draughn101
Member
For those interested, Cleveland Plasma has stupid good prices on TVs.
Plasma, LCD, OLED, LED, best tv for next gen
- Thread starter spannicus
- Start date
What I was specifically wondering about is if Samsung released an update that specifically targeted the reduction of input lag.
JudgmentJay
Member
I think people just assumed that since the input lag remained the same despite local dimming becoming available.
Tatsumi Oga
Banned
I think it's indeed colour banding then yeah. I guess it's the TV's doing, ah well. I can live with it, and i lowered the brightness to 45 and it seems a lot better now, still visible though.
I do have the TV black level at high and the Xbox One's Colour space at PC RGB, but that should be fine. What I could try this weekend is maybe reset the TV to default settings and then see if it has helped anything. First I should try disabling PC Mode to see if that changes anything.
There's a difference between vizios scaling capability and everyone else. The difference on my LG 65EF9500 is unmistakable. It's color and contrast is what really changes the way the game looks, but mix in its upconversion and it looks like it bumps up power in the ps4. It really impacted the image that dramatically. Thing is outrageous.
Motion on it has been pretty good too since I've adjusted. OLED is strange, pixel response is godly compared to motion which is still pretty good. It really shows flaws in whatever content you throw at it. Garbage in, garbage out. Input lag is tolerable to me. It can be better, and hopefully LG releases and update for this. If not, I'm still happy. It is the best picture on the market.
The best LED on the market is easily the 940C from Sony imho.
These are the Settings for the US version:
http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/sony/x830c/settings
What made you choose especialy this model?
Thanks! I'll test those, especially the color temperature because I have the same ones for everything else. Good to know the TV supports 444 Chroma, I wasn't sure with the belle-nuit test you can find on avs (even if that was a very noticeable improvement over my last TV on red and magenta).
So, yeah, I took this model because it is a very good TV for gaming and I care about picture quality. If you find that review on rtings.com conflicting with what I'm saying, I should add some clarity: I have a bright room but coming from a glossy panel I don't find I have problem with reflections at all (in fact for me, it is almost too matte).
I don't take seriously their view on contrast ratio though, blacks for example are really profound to me for an edge LED, even at night, and I even add to lower the brightness a little. The picture is very soft like I love, very authentic. For my price range it was the best I could find here. Maybe I'm lucky with black uniformity too. Maybe it's not the same exact panel I don't know, it's the 49X8309c in my case.
Picture is fantastic I have to say. Wife test passed, lol.
Glad you are happy with your purchase, I just prefer a VA panel over IPS but if you are using in a bright room there shouldn't a difference except for the much better viewing angle of the IPS panel. I personaly consider the new KD55X8005. But I can't deny the importance of the WAF (wife acceptance factor)
SMOK3Y
Generous Member
Its funny my first plasma (LG they were shockers back then 480p lol) we went from a 68cm 4:3 TV to a 42" 16:9 it took until me & kid pointed it out before she noticed...
EASTC0AST_GH05T
Member
So according to Ratings my 2014 mid tier W700B is better then the 2015 W800C, interesting. I wonder why the input lag is so high on it as well. My tv is basically the W800B without 3D and with a chrome silver bezel like the 2015 W800C. I bought it because Ratings said it has the lowest input lag while in game mode and said its one of the best gaming tvs. http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/sony/w800b . I see it has been discontinued and replaced by the W800C so I better take care of it for a long time lol.
I have to say my wife likes gaming (she plays a lot, more than me in fact), so not only she noticed the new TV, she wanted this one too.
And I have to say she was very ecstatic yesterday!
I really talk too much of my wife here on GAF, though.
DOT DASH DOT
Member
So I'm pretty confused here, everyone says how good the JS9000 is for gaming, but the step down JS8500 is basically the same but with much less lag in PC 444 mode.......
HDTVTEST: Computer gamers (for whom 4:4:4 chroma reproduction may be important) will also be pleased to know that input lag in [PC] mode measured not much higher at 37ms. [Movie] mode, burdened by high-quality video processing, increased lag to 130ms.
Surely how can it be better with a quad core vs an octocore!? Can anyone verify this?
HDTVTEST: Computer gamers (for whom 4:4:4 chroma reproduction may be important) will also be pleased to know that input lag in [PC] mode measured not much higher at 37ms. [Movie] mode, burdened by high-quality video processing, increased lag to 130ms.
Surely how can it be better with a quad core vs an octocore!? Can anyone verify this?
So help me out: I'm thinking about getting one of the following TVs:
$1K: Sony XBR55X810C 55-Inch 4K Ultra HD Smart LED TV
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0148OZLOS/?tag=neogaf0e-20
$1.4K: Samsung UN48JU7500 48" Class Curved 4K Ultra HD 3D Smart LED TV
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16889354965
$1.3K: Samsung UN50JU7100 50" Class 4K Ultra HD 3D Smart LED TV
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16889354974&cm_re=Ju7100-_-89-354-974-_-Product
Primarily used for playing FPS console shooters, but also used for watching TV and movies sometimes. It's gonna be in my "man cave" area of the house so our main TV elsewhere.
I don't really care about the cost difference. I don't know if I care about curved or not. I'm going to wall mount it myself based with my existing wall mount for my old TV that just broke.
My old TV died in just under 3 years because the "board fried". I could fix the board but that would cost at least $400 and I don't know what will break next.
Which one would you buy if you were me? Or should I buy the $400 low latency Vizio instead?
$1K: Sony XBR55X810C 55-Inch 4K Ultra HD Smart LED TV
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0148OZLOS/?tag=neogaf0e-20
$1.4K: Samsung UN48JU7500 48" Class Curved 4K Ultra HD 3D Smart LED TV
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16889354965
$1.3K: Samsung UN50JU7100 50" Class 4K Ultra HD 3D Smart LED TV
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16889354974&cm_re=Ju7100-_-89-354-974-_-Product
Primarily used for playing FPS console shooters, but also used for watching TV and movies sometimes. It's gonna be in my "man cave" area of the house so our main TV elsewhere.
I don't really care about the cost difference. I don't know if I care about curved or not. I'm going to wall mount it myself based with my existing wall mount for my old TV that just broke.
My old TV died in just under 3 years because the "board fried". I could fix the board but that would cost at least $400 and I don't know what will break next.
Which one would you buy if you were me? Or should I buy the $400 low latency Vizio instead?
I just pulled the trigger and ordered the KD55X8005 (US XBR55X810C), went to a local electronic dealer, they had it for just 999 Euro which is even 100 Euro cheaper than the cheapest online price I could find, plus they will pay me back the difference if there is a cheaper offer during black friday week. I think it comes down to personal preference and budget.
I guess you checked rtings already?
http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/sony/x810c
Jigolo
Member
The best TV for responsive gaming would be the 7500. That's the TV I'll be buying in about 2 weeks for Black Friday.
How much savings do you think we can get on BF?
Another thing for me is that I can buy from Newegg free shipping and no tax because out of state.
The no tax is already a big savings that is potentially bigger than a BF savings from a retailer where I would have to pay tax.
Jigolo
Member
I'm thinking around $500. I'd hold out another week for when the BF ads leak. Price of the TV shouldn't change.
Wow you think I can save $500 off of a 7500 if I wait for BF deals? That's a lot.
mitchman
Gold Member
I've upgraded my 65" F9000 from 2013 twice with evolution boxes, the latest this summer was the SEK-3500 which puts the features set around what the top current year model has within the limitations of the panel.
So expect at least 2 years of upgrades.
Curious about real life replies for this as well
This TV is getting good ratings as a great gaming/all around 1080p set for great price
http://www.rtings.com/tv/reviews/vizio/e-series-2015
No need for 4k for me
DOT DASH DOT
Member
Ah ok cool, Samsung don't really explain what actual benefits you get, aside from connectors and codecs etc.
I have one. It's real nice. Returned the M60 for it because the motion blur Was terrible no that one but the E60 is essentially the same but with great blur. Only thing I don't like is that I can see the vertical lines from the meh grey uniformity. Might try to switch it out for another set to see if it's better because even a slight improvement would probably be a huge difference for me. Other than that, once it's set up the tv looks and runs great.
I considered the Sony XBR55W810C but I don't know if I could go back down to 55" after using 60"
Sweet thanks... I sit about 7-8 feet away and wonder if that is too close for the 60" for quality image and seeing the whole screen without moving head around? Am considering 55 as well?
draughn101
Member
I think I've decided to go with the JS9000. It seems like the picture is great as long as I'm not directly comparing it to the OLED and I can't bring myself to buy spend 3-4K on a TV I can't game on, which is about 70% of what I do on them.
Why not the go with the JS7500?
I bought an M60 for the rec room at work this past week, and my first impression of the set's motion resolution/blur with the pre-installed 1.0.6 firmware was just as you described. Updating it to 1.2.23-HD improved it to levels comparable to the Panasonic AX900 I have here at home.
I'd never owned a Vizio before, and I've got to say I'm sold. So much so, in fact, that I've decided to replace the AX900 with the 65" Vizio Reference that releases early next year. That is, until Panasonic puts out a 4K OLED that's worthy of gaming.
draughn101
Member
The reviews for the JS900 have been great and I think that makes up for the $500 price difference. That way I get to game, but I'm still getting a great movie/tv picture too. And 4K, HDR, upgradability.
mitchman
Gold Member
Last year's SEK-2500 added 4k Netflix (H.265/HEVC) support and 2 HDMI 2.0 outputs of which one was HDCP 2.2 compatible (going off memory so it might be off). This year's SEK-3500 added VP9 codec support for 4k Youtube support (which really is glorious at high bitrates), all ports are also now both HDMI 2.2 and HDCP 2.2 compatible. Input lag also decreased significantly to around 22ms in game mode. It also switched to the Tizen OS for the UI of the TV, same as JS9000 has. It's pretty much a JS9000 for most practical purposes.
Monty Mole
Member
HDTVTest is reviewing the UK 8500 which isn't the same as the US 8500. The UK version isn't flat.
Monty Mole
Member
Got my EF9500 OLED today and PS4 games look absolutely insane. Jaw dropping. A massive step up from both my VT65 plasma and 9300 OLED. The upscaling is incredible.
Yes, there's some lag, but it's only noticeable on specific games that already have their own inherent lag, due to accumulation. Eg, Vanishing of Ethan Carter and there's no noticeable lag whatsoever and movement feels 1:1, but in Metro there is definitely some lag, although not game breaking. No noticeable lag in any platformers etc though and no problems even reaching my high scores in Geometry Wars. It's fine for me and the picture quality makes up for it. 90% of my time is watching TV and movies and I don't play competitively any more at all, so this TV definitely fits my lifestyle. If I spent most of my time playing games online, I'd probably have stuck with the 9300 instead, but no way I could go back to LCD.
I noticed the 9500 works the opposite of my 9300 though. PC mode decreased lag (compared to just game picture mode) on the 9300, but it actually increases lag by ~5ms on my 9500. Least lag according to my Bodnar is game picture mode, not labelled PC, and speakers set to external only. Also reduced lag further routing PS4 directly to the TV, rather than via my receiver.
Yes, there's some lag, but it's only noticeable on specific games that already have their own inherent lag, due to accumulation. Eg, Vanishing of Ethan Carter and there's no noticeable lag whatsoever and movement feels 1:1, but in Metro there is definitely some lag, although not game breaking. No noticeable lag in any platformers etc though and no problems even reaching my high scores in Geometry Wars. It's fine for me and the picture quality makes up for it. 90% of my time is watching TV and movies and I don't play competitively any more at all, so this TV definitely fits my lifestyle. If I spent most of my time playing games online, I'd probably have stuck with the 9300 instead, but no way I could go back to LCD.
I noticed the 9500 works the opposite of my 9300 though. PC mode decreased lag (compared to just game picture mode) on the 9300, but it actually increases lag by ~5ms on my 9500. Least lag according to my Bodnar is game picture mode, not labelled PC, and speakers set to external only. Also reduced lag further routing PS4 directly to the TV, rather than via my receiver.
Ladies and Gents I hope it's ok to hijack the thread for a quick question.
I wondered how usable an LG OLED screen gaming is with single player gaming.
I've got fast gaming monitors for serious gaming, but I'd love to enjoy stuff like Uncharted 4 on that screen if indeed possible.
Thanks
I wondered how usable an LG OLED screen gaming is with single player gaming.
I've got fast gaming monitors for serious gaming, but I'd love to enjoy stuff like Uncharted 4 on that screen if indeed possible.
Thanks
What specific numbers were you getting with your device?
I loved the TV but even with the update the blur gave me headaches if the game was 30 fps. I was really bummed to return it because that was literally the only issue I had but it was a deal breaker. Great TV for the value.
I sit about 9 or 10 feet away and I think it's just fine. The picture is great from the distance and I think for the price you pay the value is insane. I'm sure the 55" is great as well it just depends on your size preference. I always try to go as big as possible because I don't want to regret not getting the larger size in the future.
After my last TV purchase, I learned that generally if you think it's too big.. It's probably not, haha.
I sit about 10-11 feet away from my 47", and I think the 55" variant would've been perfect.
Jigolo
Member
I asked a question on rtings...
Me:
The reviewer:
I really appreciated their answer. This site is all kinds of awesome, it isn't the first time I've asked a question and got it answered. Although I do disagree with their scoring algorithms for gaming.
It's irritating that from what I've been reading on HDTVtest, AVForums, FlatpanelsHD, LG doesn't seem to be focusing on gaming at all for next years models (they don't explicitly state it, but hopefully they are behind the scenes). These OLED panels already have the best PQ by far in any TV ever made but they still seem to be pushing the limits of PQ which is totally ok but why not spend some time making the game mode better. Just a little
Me:
Thanks for the review, again. Very thorough as always even though it seems like the EC9300 carbon copy, besides that yellow tint. I'm glad you guys are aware of the banding issues on these LG OLED sets that I've been reading about on AVS forums.
Although, I don't think any of these TVs deserve a 8.9 for Video Games. Yes the response time and motion blur are great but input lag is should carry more weight in the scoring for this category then those other two do. It's the most important thing when it comes to gaming, and I don't see LG improving on thisespecially when LG reps see their TVs are supposedly exceptional like it says on this review. Honestly I wish some of the press would give LG a nudge for us gamers. 4:4:4 chroma while in game mode with sub 20 ms of lag should be achievable, if LG engineers even cared.
OLED TVs can be a master of all trades if the manufacturers wanted it to be. The best TV technology for movies, sports, and games. Imagine that.
The reviewer:
I really appreciated their answer. This site is all kinds of awesome, it isn't the first time I've asked a question and got it answered. Although I do disagree with their scoring algorithms for gaming.
It's irritating that from what I've been reading on HDTVtest, AVForums, FlatpanelsHD, LG doesn't seem to be focusing on gaming at all for next years models (they don't explicitly state it, but hopefully they are behind the scenes). These OLED panels already have the best PQ by far in any TV ever made but they still seem to be pushing the limits of PQ which is totally ok but why not spend some time making the game mode better. Just a little
Are you sure you had everything configured correctly with settings optimized for gaming? It's just odd because there have been numerous comments on here praising the upscaler and overall IQ of this tv, specifically in relation to console gaming.
I am pretty much dead set on getting either the Vizio M55 or M60. Would you still recommend this tv? My intended usage is primarily PS4 gaming.
DOT DASH DOT
Member
So are you getting 22ms lag using game on your 'F9000' then? Sorry only just saw your reply above.. That's great, I'm ordering one tomorrow, the upgrade thing has swung me.
DOT DASH DOT
Member
Didn't realise that! Bloody confusing, goes some way to explain some differences.
draughn101
Member
4K is great for ps4/Xbox one btw. I would recommend it. I think it's killer for the money. Before my OLED arrived I was actually wondering if I made a mistake ordering it because the Vizio was so good. The only downside will be the dirty screen effect. I don't notice it in all games, but it's pretty apparent in some, like BF4. Not a deal breaker by any means. Movies look great too. Just make sure you check the Black Friday deals. I think I saw one leak that had the 60" at $900.
This is a really odd question. What do you define as usable? You then say that you have fast monitors for serious gaming, so I'm not really sure what your position is. Everyone will have a different acceptance to what they're ok with.
To me, it isn't so much that a TV's lag is acceptable in single player, and horrible in mulitplayer (although the latter DEFINITELY exacerbates the lag problem). To me it's about never feeling 100% in control. With the LG 9500 (mostly in shooters, and whenever I'm using a mouse cursor, to be honest) I never feel like things are solid. There's always a bit of swim and float to the cursor. It's a very very minor amount, mind you, but enough that it's always in the way. And even though this TV has an uncanny picture, if I'm not enjoying the experience because I always feel like I'm fighting the controls, then that's enough for me to make a downgrade in picture quality.
I can't tell you if that's what you should do. I'm sure some people thing I'm nuts for thinking this way, since they can't feel the lag. But trust me, it's there.
draughn101
Member
I'm in the same boat. My EC9300 blew me away with the picture, but 40ms with PC and Expert 1 was floaty. I don't like to say I can play this and this on my tv but not this... If you know what I mean. I want to pop something in and go for it. Halo 5 online was pretty difficult to play with 40+ms input lag.
So I'm going for the Samsung JS9000. I know it's not as good picture wise, but I can game, 4K, HDR, and upgrade the processor next year if I want to.