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I'm beginning to feel "held hostage" by Steam/Valve.

SoulUnison

Banned
They used to be one of my favorite gaming companies, and definitely my favorite in the arena of PC gaming, but over the last couple years I've started to become intensely disillusioned with them.

It feels like they don't even make games anymore, which is tough, since it already used to feel like 90% of their games were acquisitions and not original properties. Likely their biggest titles out currently are Team Fortress 2 and DOTA 2, and both are juggernauts of micropayments, cosmetic content and in-game economies. Valve doesn't even make a lot of the content that these games get, anymore - they've outsourced themselves to the Steam Community and are happy to just be the curators and cash the checks.

Steam Sales and Events used to involve playing games, exploring your back catalog, and watching fun events like ARGs unfold. Now they're sadistic and cynical Skinner Boxes where you buy more so that you can spend more and (maybe) end up with something for your time, trouble and money. And if you do get anything, there's a good chance it'll be some "currency" that only exists in the Steam ecosystem so that you're trapped in an endless cycle of trying to balance out or just cutting your losses and accepting that you have money you can't spend. The recent "Holiday Auction" event felt like it was *just* this side of online gambling.

It's like how Nintendo eShop games are generally $40 for 3DS and $60 for Wii U, but gift cards come in $35 and $50 varieties.

So if Valve's barely even a game developer at this point, then what's left? You'd think if their only duties were to be glorified shopkeepers and maintenance on the Steam Servers that they'd at least manage to do a good job of those, but Steam goes down *constantly* and randomly. It's 10:30 AM on a Saturday during a holiday break *and* one of their big sales, and I haven't been able to log into my account for the last couple hours. Forget that time I can't get on Steam is time I can't be buying anything from their sale; How about the fact that I've got 282 games on my account representing an investment of thousands of dollars, and I can't play anything that uses Steam Matchmaking on a holiday weekend - the EXACT sort of extremely predictable free time that you'd think a massive service like Steam would be able to brace itself for.

What exactly does Valve spend the ludicrous amount of money it makes off the community on, anyway?
Because it sure as hell doesn't seem to be servers, maintenance or support staff.

The Steam client itself is hilariously behind the times. A ton of its functionality is based around slapped together WebKit framework and being a glorified browser. They throw (admittedly, fantastic in concept,) features like In-Home Streaming and Broadcast at us, but it's 2014 and Steam still doesn't recognize or utilize multi-core processors. Sometimes Steam will randomly freeze and hang until my external HDD spins up, despite me having never in any way used it in conjunction with Steam or as a Steam Library. But, hey, we've got Badges and Trading Cards! Spend money on Trading Cards so you can craft Badges and raise the cosmetic Level on your profile! Isn't that better than stability as a service?

I'm really starting to think that Valve is just throwing things at the wall and hoping something sticks. We've got SteamBoxes, Steam Controller, Community Workshop, Community Market, Community Greenlight, Steam Early-Access, In-Home Streaming Beta, Broadcast Beta, the new "discovery" Storefront, the Curator System... It's just a massive list of "halfway-there" features, and who's in charge of a lot of these, anyway? Valve always gets patted on the back for its unorthodox corporate culture. Nobody really works "under" anybody else, and people just work on what they're interested in. But this approach is giving us a ton of projects that get a bit off the ground and then just sort of hover, while nobody apparently wants to work on the important nuts-and-bolts stuff, and there's nobody above them to say "Hey, this needs to get done. Like, 6 years ago."

I used to absolutely adore Valve and almost unconditionally enjoy Steam, but now the more I use it the more it feels like a sunk cost.
I don't know if I'm using Steam because it's the best, or because nobody else has bothered to be better.

The GabeN meme feels so sarcastic, now.
I used to see an industry visionary - now I see a guy that got lucky 15 years ago and has been desperately hanging on ever since.
 

Durante

Member
I'm really starting to think that Valve is just throwing things at the wall and hoping something sticks. We've got SteamBoxes, Steam Controller, Community Workshop, Community Market, Community Greenlight, Steam Early-Access, In-Home Streaming Beta, Broadcast Beta, the new "discovery" Storefront, the Curator System... It's just a massive list of "halfway-there" features, and who's in charge of a lot of these, anyway?
I don't really see your point. Most of those are fantastic, useful additions, and I'm sure that -- like many other Steam features before them -- you'll see them permeate the entire industry in time.

For example, in-home streaming is now out of beta and works great for me for a variety of devices and games. The discovery update is something that has been a long time coming, and the idea is likely to be the future of all digital storefronts. It's also a direct response to complaints about the sheer number of games releasing on Steam, which in turn was a result of people (rightfully!) complaining that it was too hard to get on the platform.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
Steam Sales and Events used to involve playing games, exploring your back catalog, and watching fun events like ARGs unfold. Now they're sadistic and cynical Skinner Boxes where you buy more so that you can spend more and (maybe) end up with something for your time, trouble and money. And if you do get anything, there's a good chance it'll be some "currency" that only exists in the Steam ecosystem so that you're trapped in an endless cycle of trying to balance out or just cutting your losses and accepting that you have money you can't spend.

Man... I just buy the games I want to play that are heavily discounted. Never really got into the meta-game aspect of the sales.

I think you're being overly cynical about all of this. Although I can totally understand your frustration of not being able to log in due to a sale on the store side of things when so many PC games are Steamworks these days.
 

ghibli99

Member
I feel more disillusioned since there's never anything I want anymore (since past sales mean I already have them), and the games I *do* want never have good deals. That's my fault, I know, but it's not like when Sony has a good flash sale. There's usually a few games in there I get really excited about. Seems these days, I'm more of a PC game collector than a player. Bundles, especially from Humble and Bundle Stars, pretty much guarantee that I'll never knock all of these out.
 
I dunno, I like Steam for its ease of use.

I buy games on it, sometimes for real cheap. The whole trading cards thing I don't even understand- every time I get one I just sell it right away. I look at it like I get a 12 cent rebate for every game I buy.

I don't play Dota and don't mess with any ARGs...the fact that Valve is a service provider as opposed to a game developer is fine with me. Sure, I'd love a Half Life 3 as much as the next guy, but honestly it doesn't bother me too much.
 
I think you're expecting too much from Steam. It's just a nice place to buy and keep a game library. Steam sales still exist too. Also, I don't get why you expect a simple Steam client to use multicores. It's not a power hog.

You're always free to buy games elsewhere.
 

Croatoan

They/Them A-10 Warthog
You take steam/valve way too seriously.

Steam is just an online gamestop with good sales a couple times a year.

Valve is a strange game developer that works on its own timetable in its own style.

All the extra garbage they do is just for shits and giggles.
 
I would like to see them release a game from one of their IPs, be it L4D, Half Life (which I haven't even played), Portal... Just something new would be nice.
 
I'm never really be involved in a lot of the Steam Community stuff and trading cards etc. but I for one really appreciate what they've done for Linux gaming. I've never been a big Windows fan, so it's been good to be able to get back into PC gaming again without the baggage. They may only be offering up a delivery system, but by opening it up to other platforms they've provided a real benefit and developers seem to have more confidence in releasing their games for other platforms because of it.
 

gngf123

Member
I try to support GoG (DRM free!) and the like when I can. Valve are generally okay with me, but there are some things that annoy me.

-Awful customer service
-Pushing region locking on their store
-Some really terrible implementations of good ideas (Greenlight anyone?)

I just wish they didn't have the control over the market that they do. They would probably try harder to fix their flaws if they had more competition.

Their push for Linux gaming though has been amazing. I've wanted something like that for years.
 

Error1355

Member
Steam Sales and Events used to involve playing games, exploring your back catalog, and watching fun events like ARGs unfold. Now they're sadistic and cynical Skinner Boxes where you buy more so that you can spend more and (maybe) end up with something for your time, trouble and money. And if you do get anything, there's a good chance it'll be some "currency" that only exists in the Steam ecosystem so that you're trapped in an endless cycle of trying to balance out or just cutting your losses and accepting that you have money you can't spend. The recent "Holiday Auction" event felt like it was *just* this side of online gambling.

I just buy video games from Steam. I have no damn clue what you're buying.
 

SoulUnison

Banned
I think trying to blame vlave/steam for spending $ on stupid stuff valve puts out


Just buy stuff u really want/need. That other junk is bs

It's more about how I often can't play "my own" games because their service is often spotty, and yet Valve is obviously sitting on piles of money from all of their sales and events that never seems to get put towards server updates, client updates or support staff.

Steam support is famously, notoriously poor, and yet, in the Holiday Auction event we just had, they got about 100 people to spend around $400 on a "Profile Theme" that will EXPIRE this time next month and be unusable, anyway.

Not to mention the hundreds, if not thousands of other people who were also trying to bid on those "Profile Themes" that didn't win and now have a *ton* of money tied up in nigh-worthless "Steam Gems."

I'm not saying I'm spending money on all the bells, whistles and fluff, I'm saying that *obviously SOMEONE is,* so why aren't they improving their platform with the ridiculous windfall they're constantly making?
 
Gabe-Newell-peers-seductively-over-his-fan-of-money-610x240.jpg
 

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
steam is better than ever. it, for the most part, completely dwarfs gaming on any other platform. i have almost 0 complaints.

the one complaint that comes to mind is that resizing the steam clint to full screen in my second monitor makes part of it stick out on the first.

that's it.
 

conman

Member
I'm really starting to think that Valve is just throwing things at the wall and hoping something sticks. We've got SteamBoxes, Steam Controller, Community Workshop, Community Market, Community Greenlight, Steam Early-Access, In-Home Streaming Beta, Broadcast Beta, the new "discovery" Storefront, the Curator System... It's just a massive list of "halfway-there" features, and who's in charge of a lot of these, anyway?
Most companies and creative-minded employees would kill for that kind of freedom. The freedom to fail is the single-most precious thing you can give your employees. I'm not sure why you think this is a bad thing. And it's great for consumers and fans since we get to see what's cooking in the test kitchen.

And as far as games go, I don't miss Valve's games. They establish templates and only release games they feel are worth their time. Again, most people would kill for that freedom. And Steam has done more to give a voice and a presence to creative developers than anything I can think of in the history of game development. Period. We don't need Valve's own games when we've got a successful venue for others to make, promote, and sell amazing games. IMO Steam is one of the best things ever to happen to games.
 

Xpliskin

Member
Half-Life 3 is getting announced at E3 2018, someone here said it.

Only 3 more years for the announcement OP.

How will you feel when you'd have ignored the platform to grace HL3's digital glory ?
Do you want to feel like an outcast ?

GabeN be blessed.
 

Dice

Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
That's why you need to buy over 100 games on GOG to feel safe.
 

-COOLIO-

The Everyman
You take steam/valve way too seriously.

Steam is just an online gamestop with good sales a couple times a year.

Valve is a strange game developer that works on its own timetable in its own style.

All the extra garbage they do is just for shits and giggles.

pretty much.
 

Error1355

Member
It's more about how I often can't play "my own" games because their service is often spotty, and yet Valve is obviously sitting on piles of money from all of their sales and events that never seems to get put towards server updates, client updates or support staff.

Steam support is famously, notoriously poor, and yet, in the Holiday Auction event we just had, they got about 100 people to spend around $400 on a "Profile Theme" that will EXPIRE this time next month and be unusable, anyway.

Not to mention the hundreds, if not thousands of other people who were also trying to bid on those "Profile Themes" that didn't win and now have a *ton* of money tied up in nigh-worthless "Steam Gems."

I'm not saying I'm spending money on all the bells, whistles and fluff, I'm saying that *obviously SOMEONE is,* so why aren't they improving their platform with the ridiculous windfall they're constantly making?

I've never had a problem launching a game from my Steam Client that I've purchased. And all that other stuff is 100% optional. If someone wanted to spend $400 on the themes, let them. I sure as hell don't, but why care about what other people are doing with their money if it doesn't affect you?
 

Durante

Member
Steam support is famously, notoriously poor, and yet, in the Holiday Auction event we just had, they got about 100 people to spend around $400 on a "Profile Theme" that will EXPIRE this time next month and be unusable, anyway.

Not to mention the hundreds, if not thousands of other people who were also trying to bid on those "Profile Themes" that didn't win and now have a *ton* of money tied up in nigh-worthless "Steam Gems."
You seem upset about how other people spend their money. To an extent I can relate, but it's (a) hardly Valve's fault and (b) equally applicable (if not more so) in many other areas rather than just games.
 

Bl@de

Member
My golden rule: If it's on GOG I'll buy it there. No third party plattform, DRM free ... nothing beats that. Wish all games would be on GOG :( But well...
 
I've had more downtime and issues on a paid service like PSN than I've had with Steam. I'll never understand the people who keep calling stuff like the Steam auctions or card stuff disgusting. It's entirely optional and in no way affects your using of Steam. Unless you're so mentally weak that you HAVE to level up a meaningless number on your profile by spending money, just ignore it.

The only thing I agree with is that the client itself is pretty outdated.
 

Phyla

Member
I somewhat agree. Still, Steam makes for a pretty good distribution platform if you can look past all the clutter.

I'm not fond of Early Acces at all, however. I really hope GOG steers clear of that with their Galaxy software.
 

SoulUnison

Banned
You seem upset about how other people spend their money. To an extent I can relate, but it's (a) hardly Valve's fault and (b) equally applicable (if not more so) in many other areas rather than just games.

I'm not upset about how other people are spending their money, if anything, I'm annoyed at how *Valve* is spending it. The client is 6 years behind the PC curve in important areas, and Steam's Customer Support is well-known to be nearly non-existent, yet they've never beefed up its numbers or invested in it. Instead we get SteamBoxes, which will bring even more people into the Steam ecosystem where the increased population will be able to enjoy... The same amount of terrible customer support and the increased load on already apparently straining servers.
 

King_Moc

Banned
I partially agree. And I certainly don;t see many peoples obsession with wanting to give Steam 30% of any game purchases they make, regardless of who made the game. Everyone always wants to buy their games through Steam. I can't get my head around it. Just buy it cheaper elsewhere and add it as a non-steam game.
 
There's only one thing I hate about Steam: Greenlight.

Other than that, it pretty much made my gaming experience on PC a fantastic one... and now, it even makes my handheld experience greats now ;)
 

Mrbob

Member
Steam Auction worked pretty well for me. Got rid of inventory clutter and received a couple games out of it. Can't fault valve for attempting new things. Though their customer service does suck.

I partially agree. And I certainly don;t see many peoples obsession with wanting to give Steam 30% of any game purchases they make, regardless of who made the game. Everyone always wants to buy their games through Steam. I can't get my head around it. Just buy it cheaper elsewhere and add it as a non-steam game.

Why would I do this when I can buy a steam key from a third party retailer for cheap? From what I understand Valve doesn't take a cut from keys sold by third parties, so what is the problem again? Your complaint makes no sense.
 

Durante

Member
Well yes, Steam customer support sucks.

That can be put into much fewer words than the meandering rant in this thread though, and without touching on (and pointing out as issues) many topics that some (well, I at least) consider great features and advancements.
 

Robot Pants

Member
I agree with a lot of what you're saying OP, especially the stuff about where the hell are all the heaps of money going that they reel in from the community.

But I feel like Source 2 is gonna change and fix a lot of the othe problems like multicore rendering and having better steam in general.
I hope anyway.
 

King_Moc

Banned
Why would I do this when I can buy a steam key from a third party retailer for cheap? Your complaint makes no sense.

You've never seen people complaining about Ubi, or EA games not being on there? People were moaning about Elite recently, too. People actually want less money to go to the devs and 30% to go to Gabe...for doing nothing.
 

Nokterian

Member
You take steam/valve way too seriously.

Steam is just an online gamestop with good sales a couple times a year.

Valve is a strange game developer that works on its own timetable in its own style.

All the extra garbage they do is just for shits and giggles.

Pretty mutch this.

Also Lord Gaben is a savior for PC gaming and i am happy with that.

Gaben_dancing.gif
 

AlexBasch

Member
The melodramatic rants like this one is why GAF is so fun to read.

Between "being held hostage" by Valve and "Microsoft is fucking PC gamers with the 360 controller and I won't tolerate it", it's just amazing.

You could just have put "Customer support sucks" and everyone would have agreed with it.
 

t0rment

Member
i just play dota 2 now. i realized that steam is pretty much the worst drm ever, it's no wonder that ms tried to do the same thing on the xbone.
 
I'll admit to thinking "jesus, they've really gone down the rabbit hole with this now" when I looked over the holiday auction. I mean I could barely even follow how it worked and felt like I needed a pair of tweezers to peel back the layers upon layers of obscured psychological manipulation.

But everyone is right that you can just, you know, buy games you like on it.
 

SoulUnison

Banned
Well yes, Steam customer support sucks.

That can be pot into much fewer words than the meandering rant in this thread though, and without touching on (and pointing out as issues) many topics that some (well, I at least) consider great features.

I'm not pointing out things like In-Home Streaming and Broadcast because they're *not* great features - they're fantastic! I'm pointing out how we get things like them when the base client is still years behind in really basic stability and support.

I *want* Broadcast. I've been *using* In-Home Streaming - but I also want Steam to stop locking up my entire machine when it gets too busy because it's never been taught that CPUs can have more than one core in 2014.
 
Steam should have better customer support and a fair refund policy, considering they sell shovelware and downright broken crap on there, but other than that I don't really have any complaints.
 

RM8

Member
To me Steam is only a store and a cool launcher where I can put even my non-Steam games. So I like it a lot :] Cheap games, convenience. I don't get involved in anything else (like cards and similar stuff that I don't even understand) and I buy elsewhere if the price is better or there's a DRM-free version.
 

Mrbob

Member
You've never seen people complaining about Ubi, or EA games not being on there? People were moaning about Elite recently, too. People actually want less money to go to the devs and 30% to go to Gabe...for doing nothing.

These are isolated instances. Vast majorty of games can be purchased for cheaper elsewhere and still receive a steam key.
 
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