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[brotkasten]

it's relatively expensive at $15 per month.

You think so? $15 per month, keep 10 tracks, stream from everywhere (PC, Phone Zune, Xbox, Mac) + Smart DJ for dynamic playlists that are created from the entire library (11 million songs, I think). Sounds good to me. Scrap the 10 tracks and it's only €10 in Europe.

 

[Klocker]

You think so? $15 per month, keep 10 tracks, stream from everywhere (PC, Phone Zune, Xbox, Mac) + Smart DJ for dynamic playlists that are created from the entire library (11 million songs, I think). Sounds good to me. Scrap the 10 tracks and it's only €10 in Europe.

yea but NBC Nightly News told us tonight how "amazing Steve Jobs and Apple are" today since we can now do this with our iPhones/pods/pads as if it was the first time anyone ever thought of it.

 

[dudeguy24]

You think so? $15 per month, keep 10 tracks, stream from everywhere (PC, Phone Zune, Xbox, Mac) + Smart DJ for dynamic playlists that are created from the entire library (11 million songs, I think). Sounds good to me. Scrap the 10 tracks and it's only €10 in Europe.

Honestly, I wish they would allow us to have a cheaper plan without the 10 free songs here in the US. I couldn't care less about the credits as I'm not planning on getting rid of the Zune pass anytime soon.

 

[Klocker]

Honestly, I wish they would allow us to have a cheaper plan without the 10 free songs here in the US. I couldn't care less about the credits as I'm not planning on getting rid of the Zune pass anytime soon.

I remember when most people bought 1-3 CDs a month with each maybe 5-7 songs that they really wanted at $15-$50 a month so $15 for 10 hand chosen songs sounds fair to me.

Spoiler

before you young'uns started stealing songs and made digital downloads into a business

 

[Anton Sugar]

Eh, the iOS influence is okay. WP7 will do it better, with less restrictions.

 

[Firestorm]

Aren't there perfectly capable WLM apps on iOS (and probably Android)?

iOS app is good (developed by Microsoft).
BlackBerry app is great (developed by RIM).
Android I don't think has one yet (or I didn't see it when I used mine last).

 

[bigswords]

How do you trigger it? I use it on a daily basis and didn't get it after the update.

It's random, after you press dismiss on the alarm. All sounds are muted till a reset.

 

[antiquegamer]

yea but NBC Nightly News told us tonight how "amazing Steve Jobs and Apple are" today since we can now do this with our iPhones/pods/pads as if it was the first time anyone ever thought of it.

Well, the blame still laid at MS door for not able to leverage what they got. Apple know how to pick one or two key features and then bullshit the hell out of it as if it was best thing since slice bread. They also ship thing quickly unlike Microsoft.

If WP7 launch with Mango may be we would be in different place (may be not because MS will manage to muck thing up).

Or look at new Xbox UI, that should launch this spring ... kinect came out last year and we still using that shitty beta UI on it.

 

[strata8]

Well, the blame still laid at MS door for not able to leverage what they got. Apple know how to pick one or two key features and then bullshit the hell out of it as if it was best thing since slice bread. They also ship thing quickly unlike Microsoft.

If WP7 launch with Mango may be we would be in different place (may be not because MS will manage to muck thing up).

Or look at new Xbox UI, that should launch this spring ... kinect came out last year and we still using that shitty beta UI on it.

Yeah, I remember when iOS was feature-complete at revision 1.

 

[Joel Was Right]

One of the issues I had as an Android owner was the fragmentation of how updates were handled, in contrast to the iOS delivery method. When WP7 list features they want for their device, it seems that the OEM is the only one that can deliver on that. How would notification using lights, for example, work? Would they enable that and then send it to Microsoft to release the update, or would they push it through their own servers? And most importantly, how do consumers contact OEMs about software requests? As far as I know, there are no OEM specific devs on social networking sites and blogs for which to communicate with.

 

[brotkasten]

One of the issues I had as an Android owner was the fragmentation of how updates were handled, in contrast to the iOS delivery method. When WP7 list features they want for their device, it seems that the OEM is the only one that can deliver on that. How would notification using lights, for example, work? Would they enable that and then send it to Microsoft to release the update, or would they push it through their own servers? And most importantly, how do consumers contact OEMs about software requests? As far as I know, there are no OEM specific devs on social networking sites and blogs for which to communicate with.

Pretty much every update goes through Microsoft and Zune. When an OEM wants to push a specific firmware update to update the radio bands for example, they send it to Microsoft, Microsoft tests it again and when everything is okay, they release it via Zune. that's how it usually works or should work (HTC did it some time ago). Then you have some companies like Samsung that can't get their shit right and cause a gigantic mess for everyone, like shipping phones with newer firmwares that weren't tested by Microsoft and cant update or get bricked in the update process. Then they have to release their own update software etc. It's not very cool.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Yeah, I remember when iOS was feature-complete at revision 1.

The iPhone was really the first consumer-targeted smartphone. One of the benefits of going first is you get to work things out while everybody else is still asleep at the wheel. In Apple's case, having a cult surrounding your company and products also helps a lot towards making it easier to ship a product and fix it later. Microsoft simply didn't have the luxury of shipping as incomplete as WP7 launched, not with iOS and Android more or less on the verge of Complete Global Saturation of the smartphone market. WebOS is facing the same oblivion and for the same reason, both WP7 and WebOS just arrived way, way too late in the market to pose a credible threat to the two platforms which have established themselves as the market leaders.

 

[Blackhead]

I always wondered why Microsoft didn't go with an explicit xBox tie-in for the phones:

Relaunch WP7 in the fall as the xPhone. At the same event they'll announce the xTouch, a dedicated app/gaming device. Both devices will sync via Live to the xPlayer on your PC. And there will be the xPass that gives access to all those songs...

*shrug*

You think so? $15 per month, keep 10 tracks, stream from everywhere (PC, Phone Zune, Xbox, Mac) + Smart DJ for dynamic playlists that are created from the entire library (11 million songs, I think). Sounds good to me. Scrap the 10 tracks and it's only €10 in Europe.

I think it's worth it. But some people are just not willing (or can't afford) to pay that much for music.

 

[D4Danger]

I always wondered why Microsoft didn't go with an explicit xBox tie-in for the phones:

Relaunch WP7 in the fall as the xPhone. At the same event they'll announce the xTouch, a dedicated app/gaming device. Both devices will sync via Live to the xPlayer on your PC. And there will be the xPass that gives access to all those songs...

*shrug*

The problem with using the Xbox brand is you then create "a gaming device that does other things" and that isn't what people want

I think keeping Xbox as their gaming brand and adding it as part of WP7 was the right idea

saying that I think they should've used the Zune brand or something new instead of "Windows"

 

[Anton Sugar]

Yeah, I really don't game at all on my phone.

 

[Blackhead]

The problem with using the Xbox brand is you then create "a gaming device that does other things" and that isn't what people want

I think keeping Xbox as their gaming brand and adding it as part of WP7 was the right idea

saying that I think they should've used the Zune brand or something new instead of "Windows"

Well Microsoft won't call it an xBox phone, they'll call it an xPhone.

That said, I really do think that Microsoft should have released an xBox linked handheld gaming device. I'd prefer if it was an iPod Touch shaped device running Mango but even an xPortable, with Zune Pass as a minor secondary feature, would be welcomed. After all the xBox is "a gaming device that does other things"! Wasn't that the main theme of Microsoft's E3 event yesterday?

 

[VanMardigan]

I downloaded the 3DS software update and...whoa nelly!! If you think WP7 games are overpriced, Nintendo takes the cake. $4 for black/white GameBoy games, $8 for a version of Plants vs. Zombies that'll play on a cheap resistive screen with a crappy resolution. No thanks, I'll wait for the WP7 version.

The browser on the 3DS is garbage (that was to be expected) but it just shows how fast technology moves. Nintendo's like a dinosaur in many ways. Their app stores with barely touched (or not at all) old games selling for high amounts just doesn't make sense in today's market. Even MS' prices are barely justifiable given the lack of online multiplayer. I know Nintendo makes a big deal about devs work not being devalued, but the app store is still full of garbage and it's not going to get anywhere near the traction of the Android or Apple app stores. I think MS is pulling more towards Apple's model, but charging a premium for XBL content, but hopefully Mango expands the functionality of those games to make them more worth the price.

 

[brotkasten]

I downloaded the 3DS software update and...whoa nelly!! If you think WP7 games are overpriced, Nintendo takes the cake. $4 for black/white GameBoy games, $8 for a version of Plants vs. Zombies that'll play on a cheap resistive screen with a crappy resolution. No thanks, I'll wait for the WP7 version.

The browser on the 3DS is garbage (that was to be expected) but it just shows how fast technology moves. Nintendo's like a dinosaur in many ways. Their app stores with barely touched (or not at all) old games selling for high amounts just doesn't make sense in today's market. Even MS' prices are barely justifiable given the lack of online multiplayer. I know Nintendo makes a big deal about devs work not being devalued, but the app store is still full of garbage and it's not going to get anywhere near the traction of the Android or Apple app stores. I think MS is pulling more towards Apple's model, but charging a premium for XBL content, but hopefully Mango expands the functionality of those games to make them more worth the price.

There's a nice demo somewhere on Channel 9 that shows the socket support and the communication between two devices. So yeah, multiplayer should be in Mango.

 

[n3ss]

So... I just got a windows phone 7, any must have apps?

 

[Cerebral Assassin]

I downloaded the 3DS software update and...whoa nelly!! If you think WP7 games are overpriced, Nintendo takes the cake. $4 for black/white GameBoy games, $8 for a version of Plants vs. Zombies that'll play on a cheap resistive screen with a crappy resolution. No thanks, I'll wait for the WP7 version.

The browser on the 3DS is garbage (that was to be expected) but it just shows how fast technology moves. Nintendo's like a dinosaur in many ways. Their app stores with barely touched (or not at all) old games selling for high amounts just doesn't make sense in today's market. Even MS' prices are barely justifiable given the lack of online multiplayer. I know Nintendo makes a big deal about devs work not being devalued, but the app store is still full of garbage and it's not going to get anywhere near the traction of the Android or Apple app stores. I think MS is pulling more towards Apple's model, but charging a premium for XBL content, but hopefully Mango expands the functionality of those games to make them more worth the price.

If Nintendo cared about their app store they would release content for it themselves , they clearly don't . As for the VC Links Awakening is cheap at twice the price, far better value than any of the Xbox Live W7 games I have played,

 

[Joel Was Right]

So... I just got a windows phone 7, any must have apps?

This is a good site

http://www.windowsphoneapplist.com/

We also have an App and Gaming recommendation thread here on GAF

 

[dLMN8R]

So... I just got a windows phone 7, any must have apps?

Feed Reader 2.0: Best RSS reader (syncs with Google Reader)
Birdsong: Best twitter client
Wordament: Free, awesome massively multiplayer boggle-style word game
Alphajax: Word with Friends clone (has a free version)


But the most impressive app of all is Cocktail Flow. One of the best examples of Metro UI concepts combined with excellent design and extreme usefulness:

http://cocktailflow.com/

 

[Cerebral Assassin]

But the most impressive app of all is Cocktail Flow. One of the best examples of Metro UI concepts combined with excellent design and extreme usefulness:

This is free if you are on Orange UK(used to be about £3).

 

[venne]

The browser on the 3DS is garbage (that was to be expected) but it just shows how fast technology moves. Nintendo's like a dinosaur in many ways. Their app stores with barely touched (or not at all) old games selling for high amounts just doesn't make sense in today's market. Even MS' prices are barely justifiable given the lack of online multiplayer. I know Nintendo makes a big deal about devs work not being devalued, but the app store is still full of garbage and it's not going to get anywhere near the traction of the Android or Apple app stores. I think MS is pulling more towards Apple's model, but charging a premium for XBL content, but hopefully Mango expands the functionality of those games to make them more worth the price.

I think it's safe to say that WP7 (and, shortly, Windows 8) is Microsoft's mobile gaming platform going forward. It's pubescent at this point, but the fact that they're pushing Live on the platform should give users hope. Live was weak on Xbox when it launched and hit it's strides later, I can only assume that doing it on mobile will be much more accelerated (within a year or two).

Sony was smart enough to develop Playstation Suite for Android alongside Vita, as I don't see the 3DS and Vita approaching the sales of the DS and PSP. Nintendo looks archaic in comparison without a mobile software solution and really needs to innovate its services if it wants to be relevant in the new digital marketplace.

 

[mm04]

I just bought the Sandisk 16gb Class 4 from Amazon. I'll give the results on if it works without issue on Wednesday. It's received 4 and 5 star reviews from Focus owners, so that was enough for me to pull the trigger.

Well, so far so good. Things were a little sketchy upon the hard reset with re-downloading all of my apps and games, but since everything has been reinstalled, it's been stable. I never turn my phone off, but I did a few times just to see if the settings remained upon powering up and it was fine. Here's the card I bought for those so inclined.

 

[SeanR1221]

It's pretty crazy how much coverage the WWDC gets, but the WP7 conference from a few weeks ago got barely anything. I mean, look at Gizmodo. They've been putting up article after article of apple stuff, and they had ONE WP7 article after the Mango conference.

 

[delirium]

It's pretty crazy how much coverage the WWDC gets, but the WP7 conference from a few weeks ago got barely anything. I mean, look at Gizmodo. They've been putting up article after article of apple stuff, and they had ONE WP7 article after the Mango conference.

It's all about mindshare and Apple has it in spades.

 

[brotkasten]

It's pretty crazy how much coverage the WWDC gets, but the WP7 conference from a few weeks ago got barely anything. I mean, look at Gizmodo. They've been putting up article after article of apple stuff, and they had ONE WP7 article after the Mango conference.

To be fair, wwdc is more than just iOS 5.

 

[Blablurn]

i have a question. i'm thinking about buying the samsung omnia 7 here in china before going back to germany. it has GSM. does it mean i can also run it with a german sim card?

 

[Blackhead]

It's pretty crazy how much coverage the WWDC gets, but the WP7 conference from a few weeks ago got barely anything. I mean, look at Gizmodo. They've been putting up article after article of apple stuff, and they had ONE WP7 article after the Mango conference.

iOS5 beta is available right now, it's easy to install on current devices, and it's easy to take screenshots to show off every single new feature. Some of the features, the iMessage and iCloud, will also have a huge effect on the industry. The WP7 team isn't quite there yet.

(The WP7 team had been demoing and leaking Mango features for weeks before the developer event so few features announced there were suprising or hadn't been covered before).

 

[JaggedSac]

Just curious(and lazy), what will be the differences between iCloud for iOS and Zune/SkyDrive for WP7?

 

[gcubed]

It's pretty crazy how much coverage the WWDC gets, but the WP7 conference from a few weeks ago got barely anything. I mean, look at Gizmodo. They've been putting up article after article of apple stuff, and they had ONE WP7 article after the Mango conference.

One affects hundreds of millions of devices... one doesnt

 

[SeanR1221]

Have you guys even read anything Gizmodo puts up?

And this is coming from someone who has an iPhone, iPad, Macbook and iMac!

 

[giga]

Have you guys even read anything Gizmodo puts up?

And this is coming from someone who has an iPhone, iPad, Macbook and iMac!

Why are you reading Gizmodo?

 

[SeanR1221]

Not for news, but to see what they're spewing to others.

It's important to understand what popular outlets tell people.

 

[strata8]

iOS5 beta is available right now, it's easy to install on current devices, and it's easy to take screenshots to show off every single new feature. Some of the features, the iMessage and iCloud, will also have a huge effect on the industry. The WP7 team isn't quite there yet.

(The WP7 team had been demoing and leaking Mango features for weeks before the developer event so few features announced there were suprising or hadn't been covered before).

What? Microsoft has had an iCloud equivalent for a while now (at least, AFAIK, see below)

Just curious(and lazy), what will be the differences between iCloud for iOS and Zune/SkyDrive for WP7?

This is what I'm wondering too. Glancing over the features it doesn't seem any different to the Windows Live services.

 

[VanMardigan]

I think one of the main advantages for iCloud (and maybe the only one?) is backing up App Data. Right now, the most painful part of having to do a full system wipe is having to install apps back on the device. Zune needs to get better at that, but the marketplace needs to be better too. Android shows you your purchased apps, and soon Apple will have the same ability, plus your data will be there when you download them again.

And this is going to be a bigger deal once MS rolls out Win8, in that Apple allows you to stretch your apps across the two devices (phone/tablet) while it seems that Win8 will use an entirely different scripting language, meaning no interoperability of apps.

 

[gcubed]

Why are you reading Gizmodo?

this is the real question

 

[SeanR1221]

See above comment.

 

[giga]

What? Microsoft has had an iCloud equivalent for a while now (at least, AFAIK, see below)


This is what I'm wondering too. Glancing over the features it doesn't seem any different to the Windows Live services.

Other than the old MobileMe services like contacts, calendars, and mail, I don't believe the two are really the same. The main difference are the type of service (storage or streaming) and its automation.

iTunes in the Cloud will automatically push new purchases to your other devices and you can re-download them on other devices (max 10) multiple times. iTunes Match, while $25 a year, matches or uploads non-iTunes purchased songs and makes them available to your other devices. This isn't a streaming option though like Google Music Beta or Amazon Cloud Player. Definitely no subscription service like Zune Pass. It's simply just pushing new songs to your other devices.

Photo Stream isn't a photo storage locker like SkyDrive. SkyDrive is kind of a competitor to other photo lockers like flickr or Facebook--they're meant for sharing. Photo Stream is only automating the process of pushing photos you import/capture on one device and pushing them to all the others. So if you take several photos at a camping trip on your phone, they're automatically pushed across to your Mac/PC, iPad, etc. No compression or resolution downscaling.

This last one I think is the most useful part of iCloud. Developers can use iCloud storage APIs in their apps so that game saves, documents, or key values are never lost. New app downloads are automatically pushed to other devices (download on iTunes initially, pushed seconds later to your iPhone and iPad). Backups for music, apps, books, photos, device settings, app data, texts, and so on are all done over the air daily.

 

[Blablurn]

i have a question. i'm thinking about buying the samsung omnia 7 here in china before going back to germany. it has GSM. does it mean i can also run it with a german sim card?

anyone?

 

[venne]

Mango skydrive videos.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/06/08/microsoft-details-skydrive-integration-with-windows-phone-mango/

 

[Joel Was Right]

Mango skydrive videos.

http://www.engadget.com/2011/06/08/microsoft-details-skydrive-integration-with-windows-phone-mango/

Will sending pictures through that messaging thread (if you have Facebook, Live Messenger and Text integrated) be converted into MMS or be sent over the Internet?

Office integration looks amazing. They just need to release a SkyDrive application for the Mac. I prefer that to a web UI. I can see using this replacing DropBox for me.

 

[RaySpencer]

Well Microsoft won't call it an xBox phone, they'll call it an xPhone.

That said, I really do think that Microsoft should have released an xBox linked handheld gaming device. I'd prefer if it was an iPod Touch shaped device running Mango but even an xPortable, with Zune Pass as a minor secondary feature, would be welcomed. After all the xBox is "a gaming device that does other things"! Wasn't that the main theme of Microsoft's E3 event yesterday?

Its not xBox though, its Xbox. I dont think they consider it to be the 'x' box anymore, its just the 'Xbox'.




edit:

They always show this basically generic phone, but fuck I want them to make it, it looks awesome.

 

[JaggedSac]

Other than the old MobileMe services like contacts, calendars, and mail, I don't believe the two are really the same. The main difference are the type of service (storage or streaming) and its automation.

iTunes in the Cloud will automatically push new purchases to your other devices and you can re-download them on other devices (max 10) multiple times. iTunes Match, while $25 a year, matches or uploads non-iTunes purchased songs and makes them available to your other devices. This isn't a streaming option though like Google Music Beta or Amazon Cloud Player. Definitely no subscription service like Zune Pass. It's simply just pushing new songs to your other devices.

Photo Stream isn't a photo storage locker like SkyDrive. SkyDrive is kind of a competitor to other photo lockers like flickr or Facebook--they're meant for sharing. Photo Stream is only automating the process of pushing photos you import/capture on one device and pushing them to all the others. So if you take several photos at a camping trip on your phone, they're automatically pushed across to your Mac/PC, iPad, etc. No compression or resolution downscaling.

This last one I think is the most useful part of iCloud. Developers can use iCloud storage APIs in their apps so that game saves, documents, or key values are never lost. New app downloads are automatically pushed to other devices (download on iTunes initially, pushed seconds later to your iPhone and iPad). Backups for music, apps, books, photos, device settings, app data, texts, and so on are all done over the air daily.

Hmmm...I don't like the idea of automatically pushing all photos, music, videos, etc to all your devices, with the exception of app save states. It seems like a contradiction with the idea of the cloud. There should just be an interface to access cloud content and grab what you want, except as I mentioned before, app save states.

EDIT: Just watched the Mango/SkyDrive video. That is how I would think a cloud service should be done. I had the sound off since I am at work, but it appears that content(pictures in this case) on SkyDrive is recognized on the device and represented as a thumbnail(so thumbnails are downloaded and possibly cached on device upon initial access of an album). Once the thumbnail is clicked, the full image is then downloaded. I would assume this is how Apple would do it too. It would be dumb otherwise.

 

[Sordid]

Got my HTC 7 Pro in today, loving it so far! A couple of niggles though, apparently it doesn't support Bluetooth file transfers or custom ringtones/message tones? I'm pretty sure my dad's old Windows Mobile 6 phone let you send files via Bluetooth and customise tones, seems pretty mad that they've taken it out.

 

[RaySpencer]

The lack of custom ringtones is one of the most insane things that isnt in WP7.

 

[Joel Was Right]

Listen to these interviews, I just realised that Mango's APIs will be able to integrate into things like the Calendar. So if you've booked a flight on an app, it'll sync those details to your Calendar so you don't have to re-open the app again to check for it. That is very handy.

Last week I discovered that you can Pin a certain Map directions session onto your start screen, so you don't need to constantly enter the Maps app to find that certain route again. I had an exam so when a friend asked for the location of the exam room and when it begins, I was able to save that on my Calendar and 'invite' my other friends from selecting them in my Phonebook when registering that event on the app. They then got those details on their Calender on their WP7 phones. Can you do something like that on Android and iOS from your phone? I was very impressed.

 

[giga]

Hmmm...I don't like the idea of automatically pushing all photos, music, videos, etc to all your devices, with the exception of app save states. It seems like a contradiction with the idea of the cloud. There should just be an interface to access cloud content and grab what you want, except as I mentioned before, app save states.

EDIT: Just watched the Mango/SkyDrive video. That is how I would think a cloud service should be done. I had the sound off since I am at work, but it appears that content(pictures in this case) on SkyDrive is recognized on the device and represented as a thumbnail(so thumbnails are downloaded and possibly cached on device upon initial access of an album). Once the thumbnail is clicked, the full image is then downloaded. I would assume this is how Apple would do it too. It would be dumb otherwise.

Yeah, well, that's just like, your opinion, man.

I like the idea of purchasing an app or song on your computer, or importing some photos from your camera to your computer, and having them pushed to your other devices without needing to sync or download manually. If that doesn't float your boat, you're free to turn off automatic downloads.

 

[JaggedSac]

Yeah, well, that's just like, your opinion, man.

I like the idea of purchasing an app or song on your computer, or importing some photos from your camera to your computer, and having them pushed to your other devices without needing to sync or download manually. If that doesn't float your boat, you're free to turn off automatic downloads.

lol, well yeah man, its a forum.

Apple should rename it to iSync instead