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[BattleMonkey]

One thing that keeps me busy thinking .... wasn't Snoke incredibly chilled just after being informed that the First Order is going to lose the Starkiller? Like "yeah ok Hux, get off the planet and bring Kylo Ren with you, all fine, Snoke out."?

So, is it because the main purpose, the destruction of the New Republic is done, or does the First Order have more super-weapons?

Also, maybe i did miss it, was the planet that got destroyed Coruscant? Or did the New Republic chose another planet for their capital?

They don't really state what planets were destroyed by Starkiller base, doubt it was Coruscant.

Course they also don't state anything about the capabilities of Starkiller base, like does it have range limits? What planets does it blow up? How does it even work?

 

[WadiumArcadium]

They don't really state what planets were destroyed by Starkiller base, doubt it was Coruscant

Hosnian Prime was one. The current capital of the Republic. They say the Hosnian system in the film.

 

[DrROBschiz]

My guess is that Snoke put all this in place to draw out Luke Skywalker.

I would have rather not seen a retread of Super Weapon story but I know why they did it

This first movie almost HAD to be be what it was.... Or at least I feel like they committed to doing this neo retelling of Ep4 to get people back in after the prequel mess

They really need to step things up for EP8

 

[Gonzalez]

"Death Planet" felt like such a fucking jobber. The tiny ass Death Star put up more of a fight, than this giant brick shit house.

 

[Wrynnax]

Does it not seem obvious that Snoke would intentionally leave his apprentice only strong enough to overpower nobodies, so he would have no real threat to be overthrown/killed by Ren? Now Snoke realizing there is a legit threat, must fully train Ren in order to add a buffer between Snoke and the light? Seems logical to me.

This actually makes a lot of sense!

 

[Pai Pai Master]

Kylo Ren cannot be redeemed. He didn't just kill Han he was complacent in the murder of billions.

If he somehow does see the light and turn on Snoke he'll be defeated almost instantly. Characters like that don't get the full redemption and just turn into heroes.

 

[DrROBschiz]

"Death Planet" felt like such a fucking jobber. The tiny ass Death Star put up more of a fight, than this giant brick shit house.

Probably the weakest part of the whole "repeat Ep4" formula. For sure

This movie is going to get plenty of criticism but hey

Not as bad as the prequels... And honestly... The original movies arent perfect either

 

[Ferr986]

I think Force ghost is a stupid idea and I have a feeling writers feel the same too.

Episode VIII : "We will have Luke die this episode, thus completing Rey's training. Without her mentor to fall back on, she will have to mature on her own while confronting her nemesis."

Episode IX: "Nah, man, Luke's force ghost will appear and guide Rey. Also Anakin lecturing Kylo while we're at it."

It's a slippery slope, force ghosts. Not having them will make people question, having them will make deaths cheap.

I did read here some post talking about Anaking ghost appearing to Kylo but why he would do that when he ends up being good at the end of VI?

Making Anakin a bad ghost would, IMO, go against everything Vader and Anakin was.

The only reasonable thing I can think of is that Kylo is so crazy he thinks he sees Anakin guiding him, or Darth Thanos tricking him into it.

 

[Solo]

Snoke was probably my least favorite thing about this movie. His design looked like something out of Harry Potter or some shit.

 

[Dash_Riprock]

One small nitpick: Why did TIE fighters go from single-man fighters to requiring two crewmen (pilot+gunner)? Seems like a step backwards to me.

 

[DrROBschiz]

I did read here some post talking about Anaking ghost appearing to Kylo but why he would do that when he ends up being good at the end of VI?

Making Anakin a bad ghost would, IMO, go against everything Vader and Anakin was.

The only reasonable thing I can think of is that Kylo is so crazy he thinks he sees Anakin guiding him, or Darth Thanos tricking him into it.

I think its compelling since for some reason Kylo doesnt know the Truth about what happened between Luke and Vader

Like.... now that I think about it.... Having Ben convert still doesnt make sense.... Like cmon... Daddy issues pushing you to crazy incessant murder?

One small nitpick: Why did TIE fighters go from single-man fighters to requiring two crewmen (pilot+gunner)? Seems like a step backwards to me.

It gets worse

Where are the interceptors, A-wings, Y-wings and the rest of the diverse lineup of ships

 

[SporeCrawler]

I've heard legends of that man...
He was powerful enough to defeat a Jedi Hippie!
And valiantly fought the great Kenobi.

shit that fight was gorgeous. as much as i liked force awakens none of the fight scenes came remotely close to maul vs. kenobi vs. jeddi hipster jinn

 

[Gonzalez]

Snoke was probably my least favorite thing about this movie. His design looked like something out of Harry Potter or some shit.

He looked like the damn Mummy before he got his skin back. Felt like a step back for CGI anytime he was on screen.

 

[cubicle47b]

This was a problem in JJ's Star Trek's as well, there's almost no concept of distance or the passage of time. It's funny for a guy who did a lot of tv work, he seems to have little sense of when to let the story breathe for a bit everything moves almost absurdly quickly. Everything is rushed in his movie work. TFA really needed a couple of extra scenes to let the story breathe. While I hate montages, something like that was needed in the end to evoke a sense of time. Hell even a couple of lines of dialogue between Rey and R2 on the Falcon (You're sure it's THIS system, you said that about the last two") would have given the sense of an actual journey to find Luke.

Yes, between the super-weapon's speed and range and the lack of time spent in hyperspace the galaxy felt really small in The Force Awakens. The galaxy map doesn't help.

 

[BattleMonkey]

One small nitpick: Why did TIE fighters go from single-man fighters to requiring two crewmen (pilot+gunner)? Seems like a step backwards to me.

Those are the special forces tie fighters. There are two types of TIE's in the movies. The special forces ones with two seats have gun turrets and can shoot to the rear

 

[Aiii]

Luke should see his usual force ghosts, Ben and Yoda, asking them for guidance.

Other then that, no force ghosts needed.

Also, Han already died, Luke doesn't need to die, really no reason for anyone else from the OT to die. We already have those emotional stakes to drive the two sequels in this trilogy, adding another death instead of a completely different emotional cue (like Vader's reveal to Luke) is not only unnecessary, but will suffer from diminishing returns.

 

[JetBlackPanda]

One small nitpick: Why did TIE fighters go from single-man fighters to requiring two crewmen (pilot+gunner)? Seems like a step backwards to me.

It added a rear gunner is all. I am pretty sure forward guns work the same.

 

[flkraven]

Don't know if it's been discussed but god I hope Rey isn't related to anyone. I know she probably will be but I'm sick of everyone being related. The new Jedi order be a bunch of inbred.

 

[Lord of Castamere]

By that logic shouldn't he have been insignificant in the OT too? The leaders of the Empire and First Order have a personal interest in Luke because of his powers, likewise Leia knows that only Luke is powerful enough to overcome Kylo and Snoke.

He was though. Han was the general. Luke was just a squadron leader. He was a good pilot because he was a Jedi, but still he was only an SL because of his war hero status and piloting skills. Did they do a manhunt for him when he was training with Yoda?

Shit in Return he had moved away from the rebellion almost completely. Han was leader again, and Luke had an outcast vibe. They didn't even ask Luke to confront Vader, he did that solo.

When you think about it Han was the important one. Luke was a just distraction. If he had died, or killed Vader and flipped villian, they all still would have died in the explosion.

 

[SporeCrawler]

One small nitpick: Why did TIE fighters go from single-man fighters to requiring two crewmen (pilot+gunner)? Seems like a step backwards to me.

in general the technology seems to have taken a step down rather than a step up. the speeder that is driven by ray seems way worse than that elegant speeder that luke drove. even the speeder of darth maul seemed more compact.

Don't know if it's been discussed but god I hope Rey isn't related to anyone. I know she probably will be but I'm sick of everyone being related. The new Jedi order be a bunch of inbred.

Finn is there for you. Man I hope he will be a jedi.

It gets worse

Where are the interceptors, A-wings, Y-wings and the rest of the diverse lineup of ships

in general the technological leap that was achieved during episodes I-III was amazing. they had new types of battle droids in every movie and the starships in general evolved from a totally different much more colorful design to a form that ultimately resembled the TIE and XWing design near the end.

in comparison here we had 30 years between episodes and the technology just stayed where it is (sans starkiller base.)

Probably the weakest part of the whole "repeat Ep4" formula. For sure

This movie is going to get plenty of criticism but hey

Not as bad as the prequels... And honestly... The original movies arent perfect either

the prequels get undeserved shit. Episode III is one of my most favorite starwars films and Episode I should get some props for originality in its setting and also the awesome maul vs. kenobi vs. jinn fight. I agree that Episode II was overall pretty boring

 

[WadiumArcadium]

I think its compelling since for some reason Kylo doesnt know the Truth about what happened between Luke and Vader

According to the novel of the film, he does. And JJ has said so too.

“Kylo Ren idolizes Darth Vader, not Anakin Skywalker,” Abrams explained. “He idolizes what Vader represents and what Vader was trying to do. The idea that Vader didn’t succeed, if you look at it from Ren’s point of view, he was seduced by the enemy and failed because of that seduction. So the idea is that Ren wants to complete the thing that Vader started.”

As for what drove Ren himself away from that enemy (the Light Side) and towards the path his idol took, Abrams called it, “An incredible power. An incredible Force and an incredible potential, that was like with many young people sort of misguided and unclear. The story for him is one of conflict — not just external conflict, but internal conflict, and it’s what makes him, I think, an interesting villain.”

 

[DrROBschiz]

Luke should see his usual force ghosts, Ben and Yoda, asking them for guidance.

Other then that, no force ghosts needed.

Also, Han already died, Luke doesn't need to die, really no reason for anyone else from the OT to die. We already have those emotional stakes to drive the two sequels in this trilogy, adding another death instead of a completely different emotional cue (like Vader's reveal to Luke) is not only unnecessary, but will suffer from diminishing returns.

They killed Han because Harrison Ford doesnt have it in him to commit to this shit

Can you blame the guy? Hes old tired and sore. Im actually quite impressed with how much he did in this movie honestly

 

[VistraNorrez]

The moment when Han put his hand on Ren's face, after being stabbed and dying yet still obviously loved his son, had more emotion than the entire franchise combined. Was an amazing moment.

It looked great, and their performances were good, but I didn't feel much from it. I have no idea why. The digital pixels of a Pixar make me well up multiple times a movie, so I'm not some cold, dead-eyed monster. Hell, when Luke takes Vader's mask off in Jedi, I feel a little tug at might heart. And the last time I watched Jedi and Luke surrenders to Vader on Endor and Vader says "It is too late for me, son." That had affected me like it never did before. Those Vader Luke scenes in Jedi are powerful. Looking forward to Kylo Luke scenes in the next one.

Now the build up to Kylo stabbing Han was intense. I knew as soon as he decided to go after Kylo, it was over, and my heart was pumping like mad.

 

[Henkka]

in general the technology seems to have taken a step down rather than a step up. the speeder that is driven by ray seems way worse than that elegant speeder that luke drove. even the speeder of darth maul seemed more compact.

The level of technology is probably uneven across the galaxy. Jakku is a junkyard.

 

[BattleMonkey]

It gets worse

Where are the interceptors, A-wings, Y-wings and the rest of the diverse lineup of ships

Gotta save new ships for the sequel's merch.

in general the technology seems to have taken a step down rather than a step up. the speeder that is driven by ray seems way worse than that elegant speeder that luke drove. even the speeder of darth maul seemed more compact.

Rey's speeder was made of scavenged parts, it wasn't a purchased speeder like Luke's family had.

 

[JetBlackPanda]

Can't wait for that Rey, I am you father - luke scene

lol honestly I do hope Rey is lukes kid but please don't do the above

 

[DerZuhälter]

To defeat Kylo Ren.

Luke is also the guy who defeated Darth Vader, so if a new major bad guy shows up, you want the help of a legend like that.

The dude who got shot by a walking carpet and wounded by 2 untrained kids? Seems like overkill. Also don't understand how anyone knows how or if HE himself defeated Darth Vader.

By that logic shouldn't he have been insignificant in the OT too?

Well Star Wars is a bit inconsistent in that matter. One time Jedis are only peace keepers who can't fight a war, the next time they fight wars and in the OT Vader goes so far as saying he and Luke could rule the galaxy together.
Yet I still belive in the grand scheme of things Luke was insignificant. That's the entire point. Normal dude got tangled up in an epic space adventure, and finds out that he's the son of the big bad guy. Big bad guy + that guys boss tried to turn him, but he wasn't the deciding factor for winning the war. Well except for when he blew up that piece of architectural garbage that was the Death Star.

It's kind of stupid. I have no idea what Luke is supposed to do in the next movie.
Be a generell and lead armies? Train Jedis? How does he pose such a threat that even the new order want him out of the picture?

 

[DrROBschiz]

According to the novel of the film, he does. And JJ has said so too.

But Vader wast Seduced

He sought to betray the Emperor the minute he knew about Luke. He says so himself as the end of Ep5

That was before Luke tried to convince him to abandon his plans for world domination

I only bring this up because I recently rewatched the original trilogy after a long time and this stood out to me

 

[Aiii]

They killed Han because Harrison Ford doesnt have it in him to commit to this shit

Yeah, this doesn't change anything about what I said

 

[Dash_Riprock]

in general the technology seems to have taken a step down rather than a step up. the speeder that is driven by ray seems way worse than that elegant speeder that luke drove. even the speeder of darth maul seemed more compact.

I can forgive that since Jakku looks to be even more of a backwater world than Tattooine.

 

[kmag]

They killed Han because Harrison Ford doesnt have it in him to commit to this shit

Can you blame the guy? Hes old tired and sore. Im actually quite impressed with how much he did in this movie honestly

I was actually impressed we didn't get Harrison sleep walking through the film like everything in his career for the last 20 years. He actually seemed engaged and almost happy to be there to close off the character.

 

[Real Hero]

Snoke was probably my least favorite thing about this movie. His design looked like something out of Harry Potter or some shit.

yeah snoke is lame, hopefully he's a like a foot tall and kylo kills him

 

[LNBL]

Liking this track more and more (The Jedi Steps and Finale)

https://open.spotify.com/track/6qyhCojkTfLM3GOB2gO6dm

 

[VistraNorrez]

But Vader wast Seduced

He sought to betray the Emperor the minute he knew about Luke. He says so himself as the end of Ep5

That was before Luke tried to convince him to abandon his plans for world domination

I only bring this up because I recently rewatched the original trilogy after a long time and this stood out to me

Kylo Ren is delusional, like all of those seduced by the Dark Side. That want the Dark Side to be more powerful than the Light, so they do whatever they need to make that happen going so far as to believe that it's the right thing to do.

 

[Discotheque]

Liking this track more and more (The Jedi Steps and Finale)

spotify:track:6qyhCojkTfLM3GOB2gO6dm

best williams track i've heard since munich. this brings back that sound of mystery that he had in stuff like ET.

 

[SporeCrawler]

I can forgive that since Jakku looks to be even more of a backwater world than Tattooine.

to be honest it looked exactly like tatooine. I dont get why they had to make an extra planet that is just a one on one copy of tatooine. even the alien life forms looked similar. (okay no tuscan raiders)

The level of technology is probably uneven across the galaxy. Jakku is a junkyard.

Rey's speeder was made of scavenged parts, it wasn't a purchased speeder like Luke's family had.

that does make sense. still the ship designs of both the resistance and the first order did not change in 30 years. star destroyers, x-wings and tie fighters had no significant design upgrades.

 

[neorej]

During that battle when they lay waste to Maz's castle, and you see the X-wings in the distance, the smile on my face was huge. Was definitly a highlight of the film. Having Poe in that squadron was a bonus.

 

[DrROBschiz]

Kylo Ren is delusional, like all of those seduced by the Dark Side. That want the Dark Side to be more powerful than the Light, so they do whatever they need to make that happen going so far as to believe that it's the right thing to do.

Well they need to give him tangible motivation cuz as of right now he seems insane and pitiful

His catalyst for going dark seem even weaker than Anakins in the prequels

 

[catapult37]

Holy crap where did the First Order get the resources to build the Starkiller?

 

[WadiumArcadium]

But Vader wast Seduced

He sought to betray the Emperor the minute he knew about Luke. He says so himself as the end of Ep5

That was before Luke tried to convince him to abandon his plans for world domination

I only bring this up because I recently rewatched the original trilogy after a long time and this stood out to me

He says that but he had the opportunity to kill the Emperor in Jedi or just let Luke kill him.

Holy crap where did the First Order get the resources to build the Starkiller?

I assume there are lots of planets in the uncharted regions with resources for them to use.

 

[BattleMonkey]

to be honest it looked exactly like tatooine. I dont get why they had to make an extra planet that is just a one on one copy of tatooine. even the alien life forms looked similar. (okay no tuscan raiders)

They were trying to emulate ANH while also being different.... its like Luke on Tatooine... but it's not.... see

 

[DrROBschiz]

He says that but he had the opportunity to kill the Emperor in Jedi or just let Luke kill him.

Well Luke basically wanted Vader to quit and come home lol

Vade be like "but son I have a plan. We need to rule this land"

Then hes like Fuck it guess I gotta kill the Emperor

 

[Drinkel]

My biggest nitpick with this movie: Whats the point of Stormtrooper helmets if they don't have a filter for poison gas? Also why reveal that and then proceed to do nothing with it? The Empire/The First Order doesn't strike me as having budget concerns.

Anyway I think this movie is getting better the more I let it sink in.

 

[Messypandas]

Harrison Ford had a shot of adrenaline in this movie, moreso than Indy 4. I reckon he doesn't hate Han Solo as much as he hates working under Geoge (i know George is involved with Indy but obviously Steven is running the directing ship). You can hear in this interview Harrison really makes it sound like Lucas wanted to overrule the greatest line comeback in film history

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IgJYHsqJ6Ag

I think thats why Harrison just wanted the character killed off a number of times. If George sold the rights in the 80's I reckon he would have done another 3.

 

[trudderham]

I get the feeling that in 5/10/20 years when people watch all 9 movies for the first time they're going to get to this latest film and think "haven't I already watched this movie?" Yeah it's full of nostalgia, but at some point in the future that won't have relevance to the next generation of audiences.

 

[Napoleonthechimp]

Holy crap where did the First Order get the resources to build the Starkiller?

The engineering ability in the Star Wars universe has always been ridiculous.

 

[opoth]

Well they need to give him tangible motivation cuz as of right now he seems insane and pitiful

His catalyst for going dark seem even weaker than Anakins in the prequels

I would argue that Ren's motivations are the most real out of any dark side user in the series. Imagine being part of some sort of well known political family like the Kennedys, Clintons or Bushes and not feeling like you correctly measure up to those who came before you. Throw in a little of the privilege that comes tied to that sort of pedigree and you have someone like Kylo Ren. Entitled and insecure.

 

[Ushojax]

One thing that keeps me busy thinking .... wasn't Snoke incredibly chilled just after being informed that the First Order is going to lose the Starkiller? Like "yeah ok Hux, get off the planet and bring Kylo Ren with you, all fine, Snoke out."?

So, is it because the main purpose, the destruction of the New Republic is done, or does the First Order have more super-weapons?

Also, maybe i did miss it, was the planet that got destroyed Coruscant? Or did the New Republic chose another planet for their capital?

I think he is more interested in Luke and Rey than the Resistance. I really hope he isn't just a Palpatine ripoff though, his character was so vague in TFA that there is plenty of wiggle room for the writers.

 

[George Oscar Bluth II]

Rey's Theme and Jedi Steps

 

[Occam]

This was a problem in JJ's Star Trek's as well, there's almost no concept of distance or the passage of time. It's funny for a guy who did a lot of tv work, he seems to have little sense of when to let the story breathe for a bit everything moves almost absurdly quickly. Everything is rushed in his movie work. TFA really needed a couple of extra scenes to let the story breathe. While I hate montages, something like that was needed in the end to evoke a sense of time. Hell even a couple of lines of dialogue between Rey and R2 on the Falcon (You're sure it's THIS system, you said that about the last two") would have given the sense of an actual journey to find Luke.

He's also not that fond of establishing shots in space action sequences which really makes it a struggle to get a sense of where everything is in relation to each other.

I had a great time with the film, but seeing it a second time this stuff really jumped out, it's just unnecessarily lazy. On a first viewing the story and pace carries you along, but some of the short cuts taken are a bit grating.

I fully agree. A bit less noise and hectic jumping around at times would have made the movie much better. The camera often seemed too close. There was a lack of establishing shots. For instance the first appearance of the villain at the beginning of the movie was poorly filmed. A few quiet scenes explaining what happened with the republic since Episode VI, eg by means of simple dialogue, were sorely missing. Sometimes, less is more, a concept that as also shown in his Star Trek movies, Abrams doesn't seem to be overly fond of. Maybe it's a good thing that Episode VIII will be directed by Rian Johnson, whose style of directing appears to be more subtle.