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[Ferrio]

Which end up having hunters with TF, Pallies and Druids with Hand of Rag and, oh, why not Claw of Cromie on a rogue? Yah right

Being *casual" != idioticaly alloting loot

As for beeing jealous on TF.. yeah right :rolleyes I pity the waste for the guild's tanks, that's all

Well the argument is moot, the main tank does have one.

Also this whole retarded stereotype you have on alliance is wearing thin. It's almost as bad as people bitching about paladins and shamans in pvp.

For Paladins getting the hang of rag, because usually warriors don't want the fucking thing due to mace spec being ass. Why get the Hand of Rag when you can eventually get an Untamed Blade or Ashkandi? With sword spec they're going to equal if not outdamage hand of rag.

 

[Fularu]

Calculations prove otherwise, only ashkandi, with the proper spec, can really outdamage the hand of rag. Or else we're Looking at Dark Edge of Insanity, and the thing has been nerfed anyway.

As for the stereotypes, you carry them and flaunt them for everyone to see, my dear ferrio

And the point isn'ty really moot since I would hardly believe your guild has a single tank (or else, good luck in AQ or Naxx)

 

[paul777]

Holy shit the mage talent changes are unbelievably poor. Combustion nerfed, shatter nerfed, arcane subtlety nerfed, arcane power nerfed, fucking improved fire ward was nerfed. in return we get what, 3-4 talent points freed up and a slightly buffed ice barrier that still does not scale. I so do not regret quitting my mage.

 

[Tamanon]

Holy shit the mage talent changes are unbelievably poor. Combustion nerfed, shatter nerfed, arcane subtlety nerfed, arcane power nerfed, fucking improved fire ward was nerfed. in return we get what, 3-4 talent points freed up and a slightly buffed ice barrier that still does not scale. I so do not regret quitting my mage.

Actually I think Arcane Subtlety got a boost personally. Some of the changes I don't like, but I like some of the new talents.

 

[pxleyes]

Holy shit the mage talent changes are unbelievably poor. Combustion nerfed, shatter nerfed, arcane subtlety nerfed, arcane power nerfed, fucking improved fire ward was nerfed. in return we get what, 3-4 talent points freed up and a slightly buffed ice barrier that still does not scale. I so do not regret quitting my mage.

Actually Combustion is a buff, Subtlety is a buff.

overall though its still shit. We still dont have an aggro drop ability, and we still rely on trinkets and +dmg gear solely for our dmg. We needed a buff with int causing something like "50% of int = +dmg", so 300 int = +150dmg. Maybe not that extreme, but along those lines.

 

[paul777]

Have you ever raided as a mage? On fights where threat is an important factor mages were nerfed outright with this change to Arc sub. It's just simple math. I will (would if I still played) be doing less damage in those fights.

 

[pxleyes]

Have you ever raided as a mage? On fights where threat is an important factor mages were nerfed outright with this change to Arc sub. It's just simple math. I will (would if I still played) be doing less damage in those fights.

:lol It affects ALL trees now, so its a buff for most of us that dont us AM in raids.

 

[Tamanon]

Have you ever raided as a mage? On fights where threat is an important factor mages were nerfed outright with this change to Arc sub. It's just simple math. I will (would if I still played) be doing less damage in those fights.

Actually it means that you don't HAVE to do AM in raids anymore if you have more efficient spells.

 

[paul777]

Actually Combustion is a buff, Subtlety is a buff.

overall though its still shit. We still dont have an aggro drop ability, and we still rely on trinkets and +dmg gear solely for our dmg. We needed a buff with int causing something like "50% of int = +dmg", so 300 int = +150dmg. Maybe not that extreme, but along those lines.

How is combustion a buff? Combustion sucked before because there was no point in taking it over PoM. PoM offered identical burst damage consistently, possibility for much more burst damage with lucky crits, and it took off the cast time which is huge because if you haven't noticed WoW pvp is not at all friendly to 3-6 second cast spells. The new combustion has you casting those 3-6 second cast spells even more often. PvE, it's not that bad, but not that good either.

 

[SaitoH]

Which end up having hunters with TF, Pallies and Druids with Hand of Rag and, oh, why not Claw of Cromie on a rogue? Yah right

Being *casual" != idioticaly alloting loot

As for beeing jealous on TF.. yeah right :rolleyes I pity the waste for the guild's tanks, that's all

Why does it matter to you what someone else has? Your "idiotically allotting loot" and "waste" is none of your business. If his guild was fine with him having TF, then that's all that's important.

All this venom and self-righteous attitude you're spewing is nothing more than a silly case of loot envy.

 

[Fragamemnon]

Yeah, using AM/subtlety in raids wasn't necessary as long as you knew when to hold back. Crit burst damage could get you aggro, but in general it is easy to control as long as everything goes OK.

 

[pxleyes]

How is combustion a buff? Combustion sucked before because there was no point in taking it over PoM. PoM offered identical burst damage consistently, possibility for much more burst damage with lucky crits, and it took off the cast time which is huge because if you haven't noticed WoW pvp is not at all friendly to 3-6 second cast spells. The new combustion has you casting those 3-6 second cast spells even more often. PvE, it's not that bad, but not that good either.

are you a moron? The new Combustion guarantees 3 crit spells, and EVERY fire spell you cast increases your crit chance by 10%, so even if it does take you 10 spells, you will get 3 crits while it lasts. How is that bad?

 

[Tamanon]

Yeah, using AM/subtlety in raids wasn't necessary as long as you knew when to hold back. Crit burst damage could get you aggro, but in general it is easy to control as long as everything goes OK.

And THAT is why the new Subtlety is nice, just flat out reduces Crit aggro.

 

[pxleyes]

And THAT is why the new Subtlety is nice, just flat out reduces Crit aggro.

yea, so you can continue stable dps without having to back off when you get a few crits in a row.

 

[paul777]

Actually it means that you don't HAVE to do AM in raids anymore if you have more efficient spells.

It's really simple. My mage in pretty much full epics has about 15% crit rate with a frost spec. So 15% of the time I will be doing 50% less threat. With old arc sub I was doing 40% less threat all the time. It is a DPS nerf.

 

[paul777]

are you a moron? The new Combustion guarantees 3 crit spells, and EVERY fire spell you cast increases your crit chance by 10%, so even if it does take you 10 spells, you will get 3 crits while it lasts. How is that bad?

There is still no reason for any mage that wants to PvP to take it over PoM. Fuck, it's even worse for pvp than the old combustion. At least the old version gave you some semblance of controllable burst damage.

 

[pxleyes]

It's really simple. My mage in pretty much full epics has about 15% crit rate with a frost spec. So 15% of the time I will be doing 50% less threat. With old arc sub I was doing 40% less threat all the time. It is a DPS nerf.

You are a frost build but using AM in raids? yep, moron.

 

[pxleyes]

There is still no reason for any mage that wants to PvP to take it over PoM. Fuck, it's even worse for pvp than the old combustion. At least the old version gave you some semblance of controllable burst damage.

Did I ever say it was good for PVP? Fuck PvP in my opinion. The combustion change is a PvE buff wich has a LOT of usability.

 

[paul777]

You are a frost build but using AM in raids? yep, moron.

haha you can't be serious

 

[pxleyes]

haha you can't be serious

how am I not serious? I am currently ice/arc myself and I still use frostbolt all the time in raids.

 

[Tamanon]

how am I not serious? I am currently ice/arc myself and I still use frostbolt all the time in raids.

NO! YOU MUST DO IT HIS WAY!

And go Gators.

 

[pxleyes]

NO! YOU MUST DO IT HIS WAY!

And go Gators.

lawl.

at least we can ALL agree that Arcane Resiliance is the most pointless talent ever created. Blizzard needs to change the world Intellect with Mana.

and Go Gators.

 

[Outdoor Miner]

Forums have been nuked. Mages am uproared.

I'd be pissed too, what a shitty talent review. Poor bastards, come join us Warlock brethren. Do around the same damage but with a pet and actual survivability! :lol

 

[firex]

How is it that Barrens Chat is retarded on every single server? Why is there no Alliance equivalent?

The alliance equivalent is basically all zones level 1-60.

 

[pxleyes]

Forums have been nuked. Mages am uproared.

I'd be pissed too, what a shitty talent review. Poor bastards, come join us Warlock brethren. Do around the same damage but with a pet and actual survivability! :lol

certainly one way to subdue the masses.

 

[Liu Kang Baking A Pie]

LOL @ MAGE TALENT REVIEW.

http://pc.ign.com/articles/704/704665p1.html

LOL!!!!!!!

 

[Fularu]

Why does it matter to you what someone else has? Your "idiotically allotting loot" and "waste" is none of your business. If his guild was fine with him having TF, then that's all that's important.

All this venom and self-righteous attitude you're spewing is nothing more than a silly case of loot envy.

Way to completely miss the point :lol

TF on a rogue (or anything beside a tank btw, including dps warriors) is a waste of the best tanking weapon in-game, now please, when you have hunters getting BB, or warriors taking Maladath, I hope our poor rogues aren't bitching

And I make my business whatever the hell I want my business to be, good kind sir, just like you're doing right now

 

[MrAngryFace]

Winter's Chill
Gived your Frost damage spells a 20/40/60/80/100% chance to apply the Winter's Chill effect, which increases the chance a Frost spell will critically hit the target by 1% for 15 seconds Stacks up to 5 times.

More high quality writing from IGN lolz.

 

[Fularu]

LOL @ MAGE TALENT REVIEW.

http://pc.ign.com/articles/704/704665p1.html

LOL!!!!!!!

Ouch, and here I was thinking they hated warriors :lol I know plenty of our mages that will be bitching tonight

 

[epmode]

I want to delete my mage

 

[Fragamemnon]

My poor, poor frost mage.

He wasn't even ever all that great in PvP compared to other classes, but a good chunk of his PvE DPS (while farming/grinding solo) came from shatter crits. I really wanted the mage changes to make me want to play him again instead of my priest, now I just can't bear even thinking about it.

 

[Ferrio]

Calculations prove otherwise, only ashkandi, with the proper spec, can really outdamage the hand of rag. Or else we're Looking at Dark Edge of Insanity, and the thing has been nerfed anyway.

As for the stereotypes, you carry them and flaunt them for everyone to see, my dear ferrio

And the point isn'ty really moot since I would hardly believe your guild has a single tank (or else, good luck in AQ or Naxx)

Ya, we just have rogues tank Nef and hit evasion.

Actually seriously our MT is quite hardcore when comes to tanking, literally an obsession. He doesn't pvp, he cares nothing about dps, but is totally gung ho about being MT. Nothing he likes better in the game than tanking, which is abnormal.

For the longest time he tanked with only some crappy axe called the Hedgecutter, but still was the best tank I've ever seen. Once he got the thunderfury, he's become totally insane. During a broodlord fight, broodlord didn't change targets to any other warrior, the whole fight just kept smacking on him.

TF on a rogue (or anything beside a tank btw, including dps warriors) is a waste of the best tanking weapon in-game, now please, when you have hunters getting BB, or warriors taking Maladath, I hope our poor rogues aren't bitching

We don't bitch. Hell last night a Dragonfang blade went to a hunter, reason no rogue wanted it. Same reason I got the TF, no warrior wanted it.

 

[explodet]

Those bastards kept improved counterspell on tier 4 arcane!

And wow, arcane resilience is all sorts of useless!


EDIT: Although I can see why most mages are up in arms - with the nerf to the frost tree, and with 90% (give or take 1%) of mages being frost, you've got 90% of all mages griping.

I'm a frostie myself... but my biggest gripe is that improved counterspell!

 

[firex]

this talent review is so bad blizzard hasn't even put it up on their site!

somehow I've got a feeling either a lot of the spells are being reworked or they're going to (hopefully) change the talents more. the only good thing I noticed about frost barrier is the 30 second cooldown so it's basically recastable if you don't use it up entirely.

 

[dave is ok]

Those bastards kept improved counterspell on tier 4 arcane!

And wow, arcane resilience is all sorts of useless!

NO WAY! THATS LIKE 100+ ARMOR!

(lols)

 

[pxleyes]

this talent review is so bad blizzard hasn't even put it up on their site!

somehow I've got a feeling either a lot of the spells are being reworked or they're going to (hopefully) change the talents more. the only good thing I noticed about frost barrier is the 30 second cooldown so it's basically recastable if you don't use it up entirely.

With the PTR going live next week, I dont see many things changing. Not to mention PTRs never fixed talents, just bugs...sometimes.

 

[Fragamemnon]

Taking frost barrier now would pretty much delegate you to raid/group PvE only. You'd lose PoM, and without PoM and the new SHITTY SHATTER your PvP burst DPS can be easily eclipsed by a fucking pally in blues.

 

[explodet]

Okay, I can see one possible good thing with arcane resilience: if higher ranks are trainable. Like 50/100/150/200/250... 250% of say, 300 intellect is 750 armor - which isn't fantastic, but not useless.

 

[epmode]

http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.a...e&ThreadID=3851

P.S. - Shatter was a miscommunication. It is 5 ranks of 10% increments, not one rank as initially reported. We have contacted IGN with the appropriate update information.

OK, I don't want to delete my mage anymore.

Still, the review was largely unimaginitive and any elementalist builds are going to be gimped by keeping Improved Counterspell so deep in Arcane.

 

[Fragamemnon]

Tseric speaks:


"Shatter was a miscommunication. It is 5 ranks of 10% increments, not one rank as initially reported. We have contacted IGN with the appropriate update information."

Haha, IGN tarded that one up pretty bad.

Frost Mages got a nice buff now. A PvE raid build might look like:

Arcane: Max subtlety, 2 points focus. Five points clearcasting, 1 point new armor talent, 4 points improved explosion, improved CS and full meditation.

Frost: 5 pt. Improved Frostbolt , 5 points ice shards, 1 point imp. blizzard, 1 point cold snap, 3 points piercing ice, five points shatter, 3 points frost channeling, 1 point ice block, 3 points improved cone of cold, 2 points winter's chill, 1 point ice barrier.

That's a big boost over the current builds. More toys, less points. You'll never run out of mana in PvE with that kind of build and can totally gimp out your mana pool for +dmg and stam like a good mage (if you even have to make the tradeoff, my mage won't see MC/AQ40/BWL since my main is a healbot) since you'll have nutty regen (medidation, mage armor) and cheap spells (channeling).

PvP you'd probably want something with PoM and maybe improved nova, no need for channeling you could dump it into improved blizzard to fight the zerg.

OK, happier now.

 

[cubicle47b]

Shatter is exactly the same, Tseric just said so. It was a miscommunication with IGN.

Arcane sublety is much more of a buff than a nerf. Lowering resistances and having it affect crits from all schools is very good. And it's actually a buff on broodlord too. Now horde mages don't have to hit the arcane missiles button for the entire fight. They can just autowand and alt-tab out like the warlocks do until it's announced he's dead over vent.

 

[hobart]

Disappointing... regardless.

I reckon we were looking for a bit more. ^^

 

[explodet]

Shatter is exactly the same, Tseric just said so. It was a miscommunication with IGN.

... actually, it's slightly different.

They updated it so that it reads:

Increases the critical strike chance of all your spells against frozen targets by 10/20/30/40/50%.

I wouldn't be surprised if this is yet another error, but if true... dang.

 

[Sirpopopop]

You are a frost build but using AM in raids? yep, moron.

I've raided with him, I saw him regularly catch no.1 on the damage meter for 2 months straight as a mage, just wearing greens and blues. Tre & MAF have also played with him as well, he's no moron, and probably is a better player than you.

 

[pxleyes]

I've raided with him, I saw him regularly catch no.1 on the damage meter for 2 months straight as a mage, just wearing greens and blues. Tre & MAF have also played with him as well, he's no moron, and probably is a better player than you.

sorry, but if you dump points into the frost tree to only use AM, then you are a waste.

 

[Sirpopopop]

sorry, but if you dump points into the frost tree to only use AM, then you are a waste.

He didn't say he only used AM...

What he said was this:

On fights where threat is an important factor mages were nerfed outright with this change to Arc sub.

So for fights where threat was important - he used AM.

 

[pxleyes]

He didn't say he only used AM...

What he said was this:



So for fights where threat was important - he used AM.

then he has no concept of managing his own threat. Most mages do just fine with frost/firebolt while still managing aggro. If you are overdealing THAT much damage, then you are hurting the raid rather than helping.

 

[paul777]

then he has no concept of managing his own threat. Most mages do just fine with frost/firebolt while still managing aggro. If you are overdealing THAT much damage, then you are hurting the raid rather than helping.

It's not a matter of managing threat, it's a matter of potential DPS. I can do 1000 damage with AM but only cause 600 points of threat. The threat ceiling for AM is higher allowing me to do more damage than I could with frostbolt. Of course, a lot of fights don't really have a threat ceiling at all, but some do and on those you are better served with AM if you have Subtlety.

 

[MrAngryFace]

And this is why I wont run Raids.

 

[Tamanon]

Shatter still intact, ELEMENTALIST HERE I COME!