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Winter of Anime 2013 |OT -4| It's not my fault!

Community's choice! What should the next numbering of the |OT| format be?

Results are only viewable after voting.
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D

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
Shining Sunshine said:
Oreki doesn't like to be wrong.
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Does anyone enjoy being wrong? I suppose your continued Hyouka crusade might lead me to believe you do. Oreki is not one to be more upset than others about being wrong, that is simply not a character trait he possesses. The helicopter episode houses a mystery that is important to no one in the series but Oreki. The fact that something is personally important to him is representative of his growth as a character.
Shining Sunshine said:
Their relationship is that Chitanda relies on Oreki to help her. That's all I'm saying. Whether they feel closer to each other is not a real change in their relationship. It may be just my opinion, but I don't feel like Oreki and Chitanda's relationship matured from the first case to the final ep. It was extremely long drawn with no real advances.
Click to expand...
It is clear to me that certain ideas Hyouka presents have been lost on you. Life is enriched by relying on those around you. Oreki also relies on Chitanda to bring meaning and value to his life. As the series closes the lives of both characters have been intertwined, and though challenges often present themselves they serve to strengthen that bond.
 
M

madp

The Light of El Cantare
I thought it was universally known here even by those yet to watch that Birdy S2 is several thousand times better than S1 in every conceivable way but apparently not! Get to it.
 
G

Geneijin

Member
Shining Sunshine said:
Nope, just putting out a conjecture about why people are praising Hyouka's character development. Complexity doesn't help that argument. Chuunibyou's character development is very easy to pick out moments, but Hyouka's poor editing and long drawn story doesn't help its own argument.
Click to expand...
But it wasn't complex. It was subtle character development. What "poor editing" was there specifically in Hyouka?
 
Z

zeroshiki

Member
Geneijin said:
But it wasn't complex. It was subtle character development. What "poor editing" was there specifically in Hyouka?
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There is none. Its all imagined. Hyouka is not worse edited than the vast majority of anime out there. There is no way that is true in this or any other universe.
 
S

Shining Sunshine

Banned
dimb said:
Does anyone enjoy being wrong? I suppose your continued Hyouka crusade might lead me to believe you do. Oreki is not one to be more upset than others about being wrong, that is simply not a character trait he possesses. The helicopter episode houses a mystery that is important to no one in the series but Oreki. The fact that something is personally important to him is representative of his growth as a character.
Click to expand...

Did you forget that he involved everyone? If it was important only to him, he wouldn't have mentioned it to anyone.

dimb said:
It is clear to me that certain ideas Hyouka presents have been lost on you. Life is enriched by relying on those around you. Oreki also relies on Chitanda to bring meaning and value to his life. As the series closes the lives of both characters have been intertwined, and though challenges often present themselves they serve to strengthen that bond.
Click to expand...

Oreki says a bunch of words and nothing happens. That's the end of the series no matter how you spin it.

Geneijin said:
But it wasn't complex. It was subtle character development. What "poor editing" was there specifically in Hyouka?
Click to expand...

Watching the movie that was more than half of the ep? That movie scene could have been cut down 10 minutes and still get the important parts across. Just some editor petting his ego to make it "more dramatic and realistic" or some garbage.

The festival was the most boring part of the series. Chitanda wasting her time in several fanservice moments. That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters. The entire mystery could have been done with in 1-2 episodes. 2 episodes is really stretching it.

Every mystery that spanned more than 1 episode could have been cut down except the first one.
 
R

Risette

A Good Citizen
Shining Sunshine said:
Watching the movie that was more than half of the ep? That movie scene could have been cut down 10 minutes and still get the important parts across. Just some editor petting his ego to make it "more dramatic and realistic" or some garbage.

The festival was the most boring part of the series. Chitanda wasting her time in several fanservice moments. That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters. The entire mystery could have been done with in 1-2 episodes. 2 episodes is really stretching it.

Every mystery that spanned more than 1 episode could have been cut down except the first one.
Click to expand...
You don't know what editing is.
 
D

Dresden

Member
"That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters."

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development.
 
M

Moonlight

Banned
Shining Sunshine said:
Hyouka has cute girls, nice drawing, well animated too. But anyone who says it has character development is quite wrong. Poorly edited series as well that reminded me of the Haruhi fiasco.
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I'm sorry, but I honestly can't fathom how anyone could reach this conclusion. I could understand just not liking their character arcs (but certainly not agree), but claiming that none exists whatsoever is just... what.

EDIT: I'm severely tempted to oblige and start yanking out scenes of Hyouka that would be definitive points of transition for, at the very least, Houtarou, but I imagine at the rate this thread moves at, the discussion will leave me behind long before I finish even getting screen captures.
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
""That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters."

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development."

I just wanted to see what this would look like.
 
C

chickdigger802

Banned
Smile Precure 46

Candy's true form... eh.

And wow, them VA's put their lungs to work this eps. Great stuff! Shame there wasn't much 'animation' :S

next week pierrot's form reminds me of myotismon (sp?) lol.
 
D

Dresden

Member
"""That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters."

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development."

I just wanted to see what this would look like."

It's pretty weird.
 
D

duckroll

Member
""""That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters."

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development."

I just wanted to see what this would look like."

It's pretty weird."

I don't think it's that weird. Okay, now it's weird.
 
S

sonicmj1

Member
Shining Sunshine said:
So what of this character development? Again, this event happened and had no affect on the rest of the series. He doesn't change.
Click to expand...

That moment has reverberations through the rest of the arc and beyond. I'm not going to give you screencaps and analysis for everything that happens.

Dialogue is not the only thing to rely on. If you're taking in story one ep at a time, it'll end up with hasty conclusions.

Oreki doesn't like to be wrong. That's been established since forever. There was a moment in that ep when his intuition hit him about what might have happened. Even without all the facts, he had an idea of what was wrong at that point. Whatever he did with his friends is damage control for his low energy life style.
Click to expand...

If you're going to ignore the dialogue, the direction (there's clear symbolism here with the stoplights as he's giving his explanation, supporting that he could have let this go, but didn't in order to explain it to Chitanda), and everything that's been established about the character before and after this point, then I can't have a productive discussion with you.

Their relationship is that Chitanda relies on Oreki to help her. That's all I'm saying. Whether they feel closer to each other is not a real change in their relationship. It may be just my opinion, but I don't feel like Oreki and Chitanda's relationship matured from the first case to the final ep. It was extremely long drawn with no real advances.
Click to expand...

It takes the entire series for the characters to understand why they need each other, and how significant they both are to each other. Oreki relies on Chitanda as much as she relies on him. These are developments as significant for their individual maturation as a love confession would be.

Character development is an internal thing, and it happens independent of the plot. I'm not sure why you're fixated on plot-related outcomes here, yet willing to accept entirely internal events as proof of character development in Chuunibyou.
 
S

Shining Sunshine

Banned
pizzaroll said:
You don't know what editing is.
Click to expand...

Cut scenes, move scenes, trim the fat.

I've done movie editing for a year, so, yes I know what editing is.

Dresden said:
"That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters."

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development.
Click to expand...

And explain the character development that happened?

That Mayaka "matured" or something? Her personality didn't even change a bit from beginning to end.
Oreki decided to help out for the 5th time? What a surprise. "I can't believe Oreki would do something like that!" ~daishocku~
 
R

Regulus Tera

Romanes Eunt Domus
"""""That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters."

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development."

I just wanted to see what this would look like."

It's pretty weird."

I don't think it's that weird. Okay, now it's weird. "
You are running this joke into the ground. Just like with the Hyouka discussion.
 
D

Dresden

Member
Shining Sunshine said:
That Mayaka "matured" or something? Her personality didn't even change a bit from beginning to end.
Oreki decided to help out for the 5th time? What a surprise. "I can't believe Oreki would do something like that!" ~daishocku~
Click to expand...
There's even an extended running sequence to cap it off, man.

Dunno if I even want to start when your definition of 'development' seems to hinge more on external factors than within. Dead girls aren't a requirement for this kinda thing.
 
K

kayos90

Tragic victim of fan death
duckroll said:
""""That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters."

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development."

I just wanted to see what this would look like."

It's pretty weird."

I don't think it's that weird. Okay, now it's weird.
Click to expand...

Why are yall quoting weird?
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
"'"'"'That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters.'

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development."

I just wanted to see what this would look like.'

It's pretty weird."

I don't think it's that weird. Okay, now it's weird.'
You are running this joke into the ground. Just like with the Hyouka discussion."

So you're saying it should look like this.

Quotception.
 
S

Shining Sunshine

Banned
sonicmj1 said:
That moment has reverberations through the rest of the arc and beyond. I'm not going to give you screencaps and analysis for everything that happens.
Click to expand...

And so you say... if he learned anything, he would have not excluded his friends in his blackmail deal.

sonicmj1 said:
If you're going to ignore the dialogue, the direction (there's clear symbolism here with the stoplights as he's giving his explanation, supporting that he could have let this go, but didn't in order to explain it to Chitanda), and everything that's been established about the character before and after this point, then I can't have a productive discussion with you.
Click to expand...

I didn't ignore anything. You ignored the backstory and previous episode established plot devices. You just said the things I told you that you're ignoring.

Oreki's character has been established, and what he did in that ep remains very similar to the beginning. What dialogue he said is to deter his friends from pestering him as he has always done in previous episodes.

sonicmj1 said:
It takes the entire series for the characters to understand why they need each other, and how significant they both are to each other. Oreki relies on Chitanda as much as she relies on him. These are developments as significant for their individual maturation as a love confession would be.

Character development is an internal thing, and it happens independent of the plot. I'm not sure why you're fixated on plot-related outcomes here, yet willing to accept entirely internal events as proof of character development in Chuunibyou.
Click to expand...

Oreki and Chitanda relied on each other since the end of the Hyouka mystery. Nothing has changed. Might as well end the series at that part.

pizzaroll said:
If that's all you think editing is, I'm fearful for the future.
Click to expand...

Then I guess you like the Endless Eight? Sure had a lot of material there.

Dresden said:
There's even an extended running sequence to cap it off, man.

Dunno if I even want to start when your definition of 'development' seems to hinge more on external factors than within. Dead girls aren't a requirement for this kinda thing.
Click to expand...

It's all about characters growing. They learned nothing, they didn't mature. That's the episode. No character development.
 
C

curlyfriski

Banned
Shining Sunshine said:
Cut scenes, move scenes, trim the fat.

I've done movie editing for a year, so, yes I know what editing is.
Click to expand...

You should check out this guy named Eisenstein.

Haly said:
"'"'"'That entire cooking episode was completely pointless that added nothing to the plot or the characters.'

Ironically, that episode is a showcase of character development."

I just wanted to see what this would look like.'

It's pretty weird."

I don't think it's that weird. Okay, now it's weird.'
You are running this joke into the ground. Just like with the Hyouka discussion."

So you're saying it should look like this.

Quotception.
Click to expand...

I'm not even going to try to make sense of what's going on here
 
D

dakkumauji

Member
Shakugan no Shana S 04

yYabd.jpg
Click to expand...

And like what happened, I'll just forget about what just happened.

Quite a lot more heavyhanded on the making you feel the feels, and time wasting with the insert song flashback date. It wasn't bad and was quite more well done than probably most of everything else Shana related (besides the movie) before this. I guess I didn't like the ending even though that was probably the only way it could end. So, :[.
 
H

Haly

One day I realized that sadness is just another word for not enough coffee.
"It's definitely not fun here.

Look what weekends do to people."

It's already Monday.
 
D

dimb

Bjergsen is the greatest midlane in the world
Shining Sunshine said:
Did you forget that he involved everyone? If it was important only to him, he wouldn't have mentioned it to anyone.
Click to expand...
I just rewatched the entire series. The issue at hand is only important to Hotaro. He brings up the topic with the Classics Club because the mystery crosses his mind while he is with them. Chitanda tags along because she cares about Hotaro and wants to see what sort of things draw his interest. Satoshi doesn't come because he has homework. Ibara doesn't come because it is not something that matters to her. Hotaro even points out that she could have been helpful had she tagged along. The series very explicitly points out that this was something Hotaro alone was interested in, and that it was unusual and out of character for him to have interests and pursue them.
Shining Sunshine said:
Oreki says a bunch of words and nothing happens. That's the end of the series no matter how you spin it.
Click to expand...
Words are important in stories. It is unfortunate that they are difficult for you to process.
Shining Sunshine said:
The festival was the most boring part of the series.
Click to expand...
What is there even to say to something like this?
 
F

firehawk12

Subete no aware
darkside31337 said:
Seriously? Just because somebody disagrees with you doesn't make them a troll.

Although for the record his best work is easily Mononoke with nothing else coming close.
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I don't even care about that, I just meant I am genuinely shocked that cosmic would remotely like anything by KyoAni, let alone Chuu2.

cosmicblizzard said:
I don't like the art style in Mononoke and Trapeze's visuals are just nonsense.

I will say that I think Tsuritama has a better art style than C. The latter just appeals to me more in every other category, including the world design.
Click to expand...
I barely watched one episode of C, so I guess I can't really say, but there's no way that it had better storytelling or characters than Tsuritama.

Also, why do you like Chuu2? If you don't mind my asking.

---
Nisemonogatari Smile Precure 46
rhGr4l.jpg

Indeed.

You know, this episode was basically shounen as fuck, but it was still a bit disappointing compared to the power up that happened ages ago.

Some of their moves feature nonsensical English, but hey, at least Beauty basically got the best move.

Oh, and if you are one of those crazy spoiler freaks, do not watch the preview at the end. I can't believe they showed that, given how they teased right at the end.

I suppose one final point of miscellany would be that I expect a whole fuck-ton of doujin based on this episode, if only for obvious reasons. Pervs gotta perv! lol
 
C

Crash Station

Member
firehawk12 said:
I barely watched one episode of C, so I guess I can't really say, but there's no way that it had better storytelling or characters than Tsuritama.
Click to expand...

Eh, Tsuritama had a ton of dull moments, so I don't really have any problem saying C had better pacing and a better buildup:payoff ratio. I wouldn't really compare them anyway.

Also, why do you like Chuu2? If you don't mind my asking.
Click to expand...

I don't know.
 
C

cajunator

Banned
The problem I mainly have with Hyouka is that the show is not that entertaining.
It has meaning and character development and themes and all that stuff, but it falls short on entertainment except for the festival arc. entertainment can say a million things but it is useless if it doesnt engage an audience while doing so.
Thats the main reason why Hyouka had the whole moe glassy eyed Chitanda.
It needed a glossy veneer to dress up the drab message.
Thats not saying the message itself was bad just bland.
It needed that spice.
It demonstrated the importance of moe.

Kincaido said:
But it's Monday now.
Click to expand...

Your monday is my Friday.
Tuesday morning begins a glorious 7 day weekend.
 
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