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[Rin Tohsaka]

YOU CALL HIM D-DOG BUT IT'S CLEARLY A WOLF

What the hell happened to Huey?

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

The whole mission in the quarantine platform would have been way more interesting if you didn't have those goggles that could identify who was infected. It just rang hollow that Venom find killing the already infected, many of which are asking for death, was such horrible, irredeemable thing.
.

Not for me. For me I was going through in the hope that some of them would be unaffected by the parasites and becoming more hopeless as I went on. Then, getting to that room where there's men saluting you as you do it. That was heavy stuff. That scene plays on the idea that if you have the goggles, it must mean some of them aren't affected.... but they all are. It takes hope and completely removes it. For me, that was supposed to be the final breaking point and despite a nice little diamond on my stealth suit and fallen comrades, nothing else came of it.

 

[IMACOMPUTA]

Did anyone else notice that during the quarantine mission where you go in and kill some of your infected men, that anything you were wearing or had equipped was not reflected in either the cut-scenes or the gameplay? It was just Olive Drab fatigues and the standard pistol with suppressor and the standard submachine gun with suppressor and flashlight.

It feels strange considering that all the other cutscenes take note of what you are wearing and what items you have equipped. Did they just forget about this one?!?

I think it forced you to have lethal weapons.
It also never gave you a chance to select your equipment.

 

[KarmaCow]

I can't believe some people on the Internet are taking the meta element as a sincere "thank you" to the fans from Kojima.

He planned this game 5 years ago. There's no way he could have known this would be his last MGS. He wouldn't build the game's big twist around a farewell message.

He knew exactly what the fans wanted from this game and tricked us into thinking we were getting it. He's not thanking us, if anything he's shown a complete lack of regard for us. He's said many times he knows we want to play as Snake.

This is just him stroking his own ego and looking for more fame. He knows millions were looking forward to his game but he's so "out there" that he fooled them all.

Well it really wasn't genius at all Kojima, it was tiresome. We all knew a body double was a possibility and there were hints throughout the game but I didn't think he'd actually go and do it again. It was stale and predictable. It didn't elevate the story, it just brought it to a flat and stale ending.

Even if it was a "thank you", I sure don't appreciate it because I'm not Big Boss. I'm happy to be my own person unlike Venom.

It didn't mean it as a thank you or a tip of the hat to the fans. I meant it far more literally than that, with Kojima basically nudging you, making sure you get it, that you are playing the game. I basically agree with you, it's dumb.

 

[Arion]

Maybe episode 51 was cut because it involved killing the child soldiers. If so it would have been a good way to show "Big Boss's" decent into becoming a villain. Although I am glad that stuff is not in the game even if it hampered the ending.

 

[Tookay]

Trying to best use the content available, yeah, Chapter 1 and 2 should have been condensed.

The core arc of Diamond Dogs pursuing Skullface should have been the core, while secondary arcs happened concurrently. Introduction to Eli and his defiance of Big Boss. Running into and finally seeking the corpse of Volgan. Rescuing Huey who is under amounting suspicion along with recovering the mammal pod and associated revelations. Quiet's introduction and companionship developed with Big Boss. Mysterious outbreak at Mother Base forcing your hand at quarantine, leading to seeking out Code Talker, culminating with a developed immunity for most of your crew yet the loss of those you placed in quarantine that you have to purge yourself. And so on.

If the theme is duality, which by the end it was, the story as it is would have benefited by levying that duality in one story arc. Big Boss and the Diamond Dogs begin the story with a straight forward mission to hunt down and destroy Skull Face, but the stress of the mission escalates significantly as Diamond Dogs is eaten away from the inside by paranoia, child soldiers, and the virus. A story of trying to juggle too much at once without ever letting go of revenge, trying to save kids who won't cooperate, look after your own people who are dying (some by your own hand) from a disease, forging bonds with new and old faces amidst the an air of betrayal and paranoia, while also trying to seek revenge on the person you think fucked you over all those years ago.

This. And to accomplish this condensing, all that they would have needed to change is just the placement of some cutscenes.

 

[Kenzodielocke]

YOU CALL HIM D-DOG BUT IT'S CLEARLY A WOLF

What the hell happened to Huey?

He actually was the only character that was interesting in the game.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

The whole mission in the quarantine platform would have been way more interesting if you didn't have those goggles that could identify who was infected. It just rang hollow that Venom find killing the already infected, many of which are asking for death, was such horrible, irredeemable thing.

I actually experienced something odd during this mission.
I had just rescued a badass female prisoner right before this, and got totally fucked when I forgot to put her under direct contract because now she was in there. For me she was the soldier sitting at the bottom of the first stairs.

After you have to kill everyone I came down to the stairs and just refused to kill her, got the one survivor, tried to leave but the game wouldn't let me, so I went back and killed all the poor saluting soldiers before returing to Spunky Owl, but she was nowhere to be found...
The only thing in her place was now a stain of blood/muck/filth.

So I checked the mission objectives, and eliminate all infected was still unchecked, so I decided to search for her.
Then on the first level I went inside a room, and the game took control and did a little zoom in on a pretty much identical stain to the one she left behind a floor below, but she herself wasn't there.
When I got control back, I could finally leave with the survivor, however she still showed up in my staff list as "shot" later on.

 

[Empty Space]

If Psycho Mantis could control Sahelanthropus, why did they need the PAL cards in MGS1? I'm pretty sure Liquid's anger and revenge is still just as potent enough to give Mantis the psychic energy to control REX.

I've been struggling with this since it became clear that really was Mantis and the only conclusion I could come to is that child Mantis has his power amplified through the rage and as he gets older the susceptibility to other people's emotions becomes less pronounced, which result in his powers being weaker. This is insanely dumb, but its the only justification I can come up with. The entirety of chapter 2 left a bad taste in my mouth from the removal of mission 51, the weirdness of the body double stuff, and Quiet becoming locked out.

I don't know if Huey is a terrible person and delusional to all the things he did wrong or if everything he'd was being taken out of context and hes not actually a bad guy. I'm inclined to say the former.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

He actually was the only character that was interesting in the game.

Quiet was interesting to me. Despite not being a fan of her character design, I really liked her characterisation and narrative.

 

[Sn4ke_911]

Quiet's episode 45 cutscene was so freakin badass.

 

[sonicmj1]

You were told ahead of time by Kaz (I think) to basically go in guns a-blazin'. It's up to you as a player to actually pull the trigger, until you get the night vision goggles that will basically force you to. The level of remorse you feel for mowing down those soldiers all saluting you was one of the best moments in the game for me.

I remember the day I kidnapped you, Hissing Capybara. It's your ashes that Venom Snake smeared into his pores.

You can't pull the trigger until you make contact with the guy who sent a transmission. Shooting anyone before that point will earn you a mission failure.

 

[Tookay]

I liked Quiet as a character, especially her ending. It was the closest this game got to evoking some genuine emotion.

Not a huge fan of her character design though.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

I've been struggling with this since it became clear that really was Mantis and the only conclusion I could come to is that child Mantis has his power amplified through the rage and as he gets older the susceptibility to other people's emotions becomes less pronounced, which result in his powers being weaker. This is insanely dumb, but its the only justification I can come up with. The entirety of chapter 2 left a bad taste in my mouth from the removal of mission 51, the weirdness of the body double stuff, and Quiet becoming locked out.

I put it more because he was trying to maintain the mind control over the genome army as well.

 

[iMax]

So if it was Phantom Snake who Solid Snake burned with a flamethrower, what happened to Solidus if it wasn't his body that was taken in?

 

[Mister Negative]

I've been struggling with this since it became clear that really was Mantis and the only conclusion I could come to is that child Mantis has his power amplified through the rage and as he gets older the susceptibility to other people's emotions becomes less pronounced, which result in his powers being weaker. This is insanely dumb, but its the only justification I can come up with. The entirety of chapter 2 left a bad taste in my mouth from the removal of mission 51, the weirdness of the body double stuff, and Quiet becoming locked out.

I don't know if Huey is a terrible person and delusional to all the things he did wrong or if everything he'd was being taken out of context and hes not actually a bad guy. I'm inclined to say the former.

I think they literally say this in the tapes. Something about myelin sheaths not being fully developed in children, so Kiddo Mantis is more susceptible to the emotions of others.

 

[UpDownLeftRight]

Agreed and it really feels forced, most of the taboo stuff that Kojima planned for the game was just cut.

Remember when Kojima said he's not sure if he can release the game at this state? nothing in this game screams taboo, it got all cut and a visionary (Kojima) was robbed of his future.

Been thinking along those lines for a while now. I'd be extremely surprised if we didn't lose 50% of the story content or more considering the horrible pacing of it and complete lack of any meat to it. Then of course all the thing Kojima hinted at that never happened.

I've got a theory on how and when this began too. Ground Zeroes arguably was more riske than TPP ever manages to be. The things that happened to Paz, and the things detailed in the tapes are possibly the most graphic in the medium. I have a theory that GZ was meant to gauge a few hidden reactions too, specifically how far is too far. That scene and storyline generated a lot headlines shortly after and a lot of people seemed to be of the opinion that it crossed a line gaming doesn't need to.

It's very baseless obviously and only a hunch, but may also explain why the Paz scene in TTP is relegated to an obscure detail few will see.

 

[Misterinenja]

Finally I can open this thread.

I saw the people being vocal about their disappointment, as it corrupted the OT like a parasite.

By the way, your whining there didn't manage to ruin the game for me. I knew you were those people hell-bent on abiding canon and needy for conclusions.

Story-arc was meaningless to me after MGS4. It was done, concluded. Peace Walker, I couldn't care for it.

I came in MGSV thirsting for Kojima's artistic vision. I was afraid of by the numbers sequel to Peace Walker to fill in the gap in lore. Thank god I got the former.

His take on modern open world games twists itself around narrative. This game exceeded Sons of Liberty. It makes sense. Almost makes MGS4 better retro-actively.

I'm high on Kojima fumes. Help me. Release me from this phantom.

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

Finally I can open this thread.

I saw the people being vocal about their disappointment, as it corrupted the OT like a parasite.

By the way, your whining there didn't manage to ruin the game for me. I knew you were those people hell-bent on abiding canon and needy for conclusions.

Story-arc was meaningless to me after MGS4. It was done, concluded. Peace Walker, I couldn't care for it.

I came in MGSV thirsting for Kojima's artistic vision. I was afraid of by the numbers sequel to Peace Walker to fill in the gap in lore. Thank god I got the former.

His take on modern open world games twists itself around narrative. This game exceeded Sons of Liberty. It makes sense. Almost makes MGS4 better retro-actively.

I'm high on Kojima fumes. Help me. Release me from this phantom.

i'm sure you'll do just fine in this thread

the best way to join a thread is to call people whiners and shit

 

[Sumio Mondo]

Don't know if it's been mentioned yet but Japanese players think the game is unfinished (look at the reviews):

http://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/B00UA3U9SU/

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Finally I can open this thread.

I saw the people being vocal about their disappointment, as it corrupted the OT like a parasite.

By the way, your whining there didn't manage to ruin the game for me. I knew you were those people hell-bent on abiding canon and needy for conclusions.

Story-arc was meaningless to me after MGS4. It was done, concluded. Peace Walker, I couldn't care for it.

I came in MGSV thirsting for Kojima's artistic vision. I was afraid of by the numbers sequel to Peace Walker to fill in the gap in lore. Thank god I got the former.

His take on modern open world games twists itself around narrative. This game exceeded Sons of Liberty. It makes sense. Almost makes MGS4 better retro-actively.

I'm high on Kojima fumes. Help me. Release me from this phantom.

The parasites got to you too. RIP

 

[yuraya]

If Psycho Mantis could control Sahelanthropus, why did they need the PAL cards in MGS1? I'm pretty sure Liquid's anger and revenge is still just as potent enough to give Mantis the psychic energy to control REX.

Snake does take Mantis out pretty early in that game. Maybe Liquid planned on using him as plan B or something but never got a chance.

 

[KarmaCow]

It wasn't. Only that prick Huey made a fuss about it.

It took away from your heroism, but that is only because you're butchering your own soldiers.

Sure everyone else tries to tell you that you did the right thing but Snake himself still takes it pretty hard. There's also that scene of him walking down the hallway, covered in blood and the shard being more clearly a horn, as if he's truly fallen.

Not for me. For me I was going through in the hope that some of them would be unaffected by the parasites and becoming more hopeless as I went on. Then, getting to that room where there's men saluting you as you do it. That was heavy stuff. That scene plays on the idea that if you have the goggles, it must mean some of them aren't affected.... but they all are. It takes hope and completely removes it. For me, that was supposed to be the final breaking point and despite a nice little diamond on my stealth suit and fallen comrades, nothing else came of it.

That stuff was good but my issues is more with how they tried to make it seem like some turning point for Snake. The cutscene where you first get those goggles where Snake is hesitant to shoot them soldiers as they mindlessly go for the door is what I was expecting. He tries to disable them but there is a point where he can't and has to just kill.

Also I think the same feeling of your hope eroding away could have happened without those goggles. They could have even cheesed it with Miller not opening the door until you kill all the infected, but the last person you kill is always the last person infected. I dunno, that whole thing just fell flat for me.

 

[Misterinenja]

i'm sure you'll do just fine in this thread

the best way to join a thread is to call people whiners and shit

It made reading the OT unbearable this week.

 

[The Silver]

So if it was Phantom Snake who Solid Snake burned with a flamethrower, what happened to Solidus if it wasn't his body that was taken in?

Venom dies in MG1, real BB still gets lit up on MG2.

I don't know what you're taking about with Solidus, he has nothing to do with any of that.

 

[Zomba13]

If Psycho Mantis could control Sahelanthropus, why did they need the PAL cards in MGS1? I'm pretty sure Liquid's anger and revenge is still just as potent enough to give Mantis the psychic energy to control REX.

Psychic power diminishes with age. That is why he goes from moving a giant mech to move a dualshock controller.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

One thing that slayed in this game tho was the soundtrack (not vocal tracks which were sometimes a bit out of place). The soundtrack always kicked in at the exact right time to really elevate moments in the few cutscenes that elicited an emotional response.

 

[Zomba13]

One thing that slayed in this game tho was the soundtrack (not vocal tracks which were sometimes a bit out of place). The soundtrack always kicked in at the exact right time to really elevate moments in the few cutscenes that elicited an emotional response.

Yup. Except for Sins of the Father which was super awkward and out of place.

It'd have made more sense if the driver popped in The Final Countdown or something.

 

[meltingparappa]

Sure everyone else tries to tell you that you did the right thing but Snake himself still takes it pretty hard. There's also that scene of him walking down the hallway, covered in blood and the shard being more clearly a horn, as if he's truly fallen.

I've giving myself carpal tunnel with all the reaching, but his background as a medic might play into the guilt of him botching a quarantine.

 

[Iceternal]

The ending is so obtuse that no one can interpret it the same way !

Even the Metal Gear wiki gives different interpretations of the ending in different articles.

 

[Garrett Hawke]

Yup. Except for Sins of the Father which was super awkward and out of place.

It'd have made more sense if the driver popped in The Final Countdown or something.

Sins of the Father was suuuuper weird lmao. They just sat there, not talking, and half the time not even looking at each other. Very weird.

 

[Trago]

I think the twist is fine. It just shows how much of a dick BB is. Come to think of it, Zero doesn't seem so bad after this lol.


I miss Quiet

 

[iMax]

Venom dies in MG1, real BB still gets lit up on MG2.

I don't know what you're taking about with Solidus, he has nothing to do with any of that.

But it said in the credits under '1999' that Solid killed Phantom Boss. That's when the events of MG2 occur, right?

edit: you're right! My bad

 

[Mister Negative]

Sins of the Father was suuuuper weird lmao. They just sat there, not talking, and half the time not even looking at each other. Very weird.

Yeah, that was so close to being a good moment. But they botched it.

 

[Godan]

http://www.giantbomb.com/metal-gear...timate-ending-discussion-spoilers-1781915/#28

So finished it all today and started to have a read at what some people theories are. Just read the one above which is kind of interesting.

 

[Misterinenja]

But it said in the credits under '1999' that Solid killed Phantom Boss. That's when the events of MG2 occur, right?

It said 1995 for that.

MG2 occured in 99. That's when Big Boss 'dies'.

 

[Zomba13]

Sins of the Father was suuuuper weird lmao. They just sat there, not talking, and half the time not even looking at each other. Very weird.

Yeah it's like Skull Face didn't time out his speech properly.

"Sooo... This is awkward huh? Sorry, I didn't think the power plant was this far away. So... How's Chico? He been doing ok?"

 

[Mesoian]

Don't know if it's been mentioned yet but Japanese players think the game is unfinished (look at the reviews):

http://www.amazon.co.jp/dp/B00UA3U9SU/

I mean, they're sort of right.

 

[Arion]

Finally I can open this thread.

I saw the people being vocal about their disappointment, as it corrupted the OT like a parasite.

By the way, your whining there didn't manage to ruin the game for me. I knew you were those people hell-bent on abiding canon and needy for conclusions.

Story-arc was meaningless to me after MGS4. It was done, concluded. Peace Walker, I couldn't care for it.

I came in MGSV thirsting for Kojima's artistic vision. I was afraid of by the numbers sequel to Peace Walker to fill in the gap in lore. Thank god I got the former.

His take on modern open world games twists itself around narrative. This game exceeded Sons of Liberty. It makes sense. Almost makes MGS4 better retro-actively.

I'm high on Kojima fumes. Help me. Release me from this phantom.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31dsolM10ng

Welcome to the thread

EDIT; aren't you even slightly disappointed by the fact that they didn't put the final level in the game.

 

[Ishida]

Yeah it's like Skull Face didn't time out his speech properly.

"Sooo... This is awkward huh? Sorry, I didn't think the power plant was this far away. So... How's Chico? He been doing ok?"

Ok this got me.

 

[Tecl0n]

Sins of the Father was suuuuper weird lmao. They just sat there, not talking, and half the time not even looking at each other. Very weird.

It was a failed attempt to recreate the ladder seems to me.

 

[Alfrays]

maybe psycho mantis in MGS1 is weaker because someone opened his head and have removed some part of the brain that amplifies his power. Remember the scars a la Frankenstein?

 

[Sub_Level]

This game exceeded Sons of Liberty. It makes sense.

Are you implying Sons of Liberty doesn't make sense? Because that game explains everything to you repeatedly.

 

[Berserker976]

Finally I can open this thread.

I saw the people being vocal about their disappointment, as it corrupted the OT like a parasite.

By the way, your whining there didn't manage to ruin the game for me. I knew you were those people hell-bent on abiding canon and needy for conclusions.

Story-arc was meaningless to me after MGS4. It was done, concluded. Peace Walker, I couldn't care for it.

I came in MGSV thirsting for Kojima's artistic vision. I was afraid of by the numbers sequel to Peace Walker to fill in the gap in lore. Thank god I got the former.

His take on modern open world games twists itself around narrative. This game exceeded Sons of Liberty. It makes sense. Almost makes MGS4 better retro-actively.

I'm high on Kojima fumes. Help me. Release me from this phantom.

I've kept all my bitching and moaning to this thread thank-you-very-much!

Also,

This game exceeded Sons of Liberty.

Hahahaha!

 

[The Silver]

It was a failed attempt to recreate the ladder seems to me.

Can't top the greatest boss fight in the series

 

[Mister Negative]

kojima's vision of an open world game: an open world game very similar to other open world games

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

One thing that slayed in this game tho was the soundtrack (not vocal tracks which were sometimes a bit out of place). The soundtrack always kicked in at the exact right time to really elevate moments in the few cutscenes that elicited an emotional response.

The music that plays when they choose to make diamonds from their ashes and Venom says "We are Diamond Dogs" is pretty perfect.

 

[Dombrowski]

Quiet's episode 45 cutscene was so freakin badass.

Probably the only cutscene where I felt "YES, this is MGS, more of this PLEASE".. fuck I miss the crazy action and fighting choreography.

 

[ezekial45]

Just finished it, and I loved the ending. I'm still digesting it, but I wanted to share my thoughts on it. Even though it might get ignored over the feed.

I was really surprised that this game had so many parallels to MGS2. That game was about subverting people's expectations for a sequel to Metal Gear Solid (which was probably too meta for people at the time), while TPP focuses on subverting people's expectations for a Big Boss revenge fantasy against Cipher. Even with the comparatively lean approach to its storytelling, I still felt they did a good job of establishing that Big Boss and Venom Snake were the true villains after all. Let's be honest, was Big Boss ever really a good guy? The mission in the Quarantine Platform did a lot to show that. While it was an emotional scene for me, I got pretty attached to my crew, it also proved that essentially "Big Boss" is just a warlord that abuses his reputation to get his followers to fight and even welcome their own deaths. Sure, he may have had some noble-ish intentions with realizing The Boss' dreams, but the reality is truly grim. He's a cult leader, really. And Outer Heaven would be the crowning achievement of MSF/DD's plans. A war cult with their own nation, where they worship the "Big Boss".

I also loved that they took to heart that "Big Boss" was just an idea. Much like we saw in MGS2, Portable Ops, Peace Walker, and now in The Phantom Pain -- Anyone, provided they have the training, drive, and motivation, can become 'Snake'. MGS2 focused on this as well, but it was great seeing this come full circle here. As we all found out while playing, any soldier in Diamond Dogs can tackle the same missions and challenges that Venom Snake/Big Boss could, and maybe even better than he can. I ultimately found Venom Snake's reactions to fitting into the legacy of Big Boss to be pretty fitting. Given that he had brain damage, and along with his close ties to MSF, I can totally see him getting attached to the idea of being "Big Boss". Isn't that what all the soldiers in MSF and DD wanted? To become a legend?

With that said, I stilI felt they could've done much more with the story. I think they ultimately got too focused on remedying common criticisms of MGS' approach to story-telling, and went too far into having it take a backseat. But overall, I was still satisfied with how things turned out. I can understand why people are upset about the story, and the twist itself (which is now TOTALLY obvious after looking at all the old trailers), but I feel like a lot of people aren't giving it enough credit. There's some pretty heavy material in the plot, which ultimately seems to be an indictment on player actions throughout the game.

So yeah, I really enjoyed the story. I was kinda hoping they'd go full on Spec Ops: The Line with MGS, but I'm still pretty happy with how it turned out. The one major thing I'm sad about is that this is truly Kojima's final MGS game. I would've loved to have seen him follow this up with a remake of the Metal Gear games.

 

[fastmower]

Finally I can open this thread.

I saw the people being vocal about their disappointment, as it corrupted the OT like a parasite.

By the way, your whining there didn't manage to ruin the game for me. I knew you were those people hell-bent on abiding canon and needy for conclusions.

Story-arc was meaningless to me after MGS4. It was done, concluded. Peace Walker, I couldn't care for it.

I came in MGSV thirsting for Kojima's artistic vision. I was afraid of by the numbers sequel to Peace Walker to fill in the gap in lore. Thank god I got the former.

His take on modern open world games twists itself around narrative. This game exceeded Sons of Liberty. It makes sense. Almost makes MGS4 better retro-actively.

I'm high on Kojima fumes. Help me. Release me from this phantom.

Are you drunk?