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[Darkwater]

So let me get this right.

• She tries to block him from getting to the bar while there was enough space for two
• She's possibly verbally agressive
• She raises her fist at him

And this dude seemingly keeps his cool throughout all this. Even when she raises a fist, he tries to prevent a fight from happening by grabbing it. If he wanted to escalate the situation himself, he would have raised his own fist, right? It's only when she punches and kicks the guy that he retaliates.

Women are weaker than men by design. In this case, the woman is a whole hell of a lot weaker than the man. That gets you a shitload of credit, without a doubt. But when you start punching and kicking someone all willy-nilly like that, you use up that credit very, very quickly. Yes, the guy could have walked away from the fight, but she should not be surprised in the least that that's not what happened.

Different camera angles, eyewitness accounts and all that stuff would make this much easier.

 

[Ray Wonder]

But even with all that said, he still didn't have to hit her. As a man in a non-threatening position (would that punch of hers killed him? Nope. But his could've killed her if it were just slightly more direct), he had no reason to hit her. He could've handled her without a direct physical strike, plain and simple.

If I were in his shoes I'd either of just walked away or grabbed her fist, or just get security to bounce her out.

We can talk hypothetical situations if you want, then..

He tried to walk away, he gets hit in the back of the head with a bottle/glass. Cuts an artery, he dies.

No matter how ugly it looks, he ended the situation where he was being assaulted. Effectively.

 

[jmizzal]

First of all he shouldnt have been at the bar being 19 and putting himself in that situation being he can lose it all.

But the girl started everything and had it coming acting like an idiot

You shouldnt hit girls but these females need to stop thinking every guy uses that philosophy

 

[ThisGuy]

People who raise like that are wrong for that, and people should be expected to rise above whatever society has drilled into their heads. Gender does not matter.

Either beat everyone's asses or don't beat any. If you open up a can of whup-ass, there's consequences, no matter who's ass gets a mudhole stomped in it.

Right everyone should be door mats. Walk away from everything, never stand up for yourself beyond politely, calmed statements.

I really hope you never get put in a corner because it sounds like you're going to get the worst of it if you're not willing to fight back.

And no its not wrong by the way. Some parts of society require you to stand up for yourself. And if you want that to change, it starts with ending poverty.

 

[Trey]

That emu craned neck look back thing she does while getting in his face as he tries to get to the bar counter is hilarious.

 

[AkuMifune]

No matter how ugly it looks, he ended the situation where he was being assaulted. Effectively.

He also ended his football career. Effectively.

If he was some random college dude who wouldn't mind spending the night in jail, whatever. But this kids dream and all of his hard work died with that punch.

 

[genjiZERO]

How did he escalate? Who raised a fist? Is it really impossible for you to condemn both of their actions or something? If someone is about to hit me I'd probably grab them or push them rather than throw a punch of my own. That's what he did.

I am criticising both of them. She's a horrible human being from the video. But at the end of the day his reaction was unreasonable - if you are an underage college football player at a bar you aren't going to get away with punching a dumpy drunk girl. Especially at FSU which has a problem with keeping football players in check.

Procedurally, the law does not and should not factor in power levels between adults. Just because you are 150 doesn't give you carte blanche to beat on 220 lb people because you're weaker. He shouldn't have been charged to begin with, but I'm certain a competent lawyer can get him off.

Society however does factor in power levels between adults when one of the involved is a different gender. It shouldn't either, but I understand it.

Anecdote time: There's a girl I know that tries to play badass and constantly threatens dudes like she can beat them up. Feints punches to watch them flinch, always in public too. She does that shit to me and one time hit me with all her strength in my stomach and our friends are all like "Haha Alpha you got punked, you gonna let her do that to you? Haha you're a bitch". Throw out the fact that I wrestled in high school and practiced Jiu Jitsu after that, She is 5'2 130. I'm 6'1 190. She's in workout shape sure, but I'd flex her little ass in a heartbeat if I wanted to.

But I'd expect to lose my job, be arrested, and be a pariah in my community and forever labeled a woman-beater. Some people can be little shits and have nothing to lose. If you have something to lose, just take the L and keep it pushing.

He shouldn't have hit her, Why? Because our society depicts women as inferior and if you treat them equal to a man in that situation you will lose everything. It's simply not worth it.

yes it does. That's the whole point of the eggshell plaintiff doctrine.

 

[Deleted member 47027]

Right everyone should be door mats. Walk away from everything, never stand up for yourself beyond politely, calmed statements.

I really hope you never get put in a corner because it sounds like you're going to get the worst of it if you're not willing to fight back.

And no its not wrong by the way. Some parts of society require you to stand up for yourself. And if you want that to change, it starts with ending poverty.

Don't get me wrong, I've lived a life and have been a zillion scraps in my life and handily got my ass beat plenty of times as well. Just looking back at it...yknow. I probably shouldn't have been so quick to throw hands.

 

[marrec]

I'll amend if that quiets the crowd. I meant her punch.

And IN THIS CASE he had everything to lose, and he did. He should have just walked away.

Totally agree, dude had way more to lose from the situation than she did but he made a rash decision.

Kids need to be taught stuff like that.

 

[SneakyStephan]

If she kneed him in the groin she deserved that punch.

 

[marrec]

People who raise like that are wrong for that, and people should be expected to rise above whatever society has drilled into their heads. Gender does not matter.

Either beat everyone's asses or don't beat any. If you open up a can of whup-ass, there's consequences, no matter who's ass gets a mudhole stomped in it.

People should be expected to rise about society, but it's damn hard sometimes and you can't do it 100% of the time, which is why we should try to change the society that's raising our boys this way instead of expecting our boys to be 100% above it all 100% of the time.

 

[Draft]

As Barack Obama effectively ended racism in America, Ronda Rousey puts to bed the notion that women aren't equal to men in violent confrontations. On the newly level gendered playing field, I can't find any fault in the young man's action. If it had been a boy giving him the side eye before tossing out an ineffectual but thoroughly annoying slap to the face we would all applaud this student athlete delivering a prompt and memorable lesson.

Sorry ladies, but sexual dimorphism is a shield you can no longer retreat behind when a fight doesn't go your way.

 

[Snkfanatic]

That chick is a dumpy clothes rag. But you do not hit girls. Ever. Unless they have a knife or something. They are literally as much threat as a child. Is it OK to hit children if they hit you first?

Dude was the starting quarterback on a scholarship. He has way more responsibility to not get in trouble than some random guy in a bar.

That said he's owned up to it well and I hope he gets a second chance somewhere.

Lol wow.....

Women are as strong as children everyone. Thankfully Aku was here to inform us of this.

 

[BumRush]

Jesus, why do we glorify these people as a society?

How is he being glorified?

 

[Ray Wonder]

He also ended his football career. Effectively.

If he was some college dude who wouldn't mind spending the night in jail, whatever. But this kids dream and all of his hard work died with that punch.

Why did you reply to me with this? As a "ha ha he got what was coming to him"?

Obviously he should've known better because of that, but if I was making the decision. I wouldn't be able to cut him from the team.

 

[cm osi]

never punch a girl. not because it's not right, just because you'll never win

 

[Alpha Centauri]

I am criticising both of them. She's a horrible human being from the video. But at the end of the day his reaction was unreasonable - if you are an underage college football player at a bar you aren't going to get away with punching a dumpy drunk girl. Especially at FSU which has a problem with keeping football players in check.



yes it does. That's the whole point of the eggshell plaintiff doctrine.

Isn't that civil? Let me rephrase, criminal law.

 

[AkuMifune]

Sorry ladies, but sexual dimorphism is a shield you can no longer retreat behind when a fight doesn't go your way.

I hope Anita Sarkeesian is happy with herself now, lol.

 

[MrChocolate]

I am criticising both of them. She's a horrible human being from the video. But at the end of the day his reaction was unreasonable - if you are an underage college football player at a bar you aren't going to get away with punching a dumpy drunk girl. Especially at FSU which has a problem with keeping football players in check.

Totally agree. She acted like an idiot, and he replied in the same way.
He also fucked up his career for a reaction that could have been avoided.

 

[marrec]

I hope Anita Sarkeesian is happy with herself now, lol.

YOU DID THIS ANITA!

I dunno, she'd probably say something about how violence is taught to men from an early age by society.

 

[dave is ok]

Isn't that civil? Let me rephrase, criminal law.

It exists in criminal law too.

 

[KHarvey16]

Exactly. He used as much force as was necessary to end the fight without serious damage to anyone.

Its not pretty to see a woman hit in the face but she had minor injuries in the end.

He used more force than was necessary. The outcome does not indicate he used the least force, just that he used at least enough. I think it's obvious he could have used far less.

Procedurally, the law does not and should not factor in power levels between adults. Just because you are 150 doesn't give you carte blanche to beat on 220 lb people because you're weaker. He shouldn't have been charged to begin with, but I'm certain a competent lawyer can get him off.

Society however does factor in power levels between adults when one of the involved is a different gender. It shouldn't either, but I understand it.

Anecdote time: There's a girl I know that tries to play badass and constantly threatens dudes like she can beat them up. Feints punches to watch them flinch, always in public too. She does that shit to me and one time hit me with all her strength in my stomach and our friends are all like "Haha Alpha you got punked, you gonna let her do that to you? Haha you're a bitch". Throw out the fact that I wrestled in high school and practiced Jiu Jitsu after that, She is 5'2 130. I'm 6'1 190. She's in workout shape sure, but I'd flex her little ass in a heartbeat if I wanted to.

But I'd expect to lose my job, be arrested, and be a pariah in my community and forever labeled a woman-beater. Some people can be little shits and have nothing to lose. If you have something to lose, just take the L and keep it pushing.

He shouldn't have hit her, Why? Because our society depicts women as inferior and if you treat them equal to a man in that situation you will lose everything. It's simply not worth it.

The law requires the force used to be proportional and it wasn't.

 

[Trey]

but if I was making the decision. I wouldn't be able to cut him from the team.

You would. Or you would be forced to.

 

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

Procedurally, the law does not and should not factor in power levels between adults. Just because you are 150 doesn't give you carte blanche to beat on 220 lb people because you're weaker. He shouldn't have been charged to begin with, but I'm certain a competent lawyer can get him off.

Society however does factor in power levels between adults when one of the involved is a different gender. It shouldn't either, but I understand it.

Anecdote time: There's a girl I know that tries to play badass and constantly threatens dudes like she can beat them up. Feints punches to watch them flinch, always in public too. She does that shit to me and one time hit me with all her strength in my stomach and our friends are all like "Haha Alpha you got punked, you gonna let her do that to you? Haha you're a bitch". Throw out the fact that I wrestled in high school and practiced Jiu Jitsu after that, She is 5'2 130. I'm 6'1 190. She's in workout shape sure, but I'd flex her little ass in a heartbeat if I wanted to.

But I'd expect to lose my job, be arrested, and be a pariah in my community and forever labeled a woman-beater. Some people can be little shits and have nothing to lose. If you have something to lose, just take the L and keep it pushing.

He shouldn't have hit her, Why? Because our society depicts women as inferior and if you treat them equal to a man in that situation you will lose everything. It's simply not worth it.

Yep. Like I said, I don't judge him one bit for hitting her. It was clearly in self defense because she was obviously the aggressor. That being said, because society just naturally depicts women as fragile creatures who should never be touched regardless of what they do, it's just not worth it if you're the guy in the situation. I hope this guy gets off easier and that the women gets in trouble as well.

 

[Alpha Centauri]

It exists in criminal law too.

Eh ok. modifying my post, took the law part out of it.

 

[anotherVegan]

Criminoles.

 

[marrec]

You would. Or you would be forced to.

Ya, don't have much choice unfortunately. Luckily for FSU it's not like they're wanting for fresh recruits... unluckily for this guy this video will follow him forever.

 

[Ray Wonder]

You would. Or you would be forced to.

Yeah, I gave it a few seconds more thought. You're right. There would be pressure from every which angle. Including because he was underage drinking.

 

[AkuMifune]

Why did you reply to me with this? As a "ha ha he got what was coming to him"?

Obviously he should've known better because of that, but if I was making the decision. I wouldn't be able to cut him from the team.

No, I honestly feel bad for the kid, I hope he gets a second chance.

 

[Tom Nook]

Bye Bye to any chance for NFL career.

 

[suberzat]

You're bigger and stronger and she's clearly not a threat--no weapons, bottles, etc.

Don't hit back. Dude cost himself millions of dollars most likely.

There that to her
https://youtu.be/yXvIjk8YJtI

 

[Deleted member 47027]

YOU DID THIS ANITA!

I dunno, she'd probably say something about how violence is taught to men from an early age by society.

It totally is, too. Sucks.

I was taught that. I know better now but the damage has been done.

I do see a lot of people here wanting to beat women though, and that's really gross.

 

[Lynn616]

I wonder at what point his right arm grabbed her left. Was it before or after she raised her fist.

 

[BronzeWolf]

All this "She is a woman, so she can't do damage" thing is nonsense. According to some posters, us guys are immediately equipped with this:

I am NOT saying that dudes assaulting or doing battery to girls is ok. But when a guy is being assaulted or victim of battery, you can't expect to know the POWER LEVEL(tm) of your opponent.

 

[entremet]

There that to her
https://youtu.be/yXvIjk8YJtI

We're comparing a random, drunk college chick to a pro fighter with decades of training now?

C'mon.

 

[EnVy_CaLiBeR]

I wonder at what point his right arm grabbed her left. Was it before or after she raised her fist.

Watch the video. It was after.

 

[BronzeWolf]

We're comparing a random, drunk college chick to a pro fighter with decades of training now?

C'mon.

You are missing his point. Would you be able to tell them appart at first glance?

 

[Lynn616]

Watch the video. It was after.

Cant see that. It is off the bottom of screen.

 

[Alpha Centauri]

All this "She is a woman, so she can't do damage" thing is nonsense. According to some posters, us guys are immediately equipped with this:

I am NOT saying that dudes assaulting or doing battery to girls is ok. But when a guy is being assaulted or victim of battery, you can't expect to know the POWER LEVEL(tm) of your opponent.

You don't need to know the power level, you just need to be able to notice the gender. Them's the breaks. Like I said though in my post above, this isn't the way things should be, but we all have to be conscious of how they actually are.

 

[THRILLH0]

People really need to stop with the sarcastic "precious butterfly" crap. You do know there's a proven scientific principle which states that male humans are generally stronger than females right?

Can an individual female be stronger than an individual male? Of course. But when people say that a man shouldn't hit a woman in principle, there's a tangible basis for it.

 

[entremet]

Would you be able to tell them appart at first glance?

Even so, pro fighting has rules. It's not slugfest. Also there is reason for stuff like weight classes.

The QB here had a good foot on the girl. And probably 80 pounds on her too.

 

[marrec]

People really need to stop with the sarcastic "precious butterfly" crap. You do know there's a proven scientific principle which states that male humans are generally stronger than females right?

Can an individual female be stronger than an individual male? Of course. But when people say that a man shouldn't hit a woman in principle, there's a tangible basis for it.

Ya, and some dudes are stronger than me, what's your point?

 

[rambis]

He used more force than was necessary. The outcome does not indicate he used the least force, just that he used at least enough. I think it's obvious he could have used far less.



The law requires the force used to be proportional and it wasn't.

What law?

 

[gai_shain]

We're comparing a random, drunk college chick to a pro fighter with decades of training now?

C'mon.

people are also comparing women to kids and to elderly people so I guess every comparison works here

 

[BronzeWolf]

You don't need to know the power level, you just need to be able to notice the gender. Them's the breaks. Like I said though in my post above, this isn't the way things should be, but we all have to be conscious of how they actually are.

People really need to stop with the sarcastic "precious butterfly" crap. You do know there's a proven scientific principle which states that male humans are generally stronger than females right?

Can an individual female be stronger than an individual male? Of course. But when people say that a man shouldn't hit a woman in principle, there's a tangible basis for it.

There are many different ways on which a woman can do serious damage to a man. And none of them involve physical strength. If you are being assaulted, would you be able to know the difference?

Even so, pro fighting has rules. It's not slugfest. Also there is reason for stuff like weight classes.

The QB here had a good foot on the girl. And probably 80 pounds on her too.

The goalposts. They are moving. I asked if you would be able to notice the difference at first glance.

 

[Ray Wonder]

Even so, pro fighting has rules. It's not slugfest. Also there is reason for stuff like weight classes.

Pro fighters in a bar don't have rules.

You're still missing the point.

The point is, you don't know what someone is capable of just by looking at them.

 

[THRILLH0]

Ya, and some dudes are stronger than me, what's your point?

That there's a reason that "men shouldn't hit women" is a thing beyond the accusation of misogyny that some people are throwing out there. I think I made that pretty clear.

 

[suberzat]

We're comparing a random, drunk college chick to a pro fighter with decades of training now?

C'mon.

C'mon dude how we know

Just cause some know who Ronda doesnt mean o I can hold this chick down. Some females can really ko dudes.

Cant be so submissive

 

[suberzat]

You are missing his point. Would you be able to tell them appart at first glance?

Thank you dude

 

[Dude Abides]

You're bigger and stronger and she's clearly not a threat--no weapons, bottles, etc.

Don't hit back. Dude cost himself millions of dollars most likely.

FSU doesn't pay their players that well.