SPOILER: Spoiler Metal Gear Solid V (TPS) Spoiler Thread (Contains Spoilers, Thanos).
- Thread starter Love Deterrence
- Start date
- Status
Good catch. This "switcheroo", at least to me, is justified in a few ways within the MGS lore. The loyalty to me vs loyalty to the mission motif and the idea that Big Boss isn't a man but rather an icon. He's something intangible. The only physical thing that Big Boss "really" is are his genes, as we've seen everything else can be replicated.
Can someone tell me what the difference between MSF, Mother Base, Outer Heaven and Zanzibar Land is? Mainly looking for hey Zanzibar would be a nation.
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
According to Ocelot and the timeline, Outer Heaven is a military nation. So we don't know what Zanzibar is, but going by MG2 it was a country in which there was an "uprising". MSF was a precursor to DD/Mother Base, they were just bases really, not the "real" Outer Heaven.
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
no, the "real" Outer Heaven Ocelot spoke of was Zanzibarland, a true military nation free from the world. Outer Heaven from 1995 was a military fortress Venom was in.
Pilgrimzero
Member
At what point does BB go off the rails?
So when MGS 3 ends he basically knows his Gov used his mentor which gets him to eventually create Outer Heaven etc this MG1 and 2 happen.
But then in MGS4 we find out that he was actually opposing Zero the whole time.
And now it seems all he wants is constant war for his soldiers and he really is a bastard etc?
Is that right?
Like a Darth Vader thing? Hero turned villain. And not really like The Boss, a character who is apparently a villain but really fighting the real villains?
So when MGS 3 ends he basically knows his Gov used his mentor which gets him to eventually create Outer Heaven etc this MG1 and 2 happen.
But then in MGS4 we find out that he was actually opposing Zero the whole time.
And now it seems all he wants is constant war for his soldiers and he really is a bastard etc?
Is that right?
Like a Darth Vader thing? Hero turned villain. And not really like The Boss, a character who is apparently a villain but really fighting the real villains?
Don't make stuff up, OH was OH, Zanzibar was Zanzibar.
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
No. Ocelot says Big Boss is going to make the true Outer Heaven (as in, not the MB Outer Heaven), which will be a "military nation", the timeline says Outer Heaven is a "military nation". Zanzibar on the other hand is never refereed to as such.
XANDER CAGE
Member
There's clearly some kind of time/reality skip into a more metaphorical scene at the very end, sure. The presence of the MSX and the subtle shift from a Diamond Dogs to an Outer Heaven logo signals that. But I'm sorry, I just don't buy his body language as positive before the MSX turns on. He looks like someone who has just had their world flipped upside down and doesn't know quite how to react. The moody direction of the scene doesn't exactly imply positive feelings, either.
Big Boss may think he's being nice or cool or whatever by calling Venom his friend, but Venom's reaction is pretty clearly unhappy in my opinion. I think him punching the mirror is the release of the emotions building up inside him when he's "smiling" and "nodding," not a sudden shift to a different emotion.
Maybe Big Boss really is on the other side of the mirror and Venom's just trying to fist bump him.
Ether_Snake
å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®å®
If anything, the post MSX part is telling us that there are two possible outcomes to V, one where he turns into a demon, one where he doesn't, and both will clash. Personally, I am not reading anything literally in whatever happens after the MSX turns on. It's just a way to tell us "To be continued" to me.
Haha
TheAquaticApe
Member
Hrm. Mission 45 still won't unlock. I have everything else. Weird. Do more side ops maybe?
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
outer heaven was also MSF, Diamond Dogs, Shadow Moses, and Big Shell at one point. It's pretty clear that Outer Heaven is a concept at this point and not just an specific name.
Northeastmonk
Gold Member
I enjoyed the game, but yes I was waiting for that to happen. I liked everything else. The game play made it stand out above the plot, so what they did reveal was well worth the wait. I was expecting some sorta massive takeover and a lot more betrayal. Heck, I was even thinking we'd get to see parts of MGS1. I had my hopes up.
I want to say TPP has been one of the best experience I've had in a very long time. There were times when I was taking out an outpost at night, listening to "Only Time Will Tell", the enemy would blast a flare in the sky, and I was just searching for my objective. I want to say it's in my top GOAT. It wasn't linear, so I can't compare to other experiences I've had. It feels great beyond finishing it too. I would have liked to have done more with Eli, but I guess he has a lot to do before MGS1.
I think we would need a remake of Metal Gear to fully put things together, but I might be wrong.
Did you play mission 45? That goes into some more detail with the english strain plot.
The cut mission 51 as well I think.
Do you use a Butterfly emblem or don't you have max level for Quiet's bond?
GravityInsanity
Member
The funniest MGS V video ever. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SkNaUiaGRxw
Those were just takes on Big Boss's version of the Boss's will. The original OH was in 1995 which was a nation.
Sakura
Member
I was told Quiet would leave if I did it, so I never did.
funkystudent
Member
I think the "real" Outer Heaven is just MG1 Outer Heaven.
The post credits timeline says Big Boss was the one in charge of Metal Gear 1 Outer Heaven. But the Phantom died there.
So I guess at some point they team up again. Or Big Boss uses the phantom as a pawn without him knowing somehow, that would be a very metal gear thing to do. I dunno.
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
so many questions, so little kojima productions left to answer any
Yeah that's the real downside. I would recommend doing it after you've done everything else or looking it up on youtube though.
crazyrabbits
Banned
Everything I've found so far that's either unfinished, unused or never present in the form we saw it in the trailers/gameplay demos/etc.
- "80's Filter": Removed for being system-intensive.
- Camp Omega Special Mission (E3 2013 Trailer): Unused for unknown reasons.
- P.T Active Decoy ("Lisa") (2014 TGS gameplay presentation): Presumably cut for relationship to the cancelled "Silent Hills" project.
- Missing Delivery Point Invoices (missing locations?): Removed for unknown reasons.
- Usable Battle Gear during free-roam (Piggyback Collector's Edition strategy guide): Removed for balance reasons.
- "Burned/Skull Boss" Model (Kojima 2015 Launch Trailer): Unused for unknown reasons.
- Africa Burning Village Cutscene (E3 2014 trailer): Removed for unknown reasons.
- Africa Child Soldier Training Cutscene: Unused for unknown reasons.
- TGS 2014 Africa Mission (TGS 2014 gameplay presentation)
- Mission 46 Unused Dialogue (found in game files)
- "Mission 51" Unused Mission (found on CE Blu-Ray disc)
- Unused/unknown alternate costumes from the leaked script, including "Foxtrot". "Sandstorm", "Realtree", "Panther", "MGS3 Naked", "MGS3 Sneaking" and "MGS3 Tuxedo", along with buddy uniforms like "Horse_Parade" and "Horse_Western". Removed for unknown reasons.
For reference, there were some text files in Ground Zeroes that seemed to hint at content in TPP that never showed up either, including several weapons like a Machete, AK102, Mosin Nagant, SCAR and M4. A Machete Key Item can be collected in TPP, but it's a weapon for D-Walker.
I'll update the list with anything else I find in terms of cut/unused content.
- "80's Filter": Removed for being system-intensive.
- Camp Omega Special Mission (E3 2013 Trailer): Unused for unknown reasons.
- P.T Active Decoy ("Lisa") (2014 TGS gameplay presentation): Presumably cut for relationship to the cancelled "Silent Hills" project.
- Missing Delivery Point Invoices (missing locations?): Removed for unknown reasons.
- Usable Battle Gear during free-roam (Piggyback Collector's Edition strategy guide): Removed for balance reasons.
- "Burned/Skull Boss" Model (Kojima 2015 Launch Trailer): Unused for unknown reasons.
- Africa Burning Village Cutscene (E3 2014 trailer): Removed for unknown reasons.
- Africa Child Soldier Training Cutscene: Unused for unknown reasons.
- TGS 2014 Africa Mission (TGS 2014 gameplay presentation)
- Mission 46 Unused Dialogue (found in game files)
- "Mission 51" Unused Mission (found on CE Blu-Ray disc)
- Unused/unknown alternate costumes from the leaked script, including "Foxtrot". "Sandstorm", "Realtree", "Panther", "MGS3 Naked", "MGS3 Sneaking" and "MGS3 Tuxedo", along with buddy uniforms like "Horse_Parade" and "Horse_Western". Removed for unknown reasons.
For reference, there were some text files in Ground Zeroes that seemed to hint at content in TPP that never showed up either, including several weapons like a Machete, AK102, Mosin Nagant, SCAR and M4. A Machete Key Item can be collected in TPP, but it's a weapon for D-Walker.
I'll update the list with anything else I find in terms of cut/unused content.
XANDER CAGE
Member
Cool stuff, thanks for compiling that.
Mr. Smiley
Member
i'm half hoping for a bullshit dlc that either brings quiet back or a staff member with her sniping skills and powers
seriously. we were godlike as a silenced sniping duo
seriously. we were godlike as a silenced sniping duo
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
The way I understood it was that Ocelot implies the real Outer Heaven was Zanzibar. You even see a doorway in Motherbase with Outer Heaven logo on it and it is referred to consistently as Outer Heaven.
Zanzibar is a sovereign nation state. The distinction is silly since, as you pointed out, Outer Heaven is also referred to as a nation.
How exactly would you two reconcile Mother Base not being touched on again? It seems evident that Mother Base is the retconned Outer Heaven. Do we just have to use our imagination as to why it is never mentioned?
It is funny that this game has muddied up the 90s in the MG universe more than it has cleared things up.
Gun Animal
Member
i'm half hoping for a bullshit dlc that either brings quiet back or a staff member with her sniping skills and powers
seriously. we were godlike as a silenced sniping duo
i can't think of a precedent for losing a crucial feature like that in an open-world game before. The closest would be the weird abilities you might have for one or two missions in GTA or Assassin's Creed... but with Quiet, she's available in every mission. And then she isn't. It's kinda nuts.
edit: you guys, let's just agree that there's Outer Heaven the Mercenary "Nation" in South Africa, and Outer Heaven the political concept.
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
if the diamond dog base is supposed to be outer heaven from the 90s then Kojima has worse memory than Toriyama because there's deserts on Outer Heaven
i'm half hoping for a bullshit dlc that either brings quiet back or a staff member with her sniping skills and powers
seriously. we were godlike as a silenced sniping duo
I'd much rather have a Mission 51 DLC, as unlikely as it is.
V3n0m Sn4k3
Member
I think the burning village cutscene comes up when you reach full Demon Points.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
It's a desert strut with scorpions he fultoned from Afghanistan.
Not a stretch considering Zanzibar has sand imported from Japan.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
The Kiefer voice thing raised a question for me... why does your character sound like Kiefer? Is that Medic just being crazy and convincing himself that he sounds like Big Boss? Or did they do some weird nano technology thing on his vocal chords? lol
X
Xpike
Unconfirmed Member
wonder how much of the 15 years Big Boss spent building Zanzibar was finding the deadly hamsters
crazyrabbits
Banned
Nobody knows yet. We do know that the village is in the game, but it isn't a cutscene, and even if such a cutscene triggers while Snake is in Demon mode, why would he be crying over the village without the "perpetual blood" on him, or care when he's doing things that are as bad or worse?
The first metal gear takes place in 1995. Alot can happen in the 9 years from TPP to then, Diamond dogs could gradually change into the Outer Heaven Mercenary Corps.
Also isn't Outer Heaven merely mentioned to be a fortress, although correct me if I'm wrong. I just don't remember ever hearing it being called a nation.
Hands of Stone
Member
Eh? What's this? Haven't played MG2 in ages.
funkystudent
Member
The tapes already mention that Mother Base is just a temporary set up until they get too big for it.
So a basic timeline of events is probably.....
Venom keeps growing Diamond Dogs.
Big Boss is off buying land in Africa and doing his own army building thing.
Eventually both parties team back up and Diamond Dogs merges with whatever Big Boss has going on and the Other Heaven nation is formed.
And at some point Big Boss rejoins the US army and commands foxhound. Maybe as a cover while he is secretly planning shit so he doesn't have assassins after him all the time again.
What the fuck is a Demon Point.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
There were rooms full of manikins. The idea is that real soldiers would be mixed in so you had to use your radar to detect them.
Parasites?
Mr. Smiley
Member
hidden value that's measured by how many enemies you kill, the horn-shrapnel-thing gets longer the more of it you recieve.
Strangelove77
Member
With the game putting such emphasis on speech, language and audio you'd think they'd address this somewhere.
Jawmuncher
Member
I was killing dudes left and right and nothing here.
Yeah that was a odd omission. I just told myself when they were making venom listen to all of BBs missions and such. They probably had speeches from BB in there as well. So since he thought that was him, he talked that way when he woke up. It's a stetch, but better than nothing.
Sub_Level
wants to fuck an Asian grill.
Also here is a pic for reference.
It was strange why Big Boss would have a room full of manikins. Now we know it was just a stock room of Decoys.
Now we just need to learn the lore behind Running Man, poisonous hamsters, and why an owl hooting somehow made a soldier on guard duty think its nighttime despite it being broad daylight.
Hands of Stone
Member
Very nice lol.
- Status
Similar threads
- Poll