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World of Warcraft |OT3|

Alex

Member
There's a lot of room between the same old throughput + occasional movement and a system that will actually let people use some of their aux skills and more interesting personal responsibility, though guy I'm not voting for nonsense that would force you to respec every fight. Just more interesting encounter design that can support some choices and variety. When they goof around with boss design it's usually something gimmicky like vehicles or some weird mechanic, not player/ability driven.

That'd be sharp especially in 5 mans under the new systems in the future, things to move it away from mindess valor runs but without the same breed of frustrating pug design from early data.
 
4.3 Drops on Tuesday, as long as there isn't some major issue.

I guess that keeps me subbed for at least another month or two, but after that, I may take off again for awhile. Even though I've enjoyed the GAF Guild, we've lost a bit of steam, so it doesn't feel like there are any big obligations (or reasons) to stay. I'm not currently guilded on my main, but with Skyrim, Dark Souls coming on Monday ($34.99!), and perhaps other fall releases, I'm not sure I want to commit to a server transfer and 8-9+ hours a week of raiding right now.

Until something else comes along though (Diablo?), WoW will always probably be a game I return to.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
4.3 Drops on Tuesday, as long as there isn't some major issue.

I guess that keeps me subbed for at least another month or two, but after that, I may take off again for awhile. Even though I've enjoyed the GAF Guild, we've lost a bit of steam, so it doesn't feel like there are any big obligations (or reasons) to stay. I'm not currently guilded on my main, but with Skyrim, Dark Souls coming on Monday ($34.99!), and perhaps other fall releases, I'm not sure I want to commit to a server transfer and 8-9+ hours a week of raiding right now.

Until something else comes along though (Diablo?), WoW will always probably be a game I return to.
I don't mean this in an accusatory or mean way, but I would reiterate that I don't think a GAF guild was a good idea until MOP came out since there the XP requirement is too high to get to 25 in any reasonable time, most people are already guilded right now and it's not really encouraging that the guild was started without any actual input from any other GAFfers as faction, server, etc.

I'm all for trying the idea again when MOP comes out, though.
 
Can't wait for the patch, getting conquest from BG's is going to be a godsend for me (i don't like arena). My only concern is that this may encourage a lot more botting.
 
I don't mean this in an accusatory or mean way, but I would reiterate that I don't think a GAF guild was a good idea until MOP came out since there the XP requirement is too high to get to 25 in any reasonable time, most people are already guilded right now and it's not really encouraging that the guild was started without any actual input from any other GAFfers as faction, server, etc.

I'm all for trying the idea again when MOP comes out, though.

I don't mind trying again then, especially if I still have no obligations with my main character, as I'll certainly be playing at least the first couple months of MoP (and probably any expansion pack for the next few years).

I have had fun though - gotten a druid to the highest level I've ever gotten one (high 70s right now) and a rogue to 25, which is also the highest I've gotten one, on a high-pop server that I would actually consider transferring to. The only real negative is that it's EST, when I would favor CST or MST, but that's not a huge deal.


As for 4.3, I'm really looking forward to see how much gold I can make off Jewelcrafting. I have 40 tokens saved up on my JC, so I'm curious to see how far that gets me. Whether I'm on the higher or lower side of token stockpiling, or somewhere in between. I'm sure there are others who have way more tokens, especially if they had been playing in the ~6 months I hadn't. But I'm off to a substantial start.


Can't wait for the patch, getting conquest from BG's is going to be a godsend for me (i don't like arena). My only concern is that this may encourage a lot more botting.

I think that change was kind of a long time coming. 25 Conquest Points once a day from a win was NOTHING, and provided zero incentive to play BGs except for initial honor grinds (or for something a bit more relaxing.) Arena will still be quicker, but I'm glad you can get a reasonable Conquest income from regular BGs. (Rated BGs are still pretty much a failure.)
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I don't mind trying again then, especially if I still have no obligations with my main character, as I'll certainly be playing at least the first couple months of MoP (and probably any expansion pack for the next few years).

I have had fun though - gotten a druid to the highest level I've ever gotten one (high 70s right now) and a rogue to 25, which is also the highest I've gotten one, on a high-pop server that I would actually consider transferring to. The only real negative is that it's EST, when I would favor CST or MST, but that's not a huge deal.


As for 4.3, I'm really looking forward to see how much gold I can make off Jewelcrafting. I have 40 tokens saved up on my JC, so I'm curious to see how far that gets me. Whether I'm on the higher or lower side of token stockpiling, or somewhere in between. I'm sure there are others who have way more tokens, especially if they had been playing in the ~6 months I hadn't. But I'm off to a substantial start.




I think that change was kind of a long time coming. 25 Conquest Points once a day from a win was NOTHING, and provided zero incentive to play BGs except for initial honor grinds (or for something a bit more relaxing.) Arena will still be quicker, but I'm glad you can get a reasonable Conquest income from regular BGs. (Rated BGs are still pretty much a failure.)
Rated BGs became a fruitless endevor the moment they decided you needed to actually form a full group to get in one, i.e. its either for elite PvP guilds or for sitting around in trade chat for 2 hours. In other words, it's just a larger version of Arena, but without the benefit of only needing one or two other dudes to do.
 

Alucrid

Banned
I don't mean this in an accusatory or mean way, but I would reiterate that I don't think a GAF guild was a good idea until MOP came out since there the XP requirement is too high to get to 25 in any reasonable time, most people are already guilded right now and it's not really encouraging that the guild was started without any actual input from any other GAFfers as faction, server, etc.

I'm all for trying the idea again when MOP comes out, though.

I'd transfer for that.
 

aktham

Member
I don't mean this in an accusatory or mean way, but I would reiterate that I don't think a GAF guild was a good idea until MOP came out since there the XP requirement is too high to get to 25 in any reasonable time, most people are already guilded right now and it's not really encouraging that the guild was started without any actual input from any other GAFfers as faction, server, etc.

I'm all for trying the idea again when MOP comes out, though.

I think we got a pretty good showing in the guild right now and people are in the high 70s and boxey is about to be the first legit 85 (if he isn't already by now). I can't speak for everybody, but the whole point was for this guild to be casual and no pressure. The fall line up is killer and those games come first for me (Zelda/U3/UMvC3 etc). We have 4.3 for a year so what's the rush?
 
I think that change was kind of a long time coming. 25 Conquest Points once a day from a win was NOTHING, and provided zero incentive to play BGs except for initial honor grinds (or for something a bit more relaxing.) Arena will still be quicker, but I'm glad you can get a reasonable Conquest income from regular BGs. (Rated BGs are still pretty much a failure.)

It was a joke.The cheapest piece of gear is what 1250 honor (besides librams and that sort of thing). So what's that like 50 days to get a single piece of gear even if you win a BG every day. I could understand if they said you got no conquest but giving 25 for the first win of the day was just stupid.

Rated BGs became a fruitless endevor the moment they decided you needed to actually form a full group to get in one, i.e. its either for elite PvP guilds or for sitting around in trade chat for 2 hours. In other words, it's just a larger version of Arena, but without the benefit of only needing one or two other dudes to do.

That's what really sucks about getting conquest. Rated BG's are only an option if you are in a good pvp guild. It's way way harder than arenas (even though it wasn't supposed to be).

So basically if you don't like arena and aren't in a great pvp guild good luck getting any conquest.
 
The GAF guild is doing fine. And it was started precisely because when we all try to form the guild by consensus, nothing ever ever gets done. We've been through that too many times to count since the original semi-GAF guild wavered and fell apart years ago. The GAF guild is fine. Just because some people think they should have had more controlling interest in it doesn't mean it isn't doing just as it was intended to do.
 

C.Dark.DN

Banned
I've been gone for 2ish weeks. New full time job.
The GAF guild is doing fine. And it was started precisely because when we all try to form the guild by consensus, nothing ever ever gets done. We've been through that too many times to count since the original semi-GAF guild wavered and fell apart years ago. The GAF guild is fine. Just because some people think they should have had more controlling interest in it doesn't mean it isn't doing just as it was intended to do.
Your having controlling interest problems already?

It's probably people wanting to be an "officer" or something which is meaningless right now...

But let's be honest. You had a 75 toon, some gold, became the GM, and Neogaf members are going to invest months of their lives into the game.

(Which was bad to begin with. There should have been a vote considering the amount of time you invest into a guild. You and anyone else on this forum could be a great or bad GM. Who knows.)

You and no GM can let power go to your heads and be the ultimate "decision maker".

If you're butting heads with people who have legitimate issues... bad.

But I'm out of the loop and saw no issues two weeks ago.
 

Bisnic

Really Really Exciting Member!
Speaking of rated battlegrounds, i just wish Blizzard would put the mounts available from regular battlegrounds, or at least a recolor since they love them so much. They're too cool to be only available for the best of the best pvp guilds.

Oh well, if they did that, i bet all those pvpers would just cry about it because "fucking casual want everything".
 
I've been gone for 2ish weeks. New full time job.

Your having controlling interest problems already?

It's probably people wanting to be an "officer" or something which is meaningless right now...

But let's be honest. You had a 75 toon, some gold, became the GM, and Neogaf members are going to invest months of their lives into the game.

(Which was bad to begin with. There should have been a vote considering the amount of time you invest into a guild. You and anyone else on this forum could be a great or bad GM. Who knows.)

You and no GM can let power go to your heads and be the ultimate "decision maker".

If you're butting heads with people who have legitimate issues... bad.

But I'm out of the loop and saw no issues two weeks ago.

Nah. I have had absolutely zero issues with anything related to <NeoGAF Believe>. I have no ego wrapped up in the venture at all. Right now there's nothing to even have a power struggle over. If someone, anyone, comes along that's more capable of taking the guild in one direction or another and has a will to, they're more than welcome to GM the guild.

The only thing I've addressed from the beginning was the "We should all have had a consensus first" vs. "Just take some action" dichotomy at the guild's inception. The only reason it was done so hastily was because that was the only way I felt it was going to get done at all. *shrug*

And I understand the argument that we should've waited for MoP. If Area 52 seems like such a bad idea, we're more than welcome to try again for MoP. I'm not sure where would be a better place to roll, though, in terms of PUG viability and active economy, two reasons I thought Area 52 seemed keen. Unless there are people very attached to the Alliance. I can see why people with a preference for Alliance would be miffed about a Horde guild and I sympathize. Someone can start an Alliance guild and we can all be besties.
 

Andiie

Unconfirmed Member
I've barely played lately in the gaf guild given so many good games have come out this past couple months. Once 4.3 rolls around I should be more interested in putting more time into my char since they're reducing xp needed for Northrend. Hopefully I can knock off the last dozen levels soon after.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
The patch is out this week? :eek:

Yes.

If you want to troll trade chat, announce the patch release date in /2 in any given realm or announce the opposite: that patches never come out the same week arena seasons end. If your realm has any population at all, there will be a lot of hilarious rage.


Thinking of rolling a Mage. Tips on which spec to go for?
Arcane since you can do hilarious DPS at every level. I mean, I had a Arcane Mage do like 5K in the low 70s. It's ridiculous.
 

Bisnic

Really Really Exciting Member!
For those who played on the PTR, what's the difference in difficulty on the LFR? Is it just reduced health and damage? Or do they also take out the more complicated boss mechanics?
 
From my limited experience on the PTR with LFR, normal and heroic modes, all ive noticed so far is reduced damage and HP in the LFR. Obviously, heroic modes have more abilities/modes from LFR.


Take it with a grain of salt though, I didnt do much of the LFR and I didnt pay that much attention. :p I popped in a few times waiting for guildies to show up so we could do guild runs.
 

idlewild_

Member
For those who played on the PTR, what's the difference in difficulty on the LFR? Is it just reduced health and damage? Or do they also take out the more complicated boss mechanics?

Everything has had its damage and health cut, and anything that requires coordination has been severely nerfed or taken out.

e.g. second boss switches phases after a certain amount of time regardless of whether you hit him with the orb. third boss spawns only two globules. the aspects on fifth boss will never eat a full hour of twilight. etc.
 

Bisnic

Really Really Exciting Member!
Everything has had its damage and health cut, and anything that requires coordination has been severely nerfed or taken out.

e.g. second boss switches phases after a certain amount of time regardless of whether you hit him with the orb. third boss spawns only two globules. the aspects on fifth boss will never eat a full hour of twilight. etc.

Well if the difference is that big, hopefully raid mounts are exclusive to the "real" raids so that the more hardcore raiders dont feel bad.
 

lordmrw

Member
Looks like MMO-Champ is confirming 4.3 for this Tuesday, 11/29. Hopefully this doesn't bork my UI.

I was kind of hoping I would have my third transmog set done before then. Ah well, its my own fault for going with the Aldor instead of Scryer. Going from hated to neutral is the worst grind ever.
 

Nugg

Member
For those who played on the PTR, what's the difference in difficulty on the LFR? Is it just reduced health and damage? Or do they also take out the more complicated boss mechanics?
Some mechanics are out (like an ice tomb you're supposed to DPS to free the guy trapped in it during the Hagara encounter for instance, doesn't exist in LFR). Other mechanics can be ignored in LFR because the damage is so low, but must be dealt with in normal and heroic.
 

Bisnic

Really Really Exciting Member!
Some mechanics are out (like an ice tomb you're supposed to DPS to free the guy trapped in it during the Hagara encounter for instance, doesn't exist in LFR). Other mechanics can be ignored in LFR because the damage is so low, but must be dealt with in normal and heroic.

What? That's not even something hard to understand, even for pugs. /confused
 
Too busy playing all the new games that came out this month. :p

I've got over 50 hours into Skyrim, and Dark Souls came in the mail today (though I'm probably going to save that for a bit.)

Otherwise, the patch doesn't have me too, too excited. I think the heroics will be fun, and I want to try LFR to see just how bad (or good) it is, but since I don't have a set raid group, and the raid is fairly short anyway, that's not a major draw for me right now.

Honestly, I'm more looking forward to see how much gold I can make with a reinvigorated market for gems/enchants/etc. Really want to break 100k (with minimal effort, of course!) The market of your typical high-volume/high-profit endgame-related items has been saturated for the past few months and a new raid/dungeons will clear that right up.

Transmog is nice, but never a feature I was ever really clamoring for (though the Void Storage will be a huge bag-saver), and I'm curious about the Darkmoon Faire, but I really don't think the rewards will be worth it so much. At least it will be better than the previous iteration.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
What? That's not even something hard to understand, even for pugs. /confused

It's not hard to understand, but it if involves the fear of death, they'll remove or tame it. LFR is not supposed to be much harder than 5 man dungeons; don't underestimate why the gear level is only 6 ilvls higher than the 5 mans. It's not hard at all. The idea is that you build on what you learn in there to do the real dungeons; consider that raids are often made or broken on a single difficult mechanic. The idea, I think, is that in LFR you can figure out all the stuff that isn't a super punishing mechanic so you learn to deal with it when you step up to real raids.


I've got over 50 hours into Skyrim, and Dark Souls came in the mail today (though I'm probably going to save that for a bit.)

Otherwise, the patch doesn't have me too, too excited. I think the heroics will be fun, and I want to try LFR to see just how bad (or good) it is, but since I don't have a set raid group, and the raid is fairly short anyway, that's not a major draw for me right now.

Honestly, I'm more looking forward to see how much gold I can make with a reinvigorated market for gems/enchants/etc. Really want to break 100k (with minimal effort, of course!) The market of your typical high-volume/high-profit endgame-related items has been saturated for the past few months and a new raid/dungeons will clear that right up.

Transmog is nice, but never a feature I was ever really clamoring for (though the Void Storage will be a huge bag-saver), and I'm curious about the Darkmoon Faire, but I really don't think the rewards will be worth it so much. At least it will be better than the previous iteration.
I think you'll be surprised by LFR because you'll wonder how you're beating it so easily. It really is a lite-tier. It's not hard at all, and even with PTR trolls (everyone on the PTR who does random-group content is a troll, fwiw) we consistently got through most encounters.
 

Miletius

Member
Is anyone else seeing like no hype for the new content? The game seems really quiet considering a final raid content patch is out soon.

I'm pumped but it is kind of a low key time with all the other games that have come out recently. Still though, be nice to walk around in t6, check out LFR and do some new 5 mans.
 

aktham

Member
I still need the helm, hands and belt to complete my judgement set. I hope these drop for me this Tuesday. *crosses fingers*
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Maybe I'm missing something, but assassination rogue is really easy. I could do pretty reasonable dps on this class at 1000ms latency as far as I can tell.
 

Tamanon

Banned
Maybe I'm missing something, but assassination rogue is really easy. I could do pretty reasonable dps on this class at 1000ms latency as far as I can tell.

My understanding is that it's one of the easiest specs to play in PvE, right behind Arcane Mage. Just because there's so little going on.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
My understanding is that it's one of the easiest specs to play in PvE, right behind Arcane Mage. Just because there's so little going on.

Yeah, most of the time after set up you're either spamming Muti to get up to Envenom or Rupture, or spamming backstab to do the same thing. It's not only that, it's the fact that the energy model means you aren't doing anything like 50% of the time, just pooling energy.
 
Maybe I'm missing something, but assassination rogue is really easy. I could do pretty reasonable dps on this class at 1000ms latency as far as I can tell.

Yeah, they are really easy. The hardest part for me was finding a an add-on I liked to keep track of all my timers (S&D, Rupture, etc).
 

Ryaaan14

Banned
If you think Rogues are too easy in PvE, you're doin it wrong. Depending on your talents, you should probably be constantly juggling envenom, rupture, and recupe. Not to mention watching for interrupts, backstabs <35%, popping vanish whenever you can to activate overkill, and keeping ToTT up after every CD.

Granted you can get by with just keeping S&D up, but there is absolutely no reason to have an easy/boring rotation.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Well, patch is now confirmed even if it wasn't before with an official announcement on the loading screen.
 

vilmer_

Member
I haven't played in a month or so and I'm starting to miss the game :( I told myself I wouldn't come back for a while, but the urge to dig into 4.3 is gnawing at my brain lol! When I stopped playing it was at a point where I would login and there would only be like 4 or 5 guildies on, and it just didn't feel the same anymore. I couldn't help but reminisce on how much fun I had a while back being with a huge guild of great people that included a bunch of friends irl for years. It was really sad when we disbanded, and for the most fucked up reason ever :/ Some people changed guilds, some changed servers, others quit. I can't say there is another game that has immersed me on so many different levels. I know I'll eventually come back, I can't neglect my fresh 85 warrior, but the nostalgia always takes over. So many damn good memories in this game.
 
I haven't played in a month or so and I'm starting to miss the game :( I told myself I wouldn't come back for a while, but the urge to dig into 4.3 is gnawing at my brain lol! When I stopped playing it was at a point where I would login and there would only be like 4 or 5 guildies on, and it just didn't feel the same anymore. I couldn't help but reminisce on how much fun I had a while back being with a huge guild of great people that included a bunch of friends irl for years. It was really sad when we disbanded, and for the most fucked up reason ever :/ Some people changed guilds, some changed servers, others quit. I can't say there is another game that has immersed me on so many different levels. I know I'll eventually come back, I can't neglect my fresh 85 warrior, but the nostalgia always takes over. So many damn good memories in this game.

I can definitely pinpoint my most favorite time in the game to mid-2009 when I was in a 25-man guild with people I (mostly) liked, raiding at least 3 times a week. I haven't felt as high on the game since, but I also haven't been in a similar environment since either.

The social aspect is HUGE in this game, for better or worse. It has a larger effect than I think many people realize. It drastically strengthens the hooks the gameplay pulls you in to begin with.
 

vilmer_

Member
I can definitely pinpoint my most favorite time in the game to mid-2009 when I was in a 25-man guild with people I (mostly) liked, raiding at least 3 times a week. I haven't felt as high on the game since, but I also haven't been in a similar environment since either.

The social aspect is HUGE in this game, for better or worse. It has a larger effect than I think many people realize. It drastically strengthens the hooks the gameplay pulls you in to begin with.

Definitely. Personally, I would go as far as to say that this is the best game of all time.
 

Angry Grimace

Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
If you think Rogues are too easy in PvE, you're doin it wrong. Depending on your talents, you should probably be constantly juggling envenom, rupture, and recupe. Not to mention watching for interrupts, backstabs <35%, popping vanish whenever you can to activate overkill, and keeping ToTT up after every CD.

Granted you can get by with just keeping S&D up, but there is absolutely no reason to have an easy/boring rotation.
That is not remotely difficult compared to any other class in the game bar Arcane Mage. I don't think you use recuperation in assassination; that's sub that uses recup for energy. Every class has CDs, and the rogue ones are of pretty long CDs anyways.

It just boils down to putting SnD up, keeping rupture up and spamming Envenom, and using Backstab for CP <35%. It's not like you're anything close to GCD capped.
 

Rokal

Member
Everything has had its damage and health cut, and anything that requires coordination has been severely nerfed or taken out.

e.g. second boss switches phases after a certain amount of time regardless of whether you hit him with the orb. third boss spawns only two globules. the aspects on fifth boss will never eat a full hour of twilight. etc.

The orb also automatically splits between players in a much wider radius. You don't need to move as a group to intercept orbs. As long as one person hits the orb, it will bounce and damage will split between the raid instead of 1-shotting the player. In the normal mode, almost the entire raid needs to move together to hit the ball (in a ranged and a melee group). In LFR mode, only 2/25 people need to worry about it.

That is not remotely difficult compared to any other class in the game bar Arcane Mage. I don't think you use recuperation in assassination; that's sub that uses recup for energy. Every class has CDs, and the rogue ones are of pretty long CDs anyways.

It just boils down to putting SnD up, keeping rupture up and spamming Envenom, and using Backstab for CP <35%. It's not like you're anything close to GCD capped.

I think you over-estimate how complicated other DPS classes are. The basics of an assassination rotation is what you've listed. Keep SnD up, Rupture immediately when it falls off unless you have enough energy to mutilate and then immediately rupture, Envemon at 4+ combo points unless you're about to lose SnD in which case envenom early to renew. The difference between a good assassination rogue and a bad assassination rogue will be:

1) coordinating cooldowns for maximum possible dps.

You have 4 dps cooldowns in T12 gear (cold blood, vendetta, vanish(into garrote), ToT) before you include trinkets, consumables, or cooldowns from other classes like heroism. These aren't all on the same cooldown duration. You need to know what cooldowns you can afford to use early in the fight that will be up again before a burn phase or a cooldown like heroism/bloodlust is used, and what cooldowns you need to save. Basically, maximizing cooldown usage without missing windows where you could have stacked cooldowns for better damage.

2) maximizing attacks while the envenom buff is up

Pretty simply concept. You want to save as much energy as possible before you 4+ cp envenom, but not so much that you energy cap from relentless strikes. This will allow you to get extra mutilates in while envenom is up, which will lead to more poison procs.

That said, it's not that hard to maximize assassination dps on a target dummy. I don't think any class is, even something notoriously demanding like subtlety or feral cat dps. It gets hard to maximize everything when you're in an actual fight dealing with other mechanics that will impact the best time for cooldown usage, and potentially distract you. Assassination is less about staying on top of the GCD, and more about planning ahead for energy and cooldown usage.

I actually think rogues are one of the most engaging classes to play, because you also get a lot of defensive cooldowns to use and other things to do when you aren't GCD-locked.
 

Rokal

Member
Is anyone else seeing like no hype for the new content? The game seems really quiet considering a final raid content patch is out soon.

Hard to be pumped up about screenshots of Dragonblight and Felwood with re-used boss models. It doesn't feel like we're getting new raids or 5-mans, it feels like we're getting remixes (sort of like ZG/ZA).
 
Hard to be pumped up about screenshots of Dragonblight and Felwood with re-used boss models. It doesn't feel like we're getting new raids or 5-mans, it feels like we're getting remixes (sort of like ZG/ZA).

I don't think so. Boss models aren't very important in comparison to fight mechanics, and it seems like we're at least getting some interesting mechanics. I only read over the first 3 bosses, but already 2 of them are unlike anything in the game so far.
 
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