its all the same hardware, if one line gets it, there is no reason why they all cant
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Windows Phone |OT2|
- Thread starter brotkasten
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its all the same hardware, if one line gets it, there is no reason why they all cant
If this has really got you so perturbed then it's time to move on from WP7. Seriously.
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At this point reading about WP7->WP8 upgrade plans is mentally sapping, nobody seems to have a clue. Thurott says WP8 will require dualcore, which is bullshit. Nobody knows what's going on, and the wild FUD caused by the tech blogs is just fanning the flames.
It's Microsoft, they've made plenty of stupid decisions in the past.
When you have multiple editors from The Verge, Ars Technica, Paul Thurrot, Mary Jo Foley, etc all saying it won't happen (these are real people with credibility to maintain, unlike "MS_Nerd" on Twitter), combined with Microsoft's silence and the evangelists retraction, it doesn't look too promising right now.
The Kin was a stillborn device. We're in the second generation of WP7 handsets now and MS has done a LOT to build up this OS as a platform. Throwing the baby out with the bath water for WP8 is an insane move.
I haven't actually listened to the specific quotes he's said on the matter, but based on what's been brought up here ... I think Paul, etc are potentially conflating two separate issues.
The first question is actual support for the OS to run on the HW? They have made is sound like this is not possible, but there's growing evidence this is not the case. The OS actually is being tested on a number of current phones (though this may be via emulation), so it at least seems possible some or all phones could work.
The second question however is are the providers willing to put out the update? The cynic would say they won't want to in order to sell new phones, or because their lazy ... or whatever ... but the situation is more complicated than that. Granted those reasons may be true of gen 1 phones, but owners of recent releases won't be eligible for a new phone for quite some time. It's not like the providers actually want to fuck them over since it's bad PR ... but they have to weigh it with the risks associated in doing such an upgrade. Companies like AT&T have taken a lot of flack for not doing updates, but even they have actually promised updates for major revisions (Nodo, Mango, Tango) ... many have simply skipped the minor revisions.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong (I'm not particularly familiar with the update specifics), but past FW updates are not the same thing as fully flashing the ROM which would be required here. The problem is that if the process is complex, or worse it goes south (bricks), they are the ones assuming the risk. It will be their phone and store support trying to fix the problem. And worse for them, they would be liable for phone replacements in some circumstances.
That's not the sort of risk many would want to take on. I can't imagine many supporting it unless MS can find a way to make it as simple as current updates ... and make sure it also has a similarly low failure rate.
With the above in mind, I'm wondering if that's were Paul and others are coming from with these rumors. They've just lacked the specificity of why it's unlikely.
Where has Ars Technica said WP7 devices won't get updated?
Was looking and they say that there is nothing technically keeping them from being updated:
http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/ne...upgrade-windows-phones-to-windows-phone-8.ars
ars technica said:
Raistlin, not to mention... I'm sure at the driver level, Windows Phone 7 (Windows CE) is probably entirely different than Windows Phone 8 (Windows NT). Older phones getting upgrades would probably require some non-trivial amount of work from the OEMs. I wouldn't be surprised if Samsung and HTC didn't want to do that work, I would be very surprised if Nokia didn't.
Of course it's feasible. As long as WP8 development is close enough to W8 development.
In that case the major difference between a W8 app and a WP8 app would be the UI with most of the code working across platforms.
If not updating WP7 devices gets WP8 closer to W8 (both in shared code and development), then that's what should be done.
Tying WP8 to W8 would probably be great for the platform.
Even if WP7 don't get WP8 I'm going to assume they'll be supported in some way for quite some time, what with those new low-end devices.
frontieruk
Member
Aren't tango devices classed as 2nd gen? With the reduced memory requirements they wouldn't see the update.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
You can do a year of ZunePass for $99, so it's a bit less than $10 at that price.
frontieruk
Member
The update procedure would be no different to an end user they'd be no more risk than a standard update bar a fuck up like nodo with Samsung not testing a specific fw release
Wait ... you mean you can trade in your 900 for a white for $35?
good point
Complex Shadow
Cudi Lame
Phone-ception except this time everyone loses.
can't wait to test this out later. from what i ve seen from the mockup its pretty solid. its about time neogaf got an official mobile app.
Be careful what you wish for.
If Qualcomm S4 chips are the baseline for the next version, I'd be seriously concerned about performance. Check Anandtech's write up on Krait. The CPU performance absolutely trounces S1 and S2 devices (see Nexus One and HTC Thunderbolt performance, respectively). The GPU performance difference will be extreme as well, even more so if they are targeting the 3XX Adreno.
The mobile hardware scene is moving really fast; performance more than doubling annually fast. Current Windows Phones are based on old hardware. S1 chips were old when the platform launched in 2010. The S2 chips in the second gen phones are better, but still don't come close to current hardware.
I'd be wary of wanting the new system on the old devices. The next platform will be much better if it is not designed with current WP7 units in mind.
Yes. My store won't get them till sometime tomorrow. They have mine on hold when it comes in.
Nice. Gonna stop at some stores in the morning
Do you expect the core OS to need a lot more horsepower though? I guess it's hard to know until we know exactly what changes are being made. Assuming no major changes to multitasking and background agents, I don't see why the current gen phones shouldn't be able to handle any normal tasks.
Remember, iOS5 still runs on the 3GS.
Complex Shadow
Cudi Lame
i would love to see an s4 windows phone. just so people would shut up about how old the hardware is.
antiquegamer
Member
The new mobile Gaf is nice, even option to pin tile built-in.
A properly designed OS scales. Nothing in the core of it should need that much raw power, both from a battery and performance standpoint. More horsepower should be only necessary for applications.
And where is the "go to bottom of page" button on the neogaf site? Am I not seeing it or did they remove it?
Edit: nm, found it
Pretty badass indeed.
antiquegamer
Member
Don't know him but he got my thanks and respect.
Good Job Bob
Member
Definitely will take your advice of leaving WP. Gonna go back to my 4S after Nokia gives me my $100 credit. Also I don't know if it's my phone or car (Microsoft Sync system) but my music stops whenever I get a new message and a notification appears on my head display.
Complex Shadow
Cudi Lame
i would love to see MS say that all devices that have WP7 get WP8 update. not for all the people who bought lumia or to stop them from making a mistake. but just to breakup this internet "journalist" circle jerk.
Uh, I think that's intentional and pretty cool.
Woot! Finally got my Windows Phone (HTC Trophy). Playing around with it now and setting everything up.
1) What are some must have apps? So far I have HTC Hub...and that's about it.
2) What are some apps that have cool and useful live tiles?
3) What's the best free
- weather app
- stocks app
- grocery list app
4) Do you guys use the FB and Twitter apps, even though they're already integrated?
5) I don't really like this Trophy's screen...the blacks are more like a dark gray. Is there any way to increase blackness or contrast, other than the three brightness levels?
1) What are some must have apps? So far I have HTC Hub...and that's about it.
2) What are some apps that have cool and useful live tiles?
3) What's the best free
- weather app
- stocks app
- grocery list app
4) Do you guys use the FB and Twitter apps, even though they're already integrated?
5) I don't really like this Trophy's screen...the blacks are more like a dark gray. Is there any way to increase blackness or contrast, other than the three brightness levels?
Get appflow for great app recommendations. Out of the free weather apps, I quite like gisometeo and stormglass. Dunno about stock apps, but for list apps, I've used shopping list and shared shopping list, both of which were enough for my basic needs. I have never had to use the Facebook app since the built in functionality pretty much covers everything I need, but for twitter I sometimes switch to Mehdoh.
It isn't free but I really like MyStocks for a stock app. There is a free version called MyStocks Portfolio that's not quite as feature rich but still good. The live tile is, to me, the most important thing anyway.
I do use a Twitter app but I don't use Facebook. For my relatively small group of Facebook friends the integration works perfectly.
-If you need a news app I recommend BBC News Mobile. A billion pinnable tiles for whatever category of news you could want and it's pretty feature rich. Good use of Metro as well.
-If you're a golfer and want an app for rangefinding/score keeping pick up Executive Caddie while it's free. Great app and online service.
-I'd recommend NextGen Reader if you need an RSS reader. Not free, but high quality and fast.
Unfortunately the screen black level is just a problem of backlit LCD displays. The best thing about LED screens is the true blacks and high contrast ratios. Hopefully Verizon will actually bring a good new phone out soon as they've recently implied.
I do use a Twitter app but I don't use Facebook. For my relatively small group of Facebook friends the integration works perfectly.
-If you need a news app I recommend BBC News Mobile. A billion pinnable tiles for whatever category of news you could want and it's pretty feature rich. Good use of Metro as well.
-If you're a golfer and want an app for rangefinding/score keeping pick up Executive Caddie while it's free. Great app and online service.
-I'd recommend NextGen Reader if you need an RSS reader. Not free, but high quality and fast.
Unfortunately the screen black level is just a problem of backlit LCD displays. The best thing about LED screens is the true blacks and high contrast ratios. Hopefully Verizon will actually bring a good new phone out soon as they've recently implied.
i doubt it has anything to do with capability and more to do with the kernel change. Carriers and manufacturers most likely dont want to re-write the entire driver set and carriers want absolutely NOTHING to do with an update that wipes your phone
But this is like installing W7 on a random XP machine. As long as the hardware driver is written for the W7, you can install. How much driver do you have to write for W8? The CUP and radio is already written by Qualcomm, so you just have to write the screen and sd card drive.
To the carrier, its no different from a ICS update or iOS 5 update or no-do update.
I am plenty sure when I updated my Palm Treo, it wiped the phone and I had to resync with PC. That's the case for WM6 too. I have not done any official Android OTA update so I don't know.
Meus Renaissance
Member
At this point I would upgrade just for a screenshot feature
Robobandit
Member
I was angry at first.. but the phone was free.. and I've been known to buy full price phones off contract before..
I do love the Lumia.. even though the galaxy nexus has better battery life.
The Lumia's call clarity is very impressive.. the best on any phone I've ever had.
I'll use the 900 and the gnex until MS releases apollo devices and see how I feel about the new platform.
I would be very happy if it was designed from the ground up for something like the S4 and every device shipped had that SoC.
I feel like we haven't really seen an OS that truly takes advantage of multiple cores. I'm betting that the experience will be amazing if they do a similar level of optimization to what they have done with WP 7.5.
You just can't beat having software designed around a hardware specification.. it gives Microsoft a chance to compete with Apple on even footing in that very important area.
I do love the Lumia.. even though the galaxy nexus has better battery life.
The Lumia's call clarity is very impressive.. the best on any phone I've ever had.
I'll use the 900 and the gnex until MS releases apollo devices and see how I feel about the new platform.
I would be very happy if it was designed from the ground up for something like the S4 and every device shipped had that SoC.
I feel like we haven't really seen an OS that truly takes advantage of multiple cores. I'm betting that the experience will be amazing if they do a similar level of optimization to what they have done with WP 7.5.
You just can't beat having software designed around a hardware specification.. it gives Microsoft a chance to compete with Apple on even footing in that very important area.
VanMardigan
has calmed down a bit.
Pics or it didn't happen
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