Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Agreed.MrAngryFace said:
This last page of nitpicky raid mage talk is beyond boring. Change subjects please.
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World of Warcraft
- Thread starter Cerebral Palsy
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This last page of nitpicky raid mage talk is beyond boring. Change subjects please.
hmm, well, on PTR i'll have to see what they give premade shamans, because if it's full epics and stuff then i'll make a premade. otherwise i'll just port mine over and make a premade rogue (going to see if i'd actually like playing the class any at 60, along with druids it's a class i've never even gotten to level 10) and go with a premade mage so i have an idea of what build to go for like i will when mine is 60.
here's a weird but pure pvp build I did, and I realize there's no POM for an instant pyro or anything, but the build overall is focused purely on snares, crits and survivability, so there's no arcane. and it's not what I'm going to do for sure, it's just what I'm going to try initially on the PTR. http://www.wowhead.com/talent/?kZxero0MZiAczGVoz
Fularu said:Way to completely miss the point :lol
TF on a rogue (or anything beside a tank btw, including dps warriors) is a waste of the best tanking weapon in-game, now please, when you have hunters getting BB, or warriors taking Maladath, I hope our poor rogues aren't bitching
And I make my business whatever the hell I want my business to be, good kind sir, just like you're doing right now
Way to miss my point.
Son of Godzilla
Banned
http://www.wowhead.com/talent/?kZEx0s0czZiVcu0Vs
PvP build I'm most interested in trying out. 23 Fire 28 Ice. Basically just huge aoe rape using nova and shatter. Flamestrike + Nova + Blastwave + CoC + Snap + Nova + CoC + AE.
PvP build I'm most interested in trying out. 23 Fire 28 Ice. Basically just huge aoe rape using nova and shatter. Flamestrike + Nova + Blastwave + CoC + Snap + Nova + CoC + AE.
ToyMachine228
Member
I finally got my Bloodfang Hood last night. Only our second one after at least 25 Onyxia kills. We finally got a Judgement Crown too. Now let's hope we finally get a Vis'Kag soon. It's pretty crazy to think that...When I get Nightslayer Belt, and a Striker's Mark or Mandokir's Sting, I'm pretty much done with loot besides rings outside of BWL, which we are just starting.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Tamanon said:And THAT is why the new Subtlety is nice, just flat out reduces Crit aggro.
yea but mages usually never pull.
its always the damn warlocks :lol
Ferrio said:
erm.....maybe your ctra was glitched....thats just impossible.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Ferrio said:
yea thats wierd, cause mathmatically, its impossible for that to happen because of what broodlord's abilities does to aggro and threat on knockbacks.
must have just been a wierd thing that day.
Teknopathetic
Member
F2BB: What guild are you in?
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
Teknopathetic said:
im one of 3 MTs for "dominance" on one of the newer servers , alliance.
was horde on another server, then the guild switched up to a newer server cause the server we were currently was pretty dead pop-wise.
its been great. got to nef in 2 months and already downing rag before sons.
Teknopathetic
Member
I thought you were on Gilneas for a bit on alliance.
RonaldoSan
Member
Where did you get that?
Great Wasabi Man
Member
It's the quest rewaed form the orphans week quest, that was SUPPOSED to start monday but the rocket scientist at blizzard activated it early and some people got the quest done. they then deactivated till it was supposed to start....like the halloween even ending a day or 2 early.
RonaldoSan
Member
Nice. I have to get me one of those.
I have been running instances all week, and the new 5-man limit really makes it a more enjoyable experience. Everybody puts in work. 10-man was awful. People would just hit anything in sight, heal random people and mess up all the time. The next best change has to be the gold for quest system. I have made almost 180g this week doing tons of quests.
I have to mention what a bs quest Dead Man's Plea is. I bet most people won't ever complete this one. I think it's cool with the timer, but 45 min. is overkill for people that goes there to upgrade their valor and shadowcraft items. Quests that are insanely time restrictive belongs to the hardcore players. Put quests like that in MC, ZG, AQ or BWL. I'm not saying the quest is impossible or anything, but a pug group with 2 people having the quest and the rest not, it's never going to happen. Ask my guildies? If I was in a decent guild I probably didn't need to upgrade my shitty tier 0. I just hope Blizz tweaks the timing a little, say 55-60 min.
I have been running instances all week, and the new 5-man limit really makes it a more enjoyable experience. Everybody puts in work. 10-man was awful. People would just hit anything in sight, heal random people and mess up all the time. The next best change has to be the gold for quest system. I have made almost 180g this week doing tons of quests.
I have to mention what a bs quest Dead Man's Plea is. I bet most people won't ever complete this one. I think it's cool with the timer, but 45 min. is overkill for people that goes there to upgrade their valor and shadowcraft items. Quests that are insanely time restrictive belongs to the hardcore players. Put quests like that in MC, ZG, AQ or BWL. I'm not saying the quest is impossible or anything, but a pug group with 2 people having the quest and the rest not, it's never going to happen. Ask my guildies? If I was in a decent guild I probably didn't need to upgrade my shitty tier 0. I just hope Blizz tweaks the timing a little, say 55-60 min.
I was stealthing around the tunnels in silithus mining for arcane crystals today. While waiting for blind to finish cooling down near a mining point, I suddenly hear the sound of a pickaxe. Seconds later the mining point is gone. Funny thing was I saw no one, and the 58 elite bug standing right beside the point did nothing.
Just curious if anyone heard of this.
Ps. RonaldoSan, the 45 min run is tough, but definitely doable without epic gear. I've done it once with guildies and once in a PUG. Haven't had much success a third time though.
My complaint about the quest line now is Lord Valthalak. I can't find a PUG to do it. I got one shot 2 weeks ago, but they called it quits after 2 whole attempts. Last time I heard someone forming a group, I immediately sent a tell, and was refused because my rogue didn't have raid gear. It's getting retarded. I have a character in a raiding guild, but I don't see why I have to beg them to help me do a quest that's for non-raiders.
Just curious if anyone heard of this.
Ps. RonaldoSan, the 45 min run is tough, but definitely doable without epic gear. I've done it once with guildies and once in a PUG. Haven't had much success a third time though.
My complaint about the quest line now is Lord Valthalak. I can't find a PUG to do it. I got one shot 2 weeks ago, but they called it quits after 2 whole attempts. Last time I heard someone forming a group, I immediately sent a tell, and was refused because my rogue didn't have raid gear. It's getting retarded. I have a character in a raiding guild, but I don't see why I have to beg them to help me do a quest that's for non-raiders.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
You're not going to do 45 minute Baron first or second try like everything else in the game. Remember other videogames and how you have to do challenging shit multiple times before you get it? Just keep at it and don't stress it. It's way easier than it seems, even if you're in full blues.
And to be completely honest, if you don't have 4 friends yet in this game, whether you're in a guild or not, you've completely failed at the social aspect of WOW.
And to be completely honest, if you don't have 4 friends yet in this game, whether you're in a guild or not, you've completely failed at the social aspect of WOW.
I nearly did the 45 min. baron run with a mostly alts group with hardly any raid gear, but we just had a couple bad pulls/wipes that kept it from happening. That was on like the 4th attempt. It's actually mostly easy, you just have to practice it a bunch until you get it right. But that alone makes it boring for me...
Aye, forming the Team Sexy Pants group of 1 Mage, 1 Priest and 2 Warriors on Suramar (god bless you lads!) really breathed a shitload of life back into WoW when it was starting to get stagnated for me in the mid-20's range on my first character.Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
SatelliteOfLove
Member
SaitoH said:
Z-axis hack. From what I hear, you can "walk on your head" on the underside of the world, thus ignoring mobs, (who don't aggro thru floors, just like in buildings). It's supposed to come with another z-axis one that allows you to run at any altitude, or at any speed. You can mine underground like that cuz nodes are mirrored below ground (look at ones on steep hills to see this).
Some servers are supposed to be legion with those, and Azshara's 5 Rich Thorium chains were their prime target, but it seems as if the smart ones keep a lower profile in more difficult areas now.
So, my guild has been running MC with another guild for the past couple weekends (joint effort, I guess you could say). On our first run, we got up to Golemagg and then people just got tired, heh. Anyway, my question is this ... we do quite a bit of ZG (we down everything but Jindo routinely) and AQ20 (kurinaxx, rajaxx, buru and moam so far), and from what I've seen, both of those instances are much harder than MC, but with far weaker gear payout.
So ... question being ... am I insane in thinking that, or is it a reasonable assessment?
So ... question being ... am I insane in thinking that, or is it a reasonable assessment?
Fragamemnon
Member
MC is a joke if you have A) enough people with decent gear who know what they are doing and B) have plenty of experience there (say 3-4 raids). Then it's a boring snorefest of a raid that people can't wait to never have to do anymore except on alts (and everyone brings their mains to ragnaros for the tier 2 legs, wish they would move those to BWL).
ZG is pretty easy up to the hexxer which is almost always an entertaining fight. Jindo and Hakkar drop fantastic loot that competes with MC/BWL boss loot. Guilds just getting into AQ40 need to be farming the crap out of that place for Bloodvine now for the new NR items in 1.11 and the enchantments are best-of-class. Even the weaker bosses have a chance to drop some serious business level 65-68 epic loot (Will of Arlokk, for example). The armor rewards are dissapointing because by the time you get the necessary faction you'll have likely put a better item from MC or higher in the slot.
AQ20 gets you some Cenarion Circle rep and some of the rewards there are very good. The class books are important no matter what-even if they aren't taken/used immediately they can be used to refill guild coffers by reselling them to casuals on the AH or can be kept around and traded out to deflate DKP. Ossirian's head gives a really nice, easy to get necklace and the dungeon isn't full of trash and goes very quickly. You even get some Brood of Nozdormu faction if you're just starting out by going there too, a bit for each boss. When you get to AQ40 it really makes "getting out of the hole" in that faction that much easier.
So yeah, the loot in the 20-mans isn't that great but there are other benefits too that shouldn't be overlooked.
ZG is pretty easy up to the hexxer which is almost always an entertaining fight. Jindo and Hakkar drop fantastic loot that competes with MC/BWL boss loot. Guilds just getting into AQ40 need to be farming the crap out of that place for Bloodvine now for the new NR items in 1.11 and the enchantments are best-of-class. Even the weaker bosses have a chance to drop some serious business level 65-68 epic loot (Will of Arlokk, for example). The armor rewards are dissapointing because by the time you get the necessary faction you'll have likely put a better item from MC or higher in the slot.
AQ20 gets you some Cenarion Circle rep and some of the rewards there are very good. The class books are important no matter what-even if they aren't taken/used immediately they can be used to refill guild coffers by reselling them to casuals on the AH or can be kept around and traded out to deflate DKP. Ossirian's head gives a really nice, easy to get necklace and the dungeon isn't full of trash and goes very quickly. You even get some Brood of Nozdormu faction if you're just starting out by going there too, a bit for each boss. When you get to AQ40 it really makes "getting out of the hole" in that faction that much easier.
So yeah, the loot in the 20-mans isn't that great but there are other benefits too that shouldn't be overlooked.
Well, I don't have any real complaints with ZG/AQ20. I do find them a lot of fun (minus that Rajaxx fight), although, I wish the loot was a bit better for the effort we've put into learning the encounters. The thing that bugs me is that instead, our guild could have just picked up like, 15-20 scrubs and ran a good portion of MC over and over. I mean, that's really the only reason why we hardly go ... lack of warm, semi-capable bodies.
Fragamemnon
Member
MC is just lame and they should just nerf the trash so people from raid guilds can pug it with a smaller guild and /random off all the crap. Smaller guild gets most of the set stuff the raid guild doesn't need, raid guild gets the general stuff that's actually good (Quick Strike, ToEP, etc) and ragnaros legs. In and out in less than 3 hours from first pull, even with the noob guild in tow.
Right now it's tedious and the repair bills can stack up fast on lavapacks when you forget to itemrack to your FR gear.
Right now it's tedious and the repair bills can stack up fast on lavapacks when you forget to itemrack to your FR gear.
Azwethinkweiz
Member
How much more do you want them to nerf it? It's already had the shit nerfed out of it.
dave is ok
aztek is ok
MC is the worst zone in the game, bar none.
Fragamemnon
Member
Just the trash, really. Maybe remove 20% of the trash mobs and one or two lava packs?
The giant duos, annihilators, and the flamelords don't really get to me THAT much, except I think there are a couple too many between the entrance area and the lava packs.
Basically, I would like for the time spent clearing MC trash to be about equal to the time spent clearning BWL trash (not counting suppression room, which I feel w/ Broodlord is it's own, very lengthy encounter) or, better yet, AQ40 (where there is very little trash period for most of the dungeon, up until/after Huhu).
The giant duos, annihilators, and the flamelords don't really get to me THAT much, except I think there are a couple too many between the entrance area and the lava packs.
Basically, I would like for the time spent clearing MC trash to be about equal to the time spent clearning BWL trash (not counting suppression room, which I feel w/ Broodlord is it's own, very lengthy encounter) or, better yet, AQ40 (where there is very little trash period for most of the dungeon, up until/after Huhu).
Azwethinkweiz
Member
If you're efficient enough, you can clear MC in about two hours. Yeah, there is a lot of trash, but if you remove enough trash to be on par with BWL/AQ, the zone would be cleared in about an hour.
I don't think you should be able to do MC in the same amount of time as Baron, but then again, you can clear it faster than ZG now, so what do I know.
I don't think you should be able to do MC in the same amount of time as Baron, but then again, you can clear it faster than ZG now, so what do I know.
Fragamemnon
Member
Azwethinkweiz said:
Two hours would be really good time. Usually the problem is people farking around in vent during the lava packs and having stupid intermittent deaths. Three is a good target for any guild, assuming you're actually bidding on the loot and you like to screw around a bit on the raid.
Oh, and if you're in BWL/AQ40 gear, then of course it's going to go faster. Then again, you're most likely running MC with your alts in DM blues and some MC stuff, so it takes longer because you don't have the insane boosts that BWL brings to DPS classes.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
I don't get what you're trying to say here. It's a problem that Blizzard is doing a lot of work at once rather than making us wait?pxleyes said:
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
The thing is, mages didn't really need a buff. They just needed changes, and there are some good changes, even if they're fairly minor and disappointing.pxleyes said:
For all the whining Alliance does about Shaman PVP (which is all justified... they really are unstoppable monsters), Shaman PVE definitely needed a buff, and it appears the review focused strongly on PVE even if some of the totem buffs will also apply to PVP.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
that's such crap though. mages do need a buff. i hardly consider a tier 4 talent giving 150 armor a buff in survivability. we didn't get the needed changes at all nor any changes we asked for. it is just like rubbing salt in the wound that shamans get any kind of buff what-so-ever, especially a buff that also buffs their pvp status. it's fucking laughable to be honest.
edit: mages needed more than talent changes. I do welcome the mage talent changes as they are an improvement, but they changes do NOTHING to our mechanics which do need a buff.
The mage arcane tree has become almost worthless in 1.11.. And we still have some issues in PvP. Namely, there are several other classes that have distinct advantages over us with similar level gear. We're weak against more classes than most everyone else. Warlocks and shamans in particular destroy us, and we have lots of trouble with hunters, druids and priests. The review helps very little in that respect.
Still, I'm not suicidal over the changes or anything, and I have some faith that the review will be furthur tweaked before launch.
Still, I'm not suicidal over the changes or anything, and I have some faith that the review will be furthur tweaked before launch.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie
Member
Quit the game? What do you want me to say to make it all better?pxleyes said:
epmode said:
I'm surprised you have faith still and I am honestly curiuos as to where you still find the faith?
Also, it comes down to this: mages were originally designed to be low armor/high damage. That is what the manual says. Blizzard then went on to give EVERYONE huge dps which made mages mediocre in that regard (as seen in the fact we no longer do the most dps of any class most of the time). We are also left with the same piss poor armor we had since day one while the other classes that did and still do have more armor/survivability now also get a wonderful buff in damage. So now the difference becomes clear, as mages are no longer as useful as basically any other class anymore beyond providing water, intellect, and AoE which can be done in most instances just as well by other classes.
Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
id like to see an admission that mages are gimped compared to most any class that can do similar spells or actions. we have no clear place in either pvp or pve anymore. the crossovers that blizzard has put in place between classes and the original mage intent has caused mages to become gimp in everything they were originally good at. you say we are fine yet you go on to ask what we want from you. you know what we want, admission we are right in our complaints.
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