I Believe Having Children Is "Immoral" (Aka: Any Antinatalists Here? )

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Bounceounce

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Over the past few months I've come to the conclusion that I'm an Anti-Natalist, not along the lines of a "Childfree" zealot, but to the point that if it were possible for me to have a child, I would never choose so as I wouldn't want to force anyone into existence without consent, as it crosses a threshold in my personal moral code.
But I've found that this belief, like with determinism or nihilism, tend to only draw ire/confusion, from people totally unwilling to see your point so they just shut down and act incredibly dismissive towards anyone peddling them.
Have any anti-natalists here dealt with that?
Have any of you been the people I'm describing?
Why are, or why are you not an anti-natalist?
 
I mean I get not wanting to have kids in today's climate or whatever, but because you don't have their consent to be born?

What?
 
My friend knows an anti-natalist. He lives alone in the woods outside of Chilliwack. He is apparently very eerie.

That's the extent of my knowledge and/or interaction with anti-natalists who don't want to have children because it compromises their morality.

I like kids and I want kids.
 
Do you think it'd be immoral for only you or in general? The title makes it sound like the latter which would be crazy talk.
Are you just abstinent? Do you begrudge your own existence?
 
So if you do impregnate someone....do you say no to abortion because of consent on part of the fetus?
 
I personally don't want kids because I think it's fucked up to put more people into a world that I think is doomed to collapse within the next century.

But... Not having kids because they can't consent to be born? What?
 
Rhaknar said:
I mean I get not wanting to have kids in today's climate or whatever, but because you don't have their consent to be born?

What?
Click to expand...
I find the act of having a children to be one either solely based around an individual's desires, or the result of social conditioning that "This is just what people do so now I have to do it."
And I don't believe my individual desire would be enough cause to justify creating another, non-consenting human being.
 
Not to sound too judgmental if you're sincere, but this is honestly one of the more stupid things I've heard in quite a while.

I can understand not wanting to have children in today's societal climate and general craziness in the world, but "consent"? Did you give consent before you were being born? Are you pissed off at your parents for bringing you to this world? Honest questions.
 
Bounceounce said:
Over the past few months I've come to the conclusion that I'm an Anti-Natalist, not along the lines of a "Childfree" zealot, but to the point that if it were possible for me to have a child, I would never choose so as I wouldn't want to force anyone into existence without consent, as it crosses a threshold in my personal moral code.
But I've found that this belief, like with determinism or nihilism, tend to only draw ire/confusion, from people totally unwilling to see your point so they just shut down and act incredibly dismissive towards anyone peddling them.
Have any anti-natalists here dealt with that?
Have any of you been the people I'm describing?
Why are, or why are you not an anti-natalist?
Click to expand...

I'm not because I think kids are awesome. New perspective and energy. That said, I don't know if I'll personally have kids (due to a variety of circumstances), but I'm not at all against it were the proper circumstances arise.

I'm not really sure how the bold really works, it kind of seems incoherent. What if you birth someone that was really grateful to be alive?
 
I sorta understand why we oughta consider hitting the breaks on the baby making what with overpopulation and climate change rearing their ugly-ass heads in the near future. But the argument that you're bringing people into life without their consent? C'mon dawg.
 
I don't understand the mentality behind the consent argument you presented OP. It is impossible for anybody to consent to be born, thus it should never enter the morality equation at all.
 
So if everyone were to follow this ideology, we'd just go extinct then I guess?

I mean, I get certain concepts like not wanting to bring a child into a world where you know their life would definitely suck, whether that be due to your financial situation or some other factor. But you literally can't ask for...

You know what, you do you OP.
 
As an non-antinatalist, why should I care about your movement (is it a movement yet)? If you don't feel like having kids is a nice thing to do, that's great. I don't have kids, I'm sure we'd get along fine. But I think people who have kids are just fine, too. How do you reconcile you ideas with Camus?
 
i feel like the nature of consent requires for you to actually exist first before its significant

now choosing to not have a kid cause you cant feed them, they have a disability that could ruin their life, or you simply dont want kids is a different story
 
Bounceounce said:
I find the act of having a children to be one either solely based around an individual's desires, or the result of social conditioning that "This is just what people do so now I have to do it."
And I don't believe my individual desire would be enough cause to justify creating another, non-consenting human being.
Click to expand...

Since it is impossible for the unconceived to consent your worries seem misplaced.
 
It's impossible to express consent for one's own birth. More to the point, wanting to give existence a go is pretty much a universal "yes," at least until actually existing proves (potentially) otherwise.

Better to give the one who exists a chance to judge existence than one who has not existed.

Non-existence is an option for everyone. Existence is a rare gift.
 
Most people seem pretty happy to have existed.

While you're accommodating anyone who would have preferred to not exist, you're also much more likely to be denying existence to someone who would have very much enjoyed life.
 
Balphon said:
WikiHow to the rescue, as always.

http://www.wikihow.com/Live-As-an-Antinatalist
Click to expand...

Uh, yeah. Anthropomorphizing beings who were never born. Assigning them rights.

OptimalThoseFoal.gif
 
Familienoberhauptvogel said:
Do you think it'd be immoral for only you or in general? The title makes it sound like the latter which would be crazy talk.
Are you just abstinent? Do you begrudge your own existence?
Click to expand...
I don't believe in objective morality, so it's just a personal guideline I abide by, but I so believe that within the commonly agreed on spectrum of western morality that most posters here align with, that it's arguable an "immoral act".
ShockingAlberto said:
This just screams "Look at how edgy I am."
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You'd be justified in calling me edgy if I attacked those who do have children.
But I didn't, and I have no ill will towards those who do have kids, so please, chillax.
Night Angel said:
You sound like a crazy person. I mean that as inoffensively as possible, but really man... that's nuts.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what's exactly crazy about this, it's a perfectly reasonable conclusion.
 
I think 99.9% of people are happy to exist so it's pretty safe to assume your kid will be happy you brought them into the world regardless of their lack of consent (lol).
 
Following down the logic trail I concluded that it is similarly immoral NOT to bring things into existence.

So i'll be sure to get right on that. Thanks, OP!
 
Bounceounce said:
I don't believe in objective morality, so it's just a personal guideline I abide by, but I so believe that within the commonly agreed on spectrum of western morality that most posters here align with, that it's arguable an "immoral act".

You'd be justified in calling me edgy if I attacked those who do have children.
But I didn't, and I have no ill will towards those who do have kids, so please, chillax.

I'm not sure what's exactly crazy about this, it's a perfectly reasonable conclusion.
Click to expand...

I feel like any set of beliefs that, if shared by everyone, would bring about the extinction of mankind at the very least warrants some skepticism
 
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