TheMoon
Member
Him? No way. Never.
You could do SoT and then manually walk to the nearest statue and save to get basically the same result.
The Legend of Zelda : Majora's Mask 3D to introduce "Feather Statues" (for saves)
- Thread starter L~A
- Start date
Him? No way. Never.
You could do SoT and then manually walk to the nearest statue and save to get basically the same result.
Yes, you could, and it'd be similar, but depending how many statues are around and where they are, it's still going to be a bit different. Not that I mind, really.
We don't know the details for certain, and speculating how it might work before they explain anything is perhaps premature,
but I suppose you could emulate the original feel by restricting yourself to using the song of time, and making a save at the nearest feather afterwards.
That's actually a good point; I didn't think of that.
Orniletter
Banned
Haha, oh yeah.
Such annoyance, much obnoxious.
Edit:
Come on now, there was a single stone in the entire game that....had fluorescent paint on it changed it's size a bit. Thats hardly obnoxious.
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
For those wanting to recreate their first play through or those wanting to play the "authentic" experience.
Oh, I agree. I was only going based on what someone said above about the language when Link plays the song of time in the trailer no longer including anything about saving your game. So, it remains to be seen what the final product will have on that front.
Spieler Eins
Member
Even if it was ,,only'' two in MM again, this topic is about the fact that even more dumbing down is happening anyway. I wouldn't be surprised if the fairy is now also spelling out much more for you, especially since so many people complained that they couldn't even find the fast forward/slow down mechanics themselves during the intro.
Spieler, just out of curiosity, what's the harm in the game spoonfeeding more information to the player?
It's not gonna make the game any less difficult, which is what Nintendo said they were gonna do.
"Make it more accessible, keep the difficulty."
What's wrong with telling people: "Hey you can make the time go slower or faster, or skip half a day!" which is a very useful if somewhat hidden mechanic of the game.
TheMoon
Member
Optional hint statues != dumbing down.
Please, find some happiness in your life. Please.
If you think about it, all The Moon wants is for people to understand and attain happiness in their lives. Total annihilation is a hell of a motivator.
All they need to do is expand on the scarecrow's dialogue when you enter the astral observatory and explain the two songs a bit better. Maybe have him pop up again near woodfall after you have the ocarina.
nothing else needs to be done, really.
TheMoon
Member
You get me. Now hurry up and find bliss, everyone.
That's the thing though, you don't have to talk to the scarecrow, you can just completely ignore him and never talk to him.
Heck, the first time I played MM, I never used the Scarecrow in OoT, so I didn't even know you COULD talk to him.
Pretty much this, the scarecrow in the shop isn't noticed too much and it's very easy to just pass by the scarecrow in the first cycle. Everything a player needs to know is n the game, it's just a matter of finding it
Kind of a funny aside. My wife and I are playing through Twilight Princess. I like to do this thing where I play the fool about certain circumstances in games I'm familiar with and she isn't. I've played more 3D Zeldas than she has; she's played more 2D Zeldas and I think more Zelda games overall. She's really concerned about the Scarecrow by your treehouse in TP being important. She hasn't played OOT or MM so I'm being playfully insistent that it's just a Scarecrow. She thinks we can talk to it somehow. I've doubled down and insisted that there's no talking Scarecrows in the Zelda series and that such a thing would just be ridiculous. She points out things like Scrapper that are fantastical talking non-humans that a talking Scarecrow would be consistent with. I insist there are not any talking Scarecrows in Zelda games, because that would be just silly. When there was the sword training session with the Scarecrow, she tried to point to it as evidence of the Scarecrow's import. I continue to maintain the Scarecrow will not "magically come to life" and "start singing and dancing," and that this is not a thing in Zelda games.
She plans to play OOT 3D and MM 3D.
Tom Nook Sawyer
Member
If it's a permanent save, they just ruined the game.
terrisus
Member
Well, I guess every single VC game Nintendo has done for 3DS and WiiU have been ruined as well then...
If it's a temporary save, then it's redundant. I doubt they'd throw out the NA version changes.
TheMoon
Member
No they didn't. We don't know if there isn't an option to disable them and even if there isn't, you could just simply not use them. Stop with the silly hyperbole.
<3
I don't get it, why is it so bad? What's the difference between "saving at owl statue, playing then saving again at owl statue when done" and "making a permanent save at feather statue, play then save again at feather statue when done"?
Because people can save their game at any point in the cycle, attempt an important event (such as any in the bomber's notebook) and if they fail, they can just revert to that save. It absolutely fucks it up entirely.
Linkstrikesback
Member
You're far to hung up on this.
Why shouldn't they be allowed to put a shiekah stone inside the clock tower where you first meet the Happy mask salesman? You'll never see it again after you pass through there the two times you have to in the game (when you first enter termina and once after the first time loop).
It's not like adding the song of double time and song of inverted time to your list of songs is going to make the game any worse, or making the scarecrow perhaps wave at you when you pass him in the observatory.
Good news, you could already abuse the owl statue saves as semi-permanent in the NA/EU versions of Majoras Mask on the N64. Use it to save, copy the file to the other slot, reload. If things don't go your way, delete that file, copy again, and bam. Infinite attempts with no risk.
So you've probably never played a version that wasn't "ruined". Unless you happened to be into importing/live in Japan during the N64 age.
See my above point. You could already do this in MM64.
Twilightzoney
Member
My hope is that going back in time will still save it without having to tell us it saves it. So I can just do the SoT and turn it off. I have a feeling thats gonna happen a few times where I'll just turn it off after doing the SoT. Don't have an issue with the saves more so they are putting the perma saves there and taking away the saving from the song.
Tom Nook Sawyer
Member
Gigantic difference. One is a temporary save, the other (presumably) isn't. The game was built around the idea of there not being any redos, aside from the 3-day reset.
If there's a permanent save you can default to, it essentially removes the backbone of the game's structure.
If you use both files, it makes that impossible. It's also a much bigger PITA than a built-in feature, and something I doubt occurred to very few people (particularly with how often you'd have to copy & paste)
Ooooooh, I didn't think about that.
Okay yeah, now I get it.
Still not 100% against it, but yeah.
Ugh, your edit was too fast. I was going to make a Journal of the American Psychiatric Nurses Association (JAPNA) joke.
terrisus
Member
Linkstrikesback
Member
Ugh, your edit was too fast. I was going to make a Journal of the American Psychiatric Nurses Association (JAPNA) joke.
Lord knows I can't spell check before hitting "submit reply". It would just be wrong!
Doesn't matter. It was totally and easily doable, requiring, at most, no more than a handful more button presses than the new system will take.
Hell, given the N64 version had a built in reset when you used the owl statue, where the 3DS presumably won't and will require hitting home, quitting the game, and reloading, it's entirely possible that'll it'll be more effort/slower to "cheat" the system this time round.
If you managed to survive it being possible in the previous release, I can assure you you'll survive it being possible in this one.
Tom Nook Sawyer
Member
That is a true statement. I'm not a fan of save-states in games not originally intended for them.
Despite that, no VC game is as fundamentally built around that as idea as Majora's Mask is, where it's a central part of the game's story AND narrative. Plus, it's clearly an exploit when playing on VC--that won't be the case in a game designed with it as a feature. (assuming the interpretation of the feature is accurate)
I literally just told you how it can be effectively impossible to make use of, so yes, it does matter.
There's not only one way of making the game handheld friendly, you realize? They could have easily added the ability to make a suspend-save at any point, and then resume from there, without affecting the integrity of the game's structure.
C.Olimar788
Member
Thank god. The one thing they absolutely NEEDED to fix for this remake was the save system, and I'm very glad that they are.
Majora's Mask is a positively lovely game, but its save system was terrible. It would have been even worse on a handheld - hell, OoT's save system was rally awkward and obnoxious in OoT3D, and it was less terrible than MM's.
Majora's Mask is a positively lovely game, but its save system was terrible. It would have been even worse on a handheld - hell, OoT's save system was rally awkward and obnoxious in OoT3D, and it was less terrible than MM's.
Alcoholikaust
Member
thank god.
edit^ haha exactly
edit^ haha exactly
People keep saying this but I still don't understand how this proposed change actually makes it more handheld friendly. Outside of the Japanese version, you could already create a temp save at any owl statue and you got the Song of Soaring very early into the game.
Linkstrikesback
Member
AKA you didn't know it was possible, and you're flailing wildly to not retract your opinion. It was possible to do exactly what you're worried about with no more effort than will be required to do it in the 3DS version, yet you think the game is "ruined" while the NA/EU N64 version wasn't. You can't have it both ways my friend.
If you've come up with a better excuse than "well maybe some people couldn't do it!", feel free to share it with us. Because you know, no-one is going to hold you at gunpoint and force you to do it in MM3D either.
Tom Nook Sawyer
Member
How is that even possible when I stated both reasons in my original response? Did you not consider the fact I wouldn't consider is a possibility DUE TO THE FACT both save files weren't available?
Please don't ascribe imaginary motives to my writings--stick to the facts. It's okay if we disagree, you realize?
If it is indeed now an intrinsic part of the save-system, I consider that a gigantic step away from the ability to copy temporary quick-saves. It effectively acts as an endorsement from the developers since it goes against the concept of the original save-system--copying a save is very clearly a work-around, easily resetting to a previous Save Point as myriad others games have done is less so.
TheMoon
Member
As you can see here, it evens out since the people wearing the thickest glasses are now starting to bitch.
Your hype is hugely deflated because of an optional save system?
The owl statues are warping points.
Alcoholikaust
Member
hey that there is my phone snapI hope there's a Master Quest of sort.
EDIT: Well then...
I THINK I understand why Nintendo is changing the saving system...
but it's true: if you don't agree with the OPTIONAL CHANGE: you are a masochist. saving was a pain and you either are remembering with rose tinted glasses or never played it.
hey that there is my phone snap
but it's true: if you don't agree with the OPTIONAL CHANGE: you are a masochist. saving was a pain and you either are remembering with rose tinted glasses or never played it.
Well it's not like this change (as we know it at least) is really much different. It might save you from needing to warp with Song of Soaring but that's it.
Alcoholikaust
Member
how are saving anywhere you like with no item loss and saving at specific areas with the loss of items the same thing
?
Well It's not saving anywhere since you need the statues. Also you could create temp saves at owl statues outside of Japan if you needed to stop. Now there are just more of them.
But anyways, the items you lose by restarting the cycle are inconsequential. It's arrows, bombs, deku nuts, shit you get from chopping grass or breaking a pot. You get everything back on the way to where ever you're going very easily. Money is probably the biggest loss if you don't want to deal with the bank (which was slow) since there are some pricey items but even that becomes pointless like in all Zelda games. And it's not like you can avoid the 3-day cycle with the supposed new system. You will have to revert eventually.
I'm not arguing that the old system is immaculate but I still don't see why this new system is supposedly massively better than the old. Outside of save scumming, it's marginally better if you don't have the time to use the Song of Soaring but can run to a statue that might be in the zone.
zeldarocks
Neo Member
Am I the only one that can see the original version being billed as a "Master Quest" of sorts?