Even Pop said he's the best in the world. He put up 30/10 tonight on 60% shooting.
Maybe he could have been better. But not that much more
Lebron James' NBA Finals record is now 2-3, fails to 3-peat this year
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Maybe he could have been better. But not that much more
jordan0386
Member
He plays better defense than Durant. So he is currently the best player.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
I'm talking about best in a grander scheme than today's NBA. Come on now.
I always find those comparisons kind of useless, because it's a futile exercise.
But sure- today #teamMJ takes a W
jordan0386
Member
Bron should be top 15. I dunno who gets bumped though.
You can't change franchises, go to 4 straight Finals as lead dog, and not be top 15.
Few things have happened over the past few years. One, MJ's teammates have been hyped to be the greatest players of all time, and two, LeBron's teammates have been deemed "scrubs" who do nothing.
BadAss2961
Member
On the court, there was nothing to knock MJ with. Social media wouldn't change that.
He obviously could've been more aggressive. This might still be a series if he wasn't so worried about efficiency and his averages.
This series tho- statistically- they were pretty bad. That's quantifiable.
IrishNinja
Member
peterboy in usual form
agreed, and that's how it should be - i was addressing someone who wanted to knock lebron for off the court stuff is why that was brought up
agreed, and that's how it should be - i was addressing someone who wanted to knock lebron for off the court stuff is why that was brought up
LeBron is great but in this series, it's like his production didn't mean a damn thing. The Spurs shrugged their shoulders, made LeBron take the shots THEY wanted him to take and even then, his performance failed to lift up the rest of his team.
His stats were fantastic in these finals, but it felt like they were the most inconsequential performances you could see in a Finals series. It had no effect.
Spurs taught him and the Heat a lesson in these Finals (like they did in 2007, to LeBron anyway). Maybe they get the message this time.
His stats were fantastic in these finals, but it felt like they were the most inconsequential performances you could see in a Finals series. It had no effect.
Spurs taught him and the Heat a lesson in these Finals (like they did in 2007, to LeBron anyway). Maybe they get the message this time.
vas_a_morir
Banned
4 years in Miami.
4 Eastern Conference Championships
2 NBA championships
2 MVP awards.
Really, could you expect much more than that? That's impressive, with a beat up Wade and an under-performing Chris Bosh.
4 Eastern Conference Championships
2 NBA championships
2 MVP awards.
Really, could you expect much more than that? That's impressive, with a beat up Wade and an under-performing Chris Bosh.
They were playing great until they met up with a better team with better coaching. This is still a team that went to four straight finals. LeBron has plenty of help. He's playing with three future hall of famers.
CreepingFear
Member
Who the fuck counts Conference championships, especially the Leastern Conference?
Under performing Chris Bosh? The man was asked to play third fiddle, and stop playing in the post and start shooting threes, and he did it! He didn't underperform.
Spurs owned us. Pop sonned us. But the past years don't mean shit for production- pretty much everyone outside of lebron sucked, and I'm not sure how you can argue otherwise?
It's not a lebron Stan thing- it's more a I get annoyed when people don't argue the facts thing.
CreepingFear
Member
Hey Soul, we all know the Heat would have won if they had Boozer. What about Bosh for Boozer, what do you say?
Epsilon-delta
Banned
This is true. People hype up Pippen like he's in the Top 20 or something. For all his accolades of being a great defensive player, he never won DPOY.
Pippen is a great player, but not as great as Jordan haters make him out to be just so they can shit on MJ's legacy.
If everyone else sucked for the past four years, then the Heat wouldn't have won two straight championships. The other Heat players were doing just fine until the Finals. They seemed just fatigued and sick of it all.
vas_a_morir
Banned
Who the fuck counts? What are you talking about? An Eastern Conference Championship is how you qualify to play in the NBA finals.
BadAss2961
Member
Not 2, not 3, not 4, not 5, not 6, not 7... Might sound ridiculous now, but it was believable when this team was formed.
Miami could still win some more championships if they retool though. I don't think Bosh will want to come back to this team, so it all depends on what they get in the offseason to convince LeBron to stay.
The only reason the Heat beat the Bulls in 2010, and the Celtics over the past few years is because of Bosh.
I'm just talking about this series. Of course lebron isn't winning w/o great production from everyone else.
CreepingFear
Member
No shit, but it means nothing if you don't win 2/4. 2nd place doesn't mean shit.
PhoenixDark
Banned
Anyone who denies LeBron is the best player in the nba isn't paying attention. Stop letting media perception cloud our view of the damn game. It's even more funny when you consider most of these people are too young to remember the nonstop coverage Jordan got, the complaints about him being a selfish asshole, or the nba changing rules to benefit him.
LeBron is the best player since Jordan by any statistical measure.
LeBron is the best player since Jordan by any statistical measure.
CreepingFear
Member
Oh shit, you've turned on the Booze now too? Down is up and up is down.
I've always said that. Repeatedly. I've always acknowledged that Bosh is better.
Syphon Filter
Member
why wouldnt bosh want to return?
BadAss2961
Member
I don't see anyone saying that.
People need to realize that most of the LeBron criticism comes from him being held to the highest standard since he's (or was) trying to be the greatest of all time. For now, he's somewhere in the top 10, and will never surpass MJ.
jordan0386
Member
Bosh already said, he isn't carrying a team just to say he did so.
SlackAdjuster
Member
So when you're wrong, you just put words in others mouths? I never said anyone would come off as a saint but here: pretend we're on twitter. What are you going to clown MJ about during the years MJ was in his prime (as LBJ is now) Go ahead, I gotta see this.
And there is no "salt". I recognize LeBron as a great basketball player. He will go down as one of the greatest of all time. Not sure what any of that has to do with me replying to your comment about the decision and it opening him up for the beginning of a lot of criticism, which he deserved in my opinion. It was a dick move and no "charity" nonsense is going to change that. Period. Lots of athletes do things for charity. They dont act like assholes in the process of it.
CreepingFear
Member
Boozer makes up for it by not being a bitch, as this gif clearly demonstrates.
It is kiiiiind of weird though how Lebrons worst public moment- and I agree it was a bad choice- reaaaally is only he crime of self promotion that ended up benefitting charity.
There are athletes w waaaaay worse shit in their past that don't garner this scorn. Shit. Tony Parker cheated on his wife w the girl of his former teammate and we forget that. But the decision? Naw.
Barack Lesnar
Banned
If it were prime MJ in place of LeBron on this Heat team for this series, would they have won? No, of course not. Not a chance. Maybe they'd have lost by 5-10 less points in Games 3 and 4, still would've lost the series in 5 or 6. Can't put this on LeBron too much.
BadAss2961
Member
Why would he? He has to play 3rd fiddle, fucks up his stats. He always gets the blame, but never the credit when he deserves it. He's apparently been excluded from the LeBron/Wade bromance.
He's got his 2 rings already. Why not go somewhere where he can get the ball more and actually be appreciated.
jordan0386
Member
Was that true.
Kinda ridiculous like the Jason Richardson/Nash rumors.
NBA is a wild place.
CherryWoodFuton
Member
Lebron is the Tom Brady of the NBA. Total boy scouts that are hated because of PR missteps
I feel like people like tom Brady more, but obviously that's a tough thing to quantify.
I think there's probably some race stuff at play tbh.
HalfBakedProphet
Member
He was the best player in this series. He won two straight championships
When you're judged against Michael Fucking Jordan, its pretty damn difficult to live up to. The microscope he works under is extremely intense. I'm not jealous of that spotlight
When you're judged against Michael Fucking Jordan, its pretty damn difficult to live up to. The microscope he works under is extremely intense. I'm not jealous of that spotlight
Holy shit at this. Awards quantify what someone achieved on the court? Is that the only way to judge it now?
Pippen didn't win a DPOY award....historically a big man award at that. But Pippen was the man that guarded the other teams best player. You can't dilute that.
I don't hear too many people give more props to Pippen than what's deserved. Who shits on Jordan's legacy? He isn't the hands down best player of all time...even for all his bravado and arrogance...he says the same thing. But, he will tell you you're not going to beat him.
He had Rodman for his second 3peat. He was the best rebounder and damn near the best defensive PF in the league.
He also had Toni Kukoc coming off the bench and Steve Kerr for 3 pointers. Ron Harper was a decent clog at PG.
Jordan, Pippen, Rodman, Kerr, Kukoc, Harper. That's one helluva core to have. Then he had the Zen master on the bench for every chip.
Bam Bam Baklava
Member
Leonard was the player in the series. He did everything Lebron had to do but better.
MetalFearSolid
Banned
Tom Brady is a winner. 3 in 4 years, sure they cheated but still got 3 rings. Lebron is Peyton Manning all regular season, and a losing record in the Finals/Super Bowl.
HalfBakedProphet
Member
did you watch game one?
Disagree. Can't be invisible 2/5 games and be that.
Ninja Scooter
Member
When MJ first retired Pippen took that same team to like 55 wins and a bad call from the ECF. Dude was also 2nd to Hakeem in MVP voting iirc. He was a legitimate franchise player in his prime.
jordan0386
Member
Brady hasn't won a ring in 10 years. Lets not get crazy.
Spurs were awesome this year. They should have had it last year too.
I think Lebron is gonna leave to join up with more superstars. Smh
Lebron is a great player but nowhere near MJ. I'd probably take a prime Kobe over him to lead a team.
Ah well, too bad the nba is over now. Wonder what my crappy Knicks are gonna do next year.. Figure melo is gonna leave
I think Lebron is gonna leave to join up with more superstars. Smh
Lebron is a great player but nowhere near MJ. I'd probably take a prime Kobe over him to lead a team.
Ah well, too bad the nba is over now. Wonder what my crappy Knicks are gonna do next year.. Figure melo is gonna leave
Barack Lesnar
Banned
A lot of people forget this.
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