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[MrBadger]

This is really unnecessary, yet Nintendo imposes tutorial limitations on their games like this all the time. This time it's a bit extreme though :/

I'm annoyed about this too but I'd like to play Devil's Advocate. Usually in Nintendo games, especially Mario ones, tutorials and kiddy limitations aren't imposed on the player at all. In fact all the games featured in Super Mario Maker (even NSMBU) don't have any kind of tutorial and just throw you into the game after a very brief intro cinematic, if even that.

Outside of A Link Between Worlds (which I praise for cutting all the bullshit) I don't play Zelda so I can't speak there. But the only Nintendo game where I got frustrated because of the tutorials was Mario and Luigi Dream Team. Most Nintendo games, especially the more recent ones, are good for just throwing you into the game.

 

[Simbabbad]

See, that's the problem with this thing. They don't make sure you understand the basic tools. They make sure you spend five minutes with them. That's an important difference.

Have you bothered noticing there was (obviously) a tutorial with each new unlocked item? The delay makes sure people follow the tutorial and spend a bit of time playing with it before skipping to something else.

Misleading thread? What's misleading about the title or OP?

That makes much more sense and it's quite different to what this thread initially implied. It's a very good design choice and the salt in this thread will only make my future meals tastier.

This.

And keep believing everyone will make amazing levels now because they were restricted.

Have I ever said that? The restrictions, however, will obviously help avoid big messes of levels, and guide newcomers (children in particular). You're pretending that tutorials and restrictions are useless despite all the evidences to the contrary just because you want to play with all your shiny new toys day 1 and not (gasp) wait nine days. But it doesn't change anything: this game stands on user content, so obviously Nintendo makes everything it can to educate players, like they always did.

 

[DryvBy]

This thread is hilarious thanks to a few posters.

"Guys, let me tell you how this is a good thing to limit you. You see, you are all too stupid to use such great and amazing tools of the almighty Nintendo. Less is more. Then 9 days later, less is less and more is more. Doublethink this please. I need you to understand that 2 + 2 = 5 when I need it to be."

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

Have you bothered noticing there was (obviously) a tutorial with each new unlocked item? The delay makes sure people follow the tutorial and spend a bit of time playing with it before skipping to something else.



This.


Have I ever said that? The restrictions, however, will obviously help avoid big messes of levels, and guide newcomers (children in particular). You're pretending that tutorials and restrictions are useless despite all the evidences to the contrary just because you want to play with all your shiny new toys day 1 and not (gasp) wait nine days. But it doesn't change anything: this game stands on user content, so obviously Nintendo makes everything it can to educate players, like they always did.

So what happens when people buy the game when it isn't 9 days after launch

If you're paying for the game you should be able to use the content as you please. It's a level editor for a Mario game. There will always be masses of shit levels in online level sharing systems... Restricting content for 9 days post launch isn't going to change that. It's simply inconvenient for the consumer.

But seeing how you're already being condescending to him I'm fairly sure this post won't get me anywhere

 

[BGBW]

See, that's the problem with this thing. They don't make sure you understand the basic tools. They make sure you spend five minutes with them. That's an important difference.

What they should be doing is provide a tutorial, some kind of guided tour, or task-based challenges to ensure you understand how you can use certain elements, either separately or in combination with others.

They see this as a toy box. It's like being given a box of assorted Lego bricks without instructions. The idea is you learn by playing and experimenting rather than being told how things must go together.

 

[JoeM86]

So what happens when people buy the game when it isn't 9 days after launch

If you're paying for the game you should be able to use the content as you please. It's a level editor for a Mario game. There will always be masses of shit levels in online level sharing systems... Restricting content for 9 days post launch isn't going to change that. It's simply inconvenient for the consumer.

But seeing how you're already being condescending to him I'm fairly sure this post won't get me anywhere

Then you still have to wait 9 days. From what we can tell, this isn't an online gradual thing (unless I missed clarification)

 

[maxcriden]

So what happens when people buy the game when it isn't 9 days after launch

If you're paying for the game you should be able to use the content as you please. It's a level editor for a Mario game. There will always be masses of shit levels in online level sharing systems... Restricting content for 9 days post launch isn't going to change that. It's simply inconvenient for the consumer.

But seeing how you're already being condescending to him I'm fairly sure this post won't get me anywhere

It's not nine days after launch, though. It's nine days after each person purchases the game. So you buy it a year from now and you will have the same restrictions.

 

[Cabal]

It's not the end of the world but I think it's a poor design choice. It's hard to believe some of you are defending this as a good idea though. There are way better ways of gating content to ensure the player understands it. Just make everything unlock after testing the player on each concept/toolset in tutorial mode.

It's stupid all the way around, because making it time unlocked doesn't really ensure anyone learns anything either. It does obviously make a number of people upset, because they have to wait to access content they might get to faster in a normal unlock scenario.

Oh well still looking forward to it, I just wish this part was thought out better.

 

[Captain Europe]

Have you bothered noticing there was (obviously) a tutorial with each new unlocked item? The delay makes sure people follow the tutorial and spend a bit of time playing with it before skipping to something else.



This.


Have I ever said that? The restrictions, however, will obviously help avoid big messes of levels, and guide newcomers (children in particular). You're pretending that tutorials and restrictions are useless despite all the evidences to the contrary just because you want to play with all your shiny new toys day 1 and not (gasp) wait nine days. But it doesn't change anything: this game stands on user content, so obviously Nintendo makes everything it can to educate players, like they always did.

The OP is edited, I don't know what it stated initially but it doesn't seem misleading now.

And no, I don't think tutorials are a bad thing, where did you get that? A better way to do this would have been to have the user play like 9 levels, but watch a short tutorial first about the items used in the level. And yes, restrictions are useless and aren't gonna do anything except make the levels on day 1 a borefest.

And yes I do want to play with my shiny toys I paid 60 euros for on day one, is that weird thing now? Am I getting too old and jaded for gaming at 26?

 

[zigg]

There are way better ways of gating content to ensure the player understands it. Just make everything unlock after testing the player on each concept/toolset in tutorial mode.

I'm not really sure how this would work. Examples?

 

[THEAnderson21]

Zero issue for me. I really enjoy Splatoon's "hey, come back every few days for more stuff" hook.

 

[bryanee]

It's not nine days after launch, though. It's nine days after each person purchases the game. So you buy it a year from now and you will have the same restrictions.

So regardless of when I buy it I still have to wait nine before getting everything? Ehhh. Not going to lie but that kinda puts me off a little.

 

[maxcriden]

Ha, so people are shocked that Nintendo treats them like a child -_- have you seen the most recent offerings on the Wii U or 3DS all of their franchises are moving towards being kid friendly. How much did Skyward Sword hold your hand, it's just Nintendo being Nintendo which is, and has been for a very long time "A COMPANY OUT OF TOUCH WITH THEIR FANS"

I'm an adult, I wasn't overwhelmed with Dark Souls, or Spelunky or Minecraft, or any game for that matter. I think I can handle a few extra options for my Mario level.

Skyward Sword didn't really hold your hand all that much, FWIW. Fi let you know about low batteries and gave you the same level of general guidance Midna, Navi, and other companions had already provided in Zelda games for years.

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

It's not nine days after launch, though. It's nine days after each person purchases the game. So you buy it a year from now and you will have the same restrictions.

Then you still have to wait 9 days. From what we can tell, this isn't an online gradual thing (unless I missed clarification)

Well, dang. I'm wrong there. Thanks for the heads up guys

 

[NickMitch]

I hope Nintendo restricts all non 1-1 elements to paid DLC for your sake then

Touché!

 

[Molemitts]

Learning through play is great. But everyone defending this has failed to explain how making players wait days, is a superior system to allowing players to unlock content through gameplay. All this is doing is holding back all players of varying skill levels for an arbitrary amount of time. There's going to be awful levels no matter what, they can overcome that with a good rating and recommendation system.

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

Learning through play is great. But everyone defending this has failed to explain how making players wait days, is a superior system to allowing players to unlock content through gameplay. All this is doing is holding back all players of varying skill levels for an arbitrary amount of time. There's going to be awful levels no matter what, they can overcome that with a good rating and recommendation system.

Spoiler

because Nintendo said so

 

[Ozium]

And yes I do want to play with my shiny toys I paid 60 euros for one day one, is that weird thing now? Am I getting too old and jaded for gaming at 26?

But Nintendo is telling you what you will get when you pay your money before you pay your money. By giving them your money you are getting a game that is designed the way it was designed. Is it weird that they are advertising how the game works and being transparent about the unlocking system before it is even on sale?

They haven't duped anyone. They haven't tricked anyone. They haven't engaged in any form of chicanery or skullduggery. They are simply doing something that displeases you.

 

[Captain Europe]

But Nintendo is telling you what you will get when you pay your money before you pay your money. By giving them your money you are getting a game that is designed the way it was designed. Is it weird that they are advertising how the game works and being transparent about the unlocking system before it is even on sale?

They haven't duped anyone. They haven't tricked anyone. They haven't engaged in any form of chicanery or skullduggery. They are simply doing something that displeases you.

I'm displeased but I'm still gonna get the game cos I think it's gonna be amazingly fun when everything is unlocked, just a shame I have to go through this annoyance.

I'm aware of the fact that Nintendo just wants SMM to have good levels, but they should have accepted that bad levels were going to happen the moment they decided to release a Mario level editor.

I'm not even sure why they're being so overprotective of the IP, there's loads of shitty fangames out there with the Mario IP, it's like they're not even aware of it. It doesn't even really matter, because there's also loads great fangames that cancel out the shit, and I'm sure SMM will have great levels too.

 

[Ulthwe]

Learning through play is great. But everyone defending this has failed to explain how making players wait days, is a superior system to allowing players to unlock content through gameplay. All this is doing is holding back all players of varying skill levels for an arbitrary amount of time. There's going to be awful levels no matter what, they can overcome that with a good rating and recommendation system.

As you say, playing for 5 min a day for nine days is not a superior system to unlocking content through normal play. The main problem is that Super Mario Maker doesn't have "normal play" (formal levels per se, 1-1, 1-2... 8-4), you have to consider that if they locked the last batch of pieces only for players who beat the 100 level challenge, how many people would be left out of those pieces?

The moment Nintendo considered not having all the pieces available from the start (which I don't think is a bad idea), the 5min/9day lock seems to be the less bad option.

 

[test_account]

I'm not really sure how this would work. Examples?

You could make a template and then the player has to place those specific objects in those templates, with instructions on how to do things and what each item does.

That made me wonder, are any of the tools included really that complex? Based on the videos that i've seen, everything seems pretty easy to understand.

 

[Captain Europe]

As you say, playing for 5 min a day for nine days is not a superior system to unlocking content through normal play. The main problem is that Super Mario Maker doesn't have "normal play" (formal levels per se, 1-1, 1-2... 8-4), you have to consider that if they locked the last batch of pieces only for players who beat the 100 level challenge, how many people would be left out of those pieces?

The moment Nintendo considered not having all the pieces available from the start (which I don't think is a bad idea), the 5min/9day lock seems to be the less bad option.

Why not both though? They could have made the content unlockable via the 100 Mario courses for the experienced Mario players, and still do the 5 min a day thing for more casual gamers.

You could make a template and then the player has to place those specific objects in those templates, with instructions on how to do things and what each item does.

That made me wonder, are any of the tools included really that complex? Based on the videos that i've seen, everything seems pretty easy to understand.

That's a much better idea. And IMO none of the tools are complex and all the items are pretty easy to grasp. I'm starting to think they didn't put slopes in because they think that would have confused our puny little brains.

 

[BGBW]

Learning through play is great. But everyone defending this has failed to explain how making players wait days, is a superior system to allowing players to unlock content through gameplay. All this is doing is holding back all players of varying skill levels for an arbitrary amount of time. There's going to be awful levels no matter what, they can overcome that with a good rating and recommendation system.

Well the gameplay of Mario Maker is both making and playing. Unlocks behind playing seem to be the Amiibo costumes, which makes sense since unlocking parts behind a skill ceiling could permanently lock people out of tools whereas at least the costumes are just fun little extras.

With the making they currently say play with a new pack of tools for five minutes to unlock the next 'shipment' which will arrive the next day. That's basically a free for all five minutes that you can do whatever you want with. They said this is a tool designed around experimentation so they don't really want to tell you what to do so this makes sense. Of course the big beef here is the shipment time. Do I agree with it? No. Will I make a big deal over it? No.

However, lets say after five minutes the next batch of stuff arrived. The user may have not finished experimenting with the initial batch. After another five minutes more is added when they still haven't bothered with the initial ones they unlocked. They may feel like they're getting bombarded with stuff (of course if everything was unlocked at the beginning this feeling would not happen). So I guess they thought leaving it to the next day allows one to comfortably finish with the playing around at your own pace before worrying about the next lot.

If anything the big flaw is the nine days. I'm guessing if it was just four days there'd be less concern because each pack would be bigger. Some after all only give you about three items which isn't really worth waiting a day for.

 

[UncleSporky]

Zero issue for me. I really enjoy Splatoon's "hey, come back every few days for more stuff" hook.

I don't understand the constant comparisons to Splatoon. Splatoon is a new game, nobody quite knew how it played. Every new map and weapon was new for everyone.

95% of Wii U owners have played a Mario game before and know how nearly all of the level elements interact with each other. It's not like, "ooh, a Chain Chomp, now I get to play with this new element and learn how it works!" because everyone already knows how Chain Chomps work.

 

[Hanmik]

(j/k)

 

[A Link to the Past]

But Nintendo is telling you what you will get when you pay your money before you pay your money. By giving them your money you are getting a game that is designed the way it was designed. Is it weird that they are advertising how the game works and being transparent about the unlocking system before it is even on sale?

They haven't duped anyone. They haven't tricked anyone. They haven't engaged in any form of chicanery or skullduggery. They are simply doing something that displeases you.

But Capcom did that too. They hid characters on Street Fighter X Tekken and later sold them as DLC. Would you consider it unfair criticism of Capcom for it having done that?

 

[maxcriden]

So regardless of when I buy it I still have to wait nine before getting everything? Ehhh. Not going to lie but that kinda puts me off a little.

In the grand scheme of things, the level tools you have from the get go will be plenty to create some astoundingly fun levels. Each day you will be able to familiarize yourself more with more complex and different kinds of tools. Plus, in the meantime there should still be tons of levels to play that have advanced toolset items in them, from reviewers and from Nintendo.

To repeat this point for those reading because I think it bears repeating: Nintendo, reviewers and others will already have plenty of levels available on day one that include advanced toolset items, so there is no reason to believe that available levels to download and play will only be centered around limited toolsets. Further, there is also no reason to believe that the day Bowser or any other item is unlocked, that you will only find Bowser-centric levels online. Plenty of previous and current other sorts of levels will most assuredly still be popular, and I have no doubt talented level designers will be interested in using plenty of other items to craft their levels on those days.

 

[MrBadger]

You could make a template and then the player has to place those specific objects in those templates, with instructions on how to do things and what each item does.

That made me wonder, are any of the tools included really that complex? Based on the videos that i've seen, everything seems pretty easy to understand.

I think this method would be appropriate for things like doors, where their functionality depends on where the player puts them.

For things like enemies, they could just put the player through a brief pre-made course where they encounter that specific enemy. Beat it and it's yours to use.

 

[Simbabbad]

And no, I don't think tutorials are a bad thing, where did you get that? A better way to do this would have been to have the user play like 9 levels, but watch a short tutorial first about the items used in the level. And yes, restrictions are useless and aren't gonna do anything except make the levels on day 1 a borefest.

Tutorials ARE restrictions.

 

[Sable~Knight]

With all the tools and options available to you, you'll get lost trying to figure them out on your own. Go step by step, understand how each category works and what kinds of things are possible with it, and then move on to the next category. Of course this is assuming the game and content/unlocks are well structured.

 

[AtomicShroom]

Will advancing your system clock forward allow you to cheat the limitation? I hope it does, just so all the big crybabies in this thread can shut up already.

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

With all the tools and options available to you, you'll get lost trying to figure them out on your own. Go step by step, understand how each category works and what kinds of things are possible with it, and then move on to the next category. Of course this is assuming the game and content/unlocks are well structured.

This achieves nothing tutorials can't, though. And the idea everyone would get lost trying to figure out how to make their own Mario level with the full suite of tools is almost insulting to the intelligence of users.

 

[BGBW]

You could make a template and then the player has to place those specific objects in those templates, with instructions on how to do things and what each item does.

That made me wonder, are any of the tools included really that complex? Based on the videos that i've seen, everything seems pretty easy to understand.

The problem with this is that it goes against what they wanted this software to be. Remember, this is a pseudo sequel to Mario Paint. They give you a canvas and let you go wild. Even when it comes to what items do they want people to discover, especially when it comes to combining and shaking items. Basically they want to avoid telling the player this is how it is meant to be done.

Most complex item I've seen is the bone coaster since that has path drawing.

 

[test_account]

I think this method would be appropriate for things like doors, where their functionality depends on where the player puts them.

For things like enemies, they could just put the player through a brief pre-made course where they encounter that specific enemy. Beat it and it's yours to use.

Yeah, a tutorial based system that unlocked thing would have worked indeed.

The problem with this is that it goes against what they wanted this software to be. Remember, this is a pseudo sequel to Mario Paint. They give you a canvas and let you go wild. Even when it comes to what items do they want people to discover, especially when it comes to combining and shaking items. Basically they want to avoid telling the player this is how it is meant to be done.

Most complex item I've seen is the bone coaster since that has path drawing.

I was just going by the notion that people would feel so overwhelmed with functions that they didnt know what to do with it all. I dont think that tutorials are really needed because most stuff looks really easy to use. That said though, i would guess that there is some instructions on how to start at least. I would be surprised if they just throw people into the game and dont say a single word on how anything works. Nintendo released a video a few days ago showing how some stuff worked for example, so they are interested in showing how things work, and i dont think that they expect all consumers to have seen that video.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Will advancing your system clock forward allow you to cheat the limitation? I hope it does, just so all the big crybabies in this thread can shut up already.

Sorry, I didn't get the memo that Nintendo was beyond criticism.

 

[Ozium]

But Capcom did that too. They hid characters on Street Fighter X Tekken and later sold them as DLC. Would you consider it unfair criticism of Capcom for it having done that?

Are you saying Mario Maker has on-disc DLC that you have to pay extra for, or are you saying that Capcom was completely upfront about how the DLC's were already on the disc and advertised it as such?

either way my answer is "wat?"

 

[Trojan]

I think it's a poor design choice, but it's laughable how much some of you guys are overreacting.

 

[UncleSporky]

But Capcom did that too. They hid characters on Street Fighter X Tekken and later sold them as DLC. Would you consider it unfair criticism of Capcom for it having done that?

I would, personally. We aren't entitled to all content that a developer creates before a game is sold. If we were then that would punish fast, efficient developers. "Sorry, you don't get to sell these characters as DLC because you finished them earlier than expected. Should've worked slower!"

DLC is created from a different budget than the rest of the game and is intended to pay for its own creation. I don't mind on-disc DLC at all, unless there is evidence that the game was intended to be sold with that content included and it was literally stripped out. Usually we have no way of knowing.

 

[Ulthwe]

Why not both though? They could have made the content unlockable via the 100 Mario courses for the experienced Mario players, and still do the 5 min a day thing for more casual gamers.

Yep, that would be great. Where's that GIF when you need it?

If anything the big flaw is the nine days. I'm guessing if it was just four days there'd be less concern because each pack would be bigger. Some after all only give you about three items which isn't really worth waiting a day for.

I suppose the nine days come both from the amount of pieces / piece groups and a way to keep you engaged longer. I assume they tested to hell and back which was the right amount of time, as they usually do.

 

[CentralScrutinizer]

Its weird how I look at this as a way to force me to be creative and learn how to use each component of the builder while being able to learn new tricks every day for nine days, and some people look at this and tell nintendo to eff off for making them wait and withholding content.

I understand there are two sides to this, but I really think nintendo is making the best call. I really like the idea of adding the components in daily until nine days are up, it teaches the playerbase to master the basics of building before moving on. This is the best way to make sure their social download section isnt flooded with BS levels from day one.

What people should be mad about is the fact that the game is done already and they are making us wait a month for it. Would've been better to release it in august with very little competition as opposed to the terrible 9/11 date..

 

[Captain Europe]

I don't understand the constant comparisons to Splatoon. Splatoon is a new game, nobody quite knew how it played. Every new map and weapon was new for everyone.

95% of Wii U owners have played a Mario game before and know how nearly all of the level elements interact with each other. It's not like, "ooh, a Chain Chomp, now I get to play with this new element and learn how it works!" because everyone already knows how Chain Chomps work.

That is why it worked for Splatoon, and why this has a 30 page thread of complaints.

Tutorials ARE restrictions.

Why? It can be a tutorial vid or something that holds your hand and shows what an item does and gives you the item right after doing it, or after watching a vid. There's better ways to do a tutorial for this game.

So basically this game has 9 tutorials, each lasting a day, sounds like fun.

 

[A Link to the Past]

Are you saying Mario Maker has on-disc DLC that you have to pay extra for, or are you saying that Capcom was completely upfront about how the DLC's were already on the disc and advertised it as such?

either way my answer is "wat?"

1. Nintendo was completely upfront about this? To me, completely upfront doesn't involve showing off content for more than a year and at the last minute(ish) revealing that most of it you can't use right away.

2. You were discussing the idea of Nintendo giving people the game its designers designed. Ultimately that is not relevant to the issue that the way they designed it isn't very good. Further, the Street Fighter X Tekken debacle wasn't even truly something worthy of controversy because the roster wasn't really "incomplete." A more likely scenario is that the designers made a base game and then when the game was done, instead of releasing it much earlier, they worked on DLC content.

 

[godofrawr]

But Capcom did that too. They hid characters on Street Fighter X Tekken and later sold them as DLC. Would you consider it unfair criticism of Capcom for it having done that?

You're serious aren't you?

The shadiness of on-disc DLC, and the shadiness of treating you're customers like they aren't smart enough to use a simple level editor are very different things.

Nintendo used a similar tactic w/Splatoon, and it's rank play. Locking it behind some arbitrary goal that Nintendo had set, because they assumed the people playing weren't smart enough to comprehend a simple concept that had existed outside of the Nintendo eco-system of games for years.

There's other smaller, less obvious jabs at their customers... like the simplification of the 3D Mario games, in 3D World, or the removal of item holding in Mario Kart 8. Nintendo assumes their customers are children at this point, and it's because those that aren't just keep buying the games, regardless of the flaws in their design.

Bad design is bad.

 

[UncleSporky]

Nintendo used a similar tactic w/Splatoon, and it's rank play. Locking it behind some arbitrary goal that Nintendo had set, because they assumed the people playing weren't smart enough to comprehend a simple concept that had existed outside of the Nintendo eco-system of games for years.

They were completely correct about this because there are tons of people in ranked mode who scoot around shooting the floor directly at their feet, or run off and paint all over the level instead of trying to capture the zone or the tower.

 

[BGBW]

What people should be mad about is the fact that the game is done already and they are making us wait a month for it. Would've been better to release it in august with very little competition as opposed to the terrible 9/11 date..

Super Mario Bros came out September 13th 1985. September 11th 2015 is the nearest Friday 30 years later to celebrate the anniversary.

 

[Ozium]

That is why it worked for Splatoon, and why this has a 30 page thread of complaints.

People complained endlessly about the rollout system for Splatoon. It wasn't until people played the game and were able to grasp the reasoning by experiencing it that they stopped complaining (not all of them, mind you)

 

[Captain Europe]

1. Nintendo was completely upfront about this? To me, completely upfront doesn't involve telling you that most of the content that's been advertised for more than a year is time-locked.

Good point, I was pretty hyped to use all those tools on day one and never in a million years did I think they would do something this dumb to the level editor.

 

[A Link to the Past]

You're serious aren't you?

The shadiness of on-disc DLC, and the shadiness of treating you're customers like they aren't smart enough to use a simple level editor are very different things.

Nintendo used a similar tactic w/Splatoon, and it's rank play. Locking it behind some arbitrary goal that Nintendo had set, because they assumed the people playing weren't smart enough to comprehend a simple concept that had existed outside of the Nintendo eco-system of games for years.

There's other smaller, less obvious jabs at their customers... like the simplification of the 3D Mario games, in 3D World, or the removal of item holding in Mario Kart 8. Nintendo assumes their customers are children at this point, and it's because those that aren't just keep buying the games, regardless of the flaws in their design.

Bad design is bad.

Capcom provided a product for $60 as-is. Nintendo provided a product for $60 as-is. Both are the same in that respect, in the context of what's being discussed.

Also, how shady is it that Street Fighter X Tekken was a game with 38 characters (43 fo rPS3/Vita owners) that had on-disc DLC? Most fighting games don't have that many characters. I'd agree that if SFXT had only like 30, then it's worth being pissed about, but it's pretty clear that the 12 DLC characters WERE designed to be DLC characters, regardless of whether they are on-disc or not.

 

[beril]

You're serious aren't you?

The shadiness of on-disc DLC, and the shadiness of treating you're customers like they aren't smart enough to use a simple level editor are very different things.

Nintendo used a similar tactic w/Splatoon, and it's rank play. Locking it behind some arbitrary goal that Nintendo had set, because they assumed the people playing weren't smart enough to comprehend a simple concept that had existed outside of the Nintendo eco-system of games for years.

There's other smaller, less obvious jabs at their customers... like the simplification of the 3D Mario games, in 3D World, or the removal of item holding in Mario Kart 8. Nintendo assumes their customers are children at this point, and it's because those that aren't just keep buying the games, regardless of the flaws in their design.

Bad design is bad.

lol what? a balancing decision that makes it harder to abuse the weapon system and makes the game way better is a jab at their customers? I'm not even going to to touch the comment comment about 3D world

 

[Recall]

Tutorials ARE restrictions.

Every game could be someone's first.