omnislayer
Member
They can't recompile certain games like FF7 because the source code has been lost.
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Sony confirms PS2 emulation coming to PS4
- Thread starter Edge_Maverick
- Start date
Did anyone add trophies to the PS2 games that play on PCSX2?
Ninja Scooter
Member
Well fuck my ass. You got me.
they never worked out how. sony did and it is detailed here
alternatively, here is a GAF post explaining it http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=527460
timmyp53
Member
I played the PC port and never noticed. Now I'll just be thinking about this now. Thanks a lot. *cries*
JetBlackPanda
Member
If they add trophies... Lawd help me.
I will replay all the classics! It would be real fun to have a GAF thread that platinums a PS2 Classic a month or something.
I will replay all the classics! It would be real fun to have a GAF thread that platinums a PS2 Classic a month or something.
Mikey Jr.
Member
Here is what I think will happen/what it will be.
1. There will not be disc support. All this is is Sony releasing PS2 games, but with trophy support, cleaned up graphics, 60fps.
2. This will be "officially" released at PSX. The first batch of games? Ape Escape 2, Twisted Metal: Black, and Dark Cloud 2.
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/8...rk-cloud-2-software-ratings-appear-online.htm
3. Online support? I'm going to say no, but I hope they make exceptions for truly exceptional titles. For instance, having Socom 2 being able to go online. Not sure if this is technically possible though.
4. Price? $10.00
5. They will include 1 PS2 game in with PS Plus.
6. PS2 games will also be rolled into PSNow.
1. There will not be disc support. All this is is Sony releasing PS2 games, but with trophy support, cleaned up graphics, 60fps.
2. This will be "officially" released at PSX. The first batch of games? Ape Escape 2, Twisted Metal: Black, and Dark Cloud 2.
http://www.techtimes.com/articles/8...rk-cloud-2-software-ratings-appear-online.htm
3. Online support? I'm going to say no, but I hope they make exceptions for truly exceptional titles. For instance, having Socom 2 being able to go online. Not sure if this is technically possible though.
4. Price? $10.00
5. They will include 1 PS2 game in with PS Plus.
6. PS2 games will also be rolled into PSNow.
Let's hope we actually get at least one PS2 Classic a month.
Mikey Jr.
Member
They are clearly adding trophies. Not platinums though, if the star wars trophies are anything to go by.
Why do you feel there won't be disc support?
PS Now servers are PS3s, and they're notorious for not only running PS2 Classics poorly but adding extra lag. If Sony adds PS2 games, they've added new servers, possibly PS4 ones.
I'm not sure those Star Wars games are considered PS2 Classics though. Like they seem apart from that branding, also they ported over the SNES Star Wars with trophies. So I'm just not sure we should say they are the exact same thing.
Mr_Appleby
Member
I'm not convinced you know what recompiling is. It's certainly not sticking an ISO in a wrapper or executing it in an emulated environment.
I remember when Sony announced that Killzone was going to be a PS2 classic and I wanted to see if the online still worked even though it was the emulated version on a PS3. Sadly, they never released that PS2 classic and never said anything about it again and the servers went down and they released the HD version of the game.
Online's going to be weird. Technically pretty easy, but will Sony let people play online multiplayer, especially something as potentially popular as SOCOM without going through PSN and therefore PS+? Will they lock out online on Classics if you don't have PS+ or just not bother at all?
Most emulators have the option to recompile the code to run better
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_recompilation
broncobuster
Banned
If and when PS1 emulation comes to PS4, is anybody technically minded enough to know if there's a solution to a lack of z-buffer, the wobbly polygons issue?
funkystudent
Member
They would look ugly as sin but it would be cool if Sony also added PSP playback on PS4.
Lots of cool games that would be fun to play on the big screen. Its not like people are buying Vita TV's anyway
Lots of cool games that would be fun to play on the big screen. Its not like people are buying Vita TV's anyway
clarkision
Member
I can't buy into your last 3 points. If they don't include disc comparability, it'll be free. It already is with the Star Wars games.
They won't give this away for free either, even with PS+, that's a real small pool of games and PS+ value continues to diminish. They won't add to it.
And PS2 games won't be included with NOW. They're too small to make sense streaming.
Black Pewter
Member
If DQ8, Viewtiful Joe, and Rogue Galaxy aren't immediately added to the PSN Store after the announcement in December, I'm buying an i7 and redownloading PCSX2.
that would get me to play MHFU again for sure. of course all those other nice PSP games too
This is why I asked you if you'd consider a game running on PCSX2 a port; I don't think PCSX2 awarding trophies would really change the nomenclature any, it's not like the original game is being altered.
The original question was if FFVII PC was a port of the PC version or the PS1 version running in an emulator. Do I think SE would call the PS1 version emulated in HD a port? Definitely. Even Sony calls PS1 Classics a "conversion":
I wouldn't call a straight ISO rip running in an emulator a conversion, but Sony's not technically wrong.
However, the company that handled the Steam release, Dotemu, was advertising that they were working on the PS4 version. If it was just the PS1 version Dotemu wouldn't be involved at all. Unfortunately apparently Dotemu was pulled from the project, the company has been restructured and they deleted all references to working on the PS4 version, so it's not impossible that what we'll end up with is the PS1 version, emulated, in HD with trophies. I wouldn't be surprised if it was an "It's out now" announcement at PSX.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=169383809&postcount=1
I would wager that whatever solution they have in mind, a significant portion of PS1/PS2 games will no longer have the source code available. We know about it for FF7 because it is a high profile game, and as such SE were asked about it, but there's many more games that will be in the same situation.
I believe that Sony's emulation solution won't require anything more than the original game in iso (or equivalent) format, and these isos will be packaged up with a wrapper. The wrapper will contain the trophy data.
I can believe that MS archived uncompiled code for all 360 titles, presumably during the certification procedure. I can't really believe that Sony did the same for all PS1/PS2 titles. Hell, I wouldn't be totally confident with assuming Sony did the same for all their own PS1/PS2 games.
Smokey_Run
Member
When it comes to costs, I wouldn't mind paying for games if they activate the servers again, such as SOCOM. I'd happily pay $15 or so if it means the servers would be turned back on upon release. Other than that, I highly doubt I'd pay for any emulated PS2 games to be honest.
Mikey Jr.
Member
I do hope they add disc support. 100%
I just feel they won't/cant. Maybe it's not as easy as just popping the disc in and the ps4 plays it. Maybe there has to be a little engineering first.
That's what I think anyways.
Thanks man.
omnislayer
Member
Having to rebuy the PS2 Classics I already own on PS3 would be pretty shitty and pretty unheard of for Sony, considering PS1 Classics you buy on PS3 also work on PSP and Vita/PSTV without having to rebuy them.
Has anyone tested load times for the Star Wars games compared to the same games on original hardware. I gather you could hack a PS2 to load games off a hard drive and one advantage of this was improved load times. Plenty of games have aged fine in terms of design and even graphics, but there's a lot of PS2 games with load times that really date them.
Well surely it depends on the implementation of both. Emulation with enhancements in areas like framerates and resolution is potentially better than some of the more compromised HD remasters. There's cases like Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, where the compromises originally made to get it running on PS2 hardware were significant, and the PS3 remaster (based on the PC version) it always going to be preferable, but there's a reason people are eager for the possibility of emulating the original releases of the PS2 Silent Hill games over the HD collection.
I wonder whether Sony will consider honoring not just PS2 Classics purchased off PSN, but native PS3 remasters of PS2 games. It seems to me that it would be fair to let people that bought these games play the emulated versions of these games on PS4. At least for Sony's own titles. For myself, I bought ICO & SOTC HD and Sly Trilogy, both on PSN. I'd be pleased if having bought these also granted me access to versions of the contained games on PS4. Sony would be under no obligation to offer this of course, but it would be nice.
Well surely it depends on the implementation of both. Emulation with enhancements in areas like framerates and resolution is potentially better than some of the more compromised HD remasters. There's cases like Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, where the compromises originally made to get it running on PS2 hardware were significant, and the PS3 remaster (based on the PC version) it always going to be preferable, but there's a reason people are eager for the possibility of emulating the original releases of the PS2 Silent Hill games over the HD collection.
I wonder whether Sony will consider honoring not just PS2 Classics purchased off PSN, but native PS3 remasters of PS2 games. It seems to me that it would be fair to let people that bought these games play the emulated versions of these games on PS4. At least for Sony's own titles. For myself, I bought ICO & SOTC HD and Sly Trilogy, both on PSN. I'd be pleased if having bought these also granted me access to versions of the contained games on PS4. Sony would be under no obligation to offer this of course, but it would be nice.
Kenzodielocke
Banned
you guys honestly think Sony is going to make you rebuy ps2 classic games you bought on PSX? When was Sony so anti-consumer?
You can play your PSX games you bought digitally on three different platforms and even use the saves.
You can play your PSX games you bought digitally on three different platforms and even use the saves.
There is most likely no touching of PS1/PS2 ISOs. Sony/devs probably tweak settings of the emulator itself to ensure good high-res work, and then select what disk/memory states/changes need to be tracked for awarding Trophies.
I don't think they would all look ugly depending on the quality of the resolution boost
Consumer
Member
Holy shit.
Not sure how I didn't realize this before. This is a legit anti-megaton for me. If there aren't platinum trophies for these emulated games, I have no interest in returning to the PS2 era.
Valkyri von Thanatos
Member
My sarcasm meter, it can't make heads or tails on this one! Honestly, not having trophies is a good relief in my opinion. I almost thought you were saying that adding in trophies would be a deal breaker because it adds needless distraction to the original game, but then I checked your post more closely. Well, to each their own I guess, glad I don't care too much about these I guess, used to with Xbox 360 games, but trophies never clicked with me exactly, and I'm pretty much exclusively PlayStation now so it doesn't really matter to me.
potatohead
Member
Yea seriously.
Don't put trophies in classics, heck no.
Let them be the experiences they are.
SolidSnakex
Member
I think digital games that you've bought on PSN will will likely be compatible. But discs? That's a lot more questionable.
Krusenstern
Banned
Exactly. No need to worry about rebuying PS Classics which you already own on PSN. That's how they handle emulated games. Buy one time, play on multiple systems.
Still don't understand why people don't count one and one toghether.
What we should actually worry about is whether or not disc based emulation will work. Because sure as hell, I can't see Sony bringing games like Champions of Norrath, Baldur's Gate Dark Alliance, and King's Field to PSN.
Spieler Eins
Member
I mean, the whole point of BC is that you don't need to dig up your old hardware.
Just a select number of classics that release sporadically isn't exactly something to celebrate over, or rather something that aims at other groups/needs to begin with. However, the first trademarks (Ape Escape, Dark Cloud) at least are something that hasn't even been on PS3 yet. Still, before games of my interest are eventually uploaded (if ever), I'll be old - in particular if the EU store is again lacking compared to other regions.
Hopefully the 360 bc somewhat pushes them to consider an emulator for discs.
Just a select number of classics that release sporadically isn't exactly something to celebrate over, or rather something that aims at other groups/needs to begin with. However, the first trademarks (Ape Escape, Dark Cloud) at least are something that hasn't even been on PS3 yet. Still, before games of my interest are eventually uploaded (if ever), I'll be old - in particular if the EU store is again lacking compared to other regions.
Hopefully the 360 bc somewhat pushes them to consider an emulator for discs.
That's all part of the charm of PS1 graphics! Increasing the native resolution and applying texture filtering is one thing, but I love the wobbly glitching.
Depends on how much they boost the internal resolution. Some PSP games actually don't look bad at all running on emulation.
Cheat Code
Member
Are you seriously just playing games for a little badge that indicates you did a thing? Are you skipping some digital games because they don't include a shiny picture of trophy? Would you skip a hotly anticipated game of yours because of it?
If you answer yes to any or especially all of these questions, take up stamp collecting. It's better suited to your interests.
stan423321
Member
Honestly this is an interesting criterion. No one did as long as I'm aware, but this doesn't sound like something particularly hard to do, depending on "trophy quality" ("advance to level 7" would be easier than "juggle 5 mooks on one savefile"). If someone did that to prove you wrong (and maybe add a trophy replay saver), would you accept it?
stan423321
Member
Of course there are solutions, but I don't think they're economically viable. For starters you could make a fake "PS1+" with less wobbly polygons and a Z-Buffer, then adjust the games to run on that. Just like this fake SNES cartridge with CD Audio - it even runs on some flashcarts!
...Honestly I don't think there's anything very different from that. Apparently PS1 GPU interface already acknowledges how it works. So while Dolphin and PCSX2 can increase resolution of their GPU modules, PS1 GPU module has no info unless it dives into CPU code.
SolidSnakex
Member
They'll have trophies. The first sign of this happening was in 2013 when someone found a patent that Sony had filed about a way to implement trophies into games that previously didn't feature them. And the four Star Wars games all have trophies, including Super Star Wars which was a SNES game.