Vat grown meat research had already been occurring for a while before that episode aired. Miss that show though. One of the best to die so young D:
Will humanity ever give up eating meat? When?
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Vat grown meat research had already been occurring for a while before that episode aired. Miss that show though. One of the best to die so young D:
toddhunter
Member
I'm fine with eating meat being considered unnecessary, but I also feel that you are still killing animals when making the food products to replace it (especially to meet the greater production needs if this switch ever happened).
As such I see it more about where people choose to draw the line rather than being right or wrong.
As such I see it more about where people choose to draw the line rather than being right or wrong.
Wiktor
Member
I see it differently. As long as the animal lives in good conditions and it's killed swiftly everybody wins, both humans and animals.
You can talk about animals needs and desires, but you're forgetting that those animals would never be born if it wasn't for meat industry. Heck, pigs and some other animals would be extinct. As I see it as long as we keep improving their living conditions and fight with cruelty while raising livestock we are offering animals nice lives in exchange for their meat. Much nicer lives that they could ever have in wild, where 99,99% would never get born and majority of the rest would either die out of hunder/cold or get eaten by a predators.
Sure, it's shorter life than it could be, but it's still better than no life. Otherwise you could just as well execute anyone who gets terminal disease.
Wiktor
Member
They are for western folk. I wish they would just grind them and make patties out of bugs. Those I would gladly buy. I already eat a lot of "icky" meats, hearts, like tongues, lungs or stomaches, but I was raised on those, so it's not a problem like with bugs.
dapperbandit
Banned
Am I callous for really not caring about the emotions of livestock that are literally bred to be killed? Despite my tongue in cheek post earlier, the only moral problem I have with the meat industry is the unnessecary cruelty that sometimes happens. That's it.
People will never stop eating meat because it's an everyday luxury we've grown accustomed to. We don't need to eat it, just like we don't need a host of other material goods that make us happy. To me it's not a worthwhile argument. The reality is it's an industry that employs tens of millions and is worth hundreds of billions. And like the classic idea of the caveman using every part of a mammoth, not a whole lot goes to waste. For example, look up the ridiculous amount of uses the constituent parts of a dead pig has besides bacon.
People will never stop eating meat because it's an everyday luxury we've grown accustomed to. We don't need to eat it, just like we don't need a host of other material goods that make us happy. To me it's not a worthwhile argument. The reality is it's an industry that employs tens of millions and is worth hundreds of billions. And like the classic idea of the caveman using every part of a mammoth, not a whole lot goes to waste. For example, look up the ridiculous amount of uses the constituent parts of a dead pig has besides bacon.
BrokenEchelon
Banned
Not as long as I'm alive.
I'm by no means a steak and potatoes every night guy, but fuck living without a burger every once in a while.
I'm by no means a steak and potatoes every night guy, but fuck living without a burger every once in a while.
Krauser Kat
Member
Can people stop bringing up this terrible straw man argument.
Humans are shitty things to every environment so unless someone is willing to just shoot themselves in the face you are always doing active harm to this world. Not eating meat goes a really long way to reducing use of poorly used land and does much much less harm to animals. We are never trying for 0% harm, we are just trying to limit our effect on other species because being at the top of the food chain, automatically makes you the steward of your world. We should try to make it a better place for all things if possible.
Tevious
Member
My friend recently became a vegan and I just can't understand that. I think it's completely natural to eat meat, so I don't think there's anything wrong with it. I can just hope that in the future, animals will be raised and slaughtered more humanly. I'd be totally for laws enforcing more restrictions even if it made prices go up, but I'm not going to give up meat. Hopefully, they'll get that lab meat perfected sometime.
Implicit to the argument that you're making is that if we had the technology to make meat without harm to a living consciousness, we'd still be better raising a real animal and killing it for meat because it has the opportunity to live for a bit before dying relatively painlessly (brutally, but too quickly for it to feel much pain).
I'm not sure that passes the smell test.
But you know... now that I think about it, in a future where we have 3D printed vat meats... we could swing animal meat if the contract was to treat those animals that we kill especially well. It'd have to be a specialized industry - but for old timers that can't remove the taste of meat from their minds, I wouldn't be opposed to all livestock been treated like kobe beef (which is very apparently not the reality right now).
Doesn't make my stomach turn and I'd certainly try it, but I agree with the not being able to replicate a good meat part. If they could nail the taste and texture of a high end meat, I'd certainly be all over it. That is a pretty obese IF though.
What I'd like to know...how much of our leather is supplied by slaughtered animals? Gelatine? Dog toys? Dog/Cat food? You can't just keep animals on a vegetarian diet. Other stuff?
Those animals aren't just slaughtered for our consumption, there's a whole lot of other industries which rely on slaughtering animals. And if those animals will be slaughtered anyways...why not just eat them?
Those animals aren't just slaughtered for our consumption, there's a whole lot of other industries which rely on slaughtering animals. And if those animals will be slaughtered anyways...why not just eat them?
D
Deleted member 1235
Unconfirmed Member
I think humanity should make the decision to never eat another animal exactly 1 second after I'm dead.
Yeah... those products are the byproducts of the meat industry.
Thing about humans... we're a pretty ingenious bunch. I'm sure we'll find suitable substitutes when pressed... just like we'll make use of waste by-products and turn them into useful by-products if an opportunity presents itself.
Moreover, with accelerated technology development, I'd say ethical alternatives (may not necessarily be better, but at least the functionality/utility isn't lost completely) are very likely.
I need it to satisfy my hunger once in a while.
Doubt it's wrong, that's well your opinion.
Ate meat all my life like you and see nothing wrong with killing animals to get more unless it's a rare species. Lab grown meat tastes different, so I won't touch that stuff, not like I could looking at the price for a single patty. :/
toddhunter
Member
Calling an argument a straw man (leaving aside all the people who are going for 0% harm) and countering with "a better place for all things possible" isn't really a compelling argument. There a lots of things "possible" and if you are going to just start with what you feel is important, I think you will hit problems very quickly.
False. Humans need protein (essential and non-essential amino acids), which they can get easily from non-meat sources.
Shin Johnpv
Member
I don't know where you were at but Skirt Steak is popular in the US. So much so that the price of it has sky rocketed in the last 5 - 10 years. You used to be able to get it for like 4.99 a lb, now most places I see it, it's about 12.99 - 15.99 a lb.
Where ever you were at isn't indicative of the entire US. I really wish people would stop the Hey US why don't you guys blahblah because I was in 1 place and they didn't blahblah.
Having seen a certain movie,
Snowpiercer, nooooooooo. Please spear me that black protein bar.
It's probably a mixture of social taboo and the instinctive avoidance of prion diseases. If it weren't for the health risks then I don't think the social taboo would be as strong. I could be wrong though.
Oh, and we'll stop eating meat en masse when they create an exact replica in the lab that cheaper and healthier.
Some people will still stupidly eat meat at that point, but it'll be archaic and looked down on as silly.
The important thing is that it has to look, feel, and taste the same while being cheaper. Then we will switch.
No of course note. Meat is tasty so people will always want to eat it. I'm concerned about the affects it has on our planet for sure though.
And humans don't "need" a lot of things, so that argument doesn't hold any weight.
I haven't had steak in so long. I think next time I go to the store I'll get some, thank you OP.
And humans don't "need" a lot of things, so that argument doesn't hold any weight.
I haven't had steak in so long. I think next time I go to the store I'll get some, thank you OP.
MilkyJoe
Member
It's a catch 22. Kill animals for food or level areas for crops, destroying habitat and killing other animals and then slaughtering a myriad of other animals with the combine harvesters...
Lol, so much false information in this post. Hence, not sure if serious.
You get protein from dairy products and soya beans and spinach etc.
No one in my family has any of those issues you mentioned and they are all vegetarian and none of us takes supplements either. (I eat meat occasionally when I don't have a choice because of how ingrained meat consumption is in the west for food).
Oh btw, you know the guy Great Khali from WWE? That giant has only ever eaten vegetarian food.
Apparently before the eyes of people who naively believe in utilitarian ethics.
Riposte
Member
Sometimes I have a hard time telling the difference.
I eat meat. Not every day, but often. I've tried to limit my meat consumption over the years for a few reasons, one of which is the unethical treatment of animals. I generally don't eat fast food and the like, just because you have no idea how these animals were treated (hint: probably very poorly).
I don't think I'll ever become a full-blown vegetarian, but I'm not mad at those who are (unless they're douchebags about it, which is hurting their cause). I find people who are extreme and hostile about their vegetarianism (or non-vegetarianism) frustrating. Why can't people just engage in a conversation, making an effort to see things from others' points-of-view? But I guess knee-jerk reactions are just a part of who some of us are as people.
I don't think I'll ever become a full-blown vegetarian, but I'm not mad at those who are (unless they're douchebags about it, which is hurting their cause). I find people who are extreme and hostile about their vegetarianism (or non-vegetarianism) frustrating. Why can't people just engage in a conversation, making an effort to see things from others' points-of-view? But I guess knee-jerk reactions are just a part of who some of us are as people.
Mango The Magician
Banned
Threads like this are always hard for me. I like the people of Gaf, but when y'all act so disgruntled towards someone voicing their opinion on meat (or anything really) that we have people outright calling the OP a moron, I'm not sure how I feel about this site. I'm not a mod, and I really have no right calling people out to which I apologize, but it's a little disheartening.
To get OT:
I legitimately think that at some point in near future, lab grown meat will completely outplace natural meat, as it's far more economical and humane. Something like Arthur C. Clark's 3000.
To get OT:
I legitimately think that at some point in near future, lab grown meat will completely outplace natural meat, as it's far more economical and humane. Something like Arthur C. Clark's 3000.
Skiptastic
Member
I eat meat now. I wish I was better at phasing it out. Trying to do more meatless Mondays, but it is difficult.
Humanity will eventually give up eating meat, but it's a ways out. The costs to society as a whole will become too great and we will come up with smarter, less costly ways of providing the same nutritional value.
Humanity will eventually give up eating meat, but it's a ways out. The costs to society as a whole will become too great and we will come up with smarter, less costly ways of providing the same nutritional value.
Team Jones
Member
I recently became a vegetarian.
Prior to vegetarianism I already eliminated Red Meats and only ate Chick, Turkey, and Fish.
I train hard (gym) so my biggest fear was obtaining a sufficient amount of protein to maintain and/or expand my muscle mass - #GAINZZZ. I was able to find great sources of protein as a vegetarian, so that eliminated that fear.
so far, SO GREAT!
The energy boost is AMAZING!
Prior to vegetarianism I already eliminated Red Meats and only ate Chick, Turkey, and Fish.
I train hard (gym) so my biggest fear was obtaining a sufficient amount of protein to maintain and/or expand my muscle mass - #GAINZZZ. I was able to find great sources of protein as a vegetarian, so that eliminated that fear.
so far, SO GREAT!
The energy boost is AMAZING!
God Dayumm
Banned
I don't consume much meat but I satisfy my protein needs with dairy, so it's either one form of animal abuse or another, and I won't change that anytime soon until I can get enough protein from a plant source that tastes good by itself, doesn't have a huge carb/protein ratio, and is not an estrogen.
Meat is tasty, but so is ice cream and chocolate and so much other stuff I limit, so it's something I can give up if there is a good reason.
Meat is tasty, but so is ice cream and chocolate and so much other stuff I limit, so it's something I can give up if there is a good reason.
Agreed. Just reading the first page makes me want to leave gaf forever.
MikeHaggar
Member
We know that we don't need meat. We could survive perfectly well without it and still have a healthy diet. We know that killing all these delicious animals is purely to satisfy our taste.
I fucking love eating meat. It's rare that I ever go a day without eating meat. It's pretty much impossible that I'm going to give up eating it in my lifetime. Yet I know it's wrong. I accept my hypocrisy. I assume there are many, if not most like me. Then there are the people who try to rationalize the industry of animal death catered to our particular, unnecessary appetites.
When (if ever) do you see humans having converted to an animal-free diet? How long till we're looked back as on as cruel barbarians by our future ancestors who will never know the sweet taste of a perfectly cooked steak?
that steak is cooked PERFECTLY. i know what i'm having for dinner tonight. and i don't feel bad about eating animals at all. shit is delicious. they eat each other anyway, so why is it wrong for us to get in on the action?
Shin Johnpv
Member
In regards to the "healthyness" of red meat it should be noted that a lot of that is based on grain fed beef. Grass fed beef is much healthier, it can contain as much/some times more Omega 3 than the same size piece of Salmon, it has 2 - 3 times the amount of Conjugated linoleic acid than grain-fed beef. Grass fed beef also contains more antioxidants, minerals, and vitamins by significant amounts. You also have much higher levels of carotenoids like beta-carotene, which make sense since grains don't contain them.
Grass fed red meats are actually pretty damn healthy for you.
Grass fed red meats are actually pretty damn healthy for you.
I don't think it's realistic to expect the world to go vegetarian. We just don't want to.
So the goal should be on making viable replacements to meat, and products we create because of meat. We're getting there, we'll probably see ground beef with fat grown in labs this decade (not for sale, just proof of concept).
So the goal should be on making viable replacements to meat, and products we create because of meat. We're getting there, we'll probably see ground beef with fat grown in labs this decade (not for sale, just proof of concept).
Certainly not the god of meat. Got to sacrifice some every week.. day to not provoke him.
Meat for the meat god
MoogleWizard
Member
When it stops being delicious, so never.
There are alternatives to eating meat; there are not alternatives to drinking water. Thanks for posting, though.
There has not been a single vegetarian civilization to make it into the history books. All people, from the dawn of humanity, have eaten meat and indeed the eating of meat is what made our species what it is today.
In our modern times, with our modern approach to food, yes it is possible for some people to live on vegetables and other non-meat products. When vegetables, nuts and other nutrients are flown in by plane from around the world a vegetarian or vegan might eat well indeed.
Humanity will give up eating meat when we have advanced to the point where our nutrient source becomes utterly irrelevant. That's not going to happen any time soon. Our technology right now allows for vegetarians to experiment with this new lifestyle but it is not something any sane leader would impose on their people.
For context, vegetarians would do well to place their lifestyle in our history. It is unreasonable and unprecidented to shame people into a non-meat diet. It is radically new territory and not at all apart of the human condition.
In our modern times, with our modern approach to food, yes it is possible for some people to live on vegetables and other non-meat products. When vegetables, nuts and other nutrients are flown in by plane from around the world a vegetarian or vegan might eat well indeed.
Humanity will give up eating meat when we have advanced to the point where our nutrient source becomes utterly irrelevant. That's not going to happen any time soon. Our technology right now allows for vegetarians to experiment with this new lifestyle but it is not something any sane leader would impose on their people.
For context, vegetarians would do well to place their lifestyle in our history. It is unreasonable and unprecidented to shame people into a non-meat diet. It is radically new territory and not at all apart of the human condition.
It's only unsustainable with X number of people on the planet. Most of our woes are a direct result of overpopulation in general, or else is intensified by it.
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