Splash Wave
Member
Dude, come on.
Clinton campaign didn't do tracking polls for the last month, ignored Michigan issues
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Dude, come on.
toadsworth
Banned
It is unbelievable that they did not think, under any circumstances they could lose to him.
And now we're all fucked.
The DNC better make major changes or we are fucked for even longer.
And now we're all fucked.
The DNC better make major changes or we are fucked for even longer.
The fact that his son served in Iraq probably would help him. It's less like an elitist voting to send other people's kids to war when you are sending your actual son to war with your vote.
Etrian Oddity
Member
If Joe Biden had run for president, he would have wiped the floor with everyone. He would have beaten Hillary, Bernie and Trump without any issues. He had left policies that would attract that base along with the "don't give a damn" attitude that would have attracted fringe right voters that liked Trump for "telling it like it is."
Goddamn, I wish Uncle Joe would have run.
GloriousBagel
Banned
Such an experienced politician am I rite?
What a joke
What a joke
Flying Toaster
Member
Biden would have been brilliant. But I respect his not running. I think it was more than just the loss of his son at the time though. I really do think it was discussed and he probably decided to just respect the Clinton camp/DNC's desire that she was the pick.
IdreamofHIME
Member
Kellyanne was the most competent and understanding person in this election, too bad she was tied to Trump.
From what I have heard, he hat a "sit down" with the DNC who basically indicated that HRC was their preferred choice.
Yeah, your agenda is pretty simple. You're fighting an imaginary battle with people who think Bernie might have won. No one is saying he definitively would have clinched the election with absolute certainty, not even those who believe he would have been the superior candidate. But you know who definitively would lose?
Clinton. Because she did. Nothing changes that. You're getting upset because people are pondering whether or not an unorthodox candidate could have succeeded in an unorthodox election where the conventional candidate got crushed. That clearly irritates you because your candidate lost against Trump. Bernie did not. People are allowed to speculate how that could have gone down had he been the nom, and perhaps you think that's a waste of time but so is getting your jimmies rustled and trying to convince people to not speculate.
Again, Clinton lost against Trump. Bernie lost against Clinton. Bernie did not lose against Trump. Maybe he would have. Maybe he wouldn't have. It's not somehow ridiculous or offensive to suggest Clinton, the one who lost an all important election on the precipice of global disaster, might have been an inferior candidate.
Yup doesn't help that gaf mods were part of that bubble. It was literally critique Hillary, tons of people personally attack you, you fight back saying nothing worse than your attackers, get banned.
I bet you a lot of people have been saying the same thing about every single political who supported the war, Democrat or Republican. Where were some of you the past 15 years? Christ.
Well, that's a bit conjecture. I assume that is why she didn't actually give one until the next day
Total events
September
Clinton 34
Trump 56
October
Clinton 43
Trump 64
November
Clinton 19
Trump 25
Total
Clinton 96
Trump 145
Trump talked about an enthusiasm gap and it was real.
I never bought into this. She was elected Senator of New York, once. Yes she was "experienced" and spent a lot of time in Washington, but this "perhaps the most qualified presidential candidate ever" bullshit was simply baffling to me. More Hilldawg bubble bs.
Henchmen21
Banned
Yup. Neogaf's reputation has forever been tarnished because of this. I'm hoping there's a change up in mods because of this.
GoutPatrol
Forgotten in his cell
Twice.
Henchmen21
Banned
To an easy Dem state where nobody payed any attention to her while she was there. That's why she had high favorables as a senator. Once she's in the limelight, her favorables immediately drop.
I know they both live in New York but damn when I read that Hillary was traveling home every night I started questioning her commitment. Trump was doing the same thing but he would go home as late as he can so he really was working out there for the votes. If I'm running for president shit I'll be out in the road sleeping and fighting for votes in those 3 crucial months.
Also is it true that Obama and Biden had a falling out of sorts with the DNC? Somebody told me that Obama did not like what the DNC was doing and he took it upon himself to campaign for Clinton because he saw that the strategy was horrible...
Yeahhh, the leaving her seat in 2009 always screws with me. My bad. Point still stands though, her experience as some master politician and campaigner was still greatly exaggerated.
On the one hand that's true but I kind of wonder of her health/stress was an issue, and campaigning for a presidential election must be beyond ungodly stressful. I don't know how any of them do it.
This is very true as well. It's going to take some time to get to the bottom of this.
old manatee
Banned
The thread about Clinton and Trump needing to sleep in their own bed every night was a classic.
http://neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1305351&page=1
As much as everyone bagged on the Republicans for having a primary that looked like a clown car on fire, at least they had a choice.
SenorArdilla
Member
Clear the way for Yas Queen. Why brother with a primary if you're already playing favorites?
Splash Wave
Member
The problem has been painfully obvious for months, if not longer.
fighting and attacking...
I don't think you get this debate and discussion of ideas thing.
And the results from the Detroit area clearly show the effects of that.
Carnby
Member
Tell that to amorix.
Getting called derogatory names for supporting Bernie sanders is not called debate and discussion.
Clinton did not listen to her own criticism of Trump from April:
http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/clinton-trump-sleeping-at-home-230605
FireBeaver
Banned
It turns out that Hillary Clinton's greatest enemy in the 2016 Election was Hillary Clinton.
Xisiqomelir
Member
Like 2008 all over again.
D
Deleted member 80556
Unconfirmed Member
I did not want to know this. At all. It's just maddening. Hopefully Dems will fucking learn from this, because this is also on them.
TheChewyWaffles
Member
What is this "Yas Queen" stuff? Don't understand it.
edit: nm googled it
edit: nm googled it
Let's not forget the claims of her also being a master negotiator with what would've been the Lock Her Up contingent in the House and Senate. Sanders was a do nothing unicorns and rainbows racist, but Clinton was going to get us half a unicorn by sheer...who knows what. That was rich.
UnemployedVillain
Member
. . .
So voting on a war we shouldn't be in is okay if you have children in the Army? We get it, Biden is super likable, but some people aren't even subtle about the double standards. Shit on Hillary for supporting Bill's crime bill? Don't say anything about Biden voting for it. Rightly criticize her for supporting Bill's welfare reform? Crickets when it's mentioned Biden also voted for it.
Yes, I definitely think that a politician gets bonus points for military service. Do you disagree? Your other points are strawman attacks. Point me where I said any of those things.
UnemployedVillain
Member
I'm not talking about bonus points. I thought we were talking about critically bad voting decisions. His son being in the army probably made his vote more personal for him, but ultimately it was the wrong vote to make. And that's why I brought up those other 2 points as critically bad decisions, which only Hillary seems to be judged for supporting while people more open to Biden seem to gloss over despite him actually voting for
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Nah.
I was hardcore stanning for the last couple weeks. Before that, i was pretty sure she was going to win.
Here we are. Maybe it's a failure of her campaign. Maybe it's a 'Sexist' thing. Maybe it's a combination of all the bad PR against her that culminated to this.
But....I hate clinton. She was supposed to be the firewall for minorities. And because of that, she ignored a key demographic-the working white class in the rust belts which she lost.
Sanders was a racist? He was an active participant in the civil rights movement. I may be misinterpreting you.
Heisenberg
Member
I'm sure it's buried in the thread somewhere but I can't find it.
How did the Dems go from the incredible machine that was the Obama campaigns in 2008 and 2012 to a disaster like this? Was it a completely different group? If so, why?
How did the Dems go from the incredible machine that was the Obama campaigns in 2008 and 2012 to a disaster like this? Was it a completely different group? If so, why?
BreezyLimbo
Banned
I want to say it stemmed from the decision to ignore key demographics.
For example, Clinton visited New York and California during her campaign trail more times than she should have. She also focused mostly on minorities and battleground states-Ignoring states(Until the last second like Pennsylvania) like Michigan or Wisconsin, which Obama made an effort to go to and talk to the people there.
It's...putting too much focus on minorities that was her undoing. As ugly at it is, you just can't ignore the white vote, no matter how hateful they are. Trump won because he was able to get Obama voters to his camp-From these same rust belt states that should've been guaranteed for Clinton but weren't.
Who knows. She may have won the popular vote, but our country doesn't elect Presidents based on the popular vote. So it's useless for a state like California to send in millions of more ballots for her than it is for her to have 20k in a state like Michigan or Wisconsin.
TheLaughingStock
Member
To liberal whites and minorities who said they couldn't afford to take a risk voting for anyone other than Hillary:
Do you still claim to be pragmatic?
Do you still believe you can't afford to take a risk on a candidate?
Remember the constant argument was that a vote for anyone but Hillary would supposedly cost liberals the SC, presidential election, and set progress back for a generation. Everything Hillary or bust voters claimed was at risk voting for Sanders happened with their preferred candidate so now what's next for the Dems?
Do you still claim to be pragmatic?
Do you still believe you can't afford to take a risk on a candidate?
Remember the constant argument was that a vote for anyone but Hillary would supposedly cost liberals the SC, presidential election, and set progress back for a generation. Everything Hillary or bust voters claimed was at risk voting for Sanders happened with their preferred candidate so now what's next for the Dems?
Xisiqomelir
Member
Holy fuck I thought this GAFfer was kidding:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-trump-weston-imer-12-year-old-colorado-video
BTW, this is what happened in Jefferson County, CO:
old manatee
Banned
Holy fuck I thought this GAFfer was kidding:
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...-trump-weston-imer-12-year-old-colorado-video
BTW, this is what happened in Jefferson County, CO:
Chocolate cell phone for sure.
There were some pathetic attempts by Hillary-gaf to blow a few incredibly stupid things way out of proportion while minimizing his involvement in the civil rights movement as that little thing he did decades ago that doesn't mean anything anymore.
There is a lot of egg on their face. I can understand wanting to be pragmatic and doing what you feel is most effective in protecting America from a Trump presidency, but they were simply wrong, horribly misguided and blinded themselves to the writing that was on the wall regarding Hillary's unelectability problems.
I'm sure I read in one thread "You don't get points for not being an asshole." I couldn't believe it. Not being an asshole would be just staying at home and doing lip service. He was there amongst the people and got arrested. I think that counts for more than just not being an asshole.
Beer Monkey
Member
There was no such thing as a Hillary or Bust voter.
Henchmen21
Banned
Because she's an arrogant, greedy, corrupt POS who only cared about her own ambition (and her wealthy donors).
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