One is temporary.
And, uh, which is which?
Ferguson: Police Kill 18yo Black Male; Fire Gas/Rubber Bullets Into Protesting Crowds
- Thread starter jordan0386
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Velcro Fly
Member
Was new orleans after Katrina martial law?
Looks like nothing going on there.
Police used tear gas and rubber bullets to clear the area. pic.twitter.com/TUZPjZGrlv (https://twitter.com/AntonioFrench/status/499000458066010112)
Looks like they are trying to clear streets.
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
You seem pretty intelligent and can do your own research. Like I said, the comparison isn't as far fetched as you seem to think and I stand by that.
Velcro Fly
Member
I hope everyone there stays safe tonight. Sounds like the police are more prepared tonight.
I found no examples.
Why are you putting injustices in scare quotes?
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
Sounds like you should move to the hood then. Nothing beats real life experience.
Encompasses all the subjective and objective violations of actions contrary to one's views.
Being from Kansas and seeing people like Westboro protesting funerals, their counter protests, and abortion clinic protests, there sure as hell are protests met with displays of similar force.
Ohh 😅
Advantageous? Only in that things could be worse. I prefer peaceful protest, wait, no I prefer justice foremost. Then peaceful protest, but riots are better than war. And the ease of arms in the country coupled with the civil unrest, heightened racial tensions, and wealth inequality could easily start an inferno. Riots aren't quite up to "spark" level. Make sense?
So no answer then. Alright.
I have plenty of real life experience, actually.
https://vine.co/v/MYZZKaHFvr6
Be prepared to get gassed.
Next area - the loop and Hampton village. Might be trolls. Stay safe STL GAF!
DoubleTake
Member
The world we live in.
Exactly.
You didn't answer the question. Your explaining what you think makes them happen, not why they are different.
Hmm? Your inquiry was answered - to what manner are you still confused? Perhaps you can use this opportunity to explain the relevance to such a distinction in relation to the disheartening death of this adult?
Nor did he explain which was the first and which was the second.
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
But apparently not enough to see how someone could view the police as an occupying army without being dismissive about it.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
Shits going down again. It's on the local news.
ReplacementPelican
Member
It does make sense, I realise that it is a very tense time that we live in but the cycle of violence needs to stop somewhere and justice is not instantaneous. I hope justice is served, I'm sure there's not one person here that wouldn't want to see it but I do worry that riots could jeopardise justice somewhat.
There are times where I get to hear about those who believe the CIA is out to get them, and that the entire system is out to undermine them - or my personal favorite, chips implanted to control their thoughts. Outlandish mantra typically gets swept under the rug since I get to hear about it rather frequently.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
These terms are too generalizing and only serve to reinforce particular stereotypes.
The truth of the matter is, there are many subs of the Black community and the lower half of Middle America is on the verge of falling into what used to be the "low income" status, if it hasn't already. They might want to study up on what's happening b/c it'll be getting rougher going forward and the problems will spread outward.
They say the best way to understand another person is to walk their shoes. Lots of people who never imagined they would, are going to be walking the shoes of these rioters sooner or later (that isn't to say they're literally going to riot. Hopefully not.)
Real talk. It would take a real jackass to deny Mike justice because of the riots. Especially when the police caused this. There have been postings in this thread about people being provoked by officers screaming obscenities, but even should you choose to ignore that as hearsay, the pictures of them bringing out the dogs is damning enough. This causation only flows one way.
Oh and the riots do have one small positive. It makes this a much bigger story.
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
Haha Okay, I'm done.
Makes them happen? No, but a police state is a government which aims to control the populace through coercion and force (is a permenant construct). Martial law would come at the result of disaster where the municipality ceases to function and only the National Guard can keep the peace. (Temporary until the municipal government is restored)
How does one equate police brutality and harassment against minority groups (which has been well documented) to micro chip conspiracy theories?
hiphoptherobot
Member
Scary. My cousin is a cop in University City(area where the the loop is located). He said he hasn't been told to come in yet but he said they have called in about half of the off duty cops already.
I was not equating such.
It's a conspiracy, I been framed
They call me nigga so much, I'm starting to think it's my name
Light skinned and ashamed, cause way back in the days
They raped my grandmother's mothers, when they was enslaved
They hung my grandfather if he misbehaved, but my ancestors was brave, and most of them real
Strong, hard, black sweaty slaves working in the field
400 years later, i learned about my roots
And how they traded in their white sheets, for badges and blue suits.....
-Sticky Fingaz, 1995
Shit doesn't change in America. Open season on the young black man.
They call me nigga so much, I'm starting to think it's my name
Light skinned and ashamed, cause way back in the days
They raped my grandmother's mothers, when they was enslaved
They hung my grandfather if he misbehaved, but my ancestors was brave, and most of them real
Strong, hard, black sweaty slaves working in the field
400 years later, i learned about my roots
And how they traded in their white sheets, for badges and blue suits.....
-Sticky Fingaz, 1995
Shit doesn't change in America. Open season on the young black man.
So what you are saying is the only difference is intent. One is permanent and the other is temporary. So really there's no difference at all then in your mind.
ReplacementPelican
Member
I have no doubt that a percentage of American cops are cruel, aggressive people. There's far too many videos, reports and news stories for me to be able to deny that but once again I cannot support rioting.
Yes but your definition of 'studying up' is very different from your average Fox News viewer, the people who would buy this 'black community riot!' 'black people are thugs' rhetoric the fucking second a riot starts. I do not mean to generalise massive groups but it does help the ease of communicating what I'm trying to discuss. People will not walk in each other's shoes in this instance and most people will feel no sympathy for rioters. You may, I may, most of 'Gaf may but I would disagree that most of America may.
You may also hope that people come to terms with the state of the world today however once again, you could be a Marxist in this case, viewing the issue as wealth inequality but lots would disagree with you. The fact that this issue is so complex and far-reaching does mean it's not likely to 'come together' as you seem to hope.
I don't hope for revolution, I don't hope for people 'studying up', I hope for people to do the best that they can in the context of the culture, situation and possible aftermath of a situation like this. This isn't to support the system, I don't like it anymore than you likely do but it wont change through violence.
No, there is quite the difference especially in relation to world usage and American Constitutional law/opinion. Still trying to understand the relevance to the article at hand though.
schwabdizzle
Banned
Im here in STL and Riots are resuming I am waiting for shit to go down.
Live stream http://fox2now.com/on-air/live-streaming/
kame-sennin
Member
A witness provides a very very different account of what happened:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tfy5FiqzWHI&sns=em&app=desktop
Considering how often officers lie about violent altercations, I'm not inclined to believe the "official" statement.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
I'd be interested to see your stats on officers lying vs telling the truth about violent altercations.
I am too. And no, they're not really. Just a few pockets of activity. Nothing major.
I know there are quite a few differences that include legal interpretations but you only cited time as the difference and under your definition there would really be no difference since martial law could extend for months even years given the circumstances martial law was enacted under.
In your response to the poster you equated it as such. People are concerned about the level of arsenal the police have at their disposal. They don't just come with batons and riot shields anymore and people are concerned about it. It leads to more police brutality and harassment and your response to say its no different (not directly stated but implied) that its no different than people being concerned about microchips.
kame-sennin
Member
Nah, police departments nationwide have been proven to be corrupt nationwide, top to bottom, root and stem.
The "few bad apples" argument has to be retired, or we have to come up with a new definition for the word 'few':
Farrar and his small police force have become the poster boys of body-worn cameras...
...the year-long trial period ending in February saw an 88 percent drop in complaints against police and a 60 percent reduction in uses of force by the police. And these steep declines occurred even though the cameras were in use only about half the time.
...the year-long trial period ending in February saw an 88 percent drop in complaints against police and a 60 percent reduction in uses of force by the police. And these steep declines occurred even though the cameras were in use only about half the time.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2013/08/nypd-cameras-rialto-farrar-bloomberg.html
In 2011, New Yorkers were stopped by the police 685,724 times.
605,328 were totally innocent (88 percent).
350,743 were black (53 percent).
223,740 were Latino (34 percent).
61,805 were white (9 percent).
341,581 were aged 14-24 (51 percent).
605,328 were totally innocent (88 percent).
350,743 were black (53 percent).
223,740 were Latino (34 percent).
61,805 were white (9 percent).
341,581 were aged 14-24 (51 percent).
http://www.nyclu.org/content/stop-and-frisk-data
The Los Angeles Police Commission is investigating how half of the recording antennas in the Southeast Division went missing, seemingly as a way to evade new self-monitoring procedures that the Los Angeles Police Department imposed last year.
http://thefreethoughtproject.com/lapd-cops-disabling-recorders-cops-either-them/
There were 10,000 abuse complaints filed against the Chicago PD between 2002 and 2004
http://www.theamericanconservative.com/seven-reasons-police-brutality-is-systematic-not-anecdotal/
Criticisms against the entire police force are not generalizations, they are backed by empirical data.
schwabdizzle
Banned
Seems pretty tame compared to yesterday
Great post
So police in 3 of the largest cities = all police are corrupt? OK.
I expect many different accounts from witnesses. I'm sure at this stage of the game with the media attention that turning to "youtube" might not be the wisest avenue to take.
Oh, and this video is from St. Louis, cops threatening to arrest a man if he doesn't plant a gun on somebody else
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d5B6FK3lXc
Makes you wonder how many other guys are sitting in prison right now because they didn't / couldn't record these intimidation tactics. I don't trust cops, and that's because of how my friends and I have been treated by them in the past, ran into far more dickheads than good cops.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d5B6FK3lXc
Makes you wonder how many other guys are sitting in prison right now because they didn't / couldn't record these intimidation tactics. I don't trust cops, and that's because of how my friends and I have been treated by them in the past, ran into far more dickheads than good cops.
jhmtehgamr20xx
Banned
I wouldn't even call it "studying up" to be honest. It's just how I was raised and is the world I see around me. I've seen as many poor white people as I have blacks, esteemed wealthy blacks as I have whites.
I've had a rather balanced view of the world from a young age and it's a pathetic travesty that such a view happens to be the exception rather than the rule in this country, but I can certainly point fingers at a few culprits to blame for that. Fox News is just one of the many (and this isn't something that's split on political lines either, I must add).
I wasn't saying that to be rhetorical; this is literally what's going to happen. It's framed along racial lines partly b/c that's how it's traditionally been for decades and partly because that's the narrative the media wants to present for a gauntlet of reasons, but the truth is what used to be "middle class" is falling to the wayside. It's a lot smaller now than it was 20 years ago, even 10 years ago, and it'll continue to get smaller.
If inflation, stagnating wages and increasing prices for goods continues to push more people to the extreme end, they're going to start to understand first thing how many disenfranchised people feel and how things like these riots can end up happening. They won't be in a position to comfortably say 100% they can't consider these sort of options themselves anymore.
The only question is, will sectors of the population still be divided over something as insignificant as racial differences, or will they get through their heads an understanding for the factors that bring about these desperate scenarios, and work together to make things better?
Unfortunately this is just asking for disappointment. I mean, after the riots there'll be clean-up, maybe some arrests, and restructuring of businesses. Certain people will say "it's very sad", and it'll all quickly get swept aside for the next big news story.
But the factors leading to the riot will not be addressed, because the system benefits too much from them and things like the riots, to warrant a change. And by "system" I mean the socio-economic industrial complex, from politicians to the judiciary system to the media. This little game of divide-and-conquer among the populace is just a part of a much larger machine, and as long as people are willing to work within a machine that's designed to work against them, they'll continue to make miniscule achievements.
And let's also be honest here: every major revolution has had violence in one way or another, many innocents dying b/c they happened to be on the wrong side. The October Revolution, The Crusades, America's very independence....countless lives were lost in all of these but the victors live to tell the tale. It's foolish to think any future major movement or revolution won't involve bloodshed just b/c it's the 21st century. Just look at the aftermath of the Arab Spring.
Byakuya769
Member
Seriously, what the FUCK are you talking about? A kid got executed by a COP, people hold a vigil and more COPS come to display more force.
Are you a racist or stupid? Otherwise I don't see how you thought your little contribution even made sense. Completely unrelated observations.
Be real. If a cop isn't doing it himself, he knows guys on the force who are, and he isn't doing shit about it because "protect the shield" bullshit.
Brolic Gaoler
formerly Alienshogun
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