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[THE DUCK]

3 million units sold in 2 months. Incredible performance.

Better math than taking 27 million and saying it's 23 or 24 million......2 or 3 months later. If it makes everyone feel better, let's say 28 million. Still pretty sure that's closer to 30 million than 24 million, but like you say, my math is fuzzy.

 

[hemo memo]

You could bottle the salt from this thread and sell it as Vault-Tec Tears and it could keep a vault stocked for generations.

 

[balls of snow]

Makes sense. I havent played my series x until recently to play Harold Hallibut. Not opening up the ms store to snatch up some games on sale because of the speedrun to multiplatform by the maestros at ms hq.

 

[ChorizoPicozo]

I think that the way games are stagnating the line between cross gen / next gen will become thinner every gen ...to the point that eventually we dont even have next gen only games that much.. or only really at the end of the generation ... tales from my ass of course.. but well... it seems the industry is moving this way.

yeah. I mean, when you think about it; this Gen, devs will by making only one true Next-Gen game

1. first game, cross Gen with the old gen
2. second game, the only true "current Gen"
3. third game, cross Gen with next Gen

it creates this weird miss match, like consoles generations and devs are not in synchrony.

what's the solution, to have 10 years generations or even longer?

If I have to guess.. and only guess.. I think MS will try to position this new console as the better machine to play multiplats, Is the best they can try to do in my opinion.

going for a handled/ hybrid console could be the more nuanced approach. but Xbox has been always about making the most powerful hardware (so, that approach is the most expected one).

the issue is that devs clearly can't keep up with technology.

what is interesting, is how these two companies talk about the challenges:

Xbox blames external factors while Sony says they need to be more efficient and the need to re-evaluate how to operate to meet the expectation from the people who love AAA single player games and the approach to GaaS production.


is not like these external factors are not real, but those factors are not the reason Xbox is in this situation.. what's is really scary, based in the posture from Phil when he says that "it's about mobile, that without mobile the business is not viable" or something to that effect. is the fact that there is like a 10% chance for Xbox (the gaming division) to totally implode. (similar to what happened to embracer)


Phil is acting like mobile is the new frontier, the unexplored market but mobile is already a mature market.

MS failed at gaining market share from consoles

MS falied at capitalizing from windows ownership.

And Mobile is already taken by Google and Apple.

streaming will be complentary at best.

I'm saying this because it dosen't matter what their strategy is... is not about the strategy; it's about the execution. and MS/Xbox's execution keeps sucking asss.

 

[GHG]

Better math than taking 27 million and saying it's 23 or 24 million......2 or 3 months later. If it makes everyone feel better, let's say 28 million. Still pretty sure that's closer to 30 million than 24 million, but like you say, my math is fuzzy.

For the record, I said 24-25 million.

And this is why (from the very article I quoted):

PS5 and Xbox Series X/S Have Collectively Sold 77 Million Units, According to Take-Two Interactive

gamingbolt.com

Your assumptions are on the high side, and that's fine. But it's still nowhere near 30 million.

Ok let me simplify this for you. Meta lost 16 billion in 2023. Sony made 6 billion, Nintendo made 3 Billion. You have deep pockets. Regardless of your loses this year, which market would you chase? Yes both are loss leading, but one is currently loss stupidity, the other generally makes money.

You keep trying to twist my stance on why vr is avoided into something it's not.

I'm not twisting anything, you're the one who seems to have opposing stances on two different businesses areas despite the financial outcome being exactly the same as far as Microsoft is concerned. It's bizarre, if unsurprising.

The equation is simple, if they are involved in the business area and you've made it part of your personality then the losses are fine and they shouldn't care if it loses a bit of cash. However if they aren't involved in a business area then suddenly we need to be concerned about the financial impact if they were to. So much for "20 billion in profit".

As for "loss stupidity" as far Meta are concerned:

12.37 billion in profit? No wonder they don't care if VR loses a bit of cash. Not likely to "give up" any time soon.

As you can see, I'm learning from the best.

 

[Sw0pDiller]

These numbers are downright horrible for xbox and Acitivision/Blizzard just saved their guts from being a meaningless 3rd option. When Nintendo is coming later this year and Ps5 pro hits, they just fade out as an serious alternative. Going multiplatform just keeps them from drowning.

It's all about long term engagement though. Xbox does not have the platform to sell their games on so everything goes to make some money. I am really not sure if there is going to be another xbox but if there is, i think it will be a much more open platform like the steam deck. A pc in console dress if you will. And maybe then PlayStation will fail because the nextbox is tapping into pc and xbox gamers at the same time.

it's time to fire Phil...

 

[THE DUCK]

For the record, I said 24-25 million.

And this is why (from the very article I quoted):

PS5 and Xbox Series X/S Have Collectively Sold 77 Million Units, According to Take-Two Interactive

gamingbolt.com

Your assumptions are on the high side, and that's fine. But it's still nowhere near 30 million.



I'm not twisting anything, you're the one who seems to have opposing stances on two different businesses areas despite the financial outcome being exactly the same as far as Microsoft is concerned. It's bizarre, if unsurprising.

The equation is simple, if they are involved in the business area and you've made it part of your personality then the losses are fine and they shouldn't care if it loses a bit of cash. However if they aren't involved in a business area then suddenly we need to be concerned about the financial impact if they were to. So much for "20 billion in profit".

As for "loss stupidity" as far Meta are concerned:

12.37 billion in profit? No wonder they don't care if VR loses a bit of cash. Not likely to "give up" any time soon.

As you can see, I'm learning from the best.

I've never once said they shouldn't care about loses, what I have said is nothing in thier past leads me to they are ready to give up on the console hardware business. This doesn't fly in.the face of not wanting to enter into another business that makes even less money. So again, your twisting it to your own narrative.

The no wonder they don't care about xboxer loses was tongue and cheek, that may have been missed. Nobody wants to lose money on anything.

 

[Daniel_Mallorca1985]

 

[Dick Jones]

How the fuck does phil still have a job?

It's like his motto says
"When I manage, everybody else wins"

 

[Crayon]

Why people in this forum always seems so happy with negative Xbox news? It's because they don't want to buy another console so they can have everything on their platform? It's because they don't want choice? It's just conservatism? I have seem people here celebrating even when a game get low metacritic score. It shouldn't be the opposite? After all, this is a gaming forum.

Xbox has a very good piece of hardware, offer choices in the way you play and pay and also lowered the barrier to access games. It still ships a variety of good and different games, which are being successful sold on Playstation and Switch. So, It seems childish to me to celebrate the fall or end of a competitor in such a limited, difficult and expensive Industry. I can only imagine the outcome with two console markers.

And by the way, Nadela is doing what he did in all the other divisions and he might know what's he is doing being the leader of the largest company in the world.

 

[THE DUCK]

Debbie downer, I fixed it for you.

 

[TBiddy]

Why people in this forum always seems so happy with negative Xbox news? It's because they don't want to buy another console so they can have everything on their platform? It's because they don't want choice? It's just conservatism? I have seem people here celebrating even when a game get low metacritic score. It shouldn't be the opposite? After all, this is a gaming forum.

Xbox has a very good piece of hardware, offer choices in the way you play and pay and also lowered the barrier to access games. It still ships a variety of good and different games, which are being successful sold on Playstation and Switch. So, It seems childish to me to celebrate the fall or end of a competitor in such a limited, difficult and expensive Industry. I can only imagine the outcome with two console markers.

And by the way, Nadela is doing what he did in all the other divisions and he might know what's he is doing being the leader of the largest company in the world.

It's what happens when people tie their identity to a large company. It also happens on Team Green, of course, but jesus christ - reading this thread makes me feel sad for many of the participants.

That said, Xbox is dying. No way around it. The console itself is beefy enough, but there's literally absolutely no reason to purchase it right now. From the top of my head I can't name a single next-gen exclusive game only available on Xbox/PC, other than the new Forza. And Starfield, of course. Forgot about that. Like everyone else.. Uncle Phil had a lot of great intentions, I assume, but he has clearly failed to deliver.

 

[GHG]

I've never once said they shouldn't care about loses, what I have said is nothing in thier past leads me to they are ready to give up on the console hardware business. This doesn't fly in.the face of not wanting to enter into another business that makes even less money. So again, your twisting it to your own narrative.

The reason I'm questioning you on this is because everything you've stated is at odds with itself.

You claimed you "enjoy VR", so why should you care if they were to lose money as a result of making a re-entry in to VR? Would it not benefit you and the general consumer who has an interest in VR if they were to give it another stab?

Like I said, you're quick to become an accountant and make financial excuses for them when it's areas they aren't involved in, but as far as Xbox is concerned it's handwaving to the tune of "20 billion profit!".

As for "nothing in their past" - do you have a short memory? Microsoft are not shy in unceremoniously cutting business areas that don't make them the kind of money they originally hoped, even if they've been at it for decades.

 

[onQ123]

New Data Suggests That PS5 Has Outsold Xbox Series X/S 2-to-1 - IGN

Sony’s PlayStation 5 has sold around double the number of units as the Xbox Series X | S, according to data shared in a recent Take-Two Interactive earnings report.

www.ign.com

"Microsoft usually keeps its numbers under wraps, but with Take-Two’s information in mind, we can estimate that Xbox Series X | S sales sit at around 27 million units sold."

That's from Feb, it's end of April, like I said, close to 30 million.



Your the one quoting me as to why ms would not want a vr add on. This is why.



Why would anyone care how many huge loss leading quest 2 units were sold, meta had massive losses in the billions and an attach rate of on 2 or 3 lower priced games. Ms could care less. Based on the data we have available, vr is a nightmare. 16 billion dollars they lost in one year!

The leader in vr loses money, the console leader can't sell thier add on, and your on me for saying it's a waste of time and money vs chasing traditional console sales with attach rates at 7-9 full games and huge add on sales and broader appeal?

Wait!

So you're taking the estimated 27 million from February & ignoring that it's estimated to have sold around 800k in the last quarter & coming up with around 30 million? Where did the other 2 million come from?

 

[Three]

I think that the way games are stagnating the line between cross gen / next gen will become thinner every gen ...to the point that eventually we dont even have next gen only games that much.. or only really at the end of the generation ... tales from my ass of course.. but well... it seems the industry is moving this way.

If I have to guess.. and only guess.. I think MS will try to position this new console as the better machine to play multiplats, Is the best they can try to do in my opinion.

That's exactly what's happening. The console model is going through a massive change. Sony uttering "we believe in generations" was more than about supporting PS5 only games it was about a business model that's dying mostly lead by MS' business model that's really killing it. The business model of taking a loss on devices and building an install base to make it back with software sales is struggling. Chip and manufacturing prices aren't dropping fast enough to turn those losses into profitable hardware sales later in the gen. Game subscriptions and mobile are eating into software sales.

What you're going to see is the loss leader model in consoles be slowly phased out. You're going to see hardware become almost exactly like it is in the mobile space. Sarah bond coming from EE is no coincidence. Like mobile they will make games that don't even know what generations or manufacturers are. Like mobile the hardware will be sold at a profit from the beginning and short lived before the next. They will sell you the next one at profit that plays the same games with barely a difference. They don't need to recoup any hardware losses over a "console lifetime" that defines a generation anymore. Generations are dead. They'll sign you on to contracts like All Access to pay for your device in installments like mobile.

 

[THE DUCK]

It's what happens when people tie their identity to a large company. It also happens on Team Green, of course, but jesus christ - reading this thread makes me feel sad for many of the participants.

That said, Xbox is dying. No way around it. The console itself is beefy enough, but there's literally absolutely no reason to purchase it right now. From the top of my head I can't name a single next-gen exclusive game only available on Xbox/PC, other than the new Forza. And Starfield, of course. Forgot about that. Like everyone else.. Uncle Phil had a lot of great intentions, I assume, but he has clearly failed to deliver.

Without some of us (who happen to actually be multiplatform gamers) the forum would be way too much xbox hate and no balance.
I'm not even that Xbox crazed but the imbalance here is staggering sometimes to the point of absurd, I feel compelled to stand up for ms just so that there is the slightest modicum of reality reflected in posts. I get labeled green rat for saying anything positive about ms, in any thread, for any reason, regardless if the points have merit or not. (I'm sure some do and some don't, nobody is perfect)

There used to be more of us but a whole bunch just left, or stop posting, some were banned. What's left is definately lopsided.

As to new games, there should some more down the pipeline a bit, I'm sure we will at least see some befire the end of the year. Not a great year overall for any of the consoles in terms of first party exclusives.

 

[DForce]

You could bottle the salt from this thread and sell it as Vault-Tec Tears and it could keep a vault stocked for generations.

Why would people be salty when Xbox hardware is performing poorly?

Microsoft is in a worse position than Sony in the gaming division so there's nothing to be salty over.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

With the series X/S being a little cheaper than last year i think the drop in hardware units probably close to 25%, something like 900K shipped for the quarter is likely.

Shipments (millions of units)

 

[hemo memo]

Why would people be salty when Xbox hardware is performing poorly?

Microsoft is in a worse position than Sony in the gaming division so there's nothing to be salty over.

I don't know why. Maybe that apocalyptic future where Sony is the only one left somehow entices them.

 

[THE DUCK]

The reason I'm questioning you on this is because everything you've stated is at odds with itself.

You claimed you "enjoy VR", so why should you care if they were to lose money as a result of making a re-entry in to VR? Would it not benefit you and the general consumer who has an interest in VR if they were to give it another stab?

Like I said, you're quick to become an accountant and make financial excuses for them when it's areas they aren't involved in, but as far as Xbox is concerned it's handwaving to the tune of "20 billion profit!".

As for "nothing in their past" - do you have a short memory? Microsoft are not shy in unceremoniously cutting business areas that don't make them the kind of money they originally hoped, even if they've been at it for decades.

I do enjoy vr (just bought perscription lenses for my quest 3), I did want ms to make thier own headset, but I recognize why they did not want to.

Nothing in the past in regards to xbox or game consoles suggests they are ready to give in.
The investment has only grown over time, even recently.

But anyhow, they are at a fork in the road. It would be interesting if they went multiplatform but also simultaneously launched a portable and an "uber" high end console.

 

[TBiddy]

Without some of us (who happen to actually be multiplatform gamers) the forum would be way too much xbox hate and no balance.
I'm not even that Xbox crazed but the imbalance here is staggering sometimes to the point of absurd, I feel compelled to stand up for ms just so that there is the slightest modicum of reality reflected in posts. I get labeled green rat for saying anything positive about ms, in any thread, for any reason, regardless if the points have merit or not. (I'm sure some do and some don't, nobody is perfect)

There used to be more of us but a whole bunch just left, or stop posting, some were banned. What's left is definately lopsided.

As to new games, there should some more down the pipeline a bit, I'm sure we will at least see some befire the end of the year. Not a great year overall for any of the consoles in terms of first party exclusives.

I gave my One X to my nephew and am patiently waiting for Sony to release a PS5 that isn't god awful to look at before purchasing one - not sure if that puts me in blue or green these days.

But you're right. There's a very vocal group of users here on Gaf who seem really invested in how the other team is doing. Then again, some people care about football, others about baseball and even others about consoles, I suppose.

 

[Panajev2001a]

Like mobile the hardware will be sold at a profit from the beginning and short lived before the next

Meanwhile physics and reality are settling in and it shows in manufacturing advancements slowing down more and more and more at a higher and higher cost each time. The Moore’s Law Golden CPU era is gone.

The solution, that consumers are missing out on bamboozled by company shiny new jingly keys, is actually medium to long generations with more exotic HW that developer have time and incentive to exploit. Others I believe are kidding themselves that it is not the case… IMHO.

Pointing at the next thousand dollars and Kw consuming PC is not proving any point…

 

[THE DUCK]

I gave my One X to my nephew and am patiently waiting for Sony to release a PS5 that isn't god awful to look at before purchasing one - not sure if that puts me in blue or green these days.

But you're right. There's a very vocal group of users here on Gaf who seem really invested in how the other team is doing. Then again, some people care about football, others about baseball and even others about consoles, I suppose.

I feel like you won't have to wait long, if speculation is right ps5 pro will be announced soon, hopefully it's nice to look at? Kinda hoping it's a bit less round, maybe like this?

 

[Sony]

It's a shame to see a that steep of a decline for Xbox. Microsoft has been producing solid hardware post Xbox One. Hope they'll recover from this, it's healthy to have Sony on top of their game.

 

[Panajev2001a]

It's a shame to see a that steep of a decline for Xbox. Microsoft has been producing solid hardware post Xbox One. Hope they'll recover from this, it's healthy to have Sony on top of their game.

I think it is how a healthy market shakes out. Even if Xbox consoles were not around Sony has a lot of competition as consoles are not an insular land that can survive completely on its own.

Also, when you have huge companies that can literally buy themselves out of losses and into large revenues in one division by using the other division’s money to advance a (rather monopolistic) tendency to rule all game publishing… it is healthy if the much bigger company loses very very badly if it has an offering that consumers reject compared to their smaller competition. Otherwise the smaller companies will always die competing with bigger ones that can survive beat downs.

 

[Clear]

Nothing in the past in regards to xbox or game consoles suggests they are ready to give in.
The investment has only grown over time, even recently.

But anyhow, they are at a fork in the road. It would be interesting if they went multiplatform but also simultaneously launched a portable and an "uber" high end console.

Give in on gaming, never. But abandoning consoles is likely in some form is likely as its always going to be the weakest part (in terms of profitability) of their offer.

Comparing them to SEGA is inappropriate because they have their Cloud business to fall back on in order to preserve platform identity. And as I've said in the past that still needs a defined hardware spec for devs to target.
The big question is whether, and if so to what degree, they continue to make a *RETAIL* hardware offer.

Going high-end is I think unlikely, I suspect it'll be on par with whatever Sony are planning but that's mainly to ensure that they can take advantage of titles built for that system (cost-effective porting). High-end also adds hugely to sunk cost because their cloud back-end needs to be populated with matching hardware and remain scalable to (ideally) massive and growing demand.

As to a portable... Well that would mean them taking on Nintendo, an opponent even Sony has struggled to compete against so I'd suspect that would only be considered if their approach was distinctly different.

 

[Black_Stride]

Wait is The Coaliton going through some shit I didnt hear about?
Didnt they recently expand and now house the XGT Group........and are presumably working on a tech showcase game right now??

Pretty sure Arkane are working on the Blade game.
Rares most succesful game is Sea of Thieves and they are working on Everwild.
Halo Infinite is still charting in the top 25 most played, say what you will about the campaign(which I enjoyed) people are still playing the MP so 343i must have done something right.



Offtopic
Ill die on my sword the Halo 5 had the best MP, and they need to bring back Warzone and Firefight Warzone.
If Halo 5 mp had launched on PC I can all but guarantee they would still be supporting it today.

 

[kruis]

I think that the way games are stagnating the line between cross gen / next gen will become thinner every gen ...to the point that eventually we dont even have next gen only games that much.. or only really at the end of the generation ... tales from my ass of course.. but well... it seems the industry is moving this way.

The problem is the time and money it takes to create an AAA game.

In the PS2 days developers could release a new game every year, in the PS3 days that had slowed down to two years and as a result development costs were going up, but it was still possible to drop support for the previous platform. But during the PS4's life time the time it takes to create visually stunning games exploded. Because of the sales required to recoup the development costs for modern AAA games it's financial suicide to drop support for previous gen hardware and because of the time it takes many of today's next gen games were started when next gen hadn't even been announced.

With the release of SteamDeck and Switch 2 multiplatform developers have even less reason to create graphically demanding games. We're in perpetual crossgen territory now. A next gen Xbox will be running the same games that a SteamDeck or next gen Switch can run, but at a higher resolution or higher frame rate.

Xbox fans thinkg it's still possible for MS to capture a new, huge audience with the release of a new console and launch games that are clearly visually superior to the competition. But that's impossible now we're in perpetual crossgen. The only way out of this dilemma is to drop out of the rat race and make your new console radically different to differentiate itself. My guess is that MS will release a handheld gaming device that can play both WIndows and Xbox games. But that's probably not what diehard Xbox fans want from Microsoft.

 

[March Climber]

Why people in this forum always seems so happy with negative Xbox news? It's because they don't want to buy another console so they can have everything on their platform? It's because they don't want choice? It's just conservatism? I have seem people here celebrating even when a game get low metacritic score. It shouldn't be the opposite? After all, this is a gaming forum.

Xbox has a very good piece of hardware, offer choices in the way you play and pay and also lowered the barrier to access games. It still ships a variety of good and different games, which are being successful sold on Playstation and Switch. So, It seems childish to me to celebrate the fall or end of a competitor in such a limited, difficult and expensive Industry. I can only imagine the outcome with two console markers.

• One audience are full of PC fans who don't care, as it all just becomes easier for them the more consoles die.
• A second audience(people who still reminisce about the 360 generation nearly 20 years ago) wants MS to get their heads back into the game and make 10/10 exclusive content on a steady release schedule(this part is crucial) to compete with the other consoles.
• A third audience sees blood in the shark-infested water and wants there to just be 2 consoles.
• A fourth audience is spiteful because they feel that they invested so much money and time into a console-line for it all to slowly implode in front of them(although if any of them are ex-Sega fans they should already have their guard up for things like this).
• I'm part of the fifth audience, who didn't play Xbox for a generation or two(some never did) and bought an Xbox Series. Right now I'm enjoying their big catalogue of backwards compatible titles and exclusives, but I'm slowly using up all of the water in the well and there's currently a drought. I am happy for now but I see the impending problem.

However, at the end of the day it's a culmination of different audiences agreeing on a major issue: Xbox lost their fangs, and they desperately need to figure out their hardware side and how they want to move forward. The difference between them and Sega is that they have the luxury of a big vault of money to hold them together while they figure things out.

From my time using MS hardware products throughout life I will say this: That moment where you notice the hardware is the best it's ever been, is the same moment where MS will pull out and stop producing that hardware.

It happened to my Zune. It happened to my Lumia Windows Phone. It happened to my Microsoft band(smartwatch). It happened to my Surface Duo 2(recent android phone). It happened with Kinect 2.

So I worry about finally getting what I want, a portable Xbox console/hybrid, and them pulling out right afterwards, leaving us once again with all potential and no promise.

 

[Celine]

With the series X/S being a little cheaper than last year i think the drop in hardware units probably close to 25%, something like 900K shipped for the quarter is likely.

Shipments (millions of units)

Mega Drive annual sell-in series isn't correct.
Mega Drive final total sell-in by Sega is known and it is 30.75M (that's the figure Sega reported to CESA).

Retro Sales Age Thread

This thread is for the discussion and collation of sales data for retro systems. Hopefully we'll eventually have lots of data to fill the first few posts. There are generally four different ways of recording console sales; Production Shipments This was the preferred method of Sony (and...

www.neogaf.com

 

[DenchDeckard]

The fact that this generations series X is performing worse than the Xbox one is just downright shocking. Someones gotta wake up and give Phil some serious shit.

How do you build the best hardware you have ever created and let it go to complete waste. It's really bad.

 

[FunkMiller]

Yeah, whatever anyone says, they’ll be third party within the next few years. 30% drop in hardware sales two years in a row is fucking horrific.

And thoroughly deserved for a man who doesn’t think exclusives matter, and hamstrung his main console with a retarded little brother.

What a fucking waste.

 

[Luminoth-4545]

Mega Drive annual sell-in series isn't correct.
Mega Drive final total sell-in by Sega is known and it is 30.75M (that's the figure Sega reported to CESA).

Retro Sales Age Thread

This thread is for the discussion and collation of sales data for retro systems. Hopefully we'll eventually have lots of data to fill the first few posts. There are generally four different ways of recording console sales; Production Shipments This was the preferred method of Sony (and...

www.neogaf.com

Doesn't include third party made hardware, yes in some countries companies other than Sega produced the hardware.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

These numbers are downright horrible for xbox and Acitivision/Blizzard just saved their guts from being a meaningless 3rd option. When Nintendo is coming later this year and Ps5 pro hits, they just fade out as an serious alternative. Going multiplatform just keeps them from drowning.

I still don't get it - where did it go wrong and why? We didn't have this conversation at the start of this gen, hell - even in 2022. Then it looks like all got demolished Q3-Q4 2022, and in Q1 2023 we started getting info about Xbox hardware sales not growing despite end of shortages.

 

[Hero of Spielberg]

Why people in this forum always seems so happy with negative Xbox news? It's because they don't want to buy another console so they can have everything on their platform? It's because they don't want choice? It's just conservatism? I have seem people here celebrating even when a game get low metacritic score. It shouldn't be the opposite? After all, this is a gaming forum.

Xbox has a very good piece of hardware, offer choices in the way you play and pay and also lowered the barrier to access games. It still ships a variety of good and different games, which are being successful sold on Playstation and Switch. So, It seems childish to me to celebrate the fall or end of a competitor in such a limited, difficult and expensive Industry. I can only

Without some of us (who happen to actually be multiplatform gamers) the forum would be way too much xbox hate and no balance.
I'm not even that Xbox crazed but the imbalance here is staggering sometimes to the point of absurd, I feel compelled to stand up for ms just so that there is the slightest modicum of reality reflected in posts. I get labeled green rat for saying anything positive about ms, in any thread, for any reason, regardless if the points have merit or not. (I'm sure some do and some don't, nobody is perfect)

There used to be more of us but a whole bunch just left, or stop posting, some were banned. What's left is definately lopsided.

As to new games, there should some more down the pipeline a bit, I'm sure we will at least see some befire the end of the year. Not a great year overall for any of the consoles in terms of first party exclusives.

I feel the same way. I own both ps and Xbox so doesn’t bother me which exclusive goes where but the constant and relentless console warring from pro PS people on this forum is so tiring. Any Xbox related thread just instantly devolves into a solid stream of anti Phil / MS diarrhoea from the same people

 

[Celine]

Doesn't include third party made hardware, yes in some countries companies other than Sega produced the hardware.

The same is true for Nintendo consoles like NES and SNES (Dendy, Playtronic, Hyundai) but you don't see people bringing up the argument nearly as often as with Sega consoles because Nintendo has always provided with official data of what they've shipped, unlike Sega for which most of their historical sell-in data had to be dug out from newspapers/white papers/mags of the time.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Yeah, whatever anyone says, they’ll be third party within the next few years. 30% drop in hardware sales two years in a row is fucking horrific.

And thoroughly deserved for a man who doesn’t think exclusives matter, and hamstrung his main console with a regarded little brother.

What a fucking waste.

I hate what they have done to the brand and i despise the so called fans who have cheered them along the way

 

[jm89]

Hardware -31%

 

[Mattyp]

Did you forget about the $69b that went out the door, Nut-throat???

I don't know if people on here are really this stupid with finance or trolling sometimes.

 

[Punished Miku]

I hate what they have done to the brand and i despise the so called fans who have cheered them along the way

 

[FunkMiller]

I still don't get it - where did it go wrong and why?

You simply cannot market and sell a video games console that has zero exclusives on it. There is no reason to buy it!

 

[Banjo64]

I too am simply a neutral multi-platform gamer who spends many hours a day caressing my Sony PlayStation 5 but who feels obliged to stand up in the face of the accurate information posted online to defend Microsoft and Xbox, who I must stress I only enjoy in an equal measure to the myriad of other devices I own.

I have seen too many brethren cut down by the overzealous NeoGAF moderation team, good men like SenjutsuSage and SoloKingRobert. I must speak out and make a stand. We must make NeoGAF a safe haven for all, including astroturfers and paid actors. Otherwise who will possibly speak out against the evils of Sony and Nintendo?

 

[jufonuk]

UK Charts: Mario Kart 8 Deluxe Speeds Into Pole Position, Once Again

Somebody found a Bullet Bill

www.nintendolife.com

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

I don't know why. Maybe that apocalyptic future where Sony is the only one left somehow entices them.

I came from a time before PlayStation and Xbox existed. Trust me, there is nothing apocalyptic about someone dropping out of the console race. That is what is needed for someone else to replace them.

There will be a newcomer. But not until Xbox leaves. That is why I cheer for it because Xbox had already lost. There is no "maybe they would make a comeback", Xbox is gone, the sooner they go SEGA the quicker we get a replacement.

 

[ergem]

One thing i've noticed is that Xbox seems to have always a better profit ratio against its install base. Their 85%+ digital ratio + almost the entire active userbase paying subscription helps that.

Or MS is not investing much into the future of xbox hence lower R&D expense, better profit ratio.

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

One thing i've noticed is that Xbox seems to have always a better profit ratio against its install base. Their 85%+ digital ratio + almost the entire active userbase paying subscription helps that.

That is called "Engagement".
And it is what happens naturally when you lose all the regular customers. What you have left are the old guards who refuse to leave. You get higher engagement numbers when you don't get normal people buying your products. The ratio goes up as your sales go down.

 

[midnightAI]

I've never once said they shouldn't care about loses, what I have said is nothing in thier past leads me to they are ready to give up on the console hardware business. This doesn't fly in.the face of not wanting to enter into another business that makes even less money. So again, your twisting it to your own narrative.

The no wonder they don't care about xboxer loses was tongue and cheek, that may have been missed. Nobody wants to lose money on anything.

Trust me, as a person who loved my bright yellow Nokia Lumia 1020 (unbelievable camera on that thing), Microsoft can drop a product/brand/whole segment instantly without notice.

 

[digoutyoursoul]

Good

 

[Bernardougf]

yeah. I mean, when you think about it; this Gen, devs will by making only one true Next-Gen game

1. first game, cross Gen with the old gen
2. second game, the only true "current Gen"
3. third game, cross Gen with next Gen

it creates this weird miss match, like consoles generations and devs are not in synchrony.

what's the solution, to have 10 years generations or even longer?


going for a handled/ hybrid console could be the more nuanced approach. but Xbox has been always about making the most powerful hardware (so, that approach is the most expected one).

the issue is that devs clearly can't keep up with technology.

what is interesting, is how these two companies talk about the challenges:

Xbox blames external factors while Sony says they need to be more efficient and the need to re-evaluate how to operate to meet the expectation from the people who love AAA single player games and the approach to GaaS production.


is not like these external factors are not real, but those factors are not the reason Xbox is in this situation.. what's is really scary, based in the posture from Phil when he says that "it's about mobile, that without mobile the business is not viable" or something to that effect. is the fact that there is like a 10% chance for Xbox (the gaming division) to totally implode. (similar to what happened to embracer)


Phil is acting like mobile is the new frontier, the unexplored market but mobile is already a mature market.

MS failed at gaining market share from consoles

MS falied at capitalizing from windows ownership.

And Mobile is already taken by Google and Apple.

streaming will be complentary at best.

I'm saying this because it dosen't matter what their strategy is... is not about the strategy; it's about the execution. and MS/Xbox's execution keeps sucking asss.

I dont think there is need for a solution really, just that people are still too hang up in this "next gen" thing... specially purchasing this cheap boxes...consoles more or less dictated gens but progressively became obsolete faster and faster as the industry refused to up the prices and the difference between the high end tech (pc) and new consoles are gargantuan from the start and only gets worse....the times of being blown out by graphics are over until some great new breakthrough comes along... thats why I think this gen should have been about perfomance and not RT ....making consoles to run complex things with better processing power at 60 fps and forgetting about freacking reflexes in puddles should have been the go... but this is just my way of thinking.

As the evolution of graphics go ... today I enjoy playing more a last gen game at 60 fps than one "next gen" at 30 fps ....30 fps for me feels oldgen and dated no matter how much lightning and flexes and grass you throw at my face.

 

[Sanepar]

Hardware way down. Software/subscriptions way up.


Paints a clear picture for the future of the Xbox brand.

Subscriptions are not up.