From stuff I've read it seems plausible that it's from Goyer's script (where it might have made more sense) and was probably kept for the cool factor, logic be damned. For what it's worth, I think Faraci said it was out in at least one Terrio version.
Batman v Superman Spoiler Thread: Don't believe everything you read, Son
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We never see Batman did anything on that advice, no? Supes saved Lois in the final fight (who else is expecting Aquaman? *raises hand*). How the fight ends was rather kooky, too.
He's not dead. He's alive again at the end (implied).
hemo memo
You can't die before your death
Tony dies at the end of Civil War? :/
thecouncil
Banned
When talking to Diana at the end about the other heroes, she asks why they need to find them. He says something like, "I have a feeling." That's the follow up.
So the alien guy who has grown up side by side with men and seen the destruction men can do assumed men are good? So he's pulling everyone's leg in a "gee, I just got here and don't know what your race is like yet"
RepairmanJack
Member
One thing this movie does really well is the Bat-suit. Both the nightmare and regular Batman looks badass. Easily the best Bat-suit in any movie.
This is just dumb. It has nothing to do with assuming people are good. He's just being a whiney mopy baby and worrying only about himself. He's entirely consumed the entire movie with how people are looking at him. He's showing up worried about how he looks and worried about what he says at this hearing in a situation that he's done nothing but worry about the entire movie.
The movie gets a shit load wrong but this just isn't one of them. This is set up and followed through with the entire movie.
This is just dumb. It has nothing to do with assuming people are good. He's just being a whiney mopy baby and worrying only about himself. He's entirely consumed the entire movie with how people are looking at him. He's showing up worried about how he looks and worried about what he says at this hearing in a situation that he's done nothing but worry about the entire movie.
The movie gets a shit load wrong but this just isn't one of them. This is set up and followed through with the entire movie.
Wow, I'm really going to have to suffer some stuff to get to the meat.
StopMakingSense
Member
No, he's just making a hypothetical comparison.
Good fucking grief.
Yep, the formation of the Justice League is because of this message from Flash to Batman.
I have a feeling Bruce's visions might be explained in the Justice League movie. Someone tries to warn him of Darkseid, besides The Flash.
thecouncil
Banned
I think a worse translation of Superman's character than what we get here would be assuming the worst of everyone and that the world is shit. Haha.
BronsonLee
Member
Nihilist Superman!
Schweinehund
Member
I see making Superman do even more heroic stuff has done absolutely nothing to convince zealots that he's not some murdering sun god.
There is no winning with some people, lmao.
There is no winning with some people, lmao.
I think that was meant to be based off his conversation with Lex in the prison
Now if we had SEEN or heard Lex do something before that scene would have helped a bit
RepairmanJack
Member
It's also funny that you're basically describing Bat's in this movie. :lol
I'm fairly certain it's related to his vision considering the Flash also tells him to find the others.
RepairmanJack
Member
I think Lex knows a lot because of what he learns from Zod's ship.
Definitely. The ship had knowledge of 100 thousand planets? Lex must've learned a shit ton.
He didn't look for the bomb because he wanted to assume the best in people. It's a blissful ignorance.
What's interesting about the reviews is that a lot of them seem split on the first act. Some saying it's the best part of the film and some saying is a disjointed mess (which is my opinion) somewhat saved by the second act.
The first act to me at least is a sort of (very) extended disjointed freeform montage of stuff (introductions, setups and exposition) which barely hangs together due to the weight of the few good scenes, and seems to follow no real set chronology or logic.
It feels overlong but at the same time like there's about 20 extra scenes left on the cutting room floor to make it join together properly.
It's almost art house in a way. Be interested on peoples opinions on it, my wife didn't have much of an issue with it at all.
The first act to me at least is a sort of (very) extended disjointed freeform montage of stuff (introductions, setups and exposition) which barely hangs together due to the weight of the few good scenes, and seems to follow no real set chronology or logic.
It feels overlong but at the same time like there's about 20 extra scenes left on the cutting room floor to make it join together properly.
It's almost art house in a way. Be interested on peoples opinions on it, my wife didn't have much of an issue with it at all.
Miles Quaritch
Member
I like the idea of a detached Superman. If they tie it to his killing of Zod, even better really.
Show the long-term psychological impact of killing someone. Broad detachment coupled with over attachment to certain people who then become said persons entire reason for existing and should they die too, it's a quick sharp fall to the darkside.
Show the long-term psychological impact of killing someone. Broad detachment coupled with over attachment to certain people who then become said persons entire reason for existing and should they die too, it's a quick sharp fall to the darkside.
But wouldn't somebody like Superman just know if a bomb was located on somebody up in front of him without even actively looking for it?
As someone who hasn't seen the movie it just seems like a forced contrivance in the script.
Why is this kind of contrivance supposed to pass in a movie ostensibly about a man who has no limits to what he can achieve?
Man of Steel already dealt with the "can you save everyone" theoretical question of Superman which to him was a decent enough question for the start of his origin. Now in a movie where Superman has to go up against an ideological opposite to him it seems like the movie is constantly at odds with what it wants to let Superman actually do to elevate himself in terms of being less a god figure and more of a symbol and ideology of goodness.
Yeah, Superman feels bad about it and didn't notice it. It's explained. Does that mean that including that kind of scene was the right thing to do?
I'm in the same boat, the first act really is a mess. It's pretty much a bunch of things happening and it's fairly jarring. It was definitely missing fill in the gap scenes (which would make up the extra 30 minutes of run time) but considering people already think the movie is too long, that's outside the realm of possibility. The second the bomb goes off, the films comes together much more naturally.
He simply didn't expect it. I think this scene is plausible---he was too careless and he lamented it in the next scene. He randomly eavesdropped Alfred's communication to Bruce earlier in the movie, though.
Now that I think of it, why (fake)kill Superman? Because he fights doomsday?
thecouncil
Banned
I don't think that's one of Superman's powers, no.
I'm pretty sure his hearing is passive though, or at least in the comics I read.
I don't know.
I just feel like there are a million ways to develop Superman.
Watching tons of people explode in front of him and being sad he couldn't do something doesn't seem like something that feels natural in a movie following the depressing and not necessarily heroic MoS.
I could be wrong.
RepairmanJack
Member
The people thinking he should have seen the bomb are basically the Superman protesters from the movie. "He should have seen the bomb, it's his fault!" He just didn't expect it.
Lex planted the bomb to throw Superman under the bus in the public and to royally piss of Bruce.
He's trying to push both to their breaking points and does. Sure Supes has no limits, but when he just wants to be accepted as someone trying to do good, you have to assume those you're appealing to and just as good. You both need to just go see the movie.
Lol. So much for "Goyer didn't write this." I wonder if Goyer will have a story credit on JL too, just to fuck with everyone.
Yeah I'm going to have to watch it anyways, I'll just see it for myself when I go there.
He did good work on the Constantine show
No, his xray vision isn't always on. He turns it on and off
Superman failing to stop the bomb is commentary on how repecting privacy can cost lives! Snyder is a genius!
This can't be real but if it is, I'm gonna have great time at the movie this Saturday.
Yeah, I kinda thought that, but I was more referencing the bomb thing and maybe being able to hear the mechanics of the bomb or something, I think that was something that happened in one of the comics somebody gave to me years and years ago.
But that's just me being unreasonable.
I was/am more concerned with the way this plays out.
Legitimately worried what this means for both the next solo Batman movie and next JL movie tonally/canonically etc. .
I'm going to have to take some serious anti-depressants to go through the DCCU if it's just going to be the scale of Marvel and the bleak/depressing/tiring format of MoS, and apparently BvS, lol.
This can't be real but if it is, I'm gonna have great time at the movie this Saturday.
100% real. He sees Pa Kent while casually climbing some Tibetan mountain range in a dream, it is really weird. At first I thought, ok cool, superman needs some time alone, so he flies to Tibet and meets a monk who will give him some motivation, but then it turned out to be his dad he is seeing. I was like wtf. But the movie does this often, having the flow of a scene suddenly broken by a dream sequence.
RepairmanJack
Member
There is a whole lot more to worry about when it comes to tone than what happened with the bomb.
Batman fucking brands people so they get murdered in jail.
The dude is going through an emotional struggle and goes to get away from everything and hallucinates his dad. It's not really that far out there though I'd prefer him to have seen the other ghost dad in a fortress of solitude.
thecouncil
Banned
"I won't kill you. But I don't have to save you."
RepairmanJack
Member
I won't kill you...unless you're in your car when I attach a cable to it and swing it around for a while and then slam it down on top of another car full of people. If that happens...I can't help you.
That car was empty
I get that part. Like I said, I get the "logic" behind it. I'm just questioning why it's a good idea to have the scene play out like that. There's a big difference - one is the criticism of a plot hole while the other is a criticism of direction, and if there's anything Man of Steel proved at least to me was that it had a completely muddy direction which, at least for now, I'm skeptical about in terms of how much it's improved between movies.
Like you said, maybe I won't fully "understand" it until I watch it, and I still intend on eventually doing that, but I don't expect this to be an issue that's resolved on account of explanation.
Why the hell would Cosby be in the fortress of solitude, much less having Superman listen to him?
RepairmanJack
Member
Was it? If so that scene transitioned a little weird. It seemed like he disabled one of their vehicles and then when he got past it he grabbed it.
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