:
Didn't they also publish and market MH3 in the states? The fact that Nintendo is willing to develop new controllers (Classic Controller Pro, Circle Pad Pro) specifically for a juggernaut 3rd party exclusive demonstrates volumes about their initiative....or NOJ's initiative, at least.
I rather have the Wii U come with a demo disk kinda like the dreamcast did instead of the Wii U Sport.
Basically gimme a 4.7GB or more disk full of exclusive game demos and vids. (with option to install perhaps)
That is better than sport based games and I can see what I want without the need to set my internet and wait for hours to download demos.
Basically gimme a 4.7GB or more disk full of exclusive game demos and vids. (with option to install perhaps)
That is better than sport based games and I can see what I want without the need to set my internet and wait for hours to download demos.
bigtroyjon
Member
It's safe to say that if Nintendo wanted an exclusive GTA and offered them a blank check to pay all the dev costs, required zero input(i.e. Rockstar gets to make the game however they want), and offered a guarantee against say 10 million sales, TTWO would snap accept that deal before you could say E3 megaton. The problem is that Nintendo(or MS/Sony) would never agree to take on that kind of risk. If the game bombed for whatever reason(or had dev troubles, never came together and had to be cancelled) there is nothing the execs could say to keep their job after they just gave another company a bunch of money without any oversight and they lose most of it.
At the end of the day I think we'd be more likely to see a hardware manufacture buy Rockstar(and all the ip) from TTWO then we would see them take on the risk of fronting a huge amount of cash for a game they have no control over. Even if it cost 5-10 times as much they wouldn't have all the risk tied up in one game.
MS or Sony could get away with probably not having to guarantee a certain amount of sales considering their consoles histories of selling huge numbers of popular AAA 3rd party games but I don't think either company wants to take on that risk when they can just sit back and collect royalties on 10 million+ sales without having to pay anything.
At the end of the day I think we'd be more likely to see a hardware manufacture buy Rockstar(and all the ip) from TTWO then we would see them take on the risk of fronting a huge amount of cash for a game they have no control over. Even if it cost 5-10 times as much they wouldn't have all the risk tied up in one game.
MS or Sony could get away with probably not having to guarantee a certain amount of sales considering their consoles histories of selling huge numbers of popular AAA 3rd party games but I don't think either company wants to take on that risk when they can just sit back and collect royalties on 10 million+ sales without having to pay anything.
I think even more than Call of Duty or GTA Nintendo should get the console exclusive version of Diablo 3! That would help out big time and if it were a launch title..oh baby!
I've got a feeling we'll be getting a disc with all of the mini games they showed off at E3. I certainly hope that Nintendo and other companies have demos on the Wii U eShop day 1 though.
I've got a feeling we'll be getting a disc with all of the mini games they showed off at E3. I certainly hope that Nintendo and other companies have demos on the Wii U eShop day 1 though.
MrBelmontvedere
Member
I dunno; the old Nintendo sure, but with 1080p graphics and more power than current consoles, we might be looking at a Nintendo aiming to reinvent itself. In that case all bets are off.
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