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Please remind me, how does the lack of rupees and hearts tell us this? 😞
Zelda Wii U - Recap of 5 hours gameplay stream
- Thread starter Chaos17
- Start date
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Please remind me, how does the lack of rupees and hearts tell us this? 😞
robertsan21
Member
I don't think this deserve its own thread so I will post this video here:
https://youtu.be/jYiRDXwXgJ0
7 : 02 > "those areas have not been yet unlocked"
Did he just pointed out the black areas ?!!
Thats what he said, HOLY SHIT.
Now when I think of it, it would be crazy to have those big large area around the map so it got to be true!
smudge
Member
Often wondered about this too. Some people seem desperate to have some semblance of continuity of a much loved series. Personally I can't see it or see any point to it.
I like when they do things like the introduction to Wind Waker but on the whole, having multiple time lines etc does seem like a stretch just to tie things together for some of the fans.
Zelda games have a wonderful atmosphere this isn't helped or hindered by having some pseudo continuity shoe-horned in as an afterthought.
It's probably true that Nintendo didn't gaf about continuity when they were making the games, and only created the timeline in response to fans. That doesn't mean that no timeline can be interpreted. Whether or not the creators intended it, people can have fun speculating and interpreting things in the lore. Really there is no definitive answer because it's a work of fiction, completely open to interpretation.
I have a friend who prefers to think of it as the exact same story, told by a different person each time. Each person missing or including details which makes their version unique. That's an interpretation of the series, and he's entitled to that interpretation. Doesn't make his interpretation any more or less valid than my preferred timeline interpretation.
Sorry but I'm holding an official book here that says otherwise.
There is a timeline but generally they make it loosely tie together after the fact. How much after the fact depends on the game and producer.
You don't even need the book to see that there is some sort of timeline. WW references OoT almost directly right at the start.
Even if you're a death of the author kinda guy and disregard extra-textual commentary from the creators of the games, there's still a fairly obvious continuity for a lot of the games. Every mainline EAD game since OOT has an obvious spot. The problem is shoehorning the pre OOT games into the new set up. But denying it outright is blatantly wrong.
Whether they give much of shit about it is a totally different question.
No, he speaks about the blue areas.I don't think this deserve its own thread so I will post this video here:
https://youtu.be/jYiRDXwXgJ0
7 : 02 > "those areas have not been yet unlocked"
Did he just pointed out the black areas ?!!
The Great Plateau fits roughly 10 times into the map both horizontally and vertically, so it is 1% of the total.
Always-honest
Banned
Well, the threw something together. But i agree. Every game is actually just reimagining the game. I don't understand why people even bother with it.
What about this then ? (I know someone already checked on previous page but multiple check won"t hurt)
https://youtu.be/dar1t_L2wBk?t=2m26s
2:27 > Chico is saying something about the dot on map but I don't understand it (english isn't my first language).
windwaker is all about being connected to ocarina, Majoras mask is a direct sequel, skyward sword is written as an origin story. TP is is clearly after ocarina. Those things aren't really thrown together but the basis of the settings of those games.
Hm, I'd forgotten that. Thank you. That's the case throughout all the games?
"There's still more things to do behind the red pin"
Pretty much my sentiments.
I like your friends interpretation a lot.
That's the thing I was referring to they threw together.
Horses for courses I guess. But I agree, I don't think Anouma is losing any sleep.
Aldric
Member
The DS games are also directly linked to TWW. I'm surprised "it's a retelling of the same story!" is still a thing.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
WW very directly and explicitly connects back to the time travel shenanigans in OoT as being the entire reason for the Great Sea even existing.
And all that, yes. Direct sequels are one thing, but yeah, SS was explicitly written as the origin story for pretty much everything that happens in all the other games. This "it's just different retellings of the same legend" thing might have been the case once, but it absolutely isn't anymore. The official stance now is that all the games are separate events that really happened, placed along a timeline (splitting into three after OoT).
robertsan21
Member
to me they are saying that its more stuff to do behind the red pin, now how far down behind thats the question.
But seein how the map area is going outside into the Black areas it makes it look like there is even more stuff into the black area of the map.
I think anyone who have played all the Zelda is able to define a timeline because they're read references about X timeles in X Zelda. It can't be that innocent specialy when it's repeated through multiple games.
A writer in Nintendo definitly tried to link things so the fans can relate, if it was jsut for fun, there will be only eater eggs with no story behind which it isn't.
If at some point when you begin to link the dots and it make sense, you can't deny that's just bullshit.
http://zeldawiki.org/Zelda_Timeline
It's just lke when you investigate for a case during multiple years, there is a pattern that will show. and there're a tons of fans who did investigate digging tons of data.
I don't know what timeline this new Zelda has but I'm curious. Will Nintendo finaly merge the timeline to give some kind of conclusion ? A part of me think it's the fallen time line hero.
Because I keep hearing/reading key words like: corruption, ruins
Yeah, let's take as grain of salt.
If there is more cool and it there isn't it's ok ^^
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Can't quite tell if you're being serious or just mocking the people who champion this line of thought. If you really believe this, you're wrong. There's explicit and officially canon continuity between the games (even if there wasn't originally), and they are now being deliberately written with this in mind even if that wasn't the case originally. I think OoT is when they started thinking about this for real, as it was written as a prequel to ALttP. Then it got even more explicit with WW (the flood being used as a last resort due to adult timeline OoT Link disappearing and Hyrule being left without a hero), TP (OoT Link is there in spirit form, etc) and SS (it's a VERY explicit origin story for everything else). This isn't stuff just thrown into the timeline after the fact, it's actually in the games.
Now, that doesn't mean they necessarily care very much about Hyrule's geography being consistent, etc, but that's different.
Nintendo didn't originally think about it that way, clearly. But they do now, and they explicitly write the stories to fit that now. Then, yeah, they've retroactively tried to make all the old games make sense in the bigger picture (before that existed) by coming up with this three-way-split timeline, but your friend's interpretation (of what the series is doing these days, at least) is in fact officially invalid. This isn't speculation and theorizing, it's official word right from Nintendo's mouth.
The other day I said arguing with people who say Nintendo doesn't have new IPs is like arguing with flat earthers. The same applies to timeline deniers.
Jim_Cacher
Member
I look at that map once more and discovered that those blue lines (boundaries of each region?) extend into the black areas. I think this indicates that the black areas could be actually hidden parts of the map instead of being map boundary. Of course, this speculation can be wrong, but if those black areas are really unexplored areas, this could mean the map of BotW can be similar / bigger than the map of XCX provided that the blue areas are already a tad small than the map of XCX.
Edit: The map which is a tad smaller than XCX is the one in VGA footage. The black areas can be included in that map, so it may not affect the original analysis.
Edit: The map which is a tad smaller than XCX is the one in VGA footage. The black areas can be included in that map, so it may not affect the original analysis.
I think we're all missing an important point. The game is called The Legend of Zelda for a reason. We aren't playing the actual events, we are playing legends based on events. Think about the legends about the Greek gods. They rarely matched up with each other, and were purposefully vague. Zelda is no different. I think we all get hung up on "this place lines up with this place or that place on such and such map", or "this event happened 100 years after this other event", but in reality, these games are myth and legend. They aren't going to match up (except for the obvious ones that are direct sequels).
Even with the Skell there was a lot of ground to cover in XCX, if it's as big or even bigger in BotW, exploration is really going to take a while on foot.
smudge
Member
I don't deny there is a timeline because Nintendo said there is one. What I will state is that the timeline is shoehorned in as an after thought for fans. It is pointless, but if people enjoy it, that's fair enough.
The very first Zelda sequel was connected chronologically with Zelda. Just like ALTTP, OoT, MM, WW, TP, SS and ALBW were connected to each other. Even Link's Awakening and the Oracles are connected to other Zelda games as are the DS Zeldas obviously. This isn't something that Nintendo reps had to tell us, this was in the actual games and manuals.
The only thing that might have been shoehorned and created after the fact was the Fallen Hero timeline that connects pre-OoT games to the modern Zeldas, but even with that in mind, every single Zelda, including the old ones, were connected to each other chronologically. That's what a timeline is.
The "same story being retold" is true to a certain extent, because there is a strong element of predestination and a cyclical eternal struggle between good and evil, not to mention that these are legends, but no Zelda is an actual retelling of the same story.
Fourth Storm
Member
This is exactly it. These retellings of the legends are likely not entirely "accurate".
That being said, any ideas as to how the technology elements may have corrupted the world and led to Calamity Ganon's appearance? Sounds like we may be playing the final chapter of the Imprisoning War if Aonuma's latest hint is anything to go by. Hyrule has been defeated down to nearly the last knight and the only thing preventing complete destruction is the weakening seal around Hyrule Castle. The guardians and other tech may have been used by greedy people in search of the Sacred Realm or possibly awaken to protect it. Is all that possible 100 years after OoT, though?
Poor Myamoto, he was conflicted about hunting but like they said you've the choice to not hunt them.
https://youtu.be/6zjd4A5GDOo
They also address how they wanted to make a physic engine for this game and how it was difficult to "tame" it.
https://youtu.be/6zjd4A5GDOo
They also address how they wanted to make a physic engine for this game and how it was difficult to "tame" it.
Totally not mocking those that have spent the time to put it all together. I'm saying that to me it's always been a reimagining each game and the timeline is largely superfluous.
smudge
Member
I will concede that they are connected, I never doubted that. I just don't think the games are intentionally following any kind of predetermined story or path.
My point is that it isn't obvious, at least to me. I have't played every single game but I have played most of them. I don't have a problem with a timeline as such, I don't think it is important.
Skittzo0413
Member
I'm aware that WW is based directly on the fact that Link was sent back in time at the end of OoT, but my point is that the game never directly states this. It's easily deductible by fans, but in game it's treated as a legend, and a mystery as to why the hero didn't appear.
That's all my point was- unless this is a direct sequel like MM or PH, I really doubt this Link is the same Link from OoT who failed as others in this thread are arguing because Zelda games rarely directly and explicitly tie back to previous ones. It just doesn't make sense based on what Zelda games typically do, and I have a hard time seeing that work in the world, setting and story we've seen so far of BotW.
Actually the VGA map had clearly defined oceans on the eastern border, and since the world looks largely the same in the new map I would imagine that what we've seen at E3 is not the complete map. Unless of course some of those "province" border lines extend into open water in the ocean, which is surely a possibility.
But in general I'm a bit wary of the eastern region of the map, since we know it's likely got a huge ocean spanning the coast.
UnemployedVillain
Member
Yes because direct references to the Hero of Time in Wind Waker are just bullshit, right? Or the fact that Link ended Oot with the ocarina of time and Epona and started Majora's Mask with the ocarina of time and Epona, right? Or how Phantom Hourglass and Spirit Tracks have named references and in game photos of previous characters. You guys can not like the timeline, but saying it's just nonsense either shows you've never played the games or covering your ears and eyes because you don't like it.
Now I admit they probably weren't thinking of it waay back with the first 3 (although Zelda 2 is literally an older Zelda 1 Link), but since Oot, only the fourth game, they were
If you're going to argue guys about timeline, please go in the approriate topic: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1234504&highlight=zelda
I think other people will be pleased to participate too.
I think other people will be pleased to participate too.
smudge
Member
My first post on this subject acknowledged the direct link between WW and OoT. I like those things, clearly MM has the same Link as OoT. Im talking about the whole overarching timeline which connects every single game in the series. I don't understand why this is important to some people but clearly it is given the vitriol of your reply.
Graphics Horse
Member
They do, one of the lines maps along the edge of light blue sea and dark blue sea of the TGA map. I think the whole map is there but the lines at the far ends of the regions that would show the true boundary of the map are being hidden for now.
Re: map blackness
If you look to see what actually there on the map screen you'll find that the cursor is always dead center.
The black part is there to allow the cursor to go to the edge of the map even when fully zoomed out.
my bookie has the chance of blackness being more game world as 1 for, 100 against
If you look to see what actually there on the map screen you'll find that the cursor is always dead center.
The black part is there to allow the cursor to go to the edge of the map even when fully zoomed out.
my bookie has the chance of blackness being more game world as 1 for, 100 against
NipplesAndToes23
Member
Where'd you hear that? That would mean this game is huge!
Its more of an inferred thing. Dont need it but cool that its there if you do.
Plateau regions fits into the overall map ~90 time which equals about 1.11%.
Because for some of us Zelda fans, it's fun to speculate on and to debate with each other. Nothing more, nothing less. We just enjoy it.
Maybe this was already posted, but thought this was pretty funny. I think what Bill was trying to do was to link several clubs together and ignite the explosive barrels, but the second club he threw hits the barrel by accident and the barrel fell over on the club which was already on fire and all the barrels exploded. Really love the physics in the world.
humans are just garbage at multiplication
Nintendo chose the 1-2% number, plateau is about a percent of the area, and has 4 shrines (which would be slightly less than 2% if there's "over a hundred")
the game is gonna be big enough, no one should make up fake expectations for it that it clearly won't deliver on
I think it's in the off-plateau video, when Bill is placing markers he's pointing the tablet northwest, and the visible mountains that were furthest away could not be marked (as indicated by the little red dot vanishing) which would mean that they are not playable area.
Game is already huge. No need to pretend it's going to be way bigger.
Nintendo chose the 1-2% number, plateau is about a percent of the area, and has 4 shrines (which would be slightly less than 2% if there's "over a hundred")
the game is gonna be big enough, no one should make up fake expectations for it that it clearly won't deliver on
I think it's in the off-plateau video, when Bill is placing markers he's pointing the tablet northwest, and the visible mountains that were furthest away could not be marked (as indicated by the little red dot vanishing) which would mean that they are not playable area.
Game is already huge. No need to pretend it's going to be way bigger.
Jim_Cacher
Member
I am satisfied by the assumed map size and I just pointed out a possibility.
It looks WAY bigger than the one at the end of the trailer. This one is literally like 1/5 (or so) the length of Death Mountain, which looks massive in itself.
Skittzo0413
Member
I love that map, and it shows some of the shallow ocean borders nicely as Graphics Horse was talking about above.
The western side does extend outside the map a decent amount, so we'll see how that ends up fitting into the final game world.
I wonder what kind of barriers there will be... invisible walls? "Turn back now"s? Maybe impassible gorges or oceans?
It might not be obvious, but it's there all the same.
Note that I'm not saying they have some sort of master plan outlining a timeline for Zelda's chronology for the next 10 years, just that every single Zelda is intentionally and deliberately placed in a timeline ever since Zelda II.
How important it is to anyone is a matter of preference, which is why it's great that the games aren't very heavy handed or too hung up on timeline connections. They're there and they're undeniable, if someone doesn't notice them, understand them or care about them, that's another subject entirely.