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[TheYanger]

Speaking of ramkahen rep, I skipped everything but Vashj'ir on my Death Knight. I'll be doing all the zones a another character in a few days, but I can't buy some of the other tabards yet.

Assuming I just need to do a handful of quests to get access to the tabard and dailies, would there be a huge rep loss for not doing the zones completely?

Doing the zones, aside from vashj'ir (which gives almost nothing), gives you a huge leg up on rep for time invested. You can be nearly revered with everything before stepping foot in instances if you do them.

 

[The Lamonster]

Wow, fuck me this is just the worst.

I just got the same thing.

 

[Twig]

You people DO realize Tuesday is maintenance day, right?

 

[Touchdown]

I found druid tanking to be meh. Even if it's fun they are probably the worst tanks in the game right now.

Well that's your opinion i guess. I love bear tanking . Can't see how you can say they are the worst. In fact I think they are right there at the top. I've never had any complaints in dungeons or raids bear tanking. As long as your geared properly, your golden.

 

[keiichi]

Second Ramkahen daily
http://www.wowhead.com/quest=28736/fire-from-the-sky

 

[dimb]

You people DO realize Tuesday is maintenance day, right?

I've never gotten this on Tuesday before, but I'm holding off on reinstalling the game until the servers go up.

 

[borghe]

Doing the zones, aside from vashj'ir (which gives almost nothing), gives you a huge leg up on rep for time invested. You can be nearly revered with everything before stepping foot in instances if you do them.

actually you need vashj'ir for the Earthen Ring rep (also a little left over in Twilight Highlands). Doing all of the cata quests gets you:

Earthen Ring: Almost revered
Hyjal: Revered
Therazane: Almost revered
Ramkahen: 1/2 way to revered
Dragonmaw (or alli): 1/2 way to revered.

Therazane is the easiest rep by far. You end at almost revered and they offer up 7 dailies. If you have the rep increase from either human and/or guild perk, it's 263 per quest turn in for 1841 per day. To get through revered is only 12 days without the tabard. Ooohh.. this might be off a little also, because I didn't get around to the stonecore quest until after I hit exalted.. don't remember how much that one was worth.

Next easiest is Hyjal... servers are down ATM but you literally get to revered with quests. Getting to exalted is basically only having to get 4/5ths of the way through revered. So on average like 6-9 heroic runs. DPS casters luck out on this one as there is no point to getting exalted with Hyjal if you are one. I mean I guess they have the cloth belt, but the Dreamless Belt is significantly better and only costs 4 Dreamcloth. I just sold one in trade yesterday for 3.5K and don't feel bad about it (5K on the AH). So if you're a tailor or can convince a buddy tailor to spend 4 CDs on you (and reward him appropriately), get the Dreamless Belt instead.

Next is Dragonmaw (or whoever you allies gets). You only get about halfway into honored, but they have 5 dailies for 1420 rep a day (with guild perk). Not doing any dungeons it will take you 20 days.

Finally is Earthen Ring and Ramkahen. Earthen Ring you start out a little closer to Revered, Ramkahen gives you 400 rep per day worth of quests. Either way both are going to be your longest grind by far. My suggestion is, between the two of these figure out which has the better reward for you and equip that tabard IMMEDIATELY upon starting heroics. I did that with Earthen Ring and had it within a week. Only problem is now that the guild is done with heroics (including me) except for dailies, grinding out the other rep is taking forever. basically 2-2.6K "per day", so essentially like dailies, only dailies that take like an hour or more..

Oh, I didn't mention the TB faction which I guess I should, but this is arguably the most complicated (but potentially the easiest). TB offers up 6 dailies on the peninsula and a possible 12 quests on TB itself. The 6 on the peninsula anyone can do. The ones in TB itself work like this. Each of the two quest givers has a total of 6 possible quests they can give, 9 of which are bundled into threes (hole, ghosts, demons) and the remaining three being crocs, problim and 12 remaining enemy forces. While your faction controls TB, you will usually be given one set of the three, and then the three remaining quests. I believe I have seen it once where I was given two of the three sets though. Anyway, you have until the next battle starts queuing (15 minutes prior) to complete and turn in these quests. I hear this is changing in 4.0.6 where if you complete the quests but the quest givers despawn you can still turn them in at your camp. Now the catch to these quests is that if/when you win TB again, the quest givers reset with potentially new quests. So basically TB proper works like this. If your side controls TB all the time, you can get 4400-6600 rep per day running TB dailies. If your side never has control of TB, you can get 2200 rep running just the peninsula dailies. If your server regularly changes control of TB, at minimum you can get 4400 rep and potentially more depending on how things go. You also get 263 rep (all rep numbers are adjusted for bonus, sorry) for winning TB and 263 rep (or 368, can't remember) for beating Argaloth. Bottom line for TB though is that really, you can pound out Exalted in TB in a week or two tops.

Whew.

Second Ramkahen daily
http://www.wowhead.com/quest=28736/fire-from-the-sky

yeah.. together they are 421 rep (adjusted). However be warned that this quest is OFTEN bugged where only one or two spots will spawn soldiers.. When you have three or four players all on at the same time it gets REALLY frustrating and can end up taking 10-15 minutes for those 263 points..........

 

[Bisnic]

actually you need vashj'ir for the Earthen Ring rep (also a little left over in Twilight Highlands). Doing all of the cata quests gets you:

Earthen Ring: Almost revered
Hyjal: Revered
Therazane: Almost revered
Ramkahen: 1/2 way to revered
Dragonmaw (or alli): 1/2 way to revered.

Therazane is the easiest rep by far. You end at almost revered and they offer up 7 dailies. If you have the rep increase from either human and/or guild perk, it's 263 per quest turn in for 1841 per day. To get through revered is only 12 days without the tabard. Ooohh.. this might be off a little also, because I didn't get around to the stonecore quest until after I hit exalted.. don't remember how much that one was worth.

Next easiest is Hyjal... servers are down ATM but you literally get to revered with quests. Getting to exalted is basically only having to get 4/5ths of the way through revered. So on average like 6-9 heroic runs. DPS casters luck out on this one as there is no point to getting exalted with Hyjal if you are one. I mean I guess they have the cloth belt, but the Dreamless Belt is significantly better and only costs 4 Dreamcloth. I just sold one in trade yesterday for 3.5K and don't feel bad about it (5K on the AH). So if you're a tailor or can convince a buddy tailor to spend 4 CDs on you (and reward him appropriately), get the Dreamless Belt instead.

Next is Dragonmaw (or whoever you allies gets). You only get about halfway into honored, but they have 5 dailies for 1420 rep a day (with guild perk). Not doing any dungeons it will take you 20 days.

Finally is Earthen Ring and Ramkahen. Earthen Ring you start out a little closer to Revered, Ramkahen gives you 400 rep per day worth of quests. Either way both are going to be your longest grind by far. My suggestion is, between the two of these figure out which has the better reward for you and equip that tabard IMMEDIATELY upon starting heroics. I did that with Earthen Ring and had it within a week. Only problem is now that the guild is done with heroics (including me) except for dailies, grinding out the other rep is taking forever. basically 2-2.6K "per day", so essentially like dailies, only dailies that take like an hour or more..

Oh, I didn't mention the TB faction which I guess I should, but this is arguably the most complicated (but potentially the easiest). TB offers up 6 dailies on the peninsula and a possible 12 quests on TB itself. The 6 on the peninsula anyone can do. The ones in TB itself work like this. Each of the two quest givers has a total of 6 possible quests they can give, 9 of which are bundled into threes (hole, ghosts, demons) and the remaining three being crocs, problim and 12 remaining enemy forces. While your faction controls TB, you will usually be given one set of the three, and then the three remaining quests. I believe I have seen it once where I was given two of the three sets though. Anyway, you have until the next battle starts queuing (15 minutes prior) to complete and turn in these quests. I hear this is changing in 4.0.6 where if you complete the quests but the quest givers despawn you can still turn them in at your camp. Now the catch to these quests is that if/when you win TB again, the quest givers reset with potentially new quests. So basically TB proper works like this. If your side controls TB all the time, you can get 4400-6600 rep per day running TB dailies. If your side never has control of TB, you can get 2200 rep running just the peninsula dailies. If your server regularly changes control of TB, at minimum you can get 4400 rep and potentially more depending on how things go. You also get 263 rep (all rep numbers are adjusted for bonus, sorry) for winning TB and 263 rep (or 368, can't remember) for beating Argaloth. Bottom line for TB though is that really, you can pound out Exalted in TB in a week or two tops.

Whew.


yeah.. together they are 421 rep (adjusted). However be warned that this quest is OFTEN bugged where only one or two spots will spawn soldiers.. When you have three or four players all on at the same time it gets REALLY frustrating and can end up taking 10-15 minutes for those 263 points..........

I never saw the Ramkahen bug you're talking about. There is always around 8 groups spawning. The only bug i've seen is that sometimes, a group is not even walking around, but that's a good bug! Easy kills.

But Ramkahen rep sucks to farm, you only get 2 dailies, and when you're done with Uldum normal quests, you're barely like 20% into Honored. Bleh. I wish all factions had the same numbers of dailies as Therazane, or at least Dragonmaw/Wildhammer.

 

[Scrow]

as for all of the "5K is awful at 329", sorry, but you're full of shit. 5-6K average over the course of the instance is pretty normal at 329 in 5-man heroics with non-final enchants/gems.

on my feral druid, at 329 i was getting 8k. no final gems/enchants. 5k sounds low to me.

 

[Kyoufu]

Yeah 8k at that item level is what I would expect. 5k or less is just...well...I don't know, read elitist jerks or something..

 

[Dunlop]

Finally got my first cata raid drop, the Ag ring off of Omnotron. Feels good!

Grats we hit Omnotron tonight, last week we dropped magmaw which turned out to be a pretty easy fight once the adds are controlled.

 

[Twig]

I've never gotten this on Tuesday before, but I'm holding off on reinstalling the game until the servers go up.

Tuesday morning is maintenance time. How you don't know this by now (assuming you've played more than a couple weeks) is beyond me. It doesn't always last as long as it's lasting today, but it's always there.

Actually, I think it might be every other Tuesday, now. It USED to be every single Tuesday, definitely.

lol reinstalling y wud u do dat

If you start the game, not the launcher, you'll get the message that says maintenance started at 3am PSt and is ending at 11am PST.

 

[zugzug]

oh yeah with 8 second hex I'm not talking about 1 v 1 battle when you get jumped 2 v 1, Hex is of no use if less than time it takes to kill 1 person let alone if they are wearing medallion anyaways your screwed.

I don't get it its ok for a Rogue to stunlock you from full health to dead for the past many expansions but not for a shamans hex to give you enough time to kill someone else?

lolwut?

 

[borghe]

for the record, I don't remember what I was getting. I also don't know exactly how to read recount perfectly well (or I should say I don't care). I just know right now, hit capped and with 6K spellpower, the damage done screen on recount says like 11-12K usually right now on bosses in BWD and TotFW. I know in heroics typically through trash I might get 6K, I might get 8K, I might get 9K, with the same gear (same recount screen). Now maybe I'm reading recount wrong (or on the wrong screen). My rotation as fire mage is basically living bomb when down, pyroblast! when procced, fireball mostly except scorches to conserve a little mana, and combustion when ignite, pyroblast, LB and critical mass are procced (and impact if it's procced), and ball of fire when up. burn phase is trinket, MI and Timewarp is BLing. ilevel on armory is currently 347.

 

[Twig]

oh yeah with 8 second hex I'm not talking about 1 v 1 battle when you get jumped 2 v 1, Hex is of no use if less than time it takes to kill 1 person let alone if they are wearing medallion anyaways your screwed.

I don't get it its ok for a Rogue to stunlock you from full health to dead for the past many expansions but not for a shamans hex to give you enough time to kill someone else?

lolwut?

Rogues can't do that anymore. (Or shouldn't be able to, anyway, if I've been interpreting blue posts correctly.)

Blizzard wants fights to last longer in PvP now.

Besides that, it'd be fucking stupid if hex enabled a shaman to take on two people and win, unless the shaman is really just that much better than the two enemies.

 

[Flib]

Grats we hit Omnotron tonight, last week we dropped magmaw which turned out to be a pretty easy fight once the adds are controlled.

Yeah, our healers were undergeared so we haven't downed Magmaw yet, we have Omnotron down well now. Our healers are in a much better place, so we should be fine for Magmaw now. Our dps already has the adds down, so it's just a matter of having sufficient healing.

 

[funkmastergeneral]

Tuesday morning is maintenance time. How you don't know this by now (assuming you've played more than a couple weeks) is beyond me. It doesn't always last as long as it's lasting today, but it's always there.

Actually, I think it might be every other Tuesday, now. It USED to be every single Tuesday, definitely.

lol reinstalling y wud u do dat

If you start the game, not the launcher, you'll get the message that says maintenance started at 3am PSt and is ending at 11am PST.

I'm reinstalling the game as well and am only at about 50%, so it's annoying that I can't download it during maintenance.

 

[Twig]

I'm reinstalling the game as well and am only at about 50%, so it's annoying that I can't download it during maintenance.

Oh, I misinterpreted what he was saying. I thought he was implying that in his rage he was considering reinstalling. The reality is far less insane. x:

Carry on!

 

[Kyoufu]

oh yeah with 8 second hex I'm not talking about 1 v 1 battle when you get jumped 2 v 1, Hex is of no use if less than time it takes to kill 1 person let alone if they are wearing medallion anyaways your screwed.

I don't get it its ok for a Rogue to stunlock you from full health to dead for the past many expansions but not for a shamans hex to give you enough time to kill someone else?

lolwut?

Did you fail to realise that other classes got the same treatment? CC spells like Polymorph got the 8-sec treatment too.

 

[Dunlop]

Yeah, our healers were undergeared so we haven't downed Magmaw yet, we have Omnotron down well now. Our healers are in a much better place, so we should be fine for Magmaw now. Our dps already has the adds down, so it's just a matter of having sufficient healing.

The blessing of running a bunch of dungeons (especially with the initial mana woes of the Priest) is that I have my shadowfiend/Hymn of Hope casting down to a science. Used a Mytical mana pot (with 40% mana buff from alchemy stone) and 2 shamans that particular night timing their mana totems...and I was almost oom, so I see why your healers could have issues :lol Also I glyphed lightwell and the group is using it

I still had the new priest cataclysm tactic that is lmost necessary left in my arsenal: Kill yourself, Spirit of Redemption for unlimited heals, rez via soulstone, cast a few heals, kill yourself again for new Spirit of Redemption..profit?

I do so love now how after all these years of being a joke, lightwell is an almost essential part of boss fights

 

[SnakeswithLasers]

as for all of the "5K is awful at 329", sorry, but you're full of shit. 5-6K average over the course of the instance is pretty normal at 329 in 5-man heroics with non-final enchants/gems. ESPECIALLY when you start moving away from survival hunters, destruction locks, fury warriors, assassination rogues, etc. once you get a few 346 items and throw near-BIS gems and enchants on them, yeah your DPS ramps up VERY quickly. But at 329, 330, 331, etc your DPS is exponentially lower than it is when you start gearing up 346.

Based on the thread, most people are in line with the "5k is less than what you'd expect in entry level heroic gear." Maybe you should reconsider saying that everyone except for you is "full of shit" and reevaluate your rotation.

In the course of one response you've updated the initial estimate from 5k to 5-6k (also known as increasing your DPS by 20%), said you're calculating the DPS over the course of an instance (whereas trash pulls shouldn't count as they are completely skewed), and wanted to discount the results if they includes specs that are good at DPS (and I originally said, albeit sarcastically, that 5k would be expected if your whole group was ret paladins).

I don't mean to drag this on because it really isn't a big deal to me what DPS you or your guild is doing, but I don't understand the need to name-call in the thread because others' experiences are different than yours.

 

[ToyMachine228]

My guild is 6/12 heading into this raid week. We should definitely get Atramedes this week, we got some good attempts in last night. Beyond that I don't know how fast they'll fall. Haven't looked into many fights beyond this yet.

 

[funkmastergeneral]

My guild is 6/12 heading into this raid week. We should definitely get Atramedes this week, we got some good attempts in last night. Beyond that I don't know how fast they'll fall. Haven't looked into many fights beyond this yet.

Ascendant Council, Nef, and Cho'gall are all pretty tough fights. We've put in two raid nights to down Cho'gall and haven't gotten it yet.

 

[Ferrio]

I had the stupidest wipe on Magmaw last night. I'm the tank, and I ran in like normal at the start of the fight. The priest had just specced to holy, so when he shielded me I suddenly had a boost a speed. I flew right over the edge, causing a raid wipe. The priest was in hysterics over it.

 

[borghe]

Based on the thread, most people are in line with the "5k is less than what you'd expect in entry level heroic gear." Maybe you should reconsider saying that everyone except for you is "full of shit" and reevaluate your rotation.

there are three of you insisting this, not "most", and one is comparing going into 80 instances in LK epics to heroics where your damage to protection ration changes dramatically right at the start. and another comes from, surprise, a rogue, presumably assassin. I'm not knocking either or calling either a liar.. just pointing out that from DPS class to class and spec to spec there are going to be wildly different results from folks first hitting 329.

In the course of one response you've updated the initial estimate from 5k to 5-6k (also known as increasing your DPS by 20%), said you're calculating the DPS over the course of an instance (whereas trash pulls shouldn't count as they are completely skewed), and wanted to discount the results if they includes specs that are good at DPS (and I originally said, albeit sarcastically, that 5k would be expected if your whole group was ret paladins).

5-6K wasn't increasing DPS by 20%. It's just presuming that to you guys, someone doing 5.6K is still "doing 5K". I also was not stipulating how I was calculating it, just pointing out that there are like 3 or 4 damage screens on recount alone, and the first (damage dealt) isn't really a great measurement of the past 5-10 seconds of actual DPS.

I don't mean to drag this on because it really isn't a big deal to me what DPS you or your guild is doing, but I don't understand the need to name-call in the thread because others' experiences are different than yours.

yet I have to learn a better rotation despite never once complaining about my initial DPS. Hell, I even GAVE you my rotation before this response, AND if you look it will be the same basic rotation on EJ... and yet I get cited for name calling. Hello Mr. Pot, I guess I'm a black kettle.

anyway, onto better things... last night was my personal first real look at Omnitron... guild's umm... second or third. For me personally, the entire beginning of the fight is a pretty massive sensory overload. Had the officers telling me to work on Power Conversion after which a few pulls I realized power conversion is... blah.. a ncie buff to steal, but it's pointless to give any real time to it as long as he has the 10 second non-stealable spell that actually procs the stealable converted power buff. just trying to remove the stack completely I did get 15 stacks on me.. heh... 150% DPS was nice. but after all of that after we left I settled down and wrote it all out.. for me specifically as ranged DPS it comes down to:

don't stand in shit
if you have the big red laser, stand still and let everyone else run away.
if you have the electrical field you get to run away
when the poison bombs spawn stop everything else and spam frostbolt and blast wave to snare them

unfortunately our group wasn't synced enough to down them, but the other 10-man did and we got them to about 33%.. have a pretty strong feeling tonight we'll get them easily in 25-man. I'm hoping we start with conclave, head to omnitron, then work on either magmaw or Al'Akir.

 

[Dunlop]

I had the stupidest wipe on Magmaw last night. I'm the tank, and I ran in like normal at the start of the fight. The priest had just specced to holy, so when he shielded me I suddenly had a boost a speed. I flew right over the edge, causing a raid wipe. The priest was in hysterics over it.

:lol That is so awesome

We wiped the first time there by the hunter not paying attention to how insanely huge his hit box is and autoattacking him while we were prepping

 

[borghe]

:lol That is so awesome

We wiped the first time there by the hunter not paying attention to how insanely huge his hit box is and autoattacking him while we were prepping

we've had to reset omnitron a few times because the shaman keeps forgetting not to pop totems at the top while we're buffing. totems will ALWAYS aggro the first mech halfway through buffing

 

[Flib]

We were getting blocked on Omnotron last night because our other tank was failing hard at the interrupts on Arcanotron. He's usually pretty good, must have been having an off-night. We finally got the kill when he got Arcanotron but we did a tank-swap. I thought that was going to possibly be messy (as I was tanking Electron at the time), but it worked well and we downed it with everyone alive, and no Arcane Annihilators got out.

It's actually a pretty satisfying fight for the entry level of the first raid tier. Requires actually decent execution.

 

[Xiaoki]

actually you need vashj'ir for the Earthen Ring rep (also a little left over in Twilight Highlands). Doing all of the cata quests gets you:

Earthen Ring: Almost revered
Hyjal: Revered
Therazane: Almost revered
Ramkahen: 1/2 way to revered
Dragonmaw (or alli): 1/2 way to revered.

Is your character a Human with the guild rep bonus?

Ive leveled 3 characters to 85 are these estimates are way high. Especially Twilight Highlands rep.
On all 3 characters I have done every quest possible in Twilight Highlands and the Skullcrusher the Mountain quest will be just enough to put me into Honored.

 

[borghe]

agreed. it's not really a hard fight at all outside of the poison bombs and AAs. beyond those two, just move out of the way of shit. But both of those two really need to be perfect (or close to it and a perfect recovery) or you'll pretty much wipe.

Is your character a Human with the guild rep bonus?

Ive leveled 3 characters to 85 are these estimates are way high. Especially Twilight Highlands rep.
On all 3 characters I have done every quest possible in Twilight Highlands and the Skullcrusher the Mountain quest will be just enough to put me into Honored.

sorry. I did state that they were all buffed, however it's only the guild buff of 5%. so all of my 263 numbers are actually 250 and 368 numbers are 350. still, adding up rep on the quest page on wowhead I get 14725 for just quests.

http://www.wowhead.com/faction=1172#quests

should easily be enough for the 3K of neutral and the 6K of friendly.

 

[Evil Benius]

unfortunately our group wasn't synced enough to down them, but the other 10-man did and we got them to about 33%.. have a pretty strong feeling tonight we'll get them easily in 25-man. I'm hoping we start with conclave, head to omnitron, then work on either magmaw or Al'Akir.

Omnotron actually is not that bad once you see the fight a few times. It mainly comes down to controlling the slimes and people keeping their eye on any damage focused on/around them. Took us two nights to get him after downing Halfus on Friday and I think the only reason we had trouble was constantly bringing in new people combined with the raid leader not listening to myself and the other main healer that our third healer was just not keeping up.

It is definitely a fun, but exhausting fight to heal during the learning period. I had no idea he was close to dead and was glad we called it a night after getting the kill.

 

[Flib]

agreed. it's not really a hard fight at all outside of the poison bombs and AAs. beyond those two, just move out of the way of shit. But both of those two really need to be perfect (or close to it and a perfect recovery) or you'll pretty much wipe.

Yeah, tanking and interrupting Arcanotron sucks though. It's just stressful as shit, because if you miss an interrupt he starts casting AAs faster. If you don't immediately coordinate to get the rotation back on, it's sort of game over...especially if Incineration Security Measure or something like that is happening.

 

[thetrin]

No, it's true, the post doesn't make any sense (and presumably it's because they're trying to avoid admitting that their original design was broken and then their first attempt at a solution was insanely terrible.)

The first problem is that a field that trades sides every time is inherently superior to one that never trades sides: in both cases the competitiveness goes down, but in the latter one side never gets access to the gated content and it's almost impossible for them to change the dynamic even with a concerted effort, while in the former both sides get the gated content and a concerted enough effort to hold will encourage more competitiveness on the other side to take the site back from you. As such, it always makes sense to err on the side of "easy to flip" rather than "easy to hold" in area design, and Tol Barad's lean in the latter direction is a clear mistake.

The second problem is that you can't incentivize people more than they already are to win. People go into these things wanting to win and doing everything possible to achieve that goal; they'll only change that if you make the incentive to lose strong enough to override it (which is exactly what the ludicrous 1800 honor award did.)

Ultimately it needs to be easier for attackers to take Tol Barad. If they're going to make balance changes to it, this is what those changes need to focus on.

I think I'd be behind their logic if holding Tol Barad didn't give access to an entire instance and a set of daily quests. It sounds incredibly dumb that they're doing this.

 

[funkmastergeneral]

Yeah, tanking and interrupting Arcanotron sucks though. It's just stressful as shit, because if you miss an interrupt he starts casting AAs faster. If you don't immediately coordinate to get the rotation back on, it's sort of game over...especially if Incineration Security Measure or something like that is happening.

Get a second interrupter to help? As enhancement I have a macro made to target and use wind shear anytime I see him casting that.

 

[Angry Grimace]

not sure if it was mentioned, but regular lowbie instance means much less armor on the mobs. There is a significant DPS drop going from 83-84 dungeons to heroics.

as for all of the "5K is awful at 329", sorry, but you're full of shit. 5-6K average over the course of the instance is pretty normal at 329 in 5-man heroics with non-final enchants/gems. ESPECIALLY when you start moving away from survival hunters, destruction locks, fury warriors, assassination rogues, etc. once you get a few 346 items and throw near-BIS gems and enchants on them, yeah your DPS ramps up VERY quickly. But at 329, 330, 331, etc your DPS is exponentially lower than it is when you start gearing up 346.

I don't know if I'd take it that far. My DK does like 9.5K at exactly 329 and 0 items over level 333 and my Fury warrior does slightly less than that, but his gear is worse and that's a lower potential DPS class. 5-6K is bare minimum and not really acceptable unless someone else is carrying the DPS load by doing more.

 

[Acidote]

Get a second interrupter to help? As enhancement I have a macro made to target and use wind shear anytime I see him casting that.

/stopcasting
/target Arcanotron
/cast Wind Shear

I had it just like that, fairly simple. Set Arcanotron on focus and that's it.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

not sure if it was mentioned, but regular lowbie instance means much less armor on the mobs. There is a significant DPS drop going from 83-84 dungeons to heroics.

as for all of the "5K is awful at 329", sorry, but you're full of shit. 5-6K average over the course of the instance is pretty normal at 329 in 5-man heroics with non-final enchants/gems. ESPECIALLY when you start moving away from survival hunters, destruction locks, fury warriors, assassination rogues, etc. once you get a few 346 items and throw near-BIS gems and enchants on them, yeah your DPS ramps up VERY quickly. But at 329, 330, 331, etc your DPS is exponentially lower than it is when you start gearing up 346.

5k dps was average at like 258 gear

 

[Flib]

Get a second interrupter to help? As enhancement I have a macro made to target and use wind shear anytime I see him casting that.

We weren't using any shamans on this attempt. It was me (bear druid) and a ret pally switching back and forth.

Our mage would help if we both got locked out, but that didn't happen on our kill.

 

[Rapstah]

5k dps was average at like 258 gear

329 ilvl is supposed to compare to 187 ilvl, at which point I don't know if anyone was breaking 2K at Tier 7 content. You had to do close to 2K to down Brutallus.

 

[borghe]

Yeah, tanking and interrupting Arcanotron sucks though. It's just stressful as shit, because if you miss an interrupt he starts casting AAs faster. If you don't immediately coordinate to get the rotation back on, it's sort of game over...especially if Incineration Security Measure or something like that is happening.

eh, not quite sure what you're saying.. he only gets the haste/dmg buff from attacks against him. are you saying if you miss the interrupt you add a stack to him? what we resorted to doing was every time I'd see a converted power on him I'd pull it. it might be better for a dispel magic though if the dispel can just clear through the whole stack. Our problem was that our interrupter kept auto-attack on....... I didn't think about this until later in the night after the raid was over. If ALL the interrupter is doing are interrupts (no auto attack), I can easily steal the converted power from a damage interrupt. afaik, this is the only thing that speeds up his AA casting.

 

[funkmastergeneral]

5k dps was average at like 258 gear

It's unfair to compare the two with the way crit and other secondary stats scale, but I agree with the others that 5k dps at 329 ilevel is low. When I started heroics as enhancement I was probably pulling around 7 - 7.5k single target sustained. If I saw someone doing 5k dps my first reaction would be to check their spec and glyphs and rotation.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

329 ilvl is supposed to compare to 187 ilvl, at which point I don't know if anyone was breaking 2K at Tier 7 content. You had to do close to 2K to down Brutallus.

Where did you get that stat from? If 329 is supposed to be like 187 then 346 is like 748 ilvl with the dps people are doing. My DK friend who just got 329 to get in was pulling 8k in his first heroic.

 

[borghe]

It's unfair to compare the two with the way crit and other secondary stats scale, but I agree with the others that 5k dps at 329 ilevel is low. When I started heroics as enhancement I was probably pulling around 7 - 7.5k single target sustained. If I saw someone doing 5k dps my first reaction would be to check their spec and glyphs and rotation.

well, apparently I am just reading recount wrong then. I stand defeated. I just know looking at recount through a GB, Stonecore, SFK or DM run in the guild group DPS on the damage done screen shows everyone at like 7-10K DPS (7xxx.x or 8xxx.x next to the parentheses number of total points and percentage done) and these are guys that are downing raid bosses easy.. so I guess I'm just reading it wrong and all of my math is wrong.. oh well, like I initially said, I don't really care enough to take a closer look. To me it just seemed like a lot of bashing back to the old GS wrath daily frost emblem days. Maybe if these guys were on the way I'm reading recount they'd show up like 2-3K.

Where did you get that stat from? If 329 is supposed to be like 187 then 346 is like 748 ilvl with the dps people are doing. My DK friend who just got 329 to get in was pulling 8k in his first heroic.

ilevels don't scale linear. well they don't scale at all actually, aside from within a single xpac.

in 264 gear you were supposed to be capable of x DPS on raid mobs. When you got to cata you were still doing x DPS on world mobs. then your damage scaled again starting from there but not like it scaled from 200 to 264 ilevel, but like it scaled from 135(?) to 200. same thing will happen here.. our damage will now scale from 346 to xxx (500?) and then when xpac 4 comes out we'll start at xxx plus some percent and then scale across a leveling design instead of a raid design.

my point in all of this is that going from 272 to 333 you see your damage output increase, but going to heroics you then see your damage output decrease as everything has more armor, more resistances, etc. heroics and raids are thus why gear scales different between say 272-333 than it does between say 346-372.

 

[Rapstah]

Where did you get that stat from? If 329 is supposed to be like 187 then 346 is like 748 ilvl with the dps people are doing. My DK friend who just got 329 to get in was pulling 8k in his first heroic.

The gear limit for getting into WOTLK heroics was (is) 187, although I'd admit they didn't actually physically add that limit until 3.3. My point was still pretty bad though because 258 gear does in no way compare to what you had to wear to down Brutallus.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

The gear limit for getting into WOTLK heroics was (is) 187, although I'd admit they didn't actually physically add that limit until 3.3. My point was still pretty bad though because 258 gear does in no way compare to what you had to wear to down Brutallus.

What I am getting at is that every expansion DPS, HP, ect has gone through the roof compared to the previous high

 

[Angry Grimace]

It's unfair to compare the two with the way crit and other secondary stats scale, but I agree with the others that 5k dps at 329 ilevel is low. When I started heroics as enhancement I was probably pulling around 7 - 7.5k single target sustained. If I saw someone doing 5k dps my first reaction would be to check their spec and glyphs and rotation.

I started to reply with this, but I don't think he literally is comparing the two.

What I am getting at is that every expansion DPS, HP, ect has gone through the roof compared to the previous high

Er, nevermind. You are aware that Wrath DPS and Cata DPS aren't comparable in the least, right? It's like trying to compare an iPhone with an optical mouse. Combat ratings and mechanics don't match up in a way to make it comparable.

 

[Ramirez]

:lol That is so awesome

We wiped the first time there by the hunter not paying attention to how insanely huge his hit box is and autoattacking him while we were prepping

Yea, you can target him from anywhere in the middle of the floor, it's really lame.

 

[Angry Grimace]

329 ilvl is supposed to compare to 187 ilvl, at which point I don't know if anyone was breaking 2K at Tier 7 content. You had to do close to 2K to down Brutallus.

You could very easily do 2K in T7 if you had decent gear, or were a Death Knight. :lol

 

[Flib]

eh, not quite sure what you're saying.. he only gets the haste/dmg buff from attacks against him. are you saying if you miss the interrupt you add a stack to him? what we resorted to doing was every time I'd see a converted power on him I'd pull it. it might be better for a dispel magic though if the dispel can just clear through the whole stack. Our problem was that our interrupter kept auto-attack on....... I didn't think about this until later in the night after the raid was over. If ALL the interrupter is doing are interrupts (no auto attack), I can easily steal the converted power from a damage interrupt. afaik, this is the only thing that speeds up his AA casting.

It seems to me, or this could be just my imagination (but everyone in our raid was noticing it), but usually when we missed an AA interrupt, he would immediately cast another one ~2 seconds later. If the rotation doesn't get back on track at that point, you're fucked.

Though maybe it's bugged for us?

I don't worry about Power Conversion, our mage takes care of it and it isn't an issue I even think about.

 

[cuevas. PhD.]

Er, nevermind. You are aware that Wrath DPS and Cata DPS aren't comparable in the least, right? It's like trying to compare an iPhone with an optical mouse. Combat ratings and mechanics don't match up in a way to make it comparable.

Other than Cata dps should be way higher than Wrath dps. And it is. Let's just put it this way, if you are doing the same dps you were doing in the previous expansion you are doing something wrong.