"Exotic" might not be a compliment towards people

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If no one cares or inquiries about your religion, why are you subjecting them to it?

If I don't ask you if I look exotic, why do you feel like you should tell me about it?

Why are you putting words into my mouth?

I'm not talking about walking up to people and saying "hey, I'm atheist". Obviously.

I'm talking about conversations or situations where the subject is broached.

Are you also saying people should never compliment other people unless they ask for a compliment?

She's making an argument. She derives (loosely speaking) the conclusion from the premises. I don't know what an objective argument is, but it seems like a regular argument to me.

The central idea is that 'exotic' is not a compliment, which is either debatable or not correct in some cases, but she does a decent job of showing that it is not obviously a compliment.

What I mean is she seems to have made her mind up before she thought about it, at least that's the way it feels presented. I think she's knee jerking a little.

She does a decent job of showing us specific times when it probably wouldn't be a good compliment, she doesn't even consider the times it might.
 
If no one cares or inquiries about your religion, why are you subjecting them to it?

If I don't ask you if I look exotic, why do you feel like you should tell me about it?

If I don't ask you if I look pretty, why do you feel like you should tell me about it?

Snarky comment but it should show you the parallel on how words--no matter how benign they are--can be mean.
 
I mean this in a nice way- but why don't you ask your friends? Ask the Japanese people in your association, ask your coworkers- how do they feel about being called exotic?

After all, that's what this thread is, isn't it? We're all sharing our own perspectives. It's entirely possible and okay that you never thought of it as being offensive... but now, since it's been brought up and you realize some people might feel this way, why not ask your real life friends what their thoughts are on this? It's not your fault if you've never actually been exposed to this perspective. We're all ignorant to other people's perspectives, and it's not a signal of a lack of empathy until we're exposed and then deny others.

I know you do :D

The thing is, I've had my accent called exotic by those very groups. Especially my Japanese friends, they like it because I don't sound hispanic (or as one of them said 'hispanish' bahahaha), yet they do detect an accent they don't hear from the rest of people. I thought it was pretty cool.
 
Now I'm actually really curious speaking in generalities why it seems to be very accepted in the Latin community and no so much in the Asian community. Being that both cultures have been subject to being viewed as a fetish.

That's probably why it's hard for some of us to comprehend the offense because it really really has been nothing but a high compliment in our culture. Different walks of life I guess. good that we can share our experiences and learn from each other and hopefully become better people.
 
Why are you putting words into my mouth?

I'm not talking about walking up to people and saying "hey, I'm atheist". Obviously.

I'm talking about conversations or situations where the subject is broached/

I've already answered something about this. Look it up, I'm not about to keep arguing semantics.
 
The parts that I took issue with were how amazingly condescending she was, and her saying that your intentions don't matter.



Well, I meant with marginalizing and fetishizing. Someone could mean it as an honest compliment with no ill intent or meaning behind it. At least in the Latin community, it's how we view it. I concede that this could be a very prevalent issue with the Asian community, but I had not heard of that until recently, and (omg I can't believe I'm gonna use this) I have plenty of Asian friends. I'm in the Japanese association and a vast number of people at my company that I am friends with are Korean, Chinese, Vietnamese, etc.

But yeah, that's what I meant with a 'clean slate' - as far as intent and message sent across.
:

Caribbean here too. I can understand the Asian community having an issue with the word In AMERICA but in Latin countries the word is perfect tly acceptable on conversation.

So moral of the study is the word has different meanings but not a definitive one. And I will not use it in AMERICA TO AMERICAN MINORITIES but i will be more free in our other nations. Because speaking of absolutes is bad right guys?
 
The parts that I took issue with were how amazingly condescending she was, and her saying that your intentions don't matter.



Well, I meant with marginalizing and fetishizing. Someone could mean it as an honest compliment with no ill intent or meaning behind it. At least in the Latin community, it's how we view it. I concede that this could be a very prevalent issue with the Asian community, but I had not heard of that until recently, and (omg I can't believe I'm gonna use this) I have plenty of Asian friends. I'm in the Japanese association and a vast number of people at my company that I am friends with are Korean, Chinese, Vietnamese, etc.

But yeah, that's what I meant with a 'clean slate' - as far as intent and message sent across.

That's what I meant by 'clean slate' also. Some messages are more frequently sent with one kind of intent rather than another kind. That tends to be the hangup people have with words like 'exotic' that might be taken in a way that one individual would never intend under any circumstances. People think that's unfair, but if it turns out what you're trying to say is actually unusual and it's impossible to tell the difference then I can't see how you're being treated unfairly.
 
If I don't ask you if I look pretty, why do you feel like you should tell me about it?

Snarky comment but it should show you the parallel on how words--no matter how benign they are--can be mean.

Exotic and pretty are not in the same category. One is relatively tame, other is subjective in its execution.

This is getting ridiculous, the levels of denial in here are so funny.
 
Exotic and pretty are not in the same category. One is relatively tame, other is subjective in its execution.

This is getting ridiculous, the levels of denial in here are so funny.

I can make an argument for why "pretty" and "beautiful" are harmful to society. I did in this very thread. Now we're at in its execution stage?

What denial? You have to sufficiently prove this word causes harm and not theorectical harm. Actual harm. There are words that cause harm and it's easy to list them and why they're frowned upon for using. You need to show us how this is a seperator in which it is harmful to use or describe people as. You have not.

You can say we're in denial, but aren't you probably over reacting to a benign comment?
 
I lamented when we lost what I thought was a cool, descriptive word, Oriental, but I accepted the fact that it had become offensive and purged it from my vocabulary. Again, I lament the loss of exotic, which I think is cool and descriptive, but if it's become offensive, it is what it is. Language changes, words change, there's no point in using a word that has a reasonable risk of offense attached to it.
 
This "should" is itself a belief, and a self-defeating one at at that.

You're supposed to be ashamed of your beliefs? And you're supposed to subject people to your beliefs even if they disagree?

Edit: unless I've misunderstood you? In that case I apologize.

You put words in my mouth then put your fingers in your ears.

Good chat.

So now you're a victim? Omg I can't believe the irony here!

I'm supposed to keep going in circles with you over something I've already talked about? Spare me the sad song please.
 
Now I'm actually really curious speaking in generalities why it seems to be very accepted in the Latin community and no so much in the Asian community. Being that both cultures have been subject to being viewed as a fetish.

That's probably why it's hard for some of us to comprehend the offense because it really really has been nothing but a high compliment in our culture. Different walks of life I guess. good that we can share our experiences and learn from each other.

Not sure why honestly, I can only speak for myself on this one. I'm pretty proud of being Dominican. So if someone here in Orange County thinks I'm exotic, I'm like "Damn right I'm exotic" It's a great conversation starter and I'ts not a big deal. I used to buy drinks to girls who could guess where i was from.
 
Now I'm actually really curious speaking in generalities why it seems to be very accepted in the Latin community and no so much in the Asian community. Being that both cultures have been subject to being viewed as a fetish.

That's probably why it's hard for some of us to comprehend the offense because it really really has been nothing but a high compliment in our culture. Different walks of life I guess. good that we can share our experiences and learn from each other and hopefully become better people.

I think it's because, and this is purely anecdotal conjecture before anyone pounces on me, is that Asian culture is in Western culture much more regarded as "The Other" than Hispanic or Latin culture. Asian people still make up a small percentage of the entire United States population whereas the Latinos make up a much larger majority. A quick look at Wiki brings up that Asian Americans only make up 4.8% of the population while Hispanic or Latino make up 16.4%. But you don't need these statistics to back it up, you can look at just how prevalent Asian Americans are in the media or perhaps the lackthereof. "Fresh Off the Boat" is notable for being an Asian American family show, the first in a long time. Meanwhile, there are multiple shows surrounding the Hispanic and Latino culture.

Asian Americans already feel marginalized by the public perception of us as perhaps crazy smart or wildly exotic. Sure those might be great compliments, but not if they're not earned. Calling someone who's Asian American "exotic" because of their race when they've grown up in the United States literally their entire life is offensive because it shows that you aren't actually looking at the person, just their race.
 
Not sure why honestly, I can only speak for myself on this one. I'm pretty proud of being Dominican. So if someone here in Orange County thinks I'm exotic, I'm like "Damn right I'm exotic" It's a great conversation starter and I'ts not a big deal. I used to buy drinks to girls who could guess where i was from.

Yes Otro patriota!
 
You're supposed to be ashamed of your beliefs? And you're supposed to subject people to your beliefs even if they disagree?

Edit: unless I've misunderstood you? In that case I apologize.

No, you shouldn't be ashamed of your beliefs. I was referring to the latter half of your sentence. Telling someone that they should never force/impose/subject/etc. their beliefs on others is, itself, forcing/imposing/subjecting/etc. this keep-it-to-yourself belief on them. It's a self-defeating standard, which is unsurprising as it's stated as an absolute, and absolutes rarely ever hold up under scrutiny.

But that's getting a bit off-topic. As for this word, if there's a reasonable chance someone will find it offensive, it's best not to use it. I'm sad that it's become that way, but if a word evolves to the point where it's failing in its job, it's time to give your sad goodbyes to the word.
 
I think it's because, and this is purely anecdotal conjecture before anyone pounces on me, is that Asian culture is in Western culture much more regarded as "The Other" than Hispanic or Latin culture. Asian people still make up a small percentage of the entire United States population whereas the Latinos make up a much larger majority. A quick look at Wiki brings up that Asian Americans only make up 4.8% of the population while Hispanic or Latino make up 16.4%. But you don't need these statistics to back it up, you can look at just how prevalent Asian Americans are in the media or perhaps the lackthereof. "Fresh Off the Boat" is notable for being an Asian American family show, the first in a long time. Meanwhile, there are multiple shows surrounding the Hispanic and Latino culture.

Asian Americans already feel marginalized by the public perception of us as perhaps crazy smart or wildly exotic. Sure those might be great compliments, but not if they're not earned. Calling someone who's Asian American "exotic" because of their race when they've grown up in the United States literally their entire life is offensive because it shows that you aren't actually looking at the person, just their race.

Got ya. Thanks for the explanation. I was born here too and to be honest usually most people can't guess my race correctly so I'm used to being asked by people. I also never made the connection with race and the word exotic but I see how it can apply.
 
Got ya. Thanks for the explanation. I was born here too and to be honest usually most people can't guess my race correctly so I'm used to being asked by people. I also never made the connection with race and the word exotic but I see how it can apply.

For sure.

Like I've said previously in the thread, it's not anything that any Asian American will honestly get freaked out about and if you said it to them they'll understand your good intentions in a compliment.

It's just...not the best compliment. Almost backhanded even.
 
This is a really interesting point.

Were you born in the DR? Or, to you, what does "being Dominican" mean, and what's the source of pride behind it?


I suppose, for many Asian-Americans that were born and raised here- we actually consider ourselves American. We may have a lot of pride in our specific ethnicity, but that's not the same as being foreign/exotic to us.

I celebrate my Taiwanese roots, but I'm not "Taiwanese" at all. If I were to go back to Taiwan and say "I'm so proud to be Taiwanese," they would look at me and say, "you're not Taiwanese." Even in China, Chinese people could tell who actually was Chinese, and who were American Chinese. I'm American. I can't truly be Taiwanese, being as I was born and raised in America.

I actually find the Asians born and raised here being "proud" and wearing all that KOREAN PRIDE/CHINESE PRIDE/etc stuff to be a little silly. I also find the upper middle class Asian-Americans in my city trying to be "gangster" with their dress and accent, to be equally as silly. You're NOT gangster. You can pretend and hope and act like you are, but you're not. You're an upper-middle class kid of professionals living in a nice, safe suburb.

Holy shit this is word for word what I have always said and felt regarding being American coming from a Mexican family. I've even gotten a lot of shit for it in the past and been called a sell out to my race. I just think it's disrespectful for me to claim a country I have been to maybe twice in my life because my parents were born there. I guess the difference between us is how it affects us.
 
Wow it got considerably more civil in here.

I have learned that generally Latinos seem to like the term because it doesn't hold cultural baggage for them. I hope others have learned that many Asian Americans dislike the term because it does.

Maybe we should have been more forthright about the cultural background we have been talking from.
 
This is a really interesting point.

Were you born in the DR? Or, to you, what does "being Dominican" mean, and what's the source of pride behind it?
.

I was born and raised in NYC. Actually I'm glad you you brought this up. I think Latinos in general have a harder time assimilating as "Americans". It's a good thing but it can also hold us back from progressing. I used to think it was a 1st generation thing vs 2 nd or 3rd, but I know plenty of 1st generation asians americans have no problem being just American.

Just go to NYC and check out the amount of Dominican, and Puerto Rican flags on people's windows. You never see japanese, Chinese, Koran etc etc flags around.

EDIT: I'm not saying Asians aren't proud of where they come from. I just don't think they don't have a need to show off wear on their sleeves like Latinos do.
 
Wow it got considerably more civil in here.

I have learned that generally Latinos seem to like the term because it doesn't hold cultural baggage for them. I hope others have learned that many Asian Americans dislike the term because it does.

Maybe we should have been more forthright about the cultural background we have been talking from.
Yep. I learned from this thread.

I was born and raised in NYC. Actually I'm glad you you brought this up. I think Latinos in general have a harder time assimilating as "Americans". It's a good thing but it can also hold us back from progressing. I used to think it was a 1st generation thing vs 2 nd or 3rd, but I know plenty of 1st generation asians americans have no problem being just American.

Just go to NYC and check out the amount of Dominican, and Puerto Rican flags on people's windows. You never see japanese, Chinese, Koran etc etc flags around.

That's damn true as well. My mom used to call white people "Americanos" I was like mom I am american too lol.
 
Wow it got considerably more civil in here.

I have learned that generally Latinos seem to like the term because it doesn't hold cultural baggage for them. I hope others have learned that many Asian Americans dislike the term because it does.

Maybe we should have been more forthright about the cultural background we have been talking from.

Agreed.
 
Wow it got considerably more civil in here.

I have learned that generally Latinos seem to like the term because it doesn't hold cultural baggage for them. I hope others have learned that many Asian Americans dislike the term because it does.

Maybe we should have been more forthright about the cultural background we have been talking from.

thank you for that!

i learned the word might be offensive to some, whereas before i always assumed it was just a positive description because that's the way it was always used in my personal area with varied people who many here would consider non-white (given that i know some in gaf's more....overzealous attitude when it comes to white men doing or saying certain things).

i was hoping more people would be open to the idea that there is more to the word than just the negative aspect of it's definition, which i still say pales in comparison to its use in regular vernacular. it wasn't me trying to be a victim like mentioned before.

that the word is broad in certain areas, and in those areas and to certain people it's best to be careful, but that it doesn't demonize the word for others.
 
Because I first tried "asian exotic" and then had to add -food, -travel, -dancer, -massage, etc. in order to get to the relevant results, which in itself should show how shitty this word can be to this community.

It's weird because I googled "Asian Exotic" and the first two pages had 1 opinion piece on why exotic is bad.

I tried "Asian Exotic Dancer" and it yielded the same results as "Indian Exotic Dancer".

Basically the rest followed suit.

You can't use Google as evidence when you selectively search for these things. I can search for why Shaw Cable is horrible and why Shaw Cable is great. I get those things because I search for it, and since there's a shit load of shit on the Internet there will be a lot of opinions. We can spout opinions day in and day out. We need some kind of identifier as to why this is wrong. No one has said it. All we've heard is, "This hurts my feelings." This then degrades into, "Should we apologize for hurt feelings caused by us?" This then leads into people actually apologizing to me when I tell them they're not inflammatory post hurt my feelings. You have to draw a reasonable line of where you have to say, "Really?" While everyone's experiences different are it's unreasonable for any one to care when you're inconvenienced just a bit. If you find this to be a big bothersome then there is nothing we can do to let you understand our reasoning and convince you we're not bigots, racists, sexists, misogynists, etc. (we've been called those in this thread).
 
In what world does it NOT MATTER WHAT SOMEONE MEANT?!

if something is said from a non malicious or non attacking standpoint, either in ignorance or just a different point of view WHY SHOULD IT BE CONSIDERED AN INSULT?!



Language is only a form of communication, if your taking the word in the wrong way maybe YOU need to change your definition.
at least give the person a chance, rather than stringing them up.
 
In what world does it NOT MATTER WHAT SOMEONE MEANT?!

if something is said from a non malicious or non attacking standpoint, either in ignorance or just a different point of view WHY SHOULD IT BE CONSIDERED AN INSULT?!



Language is only a form of communication, if your taking the word in the wrong way maybe YOU need to change your definition.
at least give the person a chance, rather than stringing them up.

Because your intent doesn't mean shit when it comes to whether or not something you said was insultingly ignorant. Just like someone tell me, "you're one of the good ones" is almost always said with good intent. Still is a horrible thing to say.

I look at exotic as a "soft insult" in the sense that, if a guy says something like that to me on a date, i'm not going throw my drink in his face and storm off. But it would definitely be a strike against them. It's insensitive, even if you mean well.
 
Because your intent doesn't mean shit when it comes to whether or not something you said was insultingly ignorant. Just like someone tell me, "you're one of the good ones" is almost always said with good intent. Still is a horrible thing to say.

I look at exotic as a "soft insult" in the sense that, if a guy says something like that to me on a date, i'm not going throw my drink in his face and storm off. But it would definitely be a strike against them. It's insensitive, even if you mean well.

Words are only a tool, and the meaning can be changed based on the mass opinion.

I hate the spreading of negativity, it creates this sensitive image that we dont need as a culture.

why cant we assume for the best rather than assume for the worst?
 
All of these sorts of responses are tired as fuck. There are plenty of things we don't say because some people can take them as being marginalizing or having a racial element. We're doing fine. Try to catch up with the rest of us.

I can't believe this is still going on even after showing this is the exact shit Michael Scott's used on the Office. People are still lining up to say "I'm that guy, deal with it." If this is such a known thing that even the Office writers knew it was gross enough for Michael Scott to awkwardly say it, why would you fight for the chance to continue being him?
I have never used the word 'exotic' to describe a person and probably never will, but I do think it would be a massive overreaction to be offended at the word, unless you could tell it was being used in a negative way.
 
This thread is too long to read it all, so i'm probably repeating what have already been discussed, sorry about that.

From the first pages i've read, i think i've always used "exotic" in a different way than some people in this thread.

To me exotic indicates something that is culturally different from your own.

It's not a synonym for beautiful, it's not a compliment, and it's not carrying any inherent good or bad quality, just a description of the divide between the two cultures meeting.

An exotic cuisine, is a cuisine very different from the one you're used to, in your own culture - not necessarily a cuisine you like or dislike, simply different.
An exotic tapestry is a tapestry that is very different from the style you'd see in your own culture's tapestries, and so on.

Saying "you're exotic" to a person (though it never happened in my personal experience, so far) wouldn't imply that they are beautiful, good nor bad; simply that their culture is removed enough from my own to appear "exotic".

"Exotic concepts" are also ideas that are "foreign" to you and your mode of thinking.

So in short, an American person would appear more exotic to me than a Swiss, because their culture is more separated from mine, on a virtual scale, just like I would appear more exotic to an American, than a Canadian would (i assume).
If i had to use it as a synonym for something, i'd say it's a synonym of "foreign".

Anyway, this is how I always interpreted the adjective "exotic".
 
I was born and raised in NYC. Actually I'm glad you you brought this up. I think Latinos in general have a harder time assimilating as "Americans". It's a good thing but it can also hold us back from progressing. I used to think it was a 1st generation thing vs 2 nd or 3rd, but I know plenty of 1st generation asians americans have no problem being just American.

Just go to NYC and check out the amount of Dominican, and Puerto Rican flags on people's windows. You never see japanese, Chinese, Koran etc etc flags around.

EDIT: I'm not saying Asians aren't proud of where they come from. I just don't think they don't have a need to show off wear on their sleeves like Latinos do.
This was an interesting insight, thanks! It's nice to understand the divide on the word among different communities.
 
Because your intent doesn't mean shit when it comes to whether or not something you said was insultingly ignorant. Just like someone tell me, "you're one of the good ones" is almost always said with good intent. Still is a horrible thing to say.

I look at exotic as a "soft insult" in the sense that, if a guy says something like that to me on a date, i'm not going throw my drink in his face and storm off. But it would definitely be a strike against them. It's insensitive, even if you mean well.
Intent and context are the only things that do matter.
 
I thought this was common knowledge?
In what world does it NOT MATTER WHAT SOMEONE MEANT?!

if something is said from a non malicious or non attacking standpoint, either in ignorance or just a different point of view WHY SHOULD IT BE CONSIDERED AN INSULT?!

Language is only a form of communication, if your taking the word in the wrong way maybe YOU need to change your definition.
at least give the person a chance, rather than stringing them up.
There are plenty of examples of hurtful racist comments that aren't intended to be hurtful. See: "You are a credit to your race."
 
So a black person is supposed to happily respond to "you're one of the good ones"?

Depends on the context. The speaker thinking that generally the listener's race is terrible is one context, Not talking about race, but generally as humans is another. They may mean "Don't let other people get you down, you're one of the good ones". I've also heard it used by women to reassure men in a "you're not as much of a jerk as you think you are" context.

Context, context, context.
 
I really feel it is in big cities with diverse populations. I can understand people elsewhere needing to learn about it, but the stubbornness in some of these posts is brutal.

It's weird how you say diverse but chime away when diversity is contextualized. If exotic is bad then why is the celebration of diverse cultures not bad? If we're really arguing that it's a separator and says, "You're a foreigner", doesn't having cultural events in and around the city count as a separator too?
 
It's weird how you say diverse but chime away when diversity is contextualized. If exotic is bad then why is the celebration of diverse cultures not bad? If we're really arguing that it's a separator and says, "You're a foreigner", doesn't having cultural events in and around the city count as a separator too?

I dont know about NA but in Australia, when there is a cultural celebration it is intended to include the mainstream culture into it, or in other words, to counter the vibes of exoticness of that once foreign culture.

There are pocket suburbs in Melbourne that has a high level of population from Chinese, or Vietnam, or Greek, or Italy, and say, when they have things like Greek Week or Chinese New Year celebration, EVERYONE is invited into finding out more about that culture, and everyone is invited into the celebrations. It is intended to integrate the foreign culture not to emphasize its foreignness. It's saying Chinese-Australians are Australians too and that they are not exotic people with exotic features that should be ogled or marveled at.

Sure first timer's exposure to new cultures would be like "Whoa, this ain't Australian" or "This people are different (and therefore exotic)!" but in the long run, Australians have adopted things into our fold. Like, Yum Cha is a known and well-loved fooding item here, now.

Takes time, though.
 
Because your intent doesn't mean shit when it comes to whether or not something you said was insultingly ignorant. Just like someone tell me, "you're one of the good ones" is almost always said with good intent. Still is a horrible thing to say.

I look at exotic as a "soft insult" in the sense that, if a guy says something like that to me on a date, i'm not going throw my drink in his face and storm off. But it would definitely be a strike against them. It's insensitive, even if you mean well.

Is there a point in time where a dating relationship has progressed far enough that the term could be used without you reading into anything other than intent?
 
I dont know about NA but in Australia, when there is a cultural celebration it is intended to include the mainstream culture into it, or in other words, to counter the vibes of exoticness of that once foreign culture.

There are pocket suburbs in Melbourne that has a high level of population from Chinese, or Vietnam, or Greek, or Italy, and say, when they have things like Greek Week or Chinese New Year celebration, EVERYONE is invited into finding out more about that culture, and everyone is invited into the celebrations. It is intended to integrate the foreign culture not to emphasize its foreignness. It's saying Chinese-Australians are Australians too and that they are not exotic people with exotic features that should be ogled or marveled at.

Sure first timer's exposure to new cultures would be like "Whoa, this ain't Australian" or "This people are different (and therefore exotic)!" but in the long run, Australians have adopted things into our fold. Like, Yum Cha is a known and well-loved fooding item here, now.

Takes time, though.

Every one is welcome to the Vaisakhi Parade in Surrey but that doesn't mean it's integrating or not foreign. You can integrate as much as you want but individual people will still be subject to their own life experiences. Experiencing a culture once or twice a year doesn't acclimate someone to it, it just reinforces that it is different and is something you experience on occasion.

You have to be pragmatic about these things--sure there are good coming from cultural festivals but they're at its core a festival. You may learn something but you're not going to break down someone's personal understanding of what exotic is.

Now with all this hearsay aside, is there a legit evidence exotic is a separator for I don't take scenarios in which it can be for it to be bad as it's evident you can do that with all descriptors. Is there intrinsic damage to the word like "faggot", "retard", etc. Those we can see the intrinsic damage it causes without mental gymnastics. It seems people are only taking offense to the word in certain situations but is that good enough to warrant a "you probably shouldn't use that word" response or is it more deserving to say, "isn't that bit of an over reaction"?
 
Depends on the context. The speaker thinking that generally the listener's race is terrible is one context, Not talking about race, but generally as humans is another. They may mean "Don't let other people get you down, you're one of the good ones". I've also heard it used by women to reassure men in a "you're not as much of a jerk as you think you are" context.

Context, context, context.

That's not a matter of context; that's people using the phrase to convey a completely different meaning. Not the same meaning that might be interpreted in a different way depending on the context.

Like, there ARE people out there who use "you're one of the good ones" in reference to race, WHILE having good intent. In those cases, their good intent doesn't make what they said any less ignorant or offensive.

Is there a point in time where a dating relationship has progressed far enough that the term could be used without you reading into anything other than intent?
Well, it's not a science, it's all about your ability to read a person an a situation.

Like, if you're on a first date (or second) and you're really trying to make a good first impression and establish yourself in the best possible light, I wouldn't fawn over someone's physical appearance (especially the things that you feel make them different, or "exotic" than what you're used to seeing). Doing that before you've established that you're interested in the person for reasons OTHER than how they look to you sets off major red flags in most people, right from the start.

An exception to this rule would be if you made it relevant to discussion. For example, if I were on a date with a guy, and somehow the conversation naturally veered onto the subject of race, ethnicity and culture (which can happen on good first dates), if my date chose THAT moment to ask about my ethnicity or mention that I have "exotic" features, I wouldn't be offended -- especially because I know I have a lot of "in-between" racial features. I get told a lot that I look either black or South Asian (Indian, mostly) depending on the lighting or what angle you're catching of my face. lol
 
Every one is welcome to the Vaisakhi Parade in Surrey but that doesn't mean it's integrating or not foreign. You can integrate as much as you want but individual people will still be subject to their own life experiences. Experiencing a culture once or twice a year doesn't acclimate someone to it, it just reinforces that it is different and is something you experience on occasion.

You have to be pragmatic about these things--sure there are good coming from cultural festivals but they're at its core a festival. You may learn something but you're not going to break down someone's personal understanding of what exotic is.

Now with all this hearsay aside, is there a legit evidence exotic is a separator for I don't take scenarios in which it can be for it to be bad as it's evident you can do that with all descriptors. Is there intrinsic damage to the word like "faggot", "retard", etc. Those we can see the intrinsic damage it causes without mental gymnastics. It seems people are only taking offense to the word in certain situations but is that good enough to warrant a "you probably shouldn't use that word" response or is it more deserving to say, "isn't that bit of an over reaction"?

Well, I did not say the festivals are the complete package for integration, but it is a measure of one. I suppose, like I have alluded to, in my post, it is a mean to introduce so that integration can be paved for.

For example, I attended the Greek Week here in Melbourne because I thought the Greek culture would be closer to the mainstream Australian culture. I found that this is not thoroughly the case. They have very deep-set roots with regards to how they view family that is much closer to my Asian experience (i.e. their households can be quite large, with the grandparents living together with them). Now, I would not say that I am integrated into their culture just by attending. No, not at all. But I would say that I have gained more understanding of their culture and they are now no longer so 'different' than they once was, to me.

To be honest, sketchbag, you were the one asking people why "exotic" are so bad to them, you were the one asking people to justify "cultural festivals" to you, so I answer, and I could only answer based on my personal experience. But then reading your responses, you tend to stubbornly hold your original position why "exotic" is not that bad, to you, and therefore dismiss the answer to a question that you yourself pose in a manner as if you really would like to learn why the other side feels that way. Well, each one of us can only bring our perspective into the discussion, and if you dismiss all the replies that says the things you don't want to hear, this discussion will not go very far.

Again, maybe I have to reiterate that I, personally, do not put too much weight on the word. If someone uses that word to address me, I'd probably laugh it off, and think that the person's probably not the most cultured person I've ever met. But it wouldn't have offended me.
 
Now with all this hearsay aside, is there a legit evidence exotic is a separator for I don't take scenarios in which it can be for it to be bad as it's evident you can do that with all descriptors. Is there intrinsic damage to the word like "faggot", "retard", etc. Those we can see the intrinsic damage it causes without mental gymnastics. It seems people are only taking offense to the word in certain situations but is that good enough to warrant a "you probably shouldn't use that word" response or is it more deserving to say, "isn't that bit of an over reaction"?

What kind of evidence do you even want that's more direct than people straight up telling you that it's a damaging term and exactly why that is?
 
Well, I did not say the festivals are the complete package for integration, but it is a measure of one. I suppose, like I have alluded to, in my post, it is a mean to introduce so that integration can be paved for.

For example, I attended the Greek Week here in Melbourne because I thought the Greek culture would be closer to the mainstream Australian culture. I found that this is not thoroughly the case. They have very deep-set roots with regards to how they view family that is much closer to my Asian experience (i.e. their households can be quite large, with the grandparents living together with them). Now, I would not say that I am integrated into their culture just by attending. No, not at all. But I would say that I have gained more understanding of their culture and they are now no longer so 'different' than they once was, to me.

Seems reasonable, but there isn't any research into cultural festivals so it's really hearsay.
To be honest, sketchbag, you were the one asking people why "exotic" are so bad to them, you were the one asking people to justify "cultural festivals" to you, so I answer, and I could only answer based on my personal experience. But then reading your responses, you tend to stubbornly hold your original position why "exotic" is not that bad, to you, and therefore dismiss the answer to a question that you yourself pose in a manner as if you really would like to learn why the other side feels that way. Well, each one of us can only bring our perspective into the discussion, and if you dismiss all the replies that says the things you don't want to hear, this discussion will not go very far.

Again, maybe I have to reiterate that I, personally, do not put too much weight on the word. If someone uses that word to address me, I'd probably laugh it off, and think that the person's probably not the most cultured person I've ever met. But it wouldn't have offended me.

My point is your personal perspective on the word is irrelevant (you even acknowledged this in another post), it's that the word doesn't have intrinsic damage unless you want it. You can do this with other descriptors as well. Can it make people feel unwanted? Probably. Yet, we post examples of how it can be rude. We never post why in general it is rude.

I understand why the other side feels that way. They're feelings are hurt. I just need reasonable evidence that the word is damaging for me to care. If not, I see it as an over reaction. You could say I'm stubbornly not accepting personal feelings as evidence but then again... people get upset for even dumber reasons than this.

What kind of evidence do you even want that's more direct than people straight up telling you that it's a damaging term and exactly why that is?

We use "retard" in specific circumstances like retarded time, but we in general know there's intrinsic damage when you call someone a retard. We can create many scenarios where calling someone a retard offensive or even using the word in general against non-retard people can be offensive and ignorant. It's a word that has a proper usage and is abused then shunned. Can you show me the intrinsic damage of exotic? At some point you have to ask if you're over thinking and over reacting. You're not going have all your feelings respected. It's unreasonable to ask. What's reasonable to ask is that you shouldn't whine or complain about words that are relatively harmless in the majority of conversations, descriptions, and general conversation.
 


Seems reasonable, but there isn't any research into cultural festivals so it's really hearsay.

My point is your personal perspective on the word is irrelevant (you even acknowledged this in another post), it's that the word doesn't have intrinsic damage unless you want it. You can do this with other descriptors as well. Can it make people feel unwanted? Probably. Yet, we post examples of how it can be rude. We never post why in general it is rude.

I understand why the other side feels that way.They're feelings are hurt. I just need reasonable evidence that the word is damaging for me to care. If not, I see it as an over reaction. You could say I'm stubbornly not accepting personal feelings as evidence but then again... people get upset for even dumber reasons than this.



We use "retard" in specific circumstances like retarded time, but we in general know there's intrinsic damage when you call someone a retard. We can create many scenarios where calling someone a retard offensive or even using the word in general against non-retard people can be offensive and ignorant. It's a word that has a proper usage and is abused then shunned. Can you show me the intrinsic damage of exotic? At some point you have to ask if you're over thinking and over reacting. You're not going have all your feelings respected. It's unreasonable to ask. What's reasonable to ask is that you shouldn't whine or complain about words that are relatively harmless in the majority of conversations, descriptions, and general conversation.


Underlined part: I thought that's what we've been doing, explaining WHY it is rude.

Italicized part: What if I see your unwillingness to keep at this topic as an over-reaction to the topic?

Bolded part: Well, that's what's reasonable and unreasonable to you, but I would wager that for others it is quite reasonable to refrain using certain words until we are sure those very words won't reflect badly on us.

Also, people are not whining or complaining, as much as you have been insisting and calling them over-reacting oversensitive souls.




Overall response: Apologies, I didn't realise we were solicited for hard proof to back our emotional response in this topic. I don't think there is empirical evidence, if you're looking for statistics and studies, about the specific word "Exotic" and its effects on different people. If you, as a person, requires hard evidence to be able to care if other people's feelings are hurt or not, then... maybe you just really don't care if you hurt other people's feelings or not.
 
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