Fighting Games Weekly | July 13-19 | Stream Monster Yearly: Evolution 2015

OceanBlue said:
Lol yeah I'm just saying that, when I read Juicebox's and Anne's posts, I think of Snake Eyes vs Bonchan or Arturo vs Infiltration and I can kinda see where they're coming from. It's fun to watch them beat bad matchups, but I can't imagine it being fun as a competitor.
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winning bad matchups is insanely satisfying too though
it works both ways as long as the character doesn't actually suck ass which i think is the actual issue there over homogenization of designs or whatnot
 
Seyavesh said:
i don't really have a problem with either, it's just that i view marvel as a game that brings the greatest 'how do we design this character' senses out there by nature of the limitations on a character's mechanics

assists and other team mechanics are there to balance out the lack of tools so it's inherently built into the system to have potential universal design, meaning that the point characters can be allowed to have more limitations in strict design departments otherwise
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This is actually what I enjoy about Marvel but more so Marvel 2 where the game doesn't end up being all one touch kills. While OTKs technically make neutral more important, it ultimately makes it impossible to create certain strategies through team composition because it's too risky to, IMO. Team synergy in combos supersedes team synergy in play.

Or I could be tired and writing incoherent thoughts lol.
 
Lostconfused said:
Then why use Snake Eyez as an example? Unless I misunderstood all the mentions of him in this thread and he is just another average player.
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It makes sense when you see him play against other Americans. Obviously you can't use the same example when he plays against actual good players.

Seyavesh said:
winning bad matchups is insanely satisfying too though
it works both ways as long as the character doesn't actually suck ass which i think is the actual issue there over homogenization of designs or whatnot
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This is also true. The other easy thing you could do is make sf4 a 3v3 format. That would force a lot of people to approach things differently. In kof you are not always necessarily going for a straight win.
 
Shouta said:
This is actually what I enjoy about Marvel but more so Marvel 2 where the game doesn't end up being all one touch kills. While OTKs technically make neutral more important, it ultimately makes it impossible to create certain strategies through team composition because it's too risky to, IMO. Team synergy in combos supersedes team synergy in play.

Or I could be tired and writing incoherent thoughts lol.
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nah, the idea is sound in terms of one touch kills removing finesse that allows for more variant gameplans but the reality in regards to team composition is actually dumber than that- team synergy in neutral/in play is infinitely more important than team synergy in combos at a competitive level but only because the absolute most ideal teams and characters are all insanely stupid when it comes their ability to generate damage or wildly positive situations, either by nature of their own combos or TAC infinites.
 
Dahbomb can probably present a counter argument to the marvel thing though, since he did previously by going over things like Hagar vs Magneto or X Factor as a come back mechanic when you are down to 1 character versus 3.

I don't know, I actually don't play Marvel but to me it doesn't sound fun that once you are down a character that leads to just a negative feedback of you are losing and now you are at an even greater disadvantage.
 
I gots to get mine

Dahbomb said:
1) How many US players will be in the top 8 of Persona 4, Tekken 7 and GGXrd combined? 4
2) How many US players will be in the top 8 of USF4? 1
3) How many “gods” will be in the top 8 of UMVC3 (gods are Justin Wong, FChamp, ChrisG)? 2
4) How many players will cry on stage (whether tears of joys or tears of sadness)? 1
5) Will Ono appear in a cosplay? If so then which character? (getting the 2nd question right will award you bonus points)? Yes / Ken
6) How many different characters will we see in the top 8 of USF4 (counter picks included)? 9
7) How many different characters will we see in the top 8 of UMVC3 (counter picks included)? 14
8) How many different characters will we see in the top 8 of both the Smash games combined (counter picks included)? [Same characters from the two different games count as different characters so if there's a Fox in a Smash 4 top 8 and a Fox in Melee top 8, that counts as two separate characters as they are different games] See this post for a better explanation. 12
9) How many fatalities will we see in the top 8 of MKX? 9
10) Will Tekken x SF be at EVO? If yes then name two characters that they will unveil at the event (getting the 2nd question right will award you bonus points). No
11) Which game will have the highest stream numbers at EVO in a top 8? Bonus question: Which game will have the lowest stream numbers in a top 8? (cannot specify same game for both in order to increase your changes to get at least one right) Highest: USF4 Lowest: Persona
12) How many players will appear in more than one top 8 at EVO? 1
13) How many grand final bracket resets will there be at EVO? 3
14) Will there be more Season 1 or Season 2 characters in Killer Instinct top 8? Bonus question: By how much? Season 1 by a difference of 2
15) How many different countries will be represented in the top 8 of USF4? 4
16) Which game will have the longest top 8 runtime? Bonus question: Which game will have the shortest run time in top 8? (Cannot specify same game for both in order to increase your chances to get at least one right) Longest: Melee Shortest: MKX
17) Will any player make a repeat win at this year’s EVO from last year? No
18) Will there be a brand new fighting game announcement at EVO? Bonus question: If so then what will it be? No
19) At what time will EVO finish at (rounded to the nearest hour) on the final day? 10pm EDT
20) FINAL QUESTION: Who will win EVO for each individual game? {USFIV - Mago}{UMvC3 - Filipino Champ}{Melee - Armada}{MKX - MIT}{Xrd - Ogawa}{Smash 4 - Zero}{KI - Mygod}{Tekken 7 - Saint}{P4AU - Tahichi}
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Anne said:
Blazblue is more towards the character side of things, but it has enough built in to make it work now so I play it. The main reason I don't like Xrd is cause it's looking to be more on the character side of thigns cause character options are so fucking strong and universal options are really weak.
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How is Xrd more character based than BB? I always thought that BB was extremely character based.
 
Onemic said:
How is Xrd more character based than BB? I always thought that BB was extremely character based.
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BB has system mechanics that dilute power levels of characters a bit better, it's still very character based.

The drive set up alone lets the characters be more unique while letting the devs keep power levels in check *sorta*
 
Onemic said:
How is Xrd more character based than BB? I always thought that BB was extremely character based.
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Things like BB ukemi and the various universal means to do things make it work out better when power levels are kept in check. It's by no means towards universal design as a whole, but when the characters are of similar levels it's not close to how SF4 is. If there were a sliding scale SF4 would sit on the far end of that character based design. BB would sit on the same side as SF4 but not as far.

In Xrd offensive options are absurdly strong and character specific, and the ways to deal with them are specific or nonexistent. There's a lot of "you need to play this MU situation out this way or incur really bad risk/reward to deal".You tend to see character MUs more than player MUs. It's really noticeable with low tier, watch FAB just outright lose to weaker players cause they have a good MU over Pot. It'd be closer to SF4 on that sliding scale.

Doesn't make Xrd a bad game the same way it doesn't make SF4 or MvC3 a bad game, that's just kind of how it is. A lot of people find that to be really fun. I will concede it took BB several versions to move towards a "normalized": approach to keep MUs more open ended. CP is when it became really noticeable but lol power levels and other shit design choices.
 
Hey friends, tweeted it out, but for those who are gonna be at Evo, gonna get some games going in my room tonight, bringing a monitor and PS3 with Ultimax/Ultra and SolarKnight is bringing a Wii U and I'm bringing a copy of Smash 4.

I figure I can bring my PS3 stick again along with my dual mod but would like to not lug it around so if people have dual modded sticks/pads lemme know quick because once we're heading over we're heading over
 
I feel bad for Watson and all involved. I hope the next endeavor doesn't meet as many road blocks. Super Arcade has been the training ground for many players in that area for so many years (myself included.) It needs to come back.
 
Barcade Watson.

I really miss watching the Runback. and WNF. I will even tolerate the long downtime!
BlueshirtGuy did well but the other council felt like they can find something better. The most powerful action anyone in government can do is say No. It takes courage to say yes. Good luck Azusa.
 
QisTopTier said:
BB has system mechanics that dilute power levels of characters a bit better, it's still very character based.

The drive set up alone lets the characters be more unique while letting the devs keep power levels in check *sorta*
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Anne said:
Things like BB ukemi and the various universal means to do things make it work out better when power levels are kept in check. It's by no means towards universal design as a whole, but when the characters are of similar levels it's not close to how SF4 is. If there were a sliding scale SF4 would sit on the far end of that character based design. BB would sit on the same side as SF4 but not as far.

In Xrd offensive options are absurdly strong and character specific, and the ways to deal with them are specific or nonexistent. There's a lot of "you need to play this MU situation out this way or incur really bad risk/reward to deal".You tend to see character MUs more than player MUs. It's really noticeable with low tier, watch FAB just outright lose to weaker players cause they have a good MU over Pot. It'd be closer to SF4 on that sliding scale.

Doesn't make Xrd a bad game the same way it doesn't make SF4 or MvC3 a bad game, that's just kind of how it is. A lot of people find that to be really fun. I will concede it took BB several versions to move towards a "normalized": approach to keep MUs more open ended. CP is when it became really noticeable but lol power levels and other shit design choices.
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Ah, thanks for the explanation
 
Anne said:
CP is when it became really noticeable but lol power levels and other shit design choices.
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WS3Hw2e.png
 
Time to hit the airport.

See all you handsome folks when I touch down. I'm in contact with some of ya'll but others can reach me on Twitter: @Strikevillain
 
Though I swore off Blazblue after Kokonoe's release (and playing a long set against a Valkenhayn player), I would reconsider if the latest version was released on PC.

I still have fun playing Skullgirls on PC, though I also have the luxury of playing that offline. If Skullgirls wasn't on PC I'd be far less motivated to play it. Also helps that when I fire up Skullgirls I can be in a smooth online match in literal seconds.

Doesn't stop me from getting my ass kicked with solo Squigly online though... curse you, Fortune players....
 
SamVimes said:
I know the struggle of bad matchups but i feel like it's the tradeoff of having characters with unique playstyles. Even then at this point the 7-3s are so few and far in between that complaining about the matchups in this game when most other 2d fighters have the top tier running circles around every other character is a bit silly.
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Your original statement was "when do we say matchups don't matter in SF4"

You have an equal shot of winning Rock, Paper, Scissors with any of the picks. It's balanced. You would have equal representation if you did a tournament for it. But all of that doesn't mean the Rock vs Paper matchup isn't a automatic loss for Rock
 
QisTopTier said:
So UNIEL the best new game that's not on ps4 and really should be?
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What do you expect me to say, Arcana Heart? :p

And yes, UNIEL really should be on the PS4 -- but given how French Bread works, they won't be releasing PS4 games until the PS5 is out.

And on that note, I'll see you fools in Vegas.
 
Anne said:
Remember when I said it's not perfect? Liz is an example of how they tried to make a character go in a different direction and it ended with some sloppy design they dunno how to make fit right. They just make her ass to make it less likely she breaks everything.
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Why is Liz 5B a projectile :/
 
DryEyeRelief said:
Your original statement was "when do we say matchups don't matter in SF4"

You have an equal shot of winning Rock, Paper, Scissors with any of the picks. It's balanced. You would have equal representation if you did a tournament for it. But all of that doesn't mean the Rock vs Paper matchup isn't a automatic loss for Rock
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I'm saying that the importance is overstated, not that it's not there. The worst matchups are 7-3 and there's not so many of them. Anyway i have a completely different view from Anne and Juicebox, i feel like when universal options are strong the characters all feel too samey to have fun with the game, it's why i really dislike 3rd strike as a competitive game.
 
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