Mighty No. 9 review thread

I'm starting to wonder what Inafune did with all that Kickstarter money. Creators are contractually obligated to put it into their games. He got almost $4 million, sure, not enough to create an epic AAA game, but far, far, far, FAR more than most indie devs get. And he pumps out this POS?
 
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Yu was able to recover from that.

The game will be great.

Meh, my guess is Shenmue will be okay. Not amazing, not great. Just okay. It's what happens when a vocal fanbase causes a dead franchise to rise from its grave and pretend it's alive again for a few moments. Speaking of which, my condolences to mega man fans.
 
Dunno how much I trust the mainstream reviewers when it comes to something like this, but obviously, this doesn't bode particularly well. I'll still give it a shot, though.

...some of us "mainstream reviewers" DO have a history with games like Mega Man. Crazy thing to suggest, I know.
 
I'm going to borrow a post I made in another topic.

The first actual early footage of Bloodstained in action when it was pre-alpha looked better than the final release of Mighty No. 9.

Yet both Bloodstained and MN9 are being / were developed by Inti Creates.

The only difference is one had Inafune and Comcept's involvement and the other has Iga and his own staff.

There was a playable build of Bloodstained at E3 and it looks and plays better than Mighty No. 9 apparently.

Both games are from the same development studio. The difference here is that Inafune and Comcept involvement in one game, and Iga and it's new studio's involvement in the other.

Two projects, two different directors, same co-development staff. Both games aimed to recapture the audience of two classic franchises. Both games have the same publishing company involved. Two different results
 
A kickstarted game for four million?

I mean, I am not defending the decision to do so, but if you're going to put it on 3DS for that budget, it's going to be using that on the baseline. I do not understand why you would expect differently.

Were it me, I would have either not put it on the 3DS or not put it on current gen systems.

I would not expect the higher end versions of the games to be downgraded to compensate for the weaker platforms. I don't see how that makes any sense nor do I recall this ever being a common practice.

It would have made more sense to make the games on the higher end platforms and then downgrade the lower versions. Lower the resolution, remove effects and such, possibly not make the game literally identical. This seems to be the way this is usually done tbh.
 
That actually looks solid, what in the world happened?

It's probably using premade assets and shaders and whatnot that would make it horribly unoptimized for an actual product. It's good enough for prototyping on what the final product would look and play like.

Somewhere along the way the art direction got butchered.
 
A kickstarted game for four million?

I mean, I am not defending the decision to do so, but if you're going to put it on 3DS for that budget, it's going to be using that as the baseline. I do not understand why you would expect differently.

Were it me, I would have either not put it on the 3DS or not put it on current gen systems.

Or do what Bloodstained is doing and outsource the handheld versions? If they compromised MN9 for the 3DS as a baseline then that's even more reason to be disappointed.
 
Unreal 3.
Oh yeah, now I remember from the demo..
So it's probably down to the 3DS (and to a lesser extent Vita) holding back everything else.

There was a lot of pressure for a 3DS version during the KS campaign from what I remember.
They could have been more clear about the tradeoffs that would imply.
 
A kickstarted game for four million?

I mean, I am not defending the decision to do so, but if you're going to put it on 3DS for that budget, it's going to be using that as the baseline. I do not understand why you would expect differently.

Were it me, I would have either not put it on the 3DS or not put it on current gen systems.

But 3DS doesn't even support UE3 at all, and AFAIK, the handheld versions were always intended to be outsourced and on a different engine.

Isn't it more plausible that (a) they were targeting 60fps on last-gen consoles, or (b) they're just really fucking incompetent?

Or do what Bloodstained is doing and outsource the handheld versions? If they compromised MN9 for the 3DS as a baseline then that's even more reason to be disappointed.

The handheld versions are outsourced.
 
Ignoring the devs that have told us that the concept art wasn't totally unreasonable, the "concept art" point totally ignores the test footage.
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Maybe I'm crazy, but I didn't expect to go from that to the shit that MN9 looks like now.

Pretty sure this went out the window once they added so many additional consoles and handhelds. 3DS became the hardware they were aiming for I imagine.

Dumb really, which is why I dislike adding old platforms as stretch goals. I have the same concern for Bloodstained with the WiiU frankly, even if it being handled separately. At least that is shaping up significantly better though.
 
I'm starting to wonder what Inafune did with all that Kickstarter money. Creators are contractually obligated to put it into their games. He got almost $4 million, sure, not enough to create an epic AAA game, but far, far, far, FAR more than most indie devs get. And he pumps out this POS?

I seriously think it goes down to the fact that the game is on every single platform. Tons of ports, had to make the graphics least common denominator so they can be used everywhere (need a lot more resources to make unique assets on every system), tons of testing, etc.

If they kept the game on PC and then maybe One/PS4 it would have been a lot better. But then they wouldn't have gotten the money they asked for.
 
I'm starting to wonder what Inafune did with all that Kickstarter money. Creators are contractually obligated to put it into their games. He got almost $4 million, sure, not enough to create an epic AAA game, but far, far, far, FAR more than most indie devs get. And he pumps out this POS?

Let's assume there is a fairly small number of staff on this game. Twelve people sounds good.

At complete consistency with never scaling up or never scaling down and that everyone is being paid a living wage of $50k, you're looking at $600,000 a year. Now let's assume they just did nothing, didn't get paid, and sat on their hands until January of 2014 and the game was completely done and they were just not working on it through all of 2016. That's two years of $600k on salary and nothing else. So that's $1.2 million for our hypothetical scenario of twelve people.

So you're right, in that scenario, $4 million is a lot! But if you extrapolate that to all the other costs that go into something like this (translation, payment to the organization running the kickstarter, scaling up, QA, kickstarter cuts, backers backing out, community management, outside contractors, etc.), then that number keeps dwindling until $4 million is nothing.

You don't just buy assets with your kickstarter money and assemble them into a good game, at least without looking like a Unity horror game on Steam Greenlight.

The problem isn't that four million is this absurd game number for indie game development, it's that it's a pretty small number that Inafune still managed to waste. To even get that number, they had to promise a lot that caused compromise after compromise until this is what we got.
 
Avoided backing, though I was kicking myself at the time as I, like many of you, was so optimistic of the outcome. Dodged a bullet, but it feels like such a hollow victory.
 
The game made 4 million in backing but they did that by adding a ton of stretch goals. Those 4 million must have run pretty thin after all that stuff.

I feel this Kickstarter is a good example of less is more and his adding and adding stuff just to extend your campaign might not be a good idea.

They made an average game. It sucks for the backers but well, doesn't mean they scammed anyone.
 
Pretty sure this went out the window once they added so many additional consoles and handhelds. 3DS became the hardware they were aiming for I imagine.

They should have reworked the visuals entirely then to something that could still look nice on the 3DS, if they really wanted that 3DS port. Like Shantae.

If that test footage only represents 7 days of work like it says it's not like it was too far along to change it.

What a mess.
 
Meh, my guess is Shenmue will be okay. Not amazing, not great. Just okay. It's what happens when a vocal fanbase causes a dead franchise to rise from its grave and pretend it's alive again for a few moments. Speaking of which, my condolences to mega man fans.
Okay would be a massive improvement over the first two games.
 
But 3DS doesn't even support UE3 at all, and AFAIK, the handheld versions were always intended to be outsourced and on a different engine.

Isn't it more plausible that (a) they were targeting 60fps on last-gen consoles, or (b) they're just really fucking incompetent?



The handheld versions are outsourced.

They are outsourced, but the game still had to work on them. Just outsourcing them did not mean they went "Okay, you guys just make your own game, we'll check in with you later while we make the sickest graphics on PS4."

One game was still made for all hardware and then they outsourced the actual act of bringing it to life.
 
Or do what Bloodstained is doing and outsource the handheld versions? If they compromised MN9 for the 3DS as a baseline then that's even more reason to be disappointed.

Bloodstained is not the same as this.

The main game is not coming to 3DS, but the prequel game is. Vita is getting both, and that's been outsourced.
 
I would not expect the higher end versions of the games to be downgraded to compensate for the weaker platforms. I don't see how that makes any sense nor do I recall this ever being a common practice.

It would have made more sense to make the games on the higher end platforms and then downgrade the lower versions. Lower the resolution, remove effects and such, possibly not make the game literally identical. This seems to be the way this is usually done tbh.

What you're suggesting is basically make the handheld versions separate games, which would have required a separate budget.
It's not just texture resolution and effects that would need to be different, it's level size, enemy counts, CPU routines for pretty much everything, etc.
 
Pretty sure this went out the window once they added so many additional consoles and handhelds. 3DS became the hardware they were aiming for I imagine.

Dumb really, which is why I dislike adding old platforms as stretch goals. I have the same concern for Bloodstained with the WiiU frankly, even if it being handled separately. At least that is shaping up significantly better though.
Wii U thankfully isn't quite the disparity that something like 3DS is. I mean, it's not great, but still.
 
They are outsourced, but the game still had to work on them. Just outsourcing them did not mean they went "Okay, you guys just make your own game, we'll check in with you later while we make the sickest graphics on PS4."

One game was still made for all hardware and then they outsourced the actual act of bringing it to life.

Well, color me pretty skeptical that they would have treated 3DS as a baseline when it doesn't even support the engine that all the Inti Creates-developed versions run on. But I guess stranger things have happened.

I mean, that's clearly not what's happening with Bloodstained, although in that case, the Wii U/Vita developer is actually attempting to port the engine.
 
I don't understand why he didn't just focus on building a really good SP mode and then build out other features as sales happened. Very much like what Shovel Knight did.

Also, I don't know how anyone can say they're having regret over this. The kickstarter launched in August 2013, nearly three years ago. We're all well beyond the regret stage of things. Hell, regret was delay 1-3. Once we go into delay 4+ it just became hilarious.
 
Okay would be a massive improvement over the first two games.

That's your opinion.

The Shenmue games were critically acclaimed and sold pretty well considered the Dreamcast installed base. (Not to mention the exclusive Xbox release of Shenmue II in NA without marketing)
 
I seriously think it goes down to the fact that the game is on every single platform. Tons of ports, had to make the graphics least common denominator so they can be used everywhere (need a lot more resources to make unique assets on every system), tons of testing, etc.

If they kept the game on PC and then maybe One/PS4 it would have been a lot better. But then they wouldn't have gotten the money they asked for.

Ironically Iga was specifically clear in his own Kickstarter saying the main development of Bloodstained would be focused to target the PC / PS4 / and XB1 versions.

The Wii U and Vita are being handled by Armature and from what Iga said wouldn't have any impact on the main version.

In fact Armature even had to port Unreal 4 to the Wii U and Vita on their own. http://www.armature.com/2015/06/12/bloodstained-ue4-code-clarification/

As for the theory that Mn9 had to be downgraded to the lowest common denominator that was the 3DS, it is plausible but Abstraction Games is supposed to be handling the 3DS and Vita versions.

This whole situation is unfortunate.
 
Someone mentioned waiting for Gaffers to review it, while my review went up. I'm not a huge, paid reviewer. So I'd consider myself more a gaffer then reviewer. Also grew up playing MM games. It's just not of the same pedigree of one of the creators of Mega Man games simple as that it does have its fun moments and it's entertaining at times but it's ultimately a disappointment... sorry
 

Fucking brutal

budget comparisons

Comparing MN9 to a 3D shooter and a 8-bit pixel art game seems a bit like apples to oranges.

The others are on point though.

Except maybe Skullgirls, that budget seems really low considering they initially had a publisher.

Wasn't that Skullgirls number just to add another character?

$150k to add one character. They ended up getting around $825k and added 5. Felt pretty good about backing that one.
 
Well, color me pretty skeptical that they would have treated 3DS as a baseline when it doesn't even support the engine that all the Inti Creates-developed versions run on. But I guess stranger things have happened.

I mean, that's clearly not what's happening with Bloodstained, although in that case, the Wii U/Vita developer is actually attempting to port the engine.

Ergo the poor money management complaints.

They had to promise a 3DS version to get more money - it is the system with the biggest install base currently still alive (however barely). It was far truer when the kickstarter launched. There is a reasonable assumption to be made that a lot of classic Mega Man fans owned 3DSes.

I do not think they were thinking about the feasibility of doing it on the 3DS when they decided it would be there. They just knew it needed to be there if they wanted more money for the game.
 
Well this means to me the CE will be cheap as hell to buy soon. I'll buy it then. I collect things like that. No matter how good or bad the game is. Hell at least it'll have an interesting story attached to it.
 
Those reviews are disppointing but personally I'm waiting for Jeremy Parrish and Colin Moriarty to give their thoughts on the game. Some of the negative stuff mentioned in the reviews seems a bit nitpicky. I'm not suggesting that all the reviewers are incompetent but when it comes to difficult 2D platformers, they are often treated unfairly like DK Tropical Freeze which was largely ignored by the press but is a masterpiece imho. Same with Azure Striker Gunvolt. Parrish and Moriarty know their stuff when it comes to Mega Man. If they end up hating it, well... It's time to cancel that movie Inafune!
 
What you're suggesting is basically make the handheld versions separate games, which would have required a separate budget.
It's not just texture resolution and effects that would need to be different, it's level size, enemy counts, CPU routines for pretty much everything, etc.

I'm saying make the compromises on the lower end hardware, you know because it actually makes sense to do so.

They also kind of had a separate budget, the portable versions of the game were stretch goals they chose to include. Although I don't think scaling it down a bit and reworking a few areas would be as costly as you seem to suggest.
 
To those saying that the amount of money shouldn't matter..... Dust an Elysian Tail is prettier, more fun, and just objectively a better game. That game was made with 40k
 
Ironically Iga was specifically clear in his own Kickstarter saying the main development of Bloodstained would be focused to target the PC / PS4 / and XB1 versions.

The Wii U and Vita are be handled by Armature and wouldn't have any impact on the main version. Armature even had to port Unreal 4 to the Wii U and Vita on their own. http://www.armature.com/2015/06/12/bloodstained-ue4-code-clarification/

As for the theory that Mn9 had to be downgraded to the lowest common denominator that was the 3DS, it is plausible but Abstraction Games is supposed to be handling the 3DS and Vita versions.

This whole situation is unfortunate.


Two thoughts

1) Inafune is still taking a managers salary out of the 4 million from kickstarter, alongside paying his comcept staff and the rent on a tokyo office, whereas IGA knows that if bloodstained bombs he's back to making mobile apps

2) It's less that they developed for the 3ds/vits and ported up, but it seems like the level design, modeling, fx, etc. were all designed for a lower spec machine. It may just be a way to cheap out on art costs if you don't have to pay for contract work on a "low spec" design and a "high spec" design.
 
Those reviews are disppointing but personally I'm waiting for Jeremy Parrish and Colin Moriarty to give their thoughts on the game. Some of the negative stuff mentioned in the reviews seems a bit nitpicky. I'm not suggesting that all the reviewers are incompetent but when it comes to difficult 2D platformers, they are often treated unfairly like DK Tropical Freeze which was largely ignored by the press but is a masterpiece imho. Same with Azure Striker Gunvolt. Parrish and Moriarty know their stuff when it comes to Mega Man. If they end up hating it, well... It's time to cancel that movie Inafune!

Colin Moriarty ‏@notaxation 8 hhá 8 horas
I've had Mighty No. 9 for 2 weeks and haven't beaten it yet, which should tell you everything you need to know. Not bad. Just disappointing.
 
And thing is... I wanted to review and cover this game. I contacted Deep Silver, hoping to see and I even provided my credentials. When I got accepted, I felt excited because I look forward to playing it for the sake of providing my feedback.

However, I haven't been getting any e-mails from Deep Silver whatsoever. They haven't responded and it pisses me off. If I have to spend my own money just to play this game, I would but thing is, I need to save up for New York Comic Con in October and I don't want to do that.

Man... why the hell Deep Silver... why the hell...
 
Those reviews are disppointing but personally I'm waiting for Jeremy Parrish and Colin Moriarty to give their thoughts on the game. Some of the negative stuff mentioned in the reviews seems a bit nitpicky. I'm not suggesting that all the reviewers are incompetent but when it comes to difficult 2D platformers, they are often treated unfairly like DK Tropical Freeze which was largely ignored by the press but is a masterpiece imho. Same with Azure Striker Gunvolt. Parrish and Moriarty know their stuff when it comes to Mega Man. If they end up hating it, well... It's time to cancel that movie Inafune!

https://twitter.com/notaxation/status/744787135366995970
 
Those reviews are disppointing but personally I'm waiting for Jeremy Parrish and Colin Moriarty to give their thoughts on the game. Some of the negative stuff mentioned in the reviews seems a bit nitpicky. I'm not suggesting that all the reviewers are incompetent but when it comes to difficult 2D platformers, they are often treated unfairly like DK Tropical Freeze which was largely ignored by the press but is a masterpiece imho. Same with Azure Striker Gunvolt. Parrish and Moriarty know their stuff when it comes to Mega Man. If they end up hating it, well... It's time to cancel that movie Inafune!


The problem is this game was marketed and kickstarted as "Hey guys, new Mega Man!" Then they went and did a whole bunch of nonsense to the game play to make it not really resemble what they were targeting, then the game itself started looking worse than what it was originally supposed to, THEN it kept getting delay after delay which apparently didn't do anything to help polish...
 
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