Dead or Alive 5 Ultimate |OT| The ninjas are free; the swimsuits are not.

I think its hard for DOA cause part of the fan base are indeed in for the fanbase and if they actually try to cut the fan service it would make the following divided since the change of look and to some the Itagaki fan base.

If you try to make the game more serious and remove part of the fan service some might complain and stop buying it and if they go full fanservice they will lose the ones who want to take the game more seriously. This is a struggle I feel they kinda wanted to fix with 5 but the fanservice bandwagon complaining about the lack of fanservice TK had to go full ham on the DLC to please that area of the fan base and ignoring the people giving gameplay feedback.
 
DOA5 is made for people to play it and enjoy it, whch is why they are fine with the dlc (Good profits too matter) But I don't think it was ever meant to be taken seriously as a EVO game. Moreover I don't think they give two shits about it being on the main stage or not as long as the numbers playing it are high, which it probably is.
It getting serious or what not will not help it's case because people will always have that association with it. That will never change. Unless big money is injected then people will ignore it for the hype and the money.
 
ShinMaruku said:
DOA5 is made for people to play it and enjoy it, whch is why they are fine with the dlc (Good profits too matter) But I don't think it was ever meant to be taken seriously as a EVO game. Moreover I don't think they give two shits about it being on the main stage or not as long as the numbers playing it are high, which it probably is.
It getting serious or what not will not help it's case because people will always have that association with it. That will never change. Unless big money is injected then people will ignore it for the hype and the money.
Click to expand...

I would only point at the initial marketing push and the amount of work tecmo has out into the competitive community to show that's wrong. You don't do this kind of stuff to stay small. You do it to grow a community.

And they totally want their game at EVO:

http://kotaku.com/5918673/dead-or-a...f-their-game--was-in-fighting-tournaments-but
 
Azuardo said:
Yeah, in this case, it'd just be because of the excessive amount of skin/tits.


Here ya go, lads. Rachel long hair, Momiji short hair.

B74tCFTIIAERaNt.jpg



KT Europe doing a live demo tomorrow at 4pm GMT.
https://twitter.com/koeitecmoeurope/status/557932918619009024
Click to expand...

I think Momiji will look better with that hair when she wears other outfits. That mini police hat could make any hairstyle look dumb IMO. Its nice to see TN give her something so radically different to her huge ponytail (which I never really liked).
 
ShinMaruku said:
They'd have to inject cash into Evo for it to get there. Only way DOA5 will get on Evo's radar.
Click to expand...
I think they need a bigger tournament-going playerbase, in all honesty before you can realistically talk about something like Evo. I'm not sure how you can really build that up, though -- I think it would take a concentrated effort by the developers at both the top and the bottom end, and I don't think they have the resources to do that.
 
Kumubou said:
I think they need a bigger tournament-going playerbase, in all honesty before you can realistically talk about something like Evo. I'm not sure how you can really build that up, though -- I think it would take a concentrated effort by the developers at both the top and the bottom end, and I don't think they have the resources to do that.
Click to expand...

I think they can but it's not a big thing for them with doa5, maybe after their next 3 projects finish we'll see some effort. That said, I think the scene is doing fine, could do with more maturity but it's growing at a better clip, it will last much longer than neatherealm games will.
 
ShinMaruku said:
I think they can but it's not a big thing for them with doa5, maybe after their next 3 projects finish we'll see some effort. That said, I think the scene is doing fine, could do with more maturity but it's growing at a better clip, it will last much longer than neatherealm games will.
Click to expand...

LOL

Yes, I'm sure DOA will last much longer than the games that consistently make it to EVO, have solid online play, have far far less of a social stigma (if at all), and are developed by a studio headed by an industry icon, owned by a corporation that could swallow TK whole.

MKX must be scared to death.
 
Inorigo said:
LOL

Yes, I'm sure DOA will last much longer than the games that consistently make it to EVO, have solid online play, have far far less of a social stigma (if at all), and are developed by a studio headed by an industry icon, owned by a corporation that could swallow TK whole.

MKX must be scared to death.
Click to expand...

Because MK9 Netcode was God Tier. Im ignoring the rest of the conversation but I expect MKX to do better Online. They cant fuck it up right?
 
I'm talking outside of Evo and at locals. Look how Injustice withered.
MKX does not give two fucks because they will have their next rotation. Outside of Capcom games no game will last more than 2-3 years.(Due to this mainly being a capcom market, nothing bad on the other games or Capcom games)

But hey as I said this was never gonna be at EVO. Even if the game was great, would need cash injection to outweigh some other games.

Let's be pragmatic.
 
ShinMaruku said:
I'm talking outside of Evo and at locals. Look how Injustice withered.
MKX does not give two fucks because they will have their next rotation. Outside of Capcom games no game will last more than 2-3 years.(Due to this mainly being a capcom market, nothing bad on the other games or Capcom games)

But hey as I said this was never gonna be at EVO. Even if the game was great, would need cash injection to outweigh some other games.

Let's be pragmatic.
Click to expand...

I actually fancy myself a pragmatist, but you strike me as a bit of a defeatist in this instance.

This game could've been at EVO and thats why we're having the discussion. It's not though, because they chose to prioritize selling smutty fetish costumes and adding little girls to the game when they should've stayed on the path they were when the game was new and they first introduced Mila and Rig. Hayashi should've kept his word and kept trying to improve perception of the series while the team tried to get the netcode for the game in a place where players can actually play the game comfortably online. These are the things that are going to increase the player-base and tournament attendance thereafter and they've chosen not to do them. These are not ridiculous requests on the part of anyone.

And you know, on one hand, I get it. It's easy and profitable to bleed Otaku perverts dry while releasing a decent enough product for the rest of us. I can't knock the hustle and really I don't because I'm still buying the game. I just think it's a shame; Because DOA5 is good and that's the kicker for me. All things considered, it's a well-made game mechanically, if nothing more. TN should aspire to more. The community should aspire to more. Pragmatism has nothing to do with anything. I want to see a little ambition.
 
From what has happened with VF and other 3d fighting games I saw this game having no chance in hell of getting into Evo with the usual suspects regardless of if they never went the pandering route. Personally I don't mind the silly stuff because under neath it's a great game and that is what keeps me engaged I don't give two shits that some people call it 'titty fighter' because most of them just looking for something to not try it, you tone everything down they STILL would not give it a shot, I have no time with these people, I'm not a community building person.

As for the netcode, that they could have most certainly worked on but people should not expect roll back on the ps3/360 the way the games take resources would probably be too heavy, but they could have taken a page from their earlier games, but really netcode has always been hit and miss since Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2.

The community could aspire to be more, but I just don't think they will call me a pessimist in that regard.
 
^Yeah, definitely defeatist.

And LOL at the notion you're not into the pervy stuff. Common, Shin. Make your case, but don't act like we're stupid.
 
ShinMaruku said:
It's mainly the whole "Lol it's a tittfy fighter" thing holding it back and EVO generally tneding to Monogamers (Aka: Smash and SF players) which gives doa no place to go. I had no faith it would go to EVO unless it was part of some package.
Click to expand...

DoA doesn't even have close to the numbers to be a main game at Evo.
 
Some screen grabs I got from the stream, showing some new hair styles. Not the best quality, and I couldn't get everyone's new cuts, but thought I'd share, all the same.

Kasumi's is a side ponytail, but doesn't really look anything major. Hopefully she gets one or two other new options.

vukuvH9.png
few2eZM.png
qAIPYXn.png
7ZsnIku.png
8MMmkQU.png
bB9QLPi.png
ho3BqX4.png
2fgVNwn.png
C8NstW0.png
Click to expand...
 
EVO really Should be more inclusive to all the active communities that developers continue to support. They all don't have to be main stage streamed games but they should still get more recognition. Maybe even have a cheaper venue fee if that's the only game you'll be entering. DOA, Skullgirls, Under Night, Blazblue are all games getting new content and entries in their series. EVO should still try to include them even if they can't give them stage/stream time. That way EVO can truly be a yearly celebration of the fighting game community as a whole.

/Opinion

On topic, a lot of short hair styles added. I don't see any longer hair styles for characters like Mila, Lisa, Christie. Would have been cool to see IMO.
 
There could be more styles in. I think in most cases though the actual length of the characters hair dictates the kind of styles they add. Christy's hair is short, so they added a pinned version. Rachel wears hers up, so they added a version where it's down, etc. A few of them are getting bobs, but that seems to be it.
 
Came across some interest fan thoughts that I think is relevant to our recent discussion regarding how TN/KT promotes DOA and where a lot of the focus is.

Definitely seems to be more and more people thinking this way.

He adds on to it a few posts down, but apparently TN and KT have seen and read the post. Whether or not they've taken any of that on board a few months down the line, I'm not so sure.

Worth a read.

https://www.facebook.com/deadoralivegame/posts/585953538175402
 
Inorigo said:
^Yeah, definitely defeatist.

And LOL at the notion you're not into the pervy stuff. Common, Shin. Make your case, but don't act like we're stupid.
Click to expand...


You can have faith in people, I have none until they are forced to change under dire circumstances do they come together and become something better. The situation is just getting into evo, nothing dire, there is no high level koei interaction with getting the game into a evo, game has no chance in hell. You can call that defeatist, I'm just being pragmatic.


Who said I am not into the pervy stuff. :P I just don't give two shits if people denigrate the game over that without trying the game.


They will not be showing all the hair styles until release so keep speculating on their hair. I love how they make Lisa Storm.
 
Azuardo said:
Came across some interest fan thoughts that I think is relevant to our recent discussion regarding how TN/KT promotes DOA and where a lot of the focus is.

Definitely seems to be more and more people thinking this way.

He adds on to it a few posts down, but apparently TN and KT have seen and read the post. Whether or not they've taken any of that on board a few months down the line, I'm not so sure.

Worth a read.

https://www.facebook.com/deadoralivegame/posts/585953538175402
Click to expand...

Great post. I'm glad some folks in the company have seen it, at the very least.
 
Azuardo said:
Came across some interest fan thoughts that I think is relevant to our recent discussion regarding how TN/KT promotes DOA and where a lot of the focus is.

Definitely seems to be more and more people thinking this way.

He adds on to it a few posts down, but apparently TN and KT have seen and read the post. Whether or not they've taken any of that on board a few months down the line, I'm not so sure.

Worth a read.

https://www.facebook.com/deadoralivegame/posts/585953538175402
Click to expand...

Thanks for mentioning that, I pitched in the with relevant Likes, even if by now that already got a PR reply.
 
ShinMaruku said:
I can't read that post. Fucking facebook....
Click to expand...

Here
To Team Ninja--
A serious question: is your "I'm a Fighter" slogan meant to be ironic? I've seen a translation of the interview that producer Yousuke Hayashi did with Famitsu and it was...rather embarrassing to read. That coupled with the fact that another set of what I can only describe as "fetish" bunny DLC for only female characters (not even all of them, showing repeated neglect of a few) is really starting to make me question it.

I'm glad that you all seem to be supporting the tournament scene, but it doesn't look like you're treating many of your own characters with the dignity that they perhaps deserve. Your main draw for the Tokyo Game Show appeared to be nothing but displaying how nice the females' breasts look on next-gen hardware via your "soft engine".

You claim that you want the public to view this as a serious fighting game, but I don't think you realize how detrimental coverage like what was seen at the Tokyo Game Show may be to that goal. There was even a snippet in a recent Game Informer magazine making fun of your current business practices.

It appears that you are alienating many fans of the game with your DLC practices, e.g. perhaps fans who have a male character as their favorite, in addition to many that would like to see more unique costumes and less themed, shared costumes. Do you ever plan on releasing DLC not "sexy" or "naughty" and more inline with the Casual or Legacy DLCs? Or are those simply not worth the time and cost investment?

Many people have been asking for such for a long time now, only to be repeatedly sidelined in favor of more and more "sexy" outfits and even gravure videos. Have you forgotten that your male characters exist? Do you realize how ridiculous the gap in the number of costumes between male characters and female characters has become, for instance? As long as you have the characters in the game at all, I feel like you should be treating them a little more fairly than you have been.

Not only do they not receive costumes, they are modeled more poorly, and not promoted nearly as much in advertising for the game. Various other fighting games seem to do a better job in these areas.
Does it even concern you what people think of the male characters? If not, then why are they in the game in the first place? I don't think you are giving them to chance to become more popular.

I'm trying to write this as evenhandedly as possible so it won't be taken as just an angry rant. But, I'm worried. I think that you may be in danger of losing a decent portion of fans when it may not have to be that way. I think that there are a number of things to be enjoyed about the Dead or Alive series. But, if you are only concerned with promoting and exploiting how sexy the female characters are, anything else good about the series may be obscured. I don't think the sex appeal should be outright removed. But, I don't think that everything should proceed in this exact manner.

We are coming upon the dawn of an even further version of Dead or Alive 5. I hope that you will somewhat consider the ways that you have been handling some of your affairs moving forward. I'm not even sure that I can defend or support this series in any way for much longer and I've been following the series for 16+ years now.
Sincerely,
A Fan
Click to expand...
 
Via Purifico said:
Here
Click to expand...

Just adding onto that, the guy's addendum a few days later. No reply by TN on that one, but hopefully it was read.

ADDENDUM:

A few days have passed, and I've been made to realize that perhaps I made this post more about costumes than I had originally intended, and thus obscured the main concern that I currently have. I think that the costumes are just a symptom of the problem perhaps.

I think that the way that the game is marketed currently is flawed. I'm not saying that any and all sex appeal should be stamped out. But, I think that a combination of things like gravure movies, how the photos and videos are set up on the main website, and the dearth of originality in any costumes that do come out are serving to sap any possible personality from the characters in the game in my opinion. The idea of these being iconic characters is weakening. To be blunt, I don't think you're giving the public enough to hold onto in terms of characterization that some random dating game can't provide. You should not have to clarify on a -tournament- flier that your game is not a dating simulator, joke as it was. This added to how the interview went and the pushing of the "soft engine", while I'm sure is useful tech in the long run, it makes it seem like you, Team Ninja, don't have the confidence in any other aspects of the game besides boobs. I could be completely wrong, but I think that the game has more to offer than just that.

For instance, people hardly have the opportunity to purchase anything that's not a boob mousepad, or a fetish costume, or a bikini wall scroll, when it comes to DOA5. You shouldn't be closing off merchandising to just fans of certain characters or the people that like bikinis. I think there is also money to be made elsewhere. I've seen talk (although mostly jokingly) of characters just being outright removed in the future because they are never acknowledged or promoted. DLC kind of ties directly into that, since new releases always have to be marketed. All that people are -allowed- to see is "sexy" and "naughty" things about the female characters. Are you content with that? Is nothing else about the game marketable? Is nothing else about your -characters- marketable? This goes for both your male and female characters.

In a slightly different vein, I feel like asking consumers to pay upwards of $350 (American, perhaps even worse for other territories) for all of the bells and whistles in the game, plus the cost of the actual game and any updates you release, is a little too much to ask. Games nowadays have an issue where your initial purchase never feels complete. Gamers are feeling somewhat cheated. I don't think that road ends well in the long run, though it may seem financially lucrative for the moment. Many games eventually do release a "complete edition" after some time. But, it seems we're not done yet with DOA5. And the value of the purchase seems to be getting lesser and lesser as time goes on.

I think that these are ways in which people are being alienated. But, I don't think it has to be this way while still maintaining mostly everything about the core of the games. The internet is a big place, and there's no guarantee that anyone will read this. But, I want to keep enjoying DOA5. It's just that certain grievances have built up over time and are keeping me from doing so. I'm not liking the way you're doing business, Team Ninja. I will take my business elsewhere if it -must- come down to that. I am insignificant, I know. But, I don't think that I am alone. So, I ask of you to please take what I've said into consideration (if someone reads it at all...).
Click to expand...
 
That stream chat was really horrible. Glad they put another, more stable video after that as well.
This facebook is good because it's well-written and with a lot of details unlike usually there, but I kind of disagree with the DLC part.
However, yeah, I agree on the problem with marketing/approach change of direction lately with the costumes focus. Might be because it's the end of the life of this game and they don't have any idea anymore, and they know it'll sell, but still.

They might try yet again something else for DOA6, who knows. The costume contests might have been a step in that direction.
 
The chats in streams are always awful, but yeah, it wasn't nice. PR guys have a tough time, and I really respect the work that Chin and the KT Europe team does, whilst having to put up with the amount of shit they get. Probably the best PR team I've seen in terms of interaction with their fans, which is great for a major publisher. Bit of a shame the US branch doesn't have that for their end, too.

But I think Chin's right when he says that for all the people moaning about being disappointed with DOA5 on new gen, when 5U came out, people were hammering them cause they wanted it on next gen. So they've done it. This isn't DOA6, and people should remember that. It's a port of a last gen game, with some bells and whistles. I'm not gonna bitch; I'm just happy we've got this game as the first 3D fighter on new gen, with a great F2P model to boot. TN and KT will get the feedback they need for DOA6 from this.
 
Azuardo said:
Just adding onto that, the guy's addendum a few days later. No reply by TN on that one, but hopefully it was read.
Click to expand...

His original post was fine (I feel like folks that dodntvget it/said it was all about costumes obfuscated his point), but this addendum is equally is good.

This is all the same stuff I've been saying for months.

Azuardo said:
The chats in streams are always awful, but yeah, it wasn't nice. PR guys have a tough time, and I really respect the work that Chin and the KT Europe team does, whilst having to put up with the amount of shit they get. Probably the best PR team I've seen in terms of interaction with their fans, which is great for a major publisher. Bit of a shame the US branch doesn't have that for their end, too.

But I think Chin's right when he says that for all the people moaning about being disappointed with DOA5 on new gen, when 5U came out, people were hammering them cause they wanted it on next gen. So they've done it. This isn't DOA6, and people should remember that. It's a port of a last gen game, with some bells and whistles. I'm not gonna bitch; I'm just happy we've got this game as the first 3D fighter on new gen, with a great F2P model to boot. TN and KT will get the feedback they need for DOA6 from this.
Click to expand...

We've had some of that in this very thread. They seem to be adding plenty to this release, but perspective needs to be maintained. It's an expansion, a re-release, a port to more powerful hardeare; it is not a remaster or a sequel and has never been advertised as such. We're honestly lucky to be getting any sort of graphical upgrades at all because that really is far beside the point of LR. This release opens up the game up to an even wider audience and makes it more convenient for those of us that own new consoles, but want to continue to play the game.
 
Stream chats would be better if mods were more firm from the start. Only way you will get people acting decent is when you crush enough of them.
 
Inorigo said:
We've had some of that in this very thread. They seem to be adding plenty to this release, but perspective needs to be maintained. It's an expansion, a re-release, a port to more powerful hardeare; it is not a remaster or a sequel and has never been advertised as such. We're honestly lucky to be getting any sort of graphical upgrades at all because that really is far beside the point of LR. This release opens up the game up to an even wider audience and makes it more convenient for those of us that own new consoles, but want to continue to play the game.
Click to expand...

Better netcode is all I hope for.

ShinMaruku said:
Stream chats would be better if mods were more firm from the start. Only way you will get people acting decent is when you crush enough of them.
Click to expand...

I've never seen a "popular" stream that wasn't filled with absolute shit in it (granted I turn off chat whenever I can now). Whether it is penis pictures, emotes, show me your tits. or whatever is the popular saying of the week it somehow finds a way into chat no matter how draconian the mods are.

Small streams filled with a tight nit community are your best bet for reasonable chat rooms. At this point I just avoid them all, kind of like muting everyone in multiplayer games.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Like The Witcher games? Join me in my quest to create a "readthrough" of the books GAF
4
1K
mindfreak191 replied
Counter Strike: Go to the Bomb Site
19
7K
Aintitcool replied
Hearthstone |OT10| Ultimate Infuriation
42 43 44 45 46
2K
243K
SirKicksalot replied
  • Locked
The |OT| |OT|: Index & Volunteer & Coordinate & Collaborate [Read OP!]
2 3 4
188
75K
EviLore replied
FireWall Zero Hour |OT| VR Group Sex With Optional Toys Required
22
4K
Bullet Club replied
Top Bottom