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[Snowman Prophet of Doom]

My family looks at politics as who will fuck us over the least.

At present moment it's the Democratic "establishment".

In some alternate universe where the GOP became a champion of black rights and were genuine about it, we'd switch in a goddamn heartbeat.

I was thinking it would be very interesting if, in 40 years, some GOP political mastermind spearheaded an initiative to get his party behind reparations for redlining and Jim Crow, on the grounds that the free market doesn't work properly if there is a large underclass with huge structural disadvantages impeding it. If the GOP could use racism to bait a large portion of the country into being anti-big government, I could see them doing it with anti-racism once some generational forgetting sets in.

 

[Ashodin]

I hope the younger crowd that Bernie attracts doesn't decide to just skip the election when he drops out. Having those kind of people go out and vote for the House/Senate election could do a lot of good for the DNC.

TBH, I was already thinking of not voting if Hillary becomes the nom, but then I realized that that line of thinking is really asinine and selfish. Just because I didn't get what I wanted doesn't mean I should withhold my important vote.

 

[Spider from Mars]

General Election polls mean jack shit during primaries. Wait until after the convention before spouting those numbers.

 

[JHoNNy1OoO]

Bernie has caucused with Democrats the entire time he's been a Senator. The idea that he won't endorse HIllary when she gets the nomination is laughable.

Seriously. Bernie is a pragmatic politician which is why he's been able to run and win as an Independent. He is not some ideologue and he knows that Hillary over any GOP candidate is better for progress in this country.

TBH, I was already thinking of not voting if Hillary becomes the nom, but then I realized that that line of thinking is really asinine and selfish. Just because I didn't get what I wanted doesn't mean I should withhold my important vote.

The last thing Bernie would want is to put the White House back in GOP hands with BOTH the House and the Senate and the Bernie supporters better fucking wake up to that fact.

 

[Manmademan]

Bernie polls better in general election match-ups right now because he hasn't endured negative campaigning for 25 years the way Hillary has. I don't think his numbers would hold up at all.

In fact there was a TPM story recently about some polling outfit who message tested the most likely attacks against Bernie and how it affected his head-to-head numbers. Bernie went from leading all of the Republicans to trailing all of them heavily. All that swing voters/soft conservatives know about him right now is that he's not Hillary and he's not part of the establishment. I'm not very confident they'd stick by him after finding out what his platform is.

EXACTLY.

 

[kirblar]

Bernie polls better in general election match-ups right now because he hasn't endured negative campaigning for 25 years the way Hillary has. I don't think his numbers would hold up at all.

In fact there was a TPM story recently about some polling outfit who message tested the most likely attacks against Bernie and how it affected his head-to-head numbers. Bernie went from leading all of the Republicans to trailing all of them heavily. All that swing voters/soft conservatives know about him right now is that he's not Hillary and he's not part of the establishment. I'm not very confident they'd stick by him after finding out what his platform is.

I saw this happen w/ Obama.

 

[exmachina64]

I personally think that if that's how the democracy in US makes people think then it's not very democratic.

Democracy in the U.S. is not designed to promote democracy, it's designed to promote compromise.

 

[Blader]

I would be very surprised and disappointed if Hillary won the nomination and Bernie didn't stump for her.

 

[Livingskeletons]

I knew Bernie was a longshot, but it still stings. Damn, not really enthused at all for voting for Hilary in November. The gloating and rubbing salt in the wounds doesn't help none either.

Yeah I kinda wish Biden had joined the race now.

 

[Mr. RPG]

#politics

Election years are rough.

 

[Slayven]

He wouldn't win. Hell, I've seen a lot of Republicans say they would vote for her if Trump was the nominee.

That speaks volumes if Republicans say they would vote for a Democrat than to have Trump in the white house.

The GOP is a mess, you got people willing to go on camera and say "I don't like them" when it comes to their 2 top candidates. Hell even Paul Ryan fresh on the job cast shade on Cruz, the number 2 guy on their side. You know shit is fucked up. THey should take a cycle off and rebuild.

 

[massivekettle]

Just went onto r/Politics. Put it simply... if GOP wants dirt on Clinton, r/Politics is the go-to place

 

[RPGCrazied]

I would be very surprised and disappointed if Hillary won the nomination and Bernie didn't stump for her.

Of course he would. We need to win this. Then Obama can come out and really make a difference.

 

[BanGy.nz]

Head's up Bernie fans, at least he'll crush it in Vermont and probably take Massachusetts in a few weeks time.

 

[Chariot]

I hope the younger crowd that Bernie attracts doesn't decide to just skip the election when he drops out. Having those kind of people go out and vote for the House/Senate election could do a lot of good for the DNC.

Would be good start to congratulate them for their diligent work for a candidate and their participation in the democratic process. But so far people seem more interested in discarding the new voters for the celebration of their own victory.

 

[A Human Becoming]

No they don't. If they did, Romney would be president - he led with independents in Ohio. That's why his team was so confident of a win, and why Rove had a meltdown - they were leading with Independants, and yet lost by a hefty margins and a large number of EVs.

A large amount of 'Independants' are republicans who don't want to say they are.

Do you have source most independents lean Republican?

That still doesn't dispute my claim. Of the votes cast in 2012, 36.88% from the two major parties went to Obama while 32.42% went to Romney. Neither party is large enough to win an election. Romney won independents by 5 points, which made up 29% of voters, but that wasn't enough to make up the difference.

 

[shintoki]

Bernie polls better in general election match-ups right now because he hasn't endured negative campaigning for 25 years the way Hillary has. I don't think his numbers would hold up at all.

In fact there was a TPM story recently about some polling outfit who message tested the most likely attacks against Bernie and how it affected his head-to-head numbers. Bernie went from leading all of the Republicans to trailing all of them heavily. All that swing voters/soft conservatives know about him right now is that he's not Hillary and he's not part of the establishment. I'm not very confident they'd stick by him after finding out what his platform is.

That is definitely a positive on Hillary and I think she needs to play on it more. There is a candidate up there which has been attacked even a quarter of her. All her laundry is out in the open and she is still standing.

 

[Eidan]

Oh, so, people should be gloating, looking down on other people and insulting them backhanded, because it will be forgotten in a few months? I would prefer if we would be on good terms with each other starting now, not just in a few months when people remember they need the other people.

Did I say that?

 

[Touchdown]

Bernie needs to come up huge in the upcoming caucus states because he's going to need every delegate possible from this point on. Just like 2008 Hillary will come up big in the Super Tuesday states, and the coastal and southern states. If Bernie wants to stay competitive he's going to really need to win some Super Tuesday states.

 

[alternade]

Watching The Young Turks on YouTube and they are mad salty.

"Shes more unelectable"
"Timing of caucuses were in favor of older voters, favoring Clinton"
"Sanders OBLITERATED her lead with Latinos"
"He only needs to win everything else"
"Its not really a win for her, only 5%"

The mental gymnastics......................

 

[Crashdown]

Election years are rough.

Makes me extraordinarily jealous when I hear about Canada's "hard fought 7 week campaigns"

 

[Manmademan]

I saw this happen w/ Obama.

Yep. Obama was largely assumed to be bulletproof during the primaries, because he lacked the scandals that had dogged the clintons and didn't really have much of a voting record that could be used against him.

The republican smear machine STILL managed to paint him as a kenyan america hating muslim who pals around with terrorists. He still won, but he got hit HARD.

Bernie would get hit SO much harder.

 

[Crashdown]

C'mon people, dispense with this civility. More D-Generation X crotch chop gifs!

 

[Slayven]

Watching The Young Turks on YouTube and they are mad salty.

"Shes more unelectable"
"Timing of caucuses were in favor of older voters, favoring Clinton"
"Sanders OBLITERATED her lead with Latinos"
"He only needs to win everything else"
"Its not really a win for her, only 5%"

The mental gymnastics......................

Yeah the Turks have really fallen.

 

[Thunder Monkey]

Obama turned a NH loss into national momentum with a concession speech.

My first experience with him was the 2004 convention.

I remember my mom saying something to the effect of "That man sounds like a Kennedy. Too bad about the name."

Single greatest modern political speech I'd ever heard at that point. And I kept Barack Obama in the back of my mind. So when he announced in 2007 I knew who I was caucusing for. From there I'd work him into political conversations with my family. Tell them "Listen to this." put on one of his speeches or interviews, until I'd switched an Edwards, Hillary, and Kucinich voter into firm Obama voters. The hand-wringing among them that he could lose was entertaining. I kind of always knew he had the chops.

Though I did my fair share of chicken-littling when some polls came out showing doom.

I'll do the same this year probably, but deep down I know the American people are not dumb enough to elect Trump.

 

[Foffy]

Yeah the Turks have really fallen.

..Have?

 

[EatinOlives]

I've only gotten into politics because of Bernie and I'll be abstaining if Hillary is the nominee.

Bernie repeats over and over and over again that people need to vote. Notice how he doesn't append "for me" at the end of the sentence. He just says get out and VOTE.

Bernie at every debate repeats constantly that we need a Democrat in the White House regardless of who the nominee is, and has never made it a secret that he would support Hillary in the GE if she gets the nomination.

So my question to you is, are you REALLY listening to Bernie, or just listening to shit you want to hear?

 

[Kickz]

Caucuses are so antiquated and shady, should be primaries only

 

[exmachina64]

Is Bernie officially a Democrat now? Is he still considered an independent that caucuses with Democrats in the Senate?

Because he's caucused with the Democrats, he's been entitled to committee assignments. Maybe if he's willing to work with the party, he could serve in the leadership or chair a committee when the Democrats retake the Senate.

If nothing changes, he'd be Chair of the Senate Budget Committee, no?

 

[Agent_Carnage]

If Sanders gets annihilated on Super Tuesday is it a done deal then?

 

[Blader]

Yeah I kinda wish Biden had joined the race now.

Biden is more to the right than Hillary...

 

[Trouble]

But didn't they switch until well after Obama proved viable?

Yes, but IMO Hillary still felt like the pragmatic choice as Obama was still a relative newcomer to Washington. Most people felt she had the better chance in the general.

 

[Diablos]

Holy crap, amazing OP

 

[Chariot]

Did I say that?

You replied to a post of mine where I argued that toxic behaviour between the two voter groups is not going to help in the general with the notion that it will be forgotten in a few months. I don't think we should go that way. People should not be shitty winners is what I am saying, it shouldn't be that hard.

 

[Slayven]

Yep. Obama was largely assumed to be bulletproof during the primaries, because he lacked the scandals that had dogged the clintons and didn't really have much of a voting record that could be used against him.

The republican smear machine STILL managed to paint him as a kenyan america hating muslim who pals around with terrorists. He still won, but he got hit HARD.

Bernie would get hit SO much harder.

I don't think Bernie could handle Trump in a debate. The Dem's debates have been a friendly game of catch, except the one where the crazy guy bragged about killing some one.
Trump with the GOP candidacy stamped on his chest would be full batshit.

 

[Orbis Tabula]

I heard Hillary had Harry Reid make a call to a powerful union to come and caucus with its 50k members.. In a caucus of about 500,000 thats some shady dealings..

Were those 50k people Nevada residents? Because I don't have too much of a problem with them caucusing if so.

 

[Third Strike]

Just went onto r/Politics. Put it simply... if GOP wants dirt on Clinton, r/Politics is the go-to place

That board is absolute garbage. I used to think some conservative boards were bad, but man...

 

[exmachina64]

Yeah I kinda wish Biden had joined the race now.

Do you like Republicans? Biden calls them his friends and wants to work with them.

If that's not appealing to you, then Biden was not your candidate.

Disclaimer: This does not reflect my personal feelings.

 

[Slayven]

..Have?

I like to give people the benefit of the doubt

 

[RustyNails]

Yeah I kinda wish Biden had joined the race now.

Hey person, did you know Biden voted for the Iraq war too?

 

[Donthizz#]

OP, your avatar is badass.

 

[massivekettle]

Biden is more to the right than Hillary...

Right or left doesn't really matter here. Hillary is in the pockets of Wall Street, Fortune 500 companies. She's the establishment, the status quo.

And she's got a shit ton of skeletons in her closet.

She doesn't really excite anyone, not even her base. She will need massive external help to bring people out to vote for her in November, especially the young ones whose souls are currently getting crushed because Bernie is losing.

 

[Geist-]

Yeah the Turks have really fallen.

They're like the Fox News of liberals, but I like them more because I share their opinions.

 

[Inuhanyou]

I would be very surprised and disappointed if Hillary won the nomination and Bernie didn't stump for her.

If she is the nominee, he will vote for her. I don't think after being castigated and attacked like he has been by her machine, will have it in him to back her nomination wholeheartedly at this point..

His entire race has been about running against the corporate and large powerful forces she embodies and supports. He would not expect the people he has gained with his message to support a corperatist out of perpetual fear of a GOP win, a lot of these people aren't even Democrats to have such support for the party choice. I certainly am not.

People playing party games like that's what matters will have been the ones shocked if the GOP win due to low turnout from Independents and younger Dems.

And it won't be those voters at fault, it will be the Democratic machine that expects people to have any respect for what the Democratic party has morphed into over the years.

Is Bernie officially a Democrat now? Is he still considered an independent that caucuses with Democrats in the Senate?

Because he's caucused with the Democrats, he's been entitled to committee assignments. Maybe if he's willing to work with the party, he could serve in the leadership or chair a committee when the Democrats retake the Senate.

If nothing changes, he'd be Chair of the Senate Budget Committee, no?

I think its been shown through this whole process that the party organization at large has no love for this man, or what he wanted to do even in theory. Let's not pretend they are going to stay on good terms after this.

He'll probably go back to being an indie like he was before, and its just as well. The party life is not for him, he's not one to toe that line. He was clearly struggling against Hillary's charges of him not supporting Obama in literally everything he did. He has clearly not supported the President in situations where he did do shitty things, even though he has supported him a lot of the time too.

 

[Manmademan]

I don't think Bernie could handle Trump in a debate. The Dem's debates have been a friendly game of catch, except the one where the crazy guy bragged about killing some one.
Trump with the GOP candidacy stamped on his chest would be full batshit.

I'm not sure how I feel about the debates. I'm not sure its even really possible to debate trump.

He whips out the equivalent of a political gish gallop and just runs with it- it doesn't matter if what he says is factual or not, his audience responds to the antics and bravado.

Right or left doesn't really matter here. Hillary is in the pockets of Wall Street, Fortune 500 companies. She's the establishment, the status quo.

And she's got a shit ton of skeletons in her closet.

oh please. the clintons have the most open closet in politics. all of their skeletons are well worn and well known by the public at this point. Hillary's favorability numbers are widely assumed to be a floor, not a ceiling.

 

[danm999]

Congrats to Hillary.

Also to Sanders for keeping it competitive.

 

[Crimson_Gold]

Hey person, did you know Biden voted for the Iraq war too?

Only after killary made him. /s

 

[gutter_trash]

Right or left doesn't really matter here. Hillary is in the pockets of Wall Street, Fortune 500 companies. She's the establishment, the status quo.

And she's got a shit ton of skeletons in her closet.

LOL, I find it funny when a Harper Conservative calls Hillary "sold out"

 

[Wafflecakes]

Right or left doesn't really matter here. Hillary is in the pockets of Wall Street, Fortune 500 companies. She's the establishment, the status quo.

And she's got a shit ton of skeletons in her closet.

Yeah. No.

Hillary has been hammered hard for over 20 years now. Her skeletons have been out of the closet for a long time.

 

[Black Republican]

Jon Ralston ‏@RalstonReports 5m5 minutes ago
I'm hearing state Dems estimating turnout at 80,000. It was almost 120,000 in '08.

bad drop