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Rogue One: A Star Wars Story |OT| They rebel - SPOILERS
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demosthenes
Member
Tarkin was 100% better than Clu.
Haloid1177
Banned
"Daisy Ridley had charisma" yeah and it was over the top the majority of the time.
I see the fan film complaint. I don't agree, but I see it. But holding onto TFA through this as something more is annoying.
Ha ha ha ha! This is the same thing I've thought since I was a kid, while watching the OT. The Stormtrooper armor is useless. It protects against pretty much nothing, not laser blasts, not punches to the head, not kicks, no nothing.
It makes me laugh how the Empire managed to conquer entire star systems with such an incompetent army.
At least the clones were one badass, well-organized army that took no shit from anyone (Except Palpatine...). Stormtroopers are just hilarious in comparison. So clumsy.
They are talking about a Speeder model.
There's pretty clear progress with each attempt so I'd like to believe that they'll get it right eventually. It's not like Disney's bad at CGI. Davy Jones still holds up
My headcanon says that the Stormtroopers missed Chirrut Imwe not because the Force/faith protected him, but because they are the stupid, incompetent soldiers that cannot aim to save their lives, just like in the OT.
It's funnier that way.
Wasn't there a canon explanation that the stormtroopers were shipped blasters with faulty sights or something? Or was that EU?
Either way, yeah I'm assuming whatever level of force prowess he had allowed him to either redirect the bolts off of his path or walk a perfect path that would result in him not getting hit a single time.
disagreeing hard with this review but fuck that first 3 or so minutes is the hardest i've laughed in a bit
Lifejumper
Member
Over the top acting is synonymous with Star Wars.
BFIB
Member
Of course they are. They want clicks.
The Librarian
Banned
how much light sexism is in the rlm review
Agreeing with most of the RLM review so far, except I probably hated R1 more.
I like that they mentioned KS20's humour is very much like that of Drax. That was immediately the comparison I made coming out of the theatre. They pulled off the 'stating the obvious' bits with Drax way better, though. Seemed very shoehorned in with KS20.
I like that they mentioned KS20's humour is very much like that of Drax. That was immediately the comparison I made coming out of the theatre. They pulled off the 'stating the obvious' bits with Drax way better, though. Seemed very shoehorned in with KS20.
In A New Hope, Luke calls it a uniform, and does't really refer to it as armour.
Nah, some of it I agree with. The first half is fairly bad and the movie does a bad job with the characters. They're really dragging the movie due to the first part of it and rightfully so.
Leia is actually the most force sensitive character in the universe so that she senses things even Vader can't makes sense.
Like I asked earlier, it's not possible to track a ship that's in lightspeed in the SW universe is it? Therefore, there's nothing to indicate there wasn't a prolonged search for the ship by Vader afterwards, and since that ship is likely not the only model in existence in the galaxy, it's not strange for Leia to lie since there's no way for the Empire to know they necessarily find the same ship from the battle.
Haloid1177
Banned
There's a difference between corny and over the top acting. Yeah Luke had his ESB "NOOOOOOOOO" moment but it always felt more corny than over the top. Finn and Rey were practically caricatures at times.
Back-In-Black
Banned
I love HiTB, I disagree for the most part with their review, but pretty much all of their points are valid. Basically, I loved the movie despite their complaints but I wouldn't disagree with most of what they said. The only major thing I disagree with is the idea that SW can't be expanded past fun, light action-adventure. I think a much less humorous, war story type of SW does and can work. And, I felt TFA to be much closer to a fan-film than R1.
That's even dumber, then. If that's an 'uniform' and not an armor, then it protects against absolutely nothing. The Empire is sending their soldiers to conquer planets while wearing something that a slingshot could penetrate.
I think that speaks worse of the Star Wars universe than it does of the Empire, I guess.
This, right here, answers ANY of the plotholes and inconsistencies anyone has with the Star Wars prequels and OT.
TheOfficeMut
Unconfirmed Member
Saw the movie yesterday. Thoroughly enjoyed it, in some ways possibly more than Episode 7.
It was the first time I ever felt terrified about what the Death Star could do. I never felt that way in Episode 4, even when the planet was destroyed. Goes to show that great visuals go a long way in selling it. Leading up to this movie I was so god damn tired of anything to do with a Death Star or planet destroyer, but after seeing how utterly chaotic it can be in this movie, I wish there was another movie featuring it so I can watch in awe and terror.
Glad Vader's presence was kept to a minimum, although I found it odd that the Emperor didn't make an appearance at all. Is the Death Star not a project he held so dearly? That was one of my few disappointments. Aside from that this movie was about anything but Jedi's so I am glad there weren't any, although Donnie Yen's character certainly seemed like one. Perhaps he was a youngling or teenage Jedi in training who survived Order 66?
I didn't think the characters were underdeveloped, but I also didn't find them to be as developed as the ones in 7 for obvious reasons. Their stories were unnecessary, so to the guy at the very top of this page who cites character development in this movie as a huge issue, I completely disagree. I thought it was done just enough to appreciate their efforts and have some semblance of sadness when they met their fate. It would have been a detour we didn't need to go on just to delve into their pasts. Sometimes character mystery can develop a character than even the most on-the-nose dialogue. I don't need answers to everything and I'm glad we didn't get them. Sure, 7 had greater character development, but that's because characters in that movie are going to reappear. What purpose would it have served to delve into the pasts of Rogue One's characters? It would have wasted screen time.
I thought the visuals were great. I didn't realize Tarkin was CG, mostly because I had not seen the older Star Wars movies in years. I simply chalked up the striking resemblance to great casting. Either way, I know a lot of people are pointing to the CG as an issue, but I'm glad I didn't notice it.
The movie felt darker than 7 and for the first time ever I truly felt how terrible the Empire can be. I'd like more stand alone movies that don't feature notable Star Wars characters. This movie was great. I really enjoyed it.
It's unfortunate that may of you truly dislike it. I always feel better about a product that I like when there are critics that think it's terrible. Makes me feel fortunate for being able to enjoy something that another person can't. Unfortunately I also get upset when I can't enjoy a critically acclaimed product as well.
It was the first time I ever felt terrified about what the Death Star could do. I never felt that way in Episode 4, even when the planet was destroyed. Goes to show that great visuals go a long way in selling it. Leading up to this movie I was so god damn tired of anything to do with a Death Star or planet destroyer, but after seeing how utterly chaotic it can be in this movie, I wish there was another movie featuring it so I can watch in awe and terror.
Glad Vader's presence was kept to a minimum, although I found it odd that the Emperor didn't make an appearance at all. Is the Death Star not a project he held so dearly? That was one of my few disappointments. Aside from that this movie was about anything but Jedi's so I am glad there weren't any, although Donnie Yen's character certainly seemed like one. Perhaps he was a youngling or teenage Jedi in training who survived Order 66?
I didn't think the characters were underdeveloped, but I also didn't find them to be as developed as the ones in 7 for obvious reasons. Their stories were unnecessary, so to the guy at the very top of this page who cites character development in this movie as a huge issue, I completely disagree. I thought it was done just enough to appreciate their efforts and have some semblance of sadness when they met their fate. It would have been a detour we didn't need to go on just to delve into their pasts. Sometimes character mystery can develop a character than even the most on-the-nose dialogue. I don't need answers to everything and I'm glad we didn't get them. Sure, 7 had greater character development, but that's because characters in that movie are going to reappear. What purpose would it have served to delve into the pasts of Rogue One's characters? It would have wasted screen time.
I thought the visuals were great. I didn't realize Tarkin was CG, mostly because I had not seen the older Star Wars movies in years. I simply chalked up the striking resemblance to great casting. Either way, I know a lot of people are pointing to the CG as an issue, but I'm glad I didn't notice it.
The movie felt darker than 7 and for the first time ever I truly felt how terrible the Empire can be. I'd like more stand alone movies that don't feature notable Star Wars characters. This movie was great. I really enjoyed it.
It's unfortunate that may of you truly dislike it. I always feel better about a product that I like when there are critics that think it's terrible. Makes me feel fortunate for being able to enjoy something that another person can't. Unfortunately I also get upset when I can't enjoy a critically acclaimed product as well.
I'm fine with that line being there. It's in every movie. It's an inside joke. It's like putting Stan Lee in a Marvel movie - you never hear anyone complain about that.
I get that you can overdo the references, but some people are acting like you can't put any of the trademark elements in there. There is indeed a line you can overstep, but 'bad feeling' isn't it. That's like complaining about Indiana Jones' 'I hate snakes'. These aren't super serious movies.
I'm not going to rewrite my entire Terry Pratchett Narrativium speech from a few pages back but I think the complaining about the references has reached a silly level at this point. TFA overstepped it by shaping the entire plot to the shape of New Hope/Empire, but it was fine in this movie. Silly winks at the audience are just as big of a part of movies like Star Wars/Indiana Jones/Back to the Future as good visual design, certain music cues, etc. Some people get an instant reflux by the mere sight of something from an older movie. This is Star Wars after all, surely they're allowed to use some of it?
I feel like this movie especially did enough that was completely different from your usual Star Wars movie that it easily balances out.
It makes sense for Indiana to say it because it's the exact same character. This had a robot saying it who has never interacted with Han Solo. It's absolutely forced and is some lazy throwback to the OT like "I'll be back" is for Terminator.
I think their complaint about fan service is entirely off the mark. Fan service is bends the work for a gratuitous wink at the audience - Starkiller base, for instance, bends the entire universe to give you Death Star 2.0 - but sometimes the presence of certain things is just consistency.
Is the Empire not supposed to have AT-ATs like, a day before the start of ANH? Doesn't it make sense for Tarkin to be on the Death Star while it's testing like, 2 days before he's there when they blow up Alderaan? Lightsabers and X-Wings and TIE fighters and stormtroopers aren't member berries, they're part of this universe. It sounds like they went into a Star Wars movie about stealing the Death Star's plans with the expectation of something that wasn't a Star Wars movie about stealing the Death Star's plans.
Sure, buttface and pigface were fan service, as were C3PO and R2D2 (edit: and "I have a bad feeling about this"), albeit to a lesser degree, but overall the movie did a great job not ruining itself with fan service like TFA did.
The ssh/quiet made it feel fresh. Thought it was brilliant.
That's even dumber, then. If that's an 'uniform' and not an armor, then it protects against absolutely nothing. The Empire is sending their soldiers to conquer planets while wearing something that a slingshot could penetrate.
I think that speaks worse of the Star Wars universe than it does of the Empire, I guess.
Does it though? we all know its armour to an extent. I was just pointing out one fact. I also remember none movie pointing out (I think it was Batman Begins), grunts aren't worth the expenditure to protect fully.
To be honest, I would say it afford some protection, but minimal. Probably about as much as the prop costumes do in real life. Luke in A New Hope also remarks at how they lack any visibility as well (which might explain some of their real poor aiming, lol - truth on this one also is just movie making - you always have your bad guys be terrible aims, so you can have a movie where the good guys don't get killed in the first 5 seconds).
About as fresh as Sarah Connor in Terminator Genisys saying "Come with me if you want to live." instead of Kyle Reese.
I'm also fine with silly little references. They're fun. I could've done with some of them for sure, but whatever. They don't spoil the movie for me as such.
Some people seem so delicate with movies these days.
Back-In-Black
Banned
What? But they aren't, they just call things as they see them. Plus, they REALLY liked TFA, Mike says he liked it way more than R1 in this review. Though I agree that diversity bit in their long form TFA analysis was bad.
Tizoc
Member
I'm still waiting for Star Wars Musou to be made so that the regular white storm troppers are the usualy easy to wipe out mooks whose shoots never hit you and are followed behind by different colored more competent troopers.
Also because I love that series to death
http://i.imgur.com/xfZMBxI.mp4
Oh yeah don't get me wrong, I love how silly the Star Wars universe is in general. I don't take this universe as seriously as some people here. To me, Star Wars is great, dumb fun. The Stormtroopers being incompetent goofballs has always been a meme among the fanbase.
It was never just Han Solo who said it though. I had a quick look at the wiki to see who got the 'bad feeling about this' line in every movie:
Ep 1: Obi-Wan
Ep 2: Anakin
Ep 3: Obi-Wan
R1: K-2S0
Ep 4: Luke, and later Han
Ep 5: C3P0, and later Han
Ep 6: Han
Ep 7: Han
And that's not even counting all the books/games etc. Like I said before, it's not meant to make internal sense for these movies, it's a wink towards the audience. See the Narrativium thing. It's like putting Stan Lee in a Marvel movie. It makes no sense for him to pop up in all these different roles, but nobody ever complains about it. It's just a charming injoke.
I think complaining about that one line is missing the point.
Han wasn't even the first character to say it in the series. That was Luke.
EmCeeGramr
Member
There were definite fan service cameos in this, yeah, but some of the stuff they were going on about in the first three minutes is like if they watched a Star Trek movie and then recorded a review going "Photon torpedoes??? Nacelles? Phasers?? Transporters??? *fart noise* Yeah real original guys!!!" (Also they mention Alderaan twice as a thing in there, when it got briefly mentioned once by Jimmy Smits just as a way to remind people who this guy was, it was never shown)
CrichtonKicks
Member
The Michael Douglas/Ant-Man stuff was pretty damn amazing.
I watch them because their reviews are some of the most insightful and funny around.
Ironically, their complaints on Rogue One don't seem born from cynicism as much as a simple desire for the film to be emotionally engaging, something the franchise has previously excelled at. A criticism I completely share with them.
It's actually because he was The Watcher all along, heh heh.
demosthenes
Member
FYI, Order 66 was only ~18-20 years ago.
BFIB
Member
Anyone can come at me, but I thought the prequel reviews were terrible too.
The Librarian
Banned
"yeah, diversity is great, but not done in this way"
Gamecocks625
Member
Haha incredible
It's not just that one line. It's multiple things that are thrown in like C-3PO that are done to make fans feel special for remembering this or that line/character. It's evidence of a repeating pattern with these movies and it's old. Did we really need to see the ButtFace alien?
In the OT it was fine or whatever due to the same cast saying roughly the same things. They all interact with each other so I can buy that. Now we have completely unrelated people quoting similar lines as fanservice for the audience. It's the worst type of fanservice where things are self-referential just to be self-referential. Tarkin is somewhat fanservice but there is also a strong reason for his inclusion in the film.
Haloid1177
Banned
I don't think that's the comment I was referring to exactly. I readily admit that the movie did feel like a fan film at times, especially the GoPro ship shots and when rescuing Jyn from Wobani. It just had that feel to me. I felt a lot of the Death Star shots kinda felt the same way too. It felt like something I'd see in a fan film. I love it because it looks awesome and feels right, but there were definite times when it just felt like someone was given free reign to tell a story they dreamed about as a kid.
The actual fan service stuff I'm with you on completely. Those weren't AT-ATs, they were the predecessors, it made sense to have them. It made sense for X-Wings and TIEs to show up, hell we got a new TIE variant that was meant for in atmosphere flight. Vader made sense, Tarkin made sense, Leia made sense, "I've got a bad feeling about this" was fun, yeah the 3PO/R2 and Evazan/Ponda Baba stuff was over the top but they were quick. The contents of the film felt right to me, but some of the shots felt like something from a fan film.
And yeah, TFA did it clunkier and in a much worse way.
Well that was depressing. Good film but markedly different in tone and style from the rest of the Star Wars films. Absolutely everyone getting killed off like it was Blake's Seven was inevitable but quite a sorry sight to see all the same.
I loved seeing all the OT gear and tech revisited through modern eyes. A pretty good cast of characters overall, even if some excellent actors were underused. Some of the Star Wars nods were a little too cute here and there, but nothing to ruin the film.
I loved seeing all the OT gear and tech revisited through modern eyes. A pretty good cast of characters overall, even if some excellent actors were underused. Some of the Star Wars nods were a little too cute here and there, but nothing to ruin the film.
I actually posted my entire reasoning for being fine with the way cameos and winks were handled in R1 a couple of pages back, so I'll just quote myself because otherwise I would be repeating myself (I'll do it just this once because I really don't think what I have to say is that important, but it's exactly what we're talking about here). Let me just say beforehand that I really don't think the way of doing it here is any different to how these things were handled in the old movies, or the old Indiana Jones movies, or the old Back to the Future movies. I think the major difference is that we're all older, we've seen those old movies a million times, and they definitely wouldn't hold up to the same scrutiny these new movies get.
Here's my earlier post:
If new Star Wars movies using trademark Star Wars vehicles, planets, story elements, characters, injokes and references makes it a 'lazy' movie, I don't know what to tell you. It's the genre. It's what these movies have always done. You can go too far with it, sure, but you've got to allow for a little bit of fun. Otherwise you might as well make a movie in a new/different series.
Amazing.
CassidyIzABeast
Member
I don't understand how RLM can be down on Rogue One for fan service and references when they enjoyed TFA.
Back-In-Black
Banned
Well, they address that. To them TFA felt closer to Star Wars while Rogue One tried something different that didn't work for them, mainly being more gritty and plot focused as opposed to character focused. I disagree that such a SW story can't work but when they make the point about what are the awesome moments from the OT and the awesome moments from Rogue One, they aren't wrong. The awesome moments in the OT are character moments, the awesome moments in Rogue One are action moments. The characters aren't the focus of the story in a franchise all about characters.
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