Support NeoGAF

[The_Lump]

Net result is the price is the exact same, they aren't cutting you a slight discount. The price would have been the exact same if the charger was included. You really think they were going to break the $199 price point for a $1-2 charger?

Yeah i think they probably would. It's not just the price of the charger itself remember, it's the box being smaller/lighter, which means more units per pallet, less $ to get each unit from the factory to the shelf etc.

So if I never owned a Nintendo handheld before I would have to buy a charger separately? I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this.

Breath deep, we'll get through this together.

Spoiler

 

[tengiants]

They are providing choice. Hahaha, oh wait your serious, let me laugh harder.gif



Yep, I suggested the same thing.

Laugh all you want. I'm laughing back because you don't understand what a choice is.

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

Europeans tend to have what I feel is a better sense of consumer rights than Americans. This is being viewed as a ripoff when all Nintendo is doing is providing choice. Choice is always a good thing when it comes to consumer friendliness. Why it's being spun the other way? no idea.

A choice you say?

 

[KiefbladeMaster]

So if I never owned a Nintendo handheld before I would have to buy a charger separately? I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this.

Yes, it isn't included.

 

[RMI]

So if I never owned a Nintendo handheld before I would have to buy a charger separately? I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this.

correct. how big of a deal this is seems to be the subject of an intense debate.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

Laugh all you want. I'm laughing back because you don't understand what a choice is.

Buy a new device that requires a proprietary charging cable, do not include said cable. Yep, clearly a choice.

 

[TheSlySoul]

So if I never owned a Nintendo handheld before I would have to buy a charger separately? I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this.

Yep.
Also I have choice. I will not buy a 3DS XL with no charger for $200 because it is a terrible value.

The American sense of consumer rights is that when you buy an electronic device it should come with the cord that makes it function. Whether or not the good people of Europe share our view is irrelevant to us.

Yes, for $25,000 my car should have 4 wheels, an engine, a battery, a little bit of gas, more than one seat, and a trunk. Why am I entitled to think this?

Indeed, you can choose to buy an extra cable if you need one, or not. Seems like a choice and pro consumer to me!

It isn't EXTRA if A) You trade your only cable in and B) You never had a cable to begin with.

 

[canedaddy]

Europeans tend to have what I feel is a better sense of consumer rights than Americans. This is being viewed as a ripoff when all Nintendo is doing is providing choice. Choice is always a good thing when it comes to consumer friendliness. Why it's being spun the other way? no idea.

The American sense of consumer rights is that when you buy an electronic device it should come with the cord that makes it function. Whether or not the good people of Europe share our view is irrelevant to us.

 

[tengiants]

Buy a new device that requires a proprietary charging cable, do not include said cable. Yep, clearly a choice.

Indeed, you can choose to buy an extra cable if you need one, or not. Seems like a choice and pro consumer to me!

It isn't an EXTRA cable.

It is an extra cable in my case. This is why I'm glad there is a choice. It's not like I'm not getting a bunch of cool new features with the new xl for the same price as the old one.

 

[The_Lump]

Buy a new device that requires a proprietary charging cable, do not include said cable. Yep, clearly a choice.

The choice is: if you have the charger (many, many people do) you don't have to pay the (admittedly probably small) fee it cost to produce, pack and ship that item to you as part of the package. If you don't have the charger, you can choose to by one.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

Indeed, you can choose to buy an extra cable if you need one, or not. Seems like a choice and pro consumer to me!

It isn't an EXTRA cable.

The choice is: if you have the charger (many, many people do) you don't have to pay the (admittedly probably small) fee it cost to produce, pack and ship that item to you as part of the package. If you don't have the charger, you can choose to by one.

That is why the New 3DS is cheaper without the cable, oh wait.

 

[RMI]

It isn't an EXTRA cable.

for many people it is.

 

[Night Angel]

Indeed, you can choose to buy an extra cable if you need one, or not. Seems like a choice and pro consumer to me!

Then all I can say is that your viewpoint is absolutely fucked.

I get not thinking this is a big deal, but to outright say this is pro consumer? You obviously don't know the meaning of the phrase.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

for many people it is.

You guys should start a movement trying to get Apple to stop giving earbuds/charging cables with their new phones. Think of it, they would decrease the price of the phone and you would be helping the environment.

 

[TheSlySoul]

I get not thinking this is a big deal, but to outright say this is pro consumer? You obviously don't know the meaning of the phrase.

It is totally pro consumers to start charging for things that were expected to be free.
I am going to monopolize air. Each breath is 99 cent. I am giving customers choice to breath or not to breathe.

 

[RoninChaos]

We're seriously comparing the lack of an AC adapter to domestic abuse?

Alright I'm out.

Check the edit, homie. I clarified. Some of the people I've seen defending this thing have been attacking ANYONE that's critical, calling them all kinds of crazy shit. I can't say I've seen such fervent defense of anything compared to the folks who come out for NIntnedo. It's fucking crazy.

Also, that's not what I'm doing.

No, he's comparing how you apologists defend Nintendo to domestic abuse where the battered housewife defends her abuser.

Exactly.

 

[Averon]

We're at a point where AC adapters are considered "luxuries" and not providing an AC adapter--that is required for a device to function--is seen as "consumer choice".

I can't help but laugh at the absurdity of it all. Is it any wonder DLC and pre-order BS have gotten as crazy as it has when this level of apologism is present? This industry is completely screwed.

 

[TheSlySoul]

We're at a point where AC adapters are considered "luxuries" and not providing an AC adapter--that is require for a device to function--is seen as "consumer choice".

I can't help but laugh at the absurdity of it all.

Next thing is you shouldn't expect new controllers on your next console either. You have a DS4, why would you need a new controller?

It doesn't affect me, so it's a choice!

I have Wiimote controllers, it is totally pro consumer for Nintendo to not include a new controller in the Wii Wii. I don't have to buy another one.

 

[Rolf NB]

for many people it is.

You seem to know many people. Are many people going to keep both a 3DS and N3DS?

 

[ElectricBlanketFire]

We're at a point where AC adapters are considered "luxuries" and not providing an AC adapter--that is required for a device to function--is seen as "consumer choice".

I can't help but laugh at the absurdity of it all.

It doesn't affect me, so it's a choice!

 

[KiefbladeMaster]

for many people it is.

Actually, most people I know were planning on taking advantage of the trade-in promotion at gamestop -- something that requires you to bring in your adapter as well. My friends actually plan on just keeping their XL's now, though, after hearing this.

Not everyone will have an extra charger. Just because something doesn't affect you personally doesn't mean it's the same for everyone else. Not only that, it is literally required for the system to work properly. It should be included no matter what. It's a new piece of hardware.

 

[herod]

I think it would be better to ask them why the fuck we can't just charge it with any old micro usb charger.

 

[Ninja Scooter]

The choice is: if you have the charger (many, many people do) you don't have to pay the (admittedly probably small) fee it cost to produce, pack and ship that item to you as part of the package. If you don't have the charger, you can choose to by one.

Lol you realize this shitty logic could be used to explain away and defend any crappy video game publisher tactic that people have been up in arms about over the last few years? Online passes? EA and Sony were just trying to give gamers who don't care to play online a "choice". On disc or day 1 DLC? Publishers are just giving games who don't want that stuff a choice. If you want the content, you can choose to buy it!

It's bordering on some sort of weird Stockholm syndrome with some of you.

 

[canedaddy]

Yep.
Also I have choice. I will not buy a 3DS XL with no charger for $200 because it is a terrible value.

Great choice!

Nintendo has made it clear that this product is not intended for people who don't already own a 3DS... they don't want any late adopters. Message received! I'm sure they'll do just fine with purchases from the crazies who already own five 3DS systems and this will be No. 6.

 

[The_Lump]

Yep.
Also I have choice. I will not buy a 3DS XL with no charger for $200 because it is a terrible value.

It is? So $200 for a chargerless device is worse value than, say, a $209.99 device with a charger included?

And don't think Nintendo wouldn't tack on $10 to cover the manufacture, extra packaging and extra shipping weight/cost of that extra packaging.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

I think it would be better to ask them why the fuck we can't just charge it with any old micro usb charger.

Well then they wouldn't be able to sell a $10 proprietary charger.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

It is? So $200 for a chargerless device is worse value than, say, a $209.99 device with a charger included?

And don't think Nintendo wouldn't tack on $10 to cover the manufacture, extra packaging and extra shipping weight/cost of that extra packaging.

They haven't thus far. The price of the new handheld is the same as the old. Old 3DSXL $199, with charger. New 3DSXL $199, no charger.

If Apple dropped the earbuds/charging cable, you think they would decrease the price of the new Iphone?

 

[Jazzy Network]

It is? So $200 for a chargerless device is worse value than, say, a $209.99 device with a charger included?

And don't think Nintendo wouldn't tack on $10 to cover the manufacture, extra packaging and extra shipping weight/cost of that extra packaging.

If you honestly think NoA would have charged 210 if they had a charger bundled then I have a unicorn to show you.

 

[tengiants]

If you honestly think NoA would have charged 210 if they had a charger bundled then I have a unicorn to show you.

Do you have proof that they weren't?

 

[TheSlySoul]

It is? So $200 for a chargerless device is worse value than, say, a $209.99 device with a charger included?

And don't think Nintendo wouldn't tack on $10 to cover the manufacture, extra packaging and extra shipping weight/cost of that extra packaging.

No, I am saying $200 for just a console with no charger is a worse value than giving me the option to buy either 3DS XL $200 just the system itself or $200 for the system and an externally packaged adapter.

They haven't thus far. The price of the new handheld is the same as the old. Old 3DSXL $199, with charger. New 3DSXL $199, no charger.

If Apple dropped the earbuds/charging cable, you think they would decrease the price of the new Iphone?

Yes, this is Apple pricing. The new model takes the old model's price and the old model become cheaper. Both models can play most of the same games, but the new model can only play some powerful pacific games.

 

[The_Lump]

Lol you realize this shitty logic could be used to explain away and defend any crappy video game publisher tactic that people have been up in arms about over the last few years? Online passes? EA and Sony were just trying to give gamers who don't care to play online a "choice". On disc or day 1 DLC? Publishers are just giving games who don't want that stuff a choice. If you want the content, you can choose to buy it!

It's bordering on some sort of weird Stockholm syndrome with some of you.

Yeah I fully realise that. The only time I'm against any of those things is if they've told people they are including things which they havn't.

It's been made pretty clear (hence this thread) that the charger isn't being included. No one is being mugged.

 

[RoninChaos]

Yeah I fully realise that. The only time I'm against any of those things is if they've told people they are including things which they havn't.

It's been made pretty clear (hence this thread) that the charger isn't being included. No one is being mugged.

So it's okay they're fucking people, as long as the people know they're getting fucked?

 

[Jazzy Network]

Do you have proof that they weren't?

It's called precedent. Where in the holy world of forever has any company ever tacked an extra fee for a power cable? Go ahead and google it. I'll wait.

 

[CosmicQueso]

So it's okay they're fucking people, as long as the people know they're getting fucked?

At least buy me dinner first.

 

[FX-GMC]

They lost a sale to me with this. I'll keep my 3DS XL that came with the adapter.

 

[KiefbladeMaster]

Where are people getting the idea that it'd actually raise the system price as well? They're already making a profit by using incredibly old hardware, it'd just lower the margin a little bit -- thus allowing them to keep the price exactly as is.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

Do you have proof that they weren't?

Odd how they are including a free 3DS charger for European customers, isn't it.

 

[Roo]

In a perfect world, there would be two bundles (one with and one without AC adapter.)

- You already have a 3DS and only want to upgrade? Here, a bundle with no AC adapter.
- Are you new to the 3DS experience and want to jump in? Here, a bundle with EVERYTHING you need.

Add a big ass stamp at the front of the package saying : AC ADAPTER INCLUDED
Done!

Oh well, not sure how financially viable that is but dat Nintendo Logic™

 

[TheSlySoul]

In a perfect world, there would be two bundles (one with and one without AC adapter.)

- You already have a 3DS and only want to upgrade? Here, a bundle with no AC adapter.
- Are you new to the 3DS experience and want to jump in? Here, a bundle with EVERYTHING you need.

Add a big ass stamp at the front of the package saying : AC ADAPTER INCLUDED
Done!

Oh well, not sure how financially viable that is but dat Nintendo Logic™

Perhaps to not confuse people with too many SKUs, all new 3DS packages contains a coupon that they can use to redeem a free adapter from the store.
Problem solved. It can fit right along with the AR cards. Went from $3 to a penny.

 

[Jazzy Network]

In a perfect world, there would be two bundles (one with and one without AC adapter.)

- You already have a 3DS and only want to upgrade? Here, a bundle with no AC adapter.
- Are you new to the 3DS experience and want to jump in? Here, a bundle with EVERYTHING you need.

Add a big ass stamp at the front of the package saying : AC ADAPTER INCLUDED
Done!

Oh well, not sure how financially viable that is but dat Nintendo Logic™

That doesn't really solve anything it just further complicates things.

 

[RoninChaos]

Where are people getting the idea that it'd actually raise the system price as well? They're already making a profit by using incredibly old hardware, it'd just lower the margin a little bit -- thus allowing them to keep the price exactly as is.

It's because for some reason people believe Nintendo is some altruistic company that will only do right for the consumer, and they're not. They're out for profit like everyone else. They're just not nearly as scummy about it as a company like EA.

This is a pure money making move by Nintendo. They save money by not having the adapter in the box and they make retail happy by giving them a high margin markup item to sell to consumers who don't have the AC adapters.

 

[RoninChaos]

At least buy me dinner first.

Nope. All in, no lube and no remorse.

 

[Coolio McAwesome]

So if I never owned a Nintendo handheld before I would have to buy a charger separately? I'm having trouble wrapping my head around this.

Are you REALLY unable to wrap your head around such a simple concept? Nintendo knows a lot of people buying the N3DS already have an adapter so they don't want to force them to buy something they will never use.

Most people complaining about this obviously have chosen to ignore the 3DS for the past four years, and I'm betting a lot of them had no intent of ever buying a N3DS in the first place. It's disingenuous.

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that so many people are complaining about the fact that millions of people are going to save money by virtue of the fact that they won't be required to purchase an item that they don't need.

 

[Averon]

Where are people getting the idea that it'd actually raise the system price as well? They're already making a profit by using incredibly old hardware, it'd just lower the margin a little bit -- thus allowing them to keep the price exactly as is.

Seriously. This notion that an AC adapter would raise the price of the system to $205, $210 is ridiculous.

 

[alr1ght]

It's cute that people think that consumers are saving money with this. Hilarious, but cute.

 

[Arrogant Bastard]

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that so many people are complaining about the fact that millions of people are going to save money by virtue of the fact that they won't be required to purchase an item that they don't need.

Lol, you actually think you are going to save money. Cute. Must be why they are giving European customers a free AC Adapter with the purchase.

If Apple removed the earbuds/charging cable out of the next Iphone, you think it would be cheaper?

 

[Apathy]

Are you REALLY unable to wrap your head around such a simple concept? Nintendo knows a lot of people buying the N3DS already have an adapter so they don't want to force them to buy something they will never use.

Most people complaining about this obviously have chosen to ignore the 3DS for the past four years, and I'm betting a lot of them had no intent of ever buying a N3DS in the first place. It's disingenuous.

I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around the fact that so many people are complaining about the fact that millions of people are going to save money by virtue of the fact that they won't be required to purchase an item that they don't need.

You don't seem (or want to) understand Nintendo would not change the price from $199 if the charger was included. They would just make slightly less profit from each sale. You aren't saving anything, they are making more money.

 

[herod]

I'd be interested to know how all the experts in this thread can confidently say either way whether they're gouging or not.

 

[Pathfinder]

Since we're doing nothing but going around in circles, let's try branching out the conversation a bit to see if we latch upon something new.

If sometime between now and release date, if Nintendo sees the error of their ways and offers buyers of the N3DS a coupon for a free AC adapter, would that make people feel better?

 

[TheSlySoul]

It's cute that people think that consumers are saving money with this. Hilarious, but cute.

I guess people must think iPhone 7 should be $250 minimum even though the standard price of all other versions has been $200. Maybe if they remove headphones it will be $200. YEAH!

Since we're doing nothing but going around in circles, let's try branching out the conversation a bit to see if we latch upon something new.

If sometime between now and release date, if Nintendo sees the error of their ways and offers buyers of the N3DS a coupon for a free AC adapter, would that make people feel better?

Definitely. Then the choice thing becomes a valid point.
Although the only new 3DS I can get is XL ... but that is another issue all together.