Support NeoGAF

[Bracewell]

I feel like the problems (aside from the overheated hyperbole I mentioned earlier) crop up the most when people take the criticisms of the film, and remove them from the context of the film, and instead place them in the context of completely separate films/universes.

Basically - the instant someone kicks open the door to make this a "But Marvel didn't do it that way" comparison, things go to shit. Because then it's not so much a criticism of the movie, but a criticism of the mechanisms that go into the corporate strategy behind the making of the cinematic universes, and from there it's a quick hop, skip, and jump over to WWE-style marking out at all costs, foam-fingers and pennants flying.

I don't think discussions like these need necessarily preclude any comparisons between the two, they're both trying to do the same thing. One's just further ahead than the other.

The fanboy mentality isn't very productive though, you are correct.

I'm mostly indifferent on the movie (6-7 out of 10) at most, but I do like DC and I think some comments take it to far. Wasn't calling you out bud. I don't really care about brand mentalities either. But i'm sure if you want into an Ant-Man thread and started talking about Edgar Wright you'd also get some interesting replies lol (in good fun).

S'all good, friend. The stuff with Edgar Wright was a shame though.

Ultron was a cookie cutter mother fucker, just like the rest of those safe moist dudes.

The Drones were cookie cutter. Ultron wasn't.

No, see that was an intentional choice by the writers. The drones actually were cookies, that's why the Avengers were able to take so many out so quickly.

It'll all be explained in Civil War.

 

[Ezduo]

The action scenes in this will be glorious. God bless you Zach Snyder.

 

[Bob White]

Is there a handy gif to show how I'm wrong for not liking how they made Superman even MORE of a special messiah snowflake by having him be the first natural born baby on the planet in years?

 

[Sibersk Esto]

Why did they make a Batman VS Superman movie before introducing the new Batman with a Batman movie ?

Like an alcoholic refusing to go out with their friends, WB is taking steps to insure they don't just make Batman films until the end of time.

 

[Bob White]

Why did they make a Batman VS Superman movie before introducing the new Batman with a Batman movie ?

Because MoS was a lackluster movie that didn't set the world on fire like Avengers. So WB was like "Fuck it, put Batman in the next one. Do it now!"

 

[KalBalboa]

Why did they make a Batman VS Superman movie before introducing the new Batman with a Batman movie ?

Because we just had a trilogy of Batman films and absolutely nobody needs another film dedicated to introducing the character so soon.

 

[Poodlestrike]

The more I think about it, the more I like the

Spoiler

Lex turn Zod's corpse into Doomsday

rumor. He's strong enough to merit a big, 3rd act blowout, but his removal afterwards doesn't hurt anything going forward because, let's be real, he's not that interesting. And the actually interesting villain doesn't just get to fight another day, but may skate with total impunity! Other than the heroes becoming fully aware of their machinations, of course. So long as they can successfully sell

Spoiler

Doomsday

leading up to that third act, there's the potential to both introduce and keep a very strong villain around without underselling the heroes.

Is there a handy gif to show how I'm wrong for not liking how they made Superman even MORE of a special messiah snowflake by having him be the first natural born baby on the planet in years?

That's been a thing before. IIRC it factored into the Byrne relaunch, which is where most of the modern canon regarding Krypton started.

Why did they make a Batman VS Superman movie before introducing the new Batman with a Batman movie ?

Because everybody on the face of the planet knows exactly who Batman is, where he come from, and why he does what he does. He is a character that requires no introduction.

 

[killu4what]

Except we see none of this when he actually fights. We get no moments of pause or reluctance or Clark being unsure of how to use any of his abilities. Clark goes from learning to fly to mastering flight in an afternoon and never once displays inexperience when actually fighting. So no, the "first day" argument does not hold up in the movie itself as a central theme. It's ancillary at best and there's no basis for arguing it's central to Clark's motivations.

Spoiler

iirc faura specifically comments that superman is weak when they are fighting. And she was surprised by it

 

[Sibersk Esto]

Because we just had a trilogy of Batman films and absolutely nobody needs another film dedicated to introducing the character so soon.

And yet here we are

 

[ReiGun]

People who say that the destruction was unnecessary should take solace that they are on batman's side

But it also means you're on Lex Luthor's side.

[quote="Messypandas, post: 171705902"]And according to this, he still managed to save a bunch of peeps ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[img]http://i.imgur.com/h3LqqFz.gif
[/QUOTE][/IMG]

This gif's existence is proof that maybe it's time to let this discussion die.

 

[Poodlestrike]

Spoiler

iirc faura specifically comments that superman is weak when they are fighting. And she was surprised by it

"Where did you train? On a FARM?!?"

 

[LegendofDragoonLives]

And yet here we are

They might go with Red Hood storyline, and that's nothing but greatness. Please let Jensen Ackles be Red Hood. Do it DC, do it.

 

[Gonzalez]

"Where did you train? On a FARM?!?"

That was such a great line read.

 

[Messypandas]

"Where did you train? On a FARM?!?"

Where did you farm? ON A TRAIN!?

 

[Sibersk Esto]

"Yes Zod, here on Earth farms are elite combat training facilities"

"Oh shit I'm getting out of here man I give up"

THE END

 

[GentlemanCrow]

That's pretty cool.

This kind of detail is delighting me.

 

[javac]

"Where did you train? On a FARM?!?"

Well, I'm sorry. I'm not Clark Kent.

 

[unholyrevenger72]

They might go with Red Hood storyline, and that's nothing but greatness. Please let Jensen Ackles be Red Hood. Do it DC, do it.

Jensen turned down Captain America to keep working on Supernatural. WB is going to have to kill Supernatural before the can lure Jensen on onto the big screen.

 

[Poodlestrike]

Jensen turned down Captain America to keep working on Supernatural. WB is going to have to kill Supernatural before the can lure Jensen on onto the big screen.

Goddamn, did he really?

Well... I mean, WB owns both properties, I'm sure there's some scheduling shenanigans they could do to clear his schedule.

 

[Norml]

Why must they show us for hundredth time how batman came to be?

 

[GringoSuave89]

Why must they show us for hundredth time how batman came to be?

Dat glorious IMAX bruh

 

[marrec]

They might go with Red Hood storyline, and that's nothing but greatness. Please let Jensen Ackles be Red Hood. Do it DC, do it.

Dude sure knows how to look like an angry, conflicted, baby man.

I mean that in the best way possible.

 

[Mr. Poolman]

Because MoS was a lackluster movie that didn't set the world on fire like Avengers. So WB was like "Fuck it, put Batman in the next one. Do it now!"

This is the correct answer.

 

[Bobby Roberts]

WB was like "Fuck it, put Batman in the next one. Do it now!"

It was actually Snyder's idea.

 

[EdibleKnife]

They might go with Red Hood storyline, and that's nothing but greatness. Please let Jensen Ackles be Red Hood. Do it DC, do it.

Isn't that cutting it a bit close age wise? Affleck is like 5 years his senior. Maybe I'm just underestimating how young Ackles can play

 

[Bleepey]

MoS scene synched with trailer scene

That's a nice bit of attention to detail. I am almost starting to believe the Carnage and Superman doing very little was intentional.

 

[V-Faction]

So.

The trailer is pretty damn cool. Up to this point, I've been ignoring Batman vs. Superman stuff because I'm not into the DC side of things. I was not into having a new universe Batman after the Nolan films (which I like). I like Superman traditionally, but shied away from the movies. I really wasn't digging the concept in the slightest.

Then, I watched Man of Steel, promptly after viewing the SDCC trailer and, wow, I really enjoyed it. Having never seen it before because, again, just another Superman movie with yet another universe, I was really into it. The cast won me over, the effects were really astounding, and it felt believable. And now, because I dug the 'world' so much, I hope hope hope they stick with this version. Turn it into a DC Cinematic Universe (which they blatantly are with BvS). No more rewrites, or reimaginings. If we gotta stick with Bat-fleck, so be it.

 

[Cooter]

The action scenes in this will be glorious. God bless you Zach Snyder.

This trailer alone has already showed me more ass kicking Batman scenes than all of the trilogies.

____

Watched the trailer some more today and my god there is so much going on and I love it! This will be a movie I see at least 5 times in the theater. Yeah baby!

 

[unholyrevenger72]

Goddamn, did he really?

Well... I mean, WB owns both properties, I'm sure there's some scheduling shenanigans they could do to clear his schedule.

Spread the word if you want Ackles in something other than Supernatural, stop watching Supernatural

 

[Game4life]

Pool Scene we know was cut to the bare minimum. It doesn't change the fact that it's a low point in the movie. We know there is more on the cutting room floor.

Ultron is not cookie cutter.

I dont care what the unedited version has. I can only judge the final product and that scene was embarassing. Ultron is also one of the worst villains I can recall. Then again Marvel does not know how to make a decent villain it seems like.

 

[marrec]

Spread the word if you want Ackles in something other than Supernatural, stop watching Supernatural

I did like, 5 years ago but it doesn't matter... nothing we can do will stop that show.

 

[Spinluck]

I've never seen GAF defend a bad movie more than MoS.

 

[TheKaeptain]

I did like, 5 years ago but it doesn't matter... nothing we can do will stop that show.

Must take away the remote from our women.

 

[unholyrevenger72]

I've never seen GAF attack a decent movie more than MoS.

fixed

 

[Bobby Roberts]

I've never seen GAF defend a bad movie more than MoS.

I dunno, people seem to react really badly when you tell them Transformers: The Movie (1986) is a giant piece of shit.

They also seem to think Rocky IV is the best of the Rocky films.

 

[Gonzalez]

Pool Scene we know was cut to the bare minimum. It doesn't change the fact that it's a low point in the movie. We know there is more on the cutting room floor.

Ultron is not cookie cutter.

Are will still trying to defend AoU?

It was another Thor 2. A forgettable boring cookie cutter piece of shit.

 

[Sibersk Esto]

I dunno, people seem to react really badly when you tell them Transformers: The Movie (1986) is a giant piece of shit.

They also seem to think Rocky IV is the best of the Rocky films.

C'mon no one actually believes that one

 

[marrec]

Are will still trying to defend AoU?

It was another Thor 2. A forgettable boring cookie cutter piece of shit.

Eh, it's better than the first Avengers but doesn't get to skate by on the novelty of that first one or the charisma of its bad guy.

Its major flaw is that half of it just seems like they're trying to shove as much set up for Phase 3 in there as possible, really disjointed and out of place. The parts of the movie that are actually about Ultron and the Avengers are good dumb fun with the same great dialog and character interactions you expect from Whedon.

It's not nearly as bad as Thor 2.

Man of Steel is bad though and in a lot of ways, not to mention the complete apathy it feels toward the source material.

 

[Kuroyume]

I've never seen GAF defend a bad movie more than MoS.

It's not a bad movie. Not sure why people like you feel the need to convince people that it's bad though.

 

[Mighty Chin]

I dont care what the unedited version has. I can only judge the final product and that scene was embarassing. Ultron is also one of the worst villains I can recall. Then again Marvel does not know how to make a decent villain it seems like.

I acknowledged the first part. Just stated that we know that scene was cut to hell much to Whedon's dismay.

Ultron is great though.

 

[Mighty Chin]

Are will still trying to defend AoU?

It was another Thor 2. A forgettable boring cookie cutter piece of shit.

It doesn't need defending. It's a great superhero movie.

Your opinions are forgettable though.

 

[STILLethal]

MoS was the DBZ of movies sogood.gif

 

[TheKaeptain]

C'mon no one actually believes that one

Things some gaffers believe:

Star Wars isn't relevant anymore.
Marvel is the only company making good comics.
DC is the only company making good comics.
Rocky IV is the best one.
Superman 3 is a good movie.

 

[flaxknuckles]

Man I just rewatched the Man of Steel fight scenes and almost made out with my monitor. That is the stuff that makes me reluctant to watch other superhero movies because they never match up. Who cares if the story is good when the action and cinematography is so flat? It's a superhero movie! Even if BvS's story sucks it will be worth it just to see everyone wreck shit.

 

[Bracewell]

Eh, it's better than the first Avengers but doesn't get to skate by on the novelty of that first one or the charisma of its bad guy.

Its major flaw is that half of it just seems like they're trying to shove as much set up for Phase 3 in there as possible, really disjointed and out of place. The parts of the movie that are actually about Ultron and the Avengers are good dumb fun with the same great dialog and character interactions you expect from Whedon.

It's not nearly as bad as Thor 2.

Man of Steel is bad though and in a lot of ways, not to mention the complete apathy it feels toward the source material.

After Iron Man 2, Thor 2 was inexcusable. I can't think of anything of value I got out of those two movies. Ultron definitely wasn't that bad, it's issues were more on the editing and pacing side.

Edit: The apathy was a by-product of DC's directives for the reboot, and perhaps further aggravated by Goyer's contempt for the source material.

I acknowledged the first part. Just stated that we know that scene was cut to hell much to Whedon's dismay.

Ultron is great though.

I loved Ultron, and it looks like Luthor might be developed in a similar way. Both those characters deserve to be in good movies.

 

[marrec]

MoS was the DBZ of movies sogood.gif

This isn't exactly a ringing endorsement.

 

[unholyrevenger72]

MoS was the DBZ of movies sogood.gif

With the recent revelation Supes can emit Heat rays from all of his cells via the Nova Flare, i'm still waiting for him to learn to just shoot heat rays from his hands in a Kamehameha motion.

 

[Battersea Power Station]

Man I just rewatched the Man of Steel fight scenes and almost made out with my monitor. That is the stuff that makes me reluctant to watch other superhero movies because they never match up. Who cares if the story is good when the action and cinematography is so flat? It's a superhero movie! Even if BvS's story sucks it will be worth it just to see everyone wreck shit.

 

[Strangelove77]

Man I just rewatched the Man of Steel fight scenes and almost made out with my monitor. That is the stuff that makes me reluctant to watch other superhero movies because they never match up. Who cares if the story is good when the action and cinematography is so flat? It's a superhero movie! Even if BvS's story sucks it will be worth it just to see everyone wreck shit.

 

[SlowRevolution]

Jeffrey Dean Morgan!

Tired-of-your-shit Alfred!

Any word on whether or not Leto is getting a cameo in this?