Black Lives Matter activists chain themselves to road at Heathrow Airport, UK
- Thread starter Napoleonthechimp
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ReplacementPelican
Member
Sorry but if we're talking about policing then he's completely right. For a start, our police are accountable to an independent commission that actually favors the complaints of black citizens, they don't actually execute black people in the street and half of our public isn't like 'fuck it, they deserved it, they're black and therefore must be criminals'. We also don't give out guns like there's an 'all stock must go' fire-sale.
Moreover, when we do have issues such as stop and search predominantly targeting BAME groups, it was dealt with and improved.
The UK has racism, notably towards Muslims and Eastern Europeans as well but you'd be naive to say 'Brexit happened!' when talking about the British Police and not the citizenry.
I did but the coverage thus far doesn't indicate major disruption. They've caused some disruption but most have been arrested already and roads are opening again. Some people may miss flights (none confirmed yet I can see) thus at this point calling it major is usual internet tendency to over exaggerate everything.
Major is sustained and notable disruption. At this point were talking high media coverage for modest disruption unless actual fractal reprint starts noting otherwise. Traffic was slowed but never fully stopped according to my updates (as a regular traveller from Heathrow I have updates set up).
It's a dumb move IMHO and contrasts with main message from movement about wanting broader global presence but all the detailed info does not make it major vs actual major disruption.
It's a peeve of mine how "everything" becomes major these days allowing for little differentiation. The words minor, modest and short lived don't get their proper usage these days.
cyberheater
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As human beings. We should strive to care more. Not less.
I see and agree with your point of view.
Insightful.
Yeah that refugee comment was... odd.
If you've been a lifelong victim of systemic racism, then maybe you'd prefer pissing people off to continuing to be ignored by society at large.
They've had a lot of difficulty codifying their message more than the general goals. Being somewhat decentralised is both a blessing and a curse.
Hot Coldman
Banned
the proven alternative is "hey please care about our cause!" in an entirely non-disruptive, pleasant manner and getting nothing out of it but idle sentiment
this is a fact. you might think stunts like this breed negative momentum against the movement but that there's no other option is a fact.
anyway - they're getting on the news, on the radio. it's working.
Count Dookkake
Member
Damn...
Aaronology
Member
When the US elects Donald J. Trump then you two can claim the UK is "light years ahead of America with racism." Until that time, we remain the country that has not shot ourselves in the foot and every other limb while giving power to xenophobes and bigots out of fear of foreigners and minorities.
America's problem with gun violence and policing is acknowledged and indeed dire but that was not what I took issue with. Shade was thrown from a glass house and I felt the need to call it out. That's all.
Audioboxer
Member
Said more eloquently and in detail than me! Well done.
As you've concluded Brexit was a damning slight on many individual citizens, not necessarily our police and law enforcement. It was largely disgustingly aimed at refugees, eastern immigrants and Muslims. Without a doubt one of our darkest moments in recent history. Having a country peddle Farage on a global scale was utterly embarrassing.
For what it is worth as well I think I've seen a few times where American law enforcement actually used/invited over British forces to try and teach restraint.
I'd love to see your diary entries.
Yeah and sorry came across heavy handed: trying to post in this and the exciting suicide squad thread diverted me from taking care with my words!
With that I'm gonna have to return to suicide squad...
cyberheater
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I can understand the frustration but putting folks backs up is not the way to go.
It needs to start with education and the young folk. My sons primary school spend a lot of time on bullying and racism issues. It's taken seriously and is the right approach.
Yeah good on them. I don't doubt it will piss people off but there is a lot of racism which is still prevalent in our country. It's all well and good claiming to be better than America at not being racist but lets be honest, at the moment that's like claiming to be good at running because your faster than a tortoise.
We should be standing up for minorities and ensuring there is no nonsense with stop and searches and that everyone, regardless of race or gender or age is treated equally. At the moment this is still an aspiration rather than the reality.
We should be standing up for minorities and ensuring there is no nonsense with stop and searches and that everyone, regardless of race or gender or age is treated equally. At the moment this is still an aspiration rather than the reality.
cyberheater
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I'm old enough to know that we are living (in the UK) in a much more tolerant society then when I was young. Change is happening but real change takes time.
ReplacementPelican
Member
No, no, no. You've done it again. We're talking about policing here and I detailed how the policing is light years ahead. We can have a discussion about citizenry if you want but I have only really discussed policing or people's reactions to policing.
Yeah, our citizenry can be a horrible group. In fact, my partner was arguing on a Facebook thread about Islam, basically the whole Sam Harris thinly veiled 'Islamaphobia isn't racism and people who call islamophobes racists are the real problem' but I guess this dude was a self-confessed anti-theist so, who knows. Maybe he didn't hate anyone.
Regardless, this dude was saying 'darling' and 'love' in his comments and when pointed out that this is incredibly condescending to do to a woman he was like 'of course you have problems with that' and after a lot of back-and-forth just said it was 'SJW bullshit'. I mean, he wasn't saying to deport anyone or Muslims should be inspected by the police but it's really the only example I have.
As for the police training, yeah. Some US forces come over and see how British Police deal with people holding weapons, being aggressive, etc.. without shooting at them. What's weird about American police is actually how often they shoot. It's like that guy that was laying on the ground who they shot, you think one would be enough but they do that Point Break 'click till it's empty' bullshit.
Did Brexit suddenly not happen? Is the UK not being ravaged by one of the most monumental self inflicted wounds any nation has endured in decades, due largely to racism and xenophobia? I think it's time to drop that from the list of things citizens of the UK can feel superior to Americans over.
Brexit is basically about White migrants. You can show racism to an accent as easily as skin.
Yeah well that's not going to happen anyway because people will always prefer the status quo where they don't have to do anything to actively changing their behavior. As long as you can simply ignore the protests nobody will give a shit.
Yeah but change doesn't just happen. People always have to do the work because the status quo won't be bothered to change itself
There is always the prevailing attitude in the UK (which I have found myself subscribing to occasionally) that this sort of thing "doesn't happen here" and is mostly a US thing.
However, just because it's not as bad or widespread, doesn't mean it's not a problem. I don't see any problem with bringing this into the public conciousness in a nation where it's too easy to dismiss racism as a thing of the past.
However, just because it's not as bad or widespread, doesn't mean it's not a problem. I don't see any problem with bringing this into the public conciousness in a nation where it's too easy to dismiss racism as a thing of the past.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
This 'racism in Europe guy' disappears quick. Are we sure he's not Kaiser Soze?
cyberheater
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Which is why the huge push to address these issues at the primary school age is so important. Realistically. You are not going to change a lot of adults fundamental beliefs but you can educate the young to learn see that we are all humans beings and should be treated the same.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
That gif that aaron just posted. Gif
Europe is worried about white syrians now? What white migrants are we talking about?
this is good to see. a lot of ppl in this country can kind of dismiss black lives matters movement as a american curiosity, part of the wider bemusement towards america's unique gun obsession, whereas we are fine because our police are far less likely to use deadly force. yet beneath that there's loads of issues that should be highlighted.
this is a little embarassing though
this is a little embarassing though
Seems an odd place to hit. The people being delayed right now are likely families traveling on holiday. Families with small children who won't appreciate the nuances of the movement and are probably driving their parents up the bloody wall right now.
Like I'm not gonna attempt to discuss whether or not disruption like this does more good than harm because like hell I have any idea. Just, why target the holiday goers.
Like I'm not gonna attempt to discuss whether or not disruption like this does more good than harm because like hell I have any idea. Just, why target the holiday goers.
Audioboxer
Member
This. It's soo obvious it hurts inside how insanely important education is. Unfortunately education gets ramrodded by defence and weapon budgets in most Western countries, and on a micro-level completely ripped apart by some parents and teachers worried about "upsetting or offending" students.
As in they either censor teaching history (don't teach how our citizens murdered or abused women/blacks/other minority, it paints a bad picture of us!), or they don't want to talk about sex education in detail or address things like LGBT/racism. This being one time where I say social justice is a disease in Schools. If you want progressive change young generations need exposed to all of the horrors of human life, past and present, and also all of the intricate details around sex, the body and human life. I can almost see the irony coming from some teachers/parents suggesting we can't teach about issues around sexism because we don't want to tell our delicate children about the abuses and horrors some have faced by the opposite/same sex. Saying the word rape cannot possible be done to someone under 18, let alone teaching in detail about consent and sexual violence.
Teaching when young is easier due to the mind being more willing to soak up information and potentially process it. Teaching when older and set in ways is a fucking ridiculous challenge. Generations of human life will continue to fuck up the more we resist this fact.
Really man? That's a pretty shitty thing to say.
What in the world do you expect to change? Realistically, what kind of magical laws do you expect to pass?
Because protesting is only going to make people think
"Why aren't these people at work?"
Moff
Member
now? racism in most european countries is and has always been about white migrants. people from eastern europe mostly.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
That also means 10% of those deaths were ethnic minorities whereas ethnic minorities are 14% of the UK population, so minorities are actually underrepresented. That said London has a big problem with disproportionate targeting of stop and search, so there is definitely room for a pro-justice movement.
A lot of the Brexit fear mongering was also targeted at polish workers coming to the UK and taking jobs.
Pretty sure he meant immigrants. A large part of the leave campaign was wanting to stop free movement of people within Europe which is predominantly going to reduce the number of white Eastern Europeans entering the country.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
My apologies. Those guys were really evil? And he's your foreign minister?
Do you guys keep lists of acceptable white people? Are southern Europeans good now?
steamingsarcasm
Neo Member
Pretty sure they mean Eastern Europeans who are definitely a large part of whom Leave party's immigration promises were about.
But if anyone seriously believes that whites are the only ones meant by "migrants" then I'm laughing my ass off. Kicking syrians and other non-whites was also part of their dumbass expectations so yeah it's pretty racist. I mean shit like this happened a lot after the results: www.twitter.com/KeremBrulee/status/746748874463842304?ref_src=twsrc^tfw
Edit: Hit submit too late, but my points still stands on racism being a part of the results.
i think the fella is trying to make the point that all lives matter.
Moff
Member
I think maybe like 40 years ago it was the southern europeans, but yeah, they are fine now.
The point is people have to make a push for that to even happen. Things don't get done when you sit by and expect stuff to change on their own. People have to make these pushes whether that be a political push, community organizing, or disruption activism. Also I don't think BLM UK wants adults to magically not be racists they seem to want police accountability and things like that. Stuff that can be changed with policy.
Logistically, I wonder just how successful this kind of movement could be in a place like the UK.
In America at least there is a dominant section of black people that have been here, for the most part, since the transatlantic slave trade. The UK black population seems to be a hodgepodge of groups which I am not too sure share much in common at all outside of melanin. Like West Indian groups and Somalis....there is really nothing there. Even more when you add in Nigerians, who perform among the best academically in the UK from what I hear.
Personally I think the groups are too different to successfully pull off a movement like this.
In America at least there is a dominant section of black people that have been here, for the most part, since the transatlantic slave trade. The UK black population seems to be a hodgepodge of groups which I am not too sure share much in common at all outside of melanin. Like West Indian groups and Somalis....there is really nothing there. Even more when you add in Nigerians, who perform among the best academically in the UK from what I hear.
Personally I think the groups are too different to successfully pull off a movement like this.
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