Utah police shoot black man "lunging" w/ sword. Witnesses, autopsy say shot in back
- Thread starter timetokill
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SparkPeople
Banned
Schattenjäger;130077227 said:
I've seen your posts in various police brutality threads. Let's save you some time.
"We don't have all the facts, let's wait until the investigation is complete. I have nothing to contribute except asking everyone to stop airing their feelings and opinions of the case.
No, race is never a factor in disproportionate police violence against blacks.
Why does everybody hate me?"
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
I know you are.. If there ever was a gif of your radar.. I could see my avatar hovering around a radar screen
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
What is there to argue about? Did he call me a racist? All he said is that he is aware of my post history..
I'm aware that he is aware .. Wouldn't that make me also be on my best behavior? Stop instigating
TheRedSnifit
Member
Schattenjäger;130142528 said:
I think you're having some difficulty reading between the lines.
Man accused of suspect posting history.
Man scoffs at accusations of suspect history.
Bish acknowledges suspect posting history.
Man acknowledges suspect posting history.
Man says bish didn't call him racist. <--- This part doesn't have anything to do with accusations of suspect posting history.
Man scoffs at accusations of suspect history.
Bish acknowledges suspect posting history.
Man acknowledges suspect posting history.
Man says bish didn't call him racist. <--- This part doesn't have anything to do with accusations of suspect posting history.
He was taking a sword with him to a job interview?
Anyway, based on the witnesses saying they were calmly talking at one point, something came up that escalated everything. Not just him carrying a sword around.
The video says the guy was in trouble previously but not convicted, he took a plea. So was this escalated because the cops wanted ID and he thought he'd get in more trouble, so he ran? Not sure what the 2x4's the woman says she saw could have been either.
His mother's guess for having the sword on him is a bit odd, but then deciding to walk around with it on his back one day is a bit odd too. It all happened near a Panda Express, and she'd told him to go find a job. So it's possible, just not that clever.
I'd assume the 2x4's would have been the sword in one hand and the scabbard in the other.
The missing bit is why he drew the sword and what he did with it. They could have asked to see it, or he was trying to show them it wasn't a real one, or he did it with no warning at some point and that is how it escalated.
Whatever happened one of the cops then fired and he started running, as that is when the witness looked back.
If you didn't have a suspect post history why would he be aware of it and why would you need to be on your best behavior? Stop being obtuse.Schattenjäger;130142528 said:
By the way, contrary to what you were bitching about in the actress thread, no one here called you a racist for your post in this thread.
They simply were not surprised that you are one of those "wait for more evidence" people in a thread about black person being killed, based on your rather racially biased post history.
Jmanunknown
Member
Did anyone read the interview with the victim's aunt. The whole incident has been quite an eye opener for her.
here is what she said in the interview
http://m.sltrib.com/sltrib/mobile3/58409680-219/hunt-family-police-sword.html.csp
here is what she said in the interview
http://m.sltrib.com/sltrib/mobile3/58409680-219/hunt-family-police-sword.html.csp
(x-files music)
hehe. This is going to be what it takes. The fact of the matter is that people simply don't empathize with minorites getting targeted by police because they don't have to. To them, they just assume its an exaggeration, overblown, continuous bitching. Even if they hear something like Stop and Frisk, they justify it because of reasons.
I figured attacking the media would have done it, but its been long forgotten now. People justified it with the idea that the media was working with the looters to incite riots. So yeah, its going to be a slow journey for a sizable demographic to admit they've been mistaken/unaware. But as the violence is escalating from police, hopefully people will tend to see civil rights abuses and murder for what they are, and not have to wait on a sworn testimony from jesus describing that it had nothing to do with race/class.
Phoenix
Member
Why would you have a gun in public? If people have a right to bear arms, that doesn't just apply to firearms.
I did enjoy this thread about a gaffers post history. Too bad that story about a person being killed by police dragged it down.
Jesus. What a fucked up story in every way.
Jesus. What a fucked up story in every way.
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
www.theguardian.com/world/2014/sep/...-the-back-by-utah-police-says-family-attorney
Some new details ...the delay in questioning is suspicious... Seems he lunged at them and then was ultimately killed when fleeing ..
Darrien Hunt: Utah authorities alter account of shooting by police
Family lawyer says bullets came from behind and criticises almost incomprehensible delay in questioning officers involved
Darrien Hunt and police just before the shooting. Photograph: Jocelyn Hansen via ABC4
Jon Swaine in New York
Monday 15 September 2014 20.12 EDT
Authorities in Utah have altered their account of how a 22-year-old black man was killed by police adding that he was shot at by officers as he moved away from them after an attorney for the mans family said he was hit repeatedly from behind.
The authorities also said that the two police officers involved in the shooting of Darrien Hunt last Wednesday had not yet been interviewed about the incident. The attorney for Hunts family described this delay as almost incomprehensible.
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Hunt died outside a Panda Express restaurant at a strip mall in Saratoga Springs on Wednesday morning following an encounter with two police officers who were responding to a 911 call reporting a man with a samurai-style sword acting suspiciously.
After several days of silence Tim Taylor, the chief deputy attorney for Utah county, said in a statement on Saturday: When the officers made contact with Mr Hunt, he brandished the sword and lunged toward the officers with the sword, at which time Mr Hunt was shot.
However, Taylor confirmed to the Guardian on Monday that Hunt was in fact alleged to have lunged at the officers outside a bank several dozen yards away from where he ultimately died. While it was outside the bank that Hunt was first shot at by police, Taylor said, it was not clear whether he was struck on that occasion.
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Hunt then headed north and was shot several more times before eventually collapsing outside the Panda Express, according to Taylor. He said it was not clear if there were any further threatening moves. Whether or not the individual lunged again at point two, the other location, I dont know about that, Taylor said.
Randall Edwards, an attorney for Hunts family, said over the weekend that their private autopsy found Hunt was shot six times from behind. He was hit once in a shoulder, once in the back, once in an elbow, twice in a leg and once in a hand, according to the attorney.
The shot that killed Darrien, which was straight in the back, did not have an exit wound, Edwards told the Guardian. It raises the question as to how you can lunge at someone and be shot in the back at the same time. Edwards declined to identify the pathologist who had carried out the autopsy, citing a desire to protect him from media attention.
Hunts death follows the high-profile fatal shootings by police in August of Michael Brown, an unarmed black 18-year-old in Ferguson, Missouri, and John Crawford III, a 22-year-old black father of two who was carrying a BB rifle through a Walmart in Beavercreek, Ohio.
Hunts mother, Susan, who is white, accused the police of killing the 22-year-old due to his race. The population of Saratoga Springs is about 93% white and 0.5% black, according to the 2010 census.
They killed my son because hes black. No white boy with a little sword would they shoot while hes running away, Mrs Hunt told the Deseret News. Hunts family have not been able to explain why he was carrying the sword, which they called a souvenir from a gift shop.
Darrien Hunt in a family photograph. Photograph: Courtesy ABC4
The new account confirmed by Taylor on Monday appears to potentially match with remarks made by a witness to local media shortly after the shooting.
Jocelyn Hansen, who was filling her car at a gas station opposite the bank, has said that seconds beforehand she saw Hunt and the officers in conversation. She said that after taking a photograph of the scene, which showed Hunt smiling and with his hands at his sides, she got into her car in order to leave and then heard gunfire.
I looked up. There were shots and there was a chase, she told ABC 4 Utah. He turned and was running away from the police officers, Hansen added. She could not be reached on Monday.
The altered official account also follows an angry response by the Saratoga Springs police department to media reports of claims that Hunt may have been shot while running away.
Everyone should remember that the news outlets have ratings they need to gain. They dont report facts. They use innuendo, opinion and rumor and then report it as fact, said the unsigned statement, which was published on the departments Facebook page but has since been removed.
The real facts are being determined by an independent investigation, and not in a rushed or haphazard manner, it went on. When those facts are gathered and analyzed they will be reviewed by independent legal authorities.
The two officers involved in the incident have not been identified by Saratoga Springs police department. They have been placed on paid administrative leave. An investigation is being carried out by the countys officer-involved shooting protocol team, which includes officers from several different forces and agencies, according to Taylor, who said the county attorneys office would review these findings and issue a statement.
We havent even interviewed the officers yet, said Taylor. Weve talked briefly with them just to kind of get an idea of what the scene was at the time. He said officers were typically interviewed within 48-72 hours of a shooting. One is now scheduled to be interviewed on Tuesday and the other on Thursday, more than a week after the shooting, he said.
Im stunned. I find that almost incomprehensible, Edwards, the attorney for Hunts family, said after being informed of this by the Guardian. You want to speak with the officers almost immediately afterwards, when their memories are fresh and before they have had a chance to corroborate their stories.
Taylor said the county attorneys report would not be complete until his office received the findings of an autopsy that had completed by a state medical examiners office in Salt Lake county. He said that he expected this to take between six and seven weeks.
Edwards, the attorney for the family, said it was not clear whether the inquiry would be satisfactory. Do we trust the police to do a thorough investigation to find any kind of wrongdoing, and to ultimately punish the wrongdoer? I think the jury is still out on this one.
The attorney said he and the Hunt family would wait until the report before deciding their next move. If it appears that there was some sort of criminal activity on the part of the officer, obviously we would like to have that followed through with, he said.
Some new details ...the delay in questioning is suspicious... Seems he lunged at them and then was ultimately killed when fleeing ..
Darrien Hunt: Utah authorities alter account of shooting by police
Family lawyer says bullets came from behind and criticises almost incomprehensible delay in questioning officers involved
Darrien Hunt and police just before the shooting. Photograph: Jocelyn Hansen via ABC4
Jon Swaine in New York
Monday 15 September 2014 20.12 EDT
Authorities in Utah have altered their account of how a 22-year-old black man was killed by police adding that he was shot at by officers as he moved away from them after an attorney for the mans family said he was hit repeatedly from behind.
The authorities also said that the two police officers involved in the shooting of Darrien Hunt last Wednesday had not yet been interviewed about the incident. The attorney for Hunts family described this delay as almost incomprehensible.
Advertisement
Hunt died outside a Panda Express restaurant at a strip mall in Saratoga Springs on Wednesday morning following an encounter with two police officers who were responding to a 911 call reporting a man with a samurai-style sword acting suspiciously.
After several days of silence Tim Taylor, the chief deputy attorney for Utah county, said in a statement on Saturday: When the officers made contact with Mr Hunt, he brandished the sword and lunged toward the officers with the sword, at which time Mr Hunt was shot.
However, Taylor confirmed to the Guardian on Monday that Hunt was in fact alleged to have lunged at the officers outside a bank several dozen yards away from where he ultimately died. While it was outside the bank that Hunt was first shot at by police, Taylor said, it was not clear whether he was struck on that occasion.
Advertisement
Hunt then headed north and was shot several more times before eventually collapsing outside the Panda Express, according to Taylor. He said it was not clear if there were any further threatening moves. Whether or not the individual lunged again at point two, the other location, I dont know about that, Taylor said.
Randall Edwards, an attorney for Hunts family, said over the weekend that their private autopsy found Hunt was shot six times from behind. He was hit once in a shoulder, once in the back, once in an elbow, twice in a leg and once in a hand, according to the attorney.
The shot that killed Darrien, which was straight in the back, did not have an exit wound, Edwards told the Guardian. It raises the question as to how you can lunge at someone and be shot in the back at the same time. Edwards declined to identify the pathologist who had carried out the autopsy, citing a desire to protect him from media attention.
Hunts death follows the high-profile fatal shootings by police in August of Michael Brown, an unarmed black 18-year-old in Ferguson, Missouri, and John Crawford III, a 22-year-old black father of two who was carrying a BB rifle through a Walmart in Beavercreek, Ohio.
Hunts mother, Susan, who is white, accused the police of killing the 22-year-old due to his race. The population of Saratoga Springs is about 93% white and 0.5% black, according to the 2010 census.
They killed my son because hes black. No white boy with a little sword would they shoot while hes running away, Mrs Hunt told the Deseret News. Hunts family have not been able to explain why he was carrying the sword, which they called a souvenir from a gift shop.
Darrien Hunt in a family photograph. Photograph: Courtesy ABC4
The new account confirmed by Taylor on Monday appears to potentially match with remarks made by a witness to local media shortly after the shooting.
Jocelyn Hansen, who was filling her car at a gas station opposite the bank, has said that seconds beforehand she saw Hunt and the officers in conversation. She said that after taking a photograph of the scene, which showed Hunt smiling and with his hands at his sides, she got into her car in order to leave and then heard gunfire.
I looked up. There were shots and there was a chase, she told ABC 4 Utah. He turned and was running away from the police officers, Hansen added. She could not be reached on Monday.
The altered official account also follows an angry response by the Saratoga Springs police department to media reports of claims that Hunt may have been shot while running away.
Everyone should remember that the news outlets have ratings they need to gain. They dont report facts. They use innuendo, opinion and rumor and then report it as fact, said the unsigned statement, which was published on the departments Facebook page but has since been removed.
The real facts are being determined by an independent investigation, and not in a rushed or haphazard manner, it went on. When those facts are gathered and analyzed they will be reviewed by independent legal authorities.
The two officers involved in the incident have not been identified by Saratoga Springs police department. They have been placed on paid administrative leave. An investigation is being carried out by the countys officer-involved shooting protocol team, which includes officers from several different forces and agencies, according to Taylor, who said the county attorneys office would review these findings and issue a statement.
We havent even interviewed the officers yet, said Taylor. Weve talked briefly with them just to kind of get an idea of what the scene was at the time. He said officers were typically interviewed within 48-72 hours of a shooting. One is now scheduled to be interviewed on Tuesday and the other on Thursday, more than a week after the shooting, he said.
Im stunned. I find that almost incomprehensible, Edwards, the attorney for Hunts family, said after being informed of this by the Guardian. You want to speak with the officers almost immediately afterwards, when their memories are fresh and before they have had a chance to corroborate their stories.
Taylor said the county attorneys report would not be complete until his office received the findings of an autopsy that had completed by a state medical examiners office in Salt Lake county. He said that he expected this to take between six and seven weeks.
Edwards, the attorney for the family, said it was not clear whether the inquiry would be satisfactory. Do we trust the police to do a thorough investigation to find any kind of wrongdoing, and to ultimately punish the wrongdoer? I think the jury is still out on this one.
The attorney said he and the Hunt family would wait until the report before deciding their next move. If it appears that there was some sort of criminal activity on the part of the officer, obviously we would like to have that followed through with, he said.
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
This is a pretty good article about the case
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/darrien-hunt-carrying-toy-sword-shot-and-killed-utah-police
In this photo, taken, Friday, Sept. 12, 2014, shows Susan Hunt holding a photo of her family, including her son, Darrien Hunt, at her home in Saratoga Springs, Utah. Photo by Michelle Tessier/Deseret News/AP
Autopsy report shows police shot Darrien Hunt in the back, lawyer says
09/15/14 08:15 PMUPDATED 09/15/14 09:48 PM
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By Trymaine Lee
Darrien Nathaniel Hunt was an oddity in Saratoga Springs, a small, well-to-do city in Utah where a pair of white police officers gunned him down last week.
A young black man with a towering Afro, Hunt stood out in this overwhelmingly white city about 30 minutes south of Salt Lake City. So much so that just moments before officers killed him in a barrage of gunfire on Sept. 10, passersby pulled out their cell phones and snapped photos of the 22-year-old with the big hair, bright red shirt and toy sword slung over his shoulder.
People were taking pictures saying hey, look what I found, Randall Edwards, an attorney for Hunts family, told msnbc. Moments later Hunt was dead, struck with half a dozen bullets. The fatal shot struck him in the back, according to Edwards.
They killed my son because hes black. No white boy with a little sword would they shoot while hes running away.
SUSAN HUNT
What none of the photos taken by witnesses on Sept. 10 show is what initially sparked the gunfire or any details into the circumstances that led to Hunts death.
Police say that officers were responding to a report of a suspicious person walking around with a samurai-type sword when they confronted Hunt. They say he brandished the sword and lunged at the officers, at which point they opened fire on him.
Hunts family and their attorney are refuting those claims, saying that witnesses saw Hunt running from the officers as they fired on him, that he was shot six times from behind and that he fell and died about 100 yards from where police initially made contact with him.
Edwards, the attorney, said that an independent autopsy conducted at the behest of the family shows that the fatal shot struck Hunt at the center of his back. Five other gunshots struck him from behind, he said, including shots to his legs, shoulder, elbow and hand.
Hunts family has also been adamant that they believe his race his mother is white, his father is black played a role in the shooting. His mother, Susan Hunt, insists he was killed because hes black.
Im in Saratoga Springs, cause its a safe little community and they killed him. They killed my son because hes black, she told the Deseret News. No white boy with a little sword would they shoot while hes running away.
Edwards said the alleged weapon that Hunt was carrying at the time of his death had a blunt edge and was largely decorative something you might win at a carnival for knocking over stuffed animals.
When you look at those facts, the report from the pathologist and witness statements, it appears clear that the story that has been given out by the County Attorney that he was brandishing a sword and lunging at the officers is at least questionable, Edwards said. There were no gunshot wounds from the front, so the question then is what happened. There are only 3 people on earth, 2 people on earth now, who know what went down between those officers and Darrien and one of them is dead.
Hunts killing and the questionable circumstances surrounding his killing comes a little more than a month after the shooting death of unarmed black teen Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri. Witnesses in the Brown case say he was also running from an officer when that officer opened fire on him. Browns killing sparked local and national outrage with weeks of protests, some of which turned violent.
Obviously, when youre looking at any incident where you have a dead black kid and white officers youre going to say what going on? Is it a similar situation in Ferguson?
RANDALL EDWARDS, ATTORNEY FOR THE HUNT FAMILY
Obviously, when youre looking at any incident where you have a dead black kid and white officers youre going to say what going on? Is it a similar situation in Ferguson? Only in that sense, Edwards said. Saratoga Springs, Utah, is not Ferguson, Missouri. Officers here dont have a long history with confrontations with a minority population. Thats what we dont have. What we do have are a lot of questions of whats going on and why did this happen. I think that the family, the last thing they would ever want to do is cause or exacerbate race relations in Utah.
While there hasnt been any mass protests or marches in Hunts name, the story of Hunts killing has gone viral with many national news outlets picking up the story. In one seemingly small act of dissent, a page on Wikipedia for Saratoga Springs was edited say Saratoga Springs, Utah (Civilian Killers RIP Darrien Hunt).
The police have denied that Hunts race had anything to do with the incident.
Owen Jackson, a spokesman for Saratoga Springs, said the investigation has been handed over to the Utah County Attorneys Office. Per protocol, he said, the two officers involved in the shooting have been placed on paid administrative leave pending the outcome of an investigation.
Jackson said the Saratoga Springs 34-member Police Department was formed in 2007, and that there has never been a police involved shooting death in that time. Jackson said that he is unaware of any previous claims of racial profiling against the department.
About 95% of Saratoga Springs is white, according to recent Census data. It is also home to Mia Love, the citys most recent former mayor, who is likely to become the first-ever black Republican woman elected to congress. In recent years, the population of Saratoga Springs has exploded, from just over 1,000 in 2001 to 22,000 in 2010.
John Mejia, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Utah, said that the group is calling for an open and transparent investigation while awaiting the conclusion of the county attorneys own probe.
I think that there needs to be sort of an openness and willingness to be as public as you can possibly be in this sort of investigation, Mejia said.
Mejia said there have been about 10 deadly police shootings across the state so far this year, including four since August. Results in just two of those cases have been publicly released, he said.
There are some deadly shootings that date back to April and this is sort of state-wide issue, he said. As lawyers we understand that these things can take a while, but I think the public does start to get uneasy when the results take so long.
Hunt was the third person shot by Utah police in just three days, according to a report by the Salt Lake Tribune.
While Hunts race and the race of the officers who fired on him stand out for a number of obvious reasons, Edwards said that with so many more questions than answers, its unclear what roll, if any, race may have played in the shooting.
When faced with the question did race play a part in this, my client will say I cant think of any other reason they would shoot my son, Edwards said. You have this young black man with a pretty big Afro walking down the street carrying what looks like some sort of weapon. Its a pretty sleepy community. What happened next? And that is where things get very interesting.
Edwards said that just moments before police shot Hunt, a woman filling her car at a Chevron gas station near the scene saw Hunt and the officers talking and snapped a photo of them. In the photo, Edwards says Hunt and the officers seem calm with their hands all by their sides.
The police arent in any defensive position, he said. And its unclear if Hunt has anything in his hands.
She says that within seconds she looked down to finish pumping her gas and he is on the run and they are shooting at him, Edwards said.
Edwards said the area where she snapped the initial photo and the area Hunts body was found is about 100 to 150 yards away. He said the family doesnt have the resources to conduct the kind of investigation that the government will be able to do. During a vigil on Sunday night, Edwards said he was handing out flyers asking for anyone with information to come forward.
We really hope the government will do its part and will do an objective, thorough investigation in which the questions we have will all be answered, Edwards said.
Chief Andrew Burton of the Saratoga Springs Police Department said in a statement Monday night that immediately after the shooting the Utah County Officer Involved Shooting Protocol Team and the Utah County Attorneys Office were notified, with the former assuming responsibility for the investigation.
Burton said the city would like the investigation to be conducted quickly, but that the integrity of an investigation is paramount to an accurate outcome, and patience and commitment are required.
The chief called the investigation extremely complicated and very in-depth, with dozens of interviews that need to be conducted, forensics to be analyzed and laboratory tests conducted. He said toxicology tests and lab results must be handed over to the county attorney and that reconstructions of the incident might be required.
All that will be time consuming, Burton said. And in the end it will be the county attorney that decides if the officers involved in the shooting were justified in using deadly force.
It is difficult to determine how long such a comprehensive process would take, he said. The City of Saratoga Springs and the Saratoga Springs Police Department understand the desire on the part of the media, the family, and the public for more information about what occurred. However the City and the Police Department are unable to provide that information concerning the investigation because we are not conducting the investigation and cannot appropriately answer the questions.
In the meantime, Hunts family is devastated, reeling after the death of a man they described as eccentric but gentle, Edwards said. They are planning funeral arrangements and waiting on details of the investigation to emerge.
The family is hoping to bury Hunt on Wednesday or Thursday of this week.
The reason we had the autopsy done is for the family to get answers about what happened and why. We still dont know. At this point its difficult to suggest what the motivations were for the officers or really what happened, Edwards said. All I can say is that it seems unlikely that you brandish a sword, you jump toward the officers, lunging toward them and end up shot in the back.
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/darrien-hunt-carrying-toy-sword-shot-and-killed-utah-police
In this photo, taken, Friday, Sept. 12, 2014, shows Susan Hunt holding a photo of her family, including her son, Darrien Hunt, at her home in Saratoga Springs, Utah. Photo by Michelle Tessier/Deseret News/AP
Autopsy report shows police shot Darrien Hunt in the back, lawyer says
09/15/14 08:15 PMUPDATED 09/15/14 09:48 PM
0 save share 48
By Trymaine Lee
Darrien Nathaniel Hunt was an oddity in Saratoga Springs, a small, well-to-do city in Utah where a pair of white police officers gunned him down last week.
A young black man with a towering Afro, Hunt stood out in this overwhelmingly white city about 30 minutes south of Salt Lake City. So much so that just moments before officers killed him in a barrage of gunfire on Sept. 10, passersby pulled out their cell phones and snapped photos of the 22-year-old with the big hair, bright red shirt and toy sword slung over his shoulder.
People were taking pictures saying hey, look what I found, Randall Edwards, an attorney for Hunts family, told msnbc. Moments later Hunt was dead, struck with half a dozen bullets. The fatal shot struck him in the back, according to Edwards.
They killed my son because hes black. No white boy with a little sword would they shoot while hes running away.
SUSAN HUNT
What none of the photos taken by witnesses on Sept. 10 show is what initially sparked the gunfire or any details into the circumstances that led to Hunts death.
Police say that officers were responding to a report of a suspicious person walking around with a samurai-type sword when they confronted Hunt. They say he brandished the sword and lunged at the officers, at which point they opened fire on him.
Hunts family and their attorney are refuting those claims, saying that witnesses saw Hunt running from the officers as they fired on him, that he was shot six times from behind and that he fell and died about 100 yards from where police initially made contact with him.
Edwards, the attorney, said that an independent autopsy conducted at the behest of the family shows that the fatal shot struck Hunt at the center of his back. Five other gunshots struck him from behind, he said, including shots to his legs, shoulder, elbow and hand.
Hunts family has also been adamant that they believe his race his mother is white, his father is black played a role in the shooting. His mother, Susan Hunt, insists he was killed because hes black.
Im in Saratoga Springs, cause its a safe little community and they killed him. They killed my son because hes black, she told the Deseret News. No white boy with a little sword would they shoot while hes running away.
Edwards said the alleged weapon that Hunt was carrying at the time of his death had a blunt edge and was largely decorative something you might win at a carnival for knocking over stuffed animals.
When you look at those facts, the report from the pathologist and witness statements, it appears clear that the story that has been given out by the County Attorney that he was brandishing a sword and lunging at the officers is at least questionable, Edwards said. There were no gunshot wounds from the front, so the question then is what happened. There are only 3 people on earth, 2 people on earth now, who know what went down between those officers and Darrien and one of them is dead.
Hunts killing and the questionable circumstances surrounding his killing comes a little more than a month after the shooting death of unarmed black teen Michael Brown in Ferguson, Missouri. Witnesses in the Brown case say he was also running from an officer when that officer opened fire on him. Browns killing sparked local and national outrage with weeks of protests, some of which turned violent.
Obviously, when youre looking at any incident where you have a dead black kid and white officers youre going to say what going on? Is it a similar situation in Ferguson?
RANDALL EDWARDS, ATTORNEY FOR THE HUNT FAMILY
Obviously, when youre looking at any incident where you have a dead black kid and white officers youre going to say what going on? Is it a similar situation in Ferguson? Only in that sense, Edwards said. Saratoga Springs, Utah, is not Ferguson, Missouri. Officers here dont have a long history with confrontations with a minority population. Thats what we dont have. What we do have are a lot of questions of whats going on and why did this happen. I think that the family, the last thing they would ever want to do is cause or exacerbate race relations in Utah.
While there hasnt been any mass protests or marches in Hunts name, the story of Hunts killing has gone viral with many national news outlets picking up the story. In one seemingly small act of dissent, a page on Wikipedia for Saratoga Springs was edited say Saratoga Springs, Utah (Civilian Killers RIP Darrien Hunt).
The police have denied that Hunts race had anything to do with the incident.
Owen Jackson, a spokesman for Saratoga Springs, said the investigation has been handed over to the Utah County Attorneys Office. Per protocol, he said, the two officers involved in the shooting have been placed on paid administrative leave pending the outcome of an investigation.
Jackson said the Saratoga Springs 34-member Police Department was formed in 2007, and that there has never been a police involved shooting death in that time. Jackson said that he is unaware of any previous claims of racial profiling against the department.
About 95% of Saratoga Springs is white, according to recent Census data. It is also home to Mia Love, the citys most recent former mayor, who is likely to become the first-ever black Republican woman elected to congress. In recent years, the population of Saratoga Springs has exploded, from just over 1,000 in 2001 to 22,000 in 2010.
John Mejia, legal director of the American Civil Liberties Union of Utah, said that the group is calling for an open and transparent investigation while awaiting the conclusion of the county attorneys own probe.
I think that there needs to be sort of an openness and willingness to be as public as you can possibly be in this sort of investigation, Mejia said.
Mejia said there have been about 10 deadly police shootings across the state so far this year, including four since August. Results in just two of those cases have been publicly released, he said.
There are some deadly shootings that date back to April and this is sort of state-wide issue, he said. As lawyers we understand that these things can take a while, but I think the public does start to get uneasy when the results take so long.
Hunt was the third person shot by Utah police in just three days, according to a report by the Salt Lake Tribune.
While Hunts race and the race of the officers who fired on him stand out for a number of obvious reasons, Edwards said that with so many more questions than answers, its unclear what roll, if any, race may have played in the shooting.
When faced with the question did race play a part in this, my client will say I cant think of any other reason they would shoot my son, Edwards said. You have this young black man with a pretty big Afro walking down the street carrying what looks like some sort of weapon. Its a pretty sleepy community. What happened next? And that is where things get very interesting.
Edwards said that just moments before police shot Hunt, a woman filling her car at a Chevron gas station near the scene saw Hunt and the officers talking and snapped a photo of them. In the photo, Edwards says Hunt and the officers seem calm with their hands all by their sides.
The police arent in any defensive position, he said. And its unclear if Hunt has anything in his hands.
She says that within seconds she looked down to finish pumping her gas and he is on the run and they are shooting at him, Edwards said.
Edwards said the area where she snapped the initial photo and the area Hunts body was found is about 100 to 150 yards away. He said the family doesnt have the resources to conduct the kind of investigation that the government will be able to do. During a vigil on Sunday night, Edwards said he was handing out flyers asking for anyone with information to come forward.
We really hope the government will do its part and will do an objective, thorough investigation in which the questions we have will all be answered, Edwards said.
Chief Andrew Burton of the Saratoga Springs Police Department said in a statement Monday night that immediately after the shooting the Utah County Officer Involved Shooting Protocol Team and the Utah County Attorneys Office were notified, with the former assuming responsibility for the investigation.
Burton said the city would like the investigation to be conducted quickly, but that the integrity of an investigation is paramount to an accurate outcome, and patience and commitment are required.
The chief called the investigation extremely complicated and very in-depth, with dozens of interviews that need to be conducted, forensics to be analyzed and laboratory tests conducted. He said toxicology tests and lab results must be handed over to the county attorney and that reconstructions of the incident might be required.
All that will be time consuming, Burton said. And in the end it will be the county attorney that decides if the officers involved in the shooting were justified in using deadly force.
It is difficult to determine how long such a comprehensive process would take, he said. The City of Saratoga Springs and the Saratoga Springs Police Department understand the desire on the part of the media, the family, and the public for more information about what occurred. However the City and the Police Department are unable to provide that information concerning the investigation because we are not conducting the investigation and cannot appropriately answer the questions.
In the meantime, Hunts family is devastated, reeling after the death of a man they described as eccentric but gentle, Edwards said. They are planning funeral arrangements and waiting on details of the investigation to emerge.
The family is hoping to bury Hunt on Wednesday or Thursday of this week.
The reason we had the autopsy done is for the family to get answers about what happened and why. We still dont know. At this point its difficult to suggest what the motivations were for the officers or really what happened, Edwards said. All I can say is that it seems unlikely that you brandish a sword, you jump toward the officers, lunging toward them and end up shot in the back.
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
Wow everyone has an agenda ..Fox News reporting that the prosecutor said it was a real sword
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/09/15/darrien-hunt-shooting-prosecutor-says-utah-man-had-real-sword/
Darrien Hunt shooting: Prosecutor says Utah man had real sword
Published September 15, 2014
Associated Press
Facebook7 Twitter9
Sept. 12, 2014: Susan Hunt holds a photo of her family, including her son, Darrien Hunt, at her home in Saratoga Springs, Utah. (AP/Deseret News)
SALT LAKE CITY A young black man who was fatally shot last week by Utah police lunged at the officers with a real sword that had a 2.5-foot steel blade, prosecutors said Monday.
Reports from Darrien Hunt's family that the 22-year-old was carrying a toy sword are not accurate, said Utah County Chief Deputy Attorney Tim Taylor.
"It wasn't plastic, it wasn't wood," Taylor said. "It appears to be a real samurai sword."
The Saratoga Springs Police Department is under fire over the fatal shooting of Hunt last Wednesday. The city removed a critical social media posting that accused the news media of reporting innuendo, opinion and rumor as fact with the police chief apologizing for the remarks.
Hunt's mother has accused police of shooting her son because he is black. Police say race played no role.
An attorney for the family says an independent autopsy shows Hunt was shot six times while running away.
Taylor said investigators are talking with witnesses and gathering surveillance video from the strip mall to piece together what happened. There are at least three businesses nearby where the shooting occurred that may have surveillance cameras that captured moments of the encounter, he said.
The shooting is being reviewed by a coalition of investigators from different agencies who review officer involved shootings under the direction of Taylor's office, Jackson said. The two officers involved in the shooting are on administrative leave, per standard protocol.
The social media post Sunday, around the same time more than 100 people gathered at a candlelight vigil for Hunt, only brought more attention to the shooting. On the police department's Facebook page, they asked for the public to be patient and rejected the notion that there was a cover-up.
"Everyone should remember that the news outlets have ratings they need to gain. They don't report facts. They use innuendo, opinion and rumor and then report it as fact," the post said. "The real facts are being determined by an independent investigation, and not in a rushed or haphazard manner."
Saratoga Springs Police Chief Andrew Burton on Monday apologized for the post, asking again for patience and understanding from the public and the news media as they work their way through an extremely complicated investigation. He said in a statement that their frustration about not being able to answer questions about the incident led to the post.
Randall Edwards, an attorney for the family of Darrien Hunt, called it a foolish statement to make but said accusing the media of a bias when the facts aren't on your side is a common response.
"There are a lot of raw emotions over this very intense thing. You're going to have people who are going to make statements that later on reflection they are going to wish they hadn't made," Edwards told The Associated Press.
Edwards said an independent autopsy requested by the family shows Hunt was shot six times, all from behind, which he said demonstrates that Hunt was running away. He said Hunt died from a bullet that hit him square in the back.
Taylor declined to comment on that autopsy, saying investigators are waiting to see the results of an autopsy done by the state medical examiner.
Police say the shooting happened Wednesday morning after they were called to investigate a "suspicious" man walking near businesses while carrying a "samurai-type sword."
Saratoga Springs is home to Mia Love, who is vying to become the first black Republican woman ever elected to Congress. She served as mayor of the city of 23,000 people from 2010 to early this year.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/09/15/darrien-hunt-shooting-prosecutor-says-utah-man-had-real-sword/
Darrien Hunt shooting: Prosecutor says Utah man had real sword
Published September 15, 2014
Associated Press
Facebook7 Twitter9
Sept. 12, 2014: Susan Hunt holds a photo of her family, including her son, Darrien Hunt, at her home in Saratoga Springs, Utah. (AP/Deseret News)
SALT LAKE CITY A young black man who was fatally shot last week by Utah police lunged at the officers with a real sword that had a 2.5-foot steel blade, prosecutors said Monday.
Reports from Darrien Hunt's family that the 22-year-old was carrying a toy sword are not accurate, said Utah County Chief Deputy Attorney Tim Taylor.
"It wasn't plastic, it wasn't wood," Taylor said. "It appears to be a real samurai sword."
The Saratoga Springs Police Department is under fire over the fatal shooting of Hunt last Wednesday. The city removed a critical social media posting that accused the news media of reporting innuendo, opinion and rumor as fact with the police chief apologizing for the remarks.
Hunt's mother has accused police of shooting her son because he is black. Police say race played no role.
An attorney for the family says an independent autopsy shows Hunt was shot six times while running away.
Taylor said investigators are talking with witnesses and gathering surveillance video from the strip mall to piece together what happened. There are at least three businesses nearby where the shooting occurred that may have surveillance cameras that captured moments of the encounter, he said.
The shooting is being reviewed by a coalition of investigators from different agencies who review officer involved shootings under the direction of Taylor's office, Jackson said. The two officers involved in the shooting are on administrative leave, per standard protocol.
The social media post Sunday, around the same time more than 100 people gathered at a candlelight vigil for Hunt, only brought more attention to the shooting. On the police department's Facebook page, they asked for the public to be patient and rejected the notion that there was a cover-up.
"Everyone should remember that the news outlets have ratings they need to gain. They don't report facts. They use innuendo, opinion and rumor and then report it as fact," the post said. "The real facts are being determined by an independent investigation, and not in a rushed or haphazard manner."
Saratoga Springs Police Chief Andrew Burton on Monday apologized for the post, asking again for patience and understanding from the public and the news media as they work their way through an extremely complicated investigation. He said in a statement that their frustration about not being able to answer questions about the incident led to the post.
Randall Edwards, an attorney for the family of Darrien Hunt, called it a foolish statement to make but said accusing the media of a bias when the facts aren't on your side is a common response.
"There are a lot of raw emotions over this very intense thing. You're going to have people who are going to make statements that later on reflection they are going to wish they hadn't made," Edwards told The Associated Press.
Edwards said an independent autopsy requested by the family shows Hunt was shot six times, all from behind, which he said demonstrates that Hunt was running away. He said Hunt died from a bullet that hit him square in the back.
Taylor declined to comment on that autopsy, saying investigators are waiting to see the results of an autopsy done by the state medical examiner.
Police say the shooting happened Wednesday morning after they were called to investigate a "suspicious" man walking near businesses while carrying a "samurai-type sword."
Saratoga Springs is home to Mia Love, who is vying to become the first black Republican woman ever elected to Congress. She served as mayor of the city of 23,000 people from 2010 to early this year.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
Thanks for the updates, dude.
Hanging back on questioning the officers won't look good...
Hanging back on questioning the officers won't look good...
Schattenjäger
Gabriel Knight
So in the matter of a day.. You have police changing their story.. While the county investigator also claiming the sword was not a toy but real with a 2.5 foot blade
Angelus Errare
Banned
We need his facebook photos and school records to really assess this situation.
TheRedSnifit
Member
It was a real sword from what I can tell, but it had a rounded edge. When they say it's a "real sword" and not a "toy", they mean it's like this:
It really isn't at all relevant, since if he actually attacked the police with it you can't reasonably expect them to have been able to tell whether or not it's actually sharp.
Is there a picture of the sword in question? So it was a replica sword?It was a real sword from what I can tell, but it had a rounded edge. When they say it's a "real sword" and not a "toy", they mean it's like this:
TheRedSnifit
Member
I don't think there's a picture, but the article describes it as a "souvenir sword", which usually means "cheap-but-real replica".
So my bro-in-law is actually a cop for the city, although he's recently been promoted to detective. I asked my sister what the inside scoop was, but she said she couldn't say much because it was still under investigation. All she could tell me was that, as far as she's been told, the media's kind of made a mess of it in her opinion, and that the guy lunged at one cop, and the other cop shot him from the rear. She feels there was no fault by the cop.
Now, I love my sister, but her husband being a cop, she's very protective of cops. She wouldn't lie to me, but she also wasn't an eye-witness, so I still think it's important to see what the investigation turns up.
Now, I love my sister, but her husband being a cop, she's very protective of cops. She wouldn't lie to me, but she also wasn't an eye-witness, so I still think it's important to see what the investigation turns up.
Jmanunknown
Member
The investigation will turn up whatever the police want now. By not having the police officers interviewed yet they can use what ever evidence is already out their to change their official stories to fit their narrative and It is already happening.
Even if that was the case, they have left themselves vulnerable to all sorts of accusation of a cover up now.
Monocle
Member
I see you and I watch the same documentaries on urban tactics.
SapientWolf
Trucker Sexologist
It's starting to look like he drew steel. But why would he do that? Nothing about this makes any sense. The police and witness accounts are vague and incomplete.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
So this article popped up on my twitter feed
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2014/09/15/3567345/why-was-this-black-man-killed-by-cops-in-utah/
He may have been cosplaying Mugen from Samurai Champloo
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2014/09/15/3567345/why-was-this-black-man-killed-by-cops-in-utah/
He may have been cosplaying Mugen from Samurai Champloo
Jmanunknown
Member
This whole incident is crazy. Like the odd's of the police shooting and killing a black man in Saratoga Springs are really low since they make up 0.5 percent of the population there and
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/darrien-hunt-carrying-toy-sword-shot-and-killed-utah-police
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/darrien-hunt-carrying-toy-sword-shot-and-killed-utah-police
Being an agent provocateur should be a bannable offense. Devils advocate is a cleaner way of saying troll. And jackass.
Bullshit. They are rather different. And if you can't tell the difference it is your problem. The dude you were replying to may or may not be a troll, I don't know, but to say that a troll and devils advocate are the same is just wrong.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
Agent provocateur/troll are with malice, devil's advocate not necessarily so. There actually are some posters who do that without any ill intent, you just have to look at individual posts.
Angelus Errare
Banned
Meanwhile in another part of America, a black guy gets shot and killed at a Walmart while playing videogames with a pellet gun next to him.
I don't understand this disconnect that exists in American society. Of course swords are deadly weapons and people automatically assume that there is some sort of foul play when a person lunges in public with such an item. But at the same time you have open carry permits (also in Utah) and firearms do not have the same sort of stigma in public places.
Once again I hope some sort of video evidence is provided in court but the witnesses are painting a pretty grim picture. I understand the principle of shooting some crazy person who is running in public with an axe but you need to establish that he is an imminent danger to others. In Europe that would generally mean that he has already hurt someone, is running towards an individual with a weapon in his hand or some such. But I have to say that it is not an easy job for law enforcement to deal with these situations. I couldn't make that assessment in a split-second and preconceptions only make it harder ("Must stop sword wielding lunatic from hurting others").
Once again I hope some sort of video evidence is provided in court but the witnesses are painting a pretty grim picture. I understand the principle of shooting some crazy person who is running in public with an axe but you need to establish that he is an imminent danger to others. In Europe that would generally mean that he has already hurt someone, is running towards an individual with a weapon in his hand or some such. But I have to say that it is not an easy job for law enforcement to deal with these situations. I couldn't make that assessment in a split-second and preconceptions only make it harder ("Must stop sword wielding lunatic from hurting others").
So this article popped up on my twitter feed
http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2014/09/15/3567345/why-was-this-black-man-killed-by-cops-in-utah/
He may have been cosplaying Mugen from Samurai Champloo
That is exactly the first thing that came to my mind when I saw the pic before your assessment.
I now would be surprised if he wasn't a fan of it.
Cops
Security guards
Literally everyone whose job involves carrying and using a firearm is taught to aim center mass. To put down the threat and increase the odds of hitting target.
Hell, I had a friend trained as security for an armored car. He was taught: "Aim center mass. Put them down. Then put two more into their chest while they're on the ground, to ensure your own safety."
I kid you not.
Triggerhappytel
Member
Because this kind of shit seems to happen about once a week.
This seems awful on the surface, but I think we do need more evidence first. Suggesting the sword was blunt isn't really a defence as there's no way the officers could have known that, but shooting to kill as he fled is pretty fucking heinous.
I feel like in some ways that would make it higher, in a like "he must be up to something" kind of way.
Lel
That's just as dangerous. Remember that guy a few weeks ago who was shot while he had his hands handcuffed and they said he was reaching for a gun?
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