Rogue One: A Star Wars Story |OT| They rebel - SPOILERS

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Fisty said:
Lol so if the person who literally brainstormed this entire universe and it's lore lays the ground rules and other people come in and change stuff and ignore those tenets, it's OK as long as you like it? Say whatever you want about Lucas, mitochlorians are canon, good or bad. It's his universe to build however he wants.

And as for Kojima, good or bad, parasites and nanomachines ARE responsible for all of those events. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean Ken Levine could just show up and make a Metal Gear game where it's actually invisible monkeys pulling the strings
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I'm not the guy you quoted, but to me: absolutely. George Lucas (and others) wrote his 6 movies. I take that into account when I watch those movies. Other people wrote/are writing the new ones. I judge them based on that when I watch those. Quality is the only thing that matters. Lucas had good ideas, he had bad ideas. If someone new comes along and gives me a better story/better interpretation of those earlier ideas that I end up enjoying more, why would I be upset about that?

To be fair, I'm the kind of guy who doesn't particularly care about what's canon and what's not. It's a bit silly to me. I judge a movie on its own merits, and whatever they do in the new movies, it can't ruin the classics for me. The prequels couldn't ruin the classics for me either. And I hated those.
 
Fisty said:
Lol so if the person who literally brainstormed this entire universe and it's lore lays the ground rules and other people come in and change stuff and ignore those tenets, it's OK as long as you like it? Say whatever you want about Lucas, mitochlorians are canon, good or bad. It's his universe to build however he wants.

And as for Kojima, good or bad, parasites and nanomachines ARE responsible for all of those events. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean Ken Levine could just show up and make a Metal Gear game where it's actually invisible monkeys pulling the strings
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I'm saying we should have higher standards for storytelling aside from accepting whatever comes from the creator's mouth.
 
Fisty said:
We don't have to like it, but we do have to accept it. Unless the creator retcons something, it should be accepted as fact in said universe.
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Yes, and when the baton is passed, we have to accept that new creator's vision because that is the one being put to paper and translated on screen. And both Kojima and Lucas retcon the hell out of their shit.
 
Fisty said:
Lol so if the person who literally brainstormed this entire universe and it's lore lays the ground rules and other people come in and change stuff and ignore those tenets, it's OK as long as you like it? Say whatever you want about Lucas, mitochlorians are canon, good or bad. It's his universe to build however he wants.

And as for Kojima, good or bad, parasites and nanomachines ARE responsible for all of those events. Just because you don't like it doesn't mean Ken Levine could just show up and make a Metal Gear game where it's actually invisible monkeys pulling the strings
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It's OK because George Lucas willingly handed control of Star Wars to others. Whatever they create is has the same legitimacy as his previous work.

If George didn't want people potentially overriding his work (oh the sweet irony) then he didn't have to sell, but he did.
 
Is Kojima really considered a master of storytelling? I haven't kept up his work since MGS1--MGS2--MGS:Twin Snakes. Pure cheese and I hear that was tame and it gets worse from there.
 
How do you feel about deceiving trailers?

When we get a trailer for VIII, we can almost count on the fact that nothing will be in the final film, I don't like that.

TFA did this too. It bothers me. This shot was a money shot. Why was it not in the film.

rogue-one-jyn-erso.jpg


27ro2.jpg
 
Mega said:
Is Kojima really considered a master of storytelling? I haven't kept up his work since MGS1--MGS2--MGS:Twin Snakes. Pure cheese and I hear that was tame and it gets worse from there.
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Only by people who have never read a book or watched a movie.
 
Into the Light said:
How do you feel about deceiving trailers?

When we get a trailer for VIII, we can almost count on the fact that nothing will be in the final film, I don't like that.

TFA did this too. It bothers me. This shot was a money shot. Why was it not in the film.

rogue-one-jyn-erso.jpg


27ro2.jpg
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Movie had reshoots, you would want a shot that didn't work in the movie so it got cut be forced into the movie just because it was in a trailer? It all worked out for the best.
 
Into the Light said:
How do you feel about deceiving trailers?

When we get a trailer for VIII, we can almost count on the fact that nothing will be in the final film, I don't like that.

TFA did this too. It bothers me. This shot was a money shot. Why was it not in the film.

rogue-one-jyn-erso.jpg


27ro2.jpg
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I only remember the kylo ren igniting his lightsaber scene not making the final cut. What were the others?
 
Into the Light said:
How do you feel about deceiving trailers?

When we get a trailer for VIII, we can almost count on the fact that nothing will be in the final film, I don't like that.

TFA did this too. It bothers me. This shot was a money shot. Why was it not in the film.

rogue-one-jyn-erso.jpg


27ro2.jpg
Click to expand...

that scene is in it, but there is no tie fighter. I like that. I think they thought if there was no tie fighter it would give too much away for that scene. Her walking to the end control panel. Looks like it could give away the climax.
 
Lifejumper said:
I only remember the kylo ren igniting his lightsaber scene not making the final cut. What were the others?
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There were a few in the first teaser - Rey on her speeder, Maz passing the lightsaber to Leia and the X-Wing shot was slightly different. There was one of Rey offering her hand to Finn on Jakku as well. The main trailers had hardly any cut shots as far as I recall.
 
Into the Light said:
How do you feel about deceiving trailers?
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It really only matters if the movie is a piece of shit, right?

You'd think for as spoilerphobic as people can be, the fact the trailer is a total lie would be a comfort for the sort of person who only watches ads for the opportunity to complain about how everything is being given away and boy doesn't that suck how nowadays you see everything in the trailer lol saved me 8 bucks lol guess I don't need to see that anymore.
 
WadiumArcadium said:
There were a few in the first teaser - Rey on her speeder, Maz passing the lightsaber to Leia and the X-Wing shot was slightly different. There was one of Rey offering her hand to Finn on Jakku as well. The main trailers had hardly any cut shots as far as I recall.
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The hand to Finn part was in the final film.
 
Bobby Roberts said:
The goal is to get the plans out. They all have parts of that goal they have to attain. They fulfill their part in that plan, and they find their peace afterwards. That's part of the emotional punch of the film, really: These frantic, fucked-up nobodies finally get to rest after doing their part.
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This is my biggest problem with the film. It's not that in the scale of things, these guys are nobodies. It's that these are laughably underdeveloped, nobody characters that have no sense of personality that makes me give a single shit when they die.

There is nothing commendable about having the balls to kill off your characters if you haven't done the legwork to make us care when it happens.

I remember yawning a whole lot through this film and it was because I simply wasn't invested in anything going on. Give me a way in. Not these wet mops and forced Vader scenes.
 
Into the Light said:
How do you feel about deceiving trailers?

When we get a trailer for VIII, we can almost count on the fact that nothing will be in the final film, I don't like that.
Click to expand...

I don't know the complete story behind the differences between trailer and movie (does anyone?), whether it was due to reshoots or just especially framed shots for marketing, but I actually prefer that. There are actually a lot of movies that used to do that, although it's a little less common now.

I always preferred trailers that uses footage that isn't in the movie (or part of it). Focus on selling me the atmosphere and vibe of the movie. I don't need to see the movie, and my favorite movie experiences still happen when I go into a movie completely blind.

See, for a relatively recent example, this trailer for Kill Bill Vol 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q2h6EFk36kI

None of that footage is from the movie and it's obviously especially shot for that trailer. It still sells the tone and sense of comedy from that movie, while keeping the rest of the movie a complete surprise.

Of course, that exact kind of trailer wouldn't work for a Star Wars trailer, but I'm more than fine with them using alternate shots/shots that were never intended for the movie in a trailer. Especially given how many movie trailers explain the entire plot in a couple of minutes.

The Rogue One trailers told you exactly what kind of movie it was going to be without telling you more than you needed to know. While you might not have seen that fighter in that exact shot, it is definitely indicative of the kind of thing you might see in that movie. I don't see anything immoral about that. It's a style of advertising that's been used for years and years in Hollywood.

Of course, I don't know if that particular shot was deleted in reshoots. But given how the TFA trailers worked, I'm guessing at least some of it is completely intentional (in that they never intended that footage to be used in the movie). You're not being conned with that, you're being sold the vibe and tone of the film.

Also I'm personally a strong believer of not watching trailers over and over again and analyzing every little detail. I'll watch it once and then wait for the movie. You don't even notice shots like that missing or being different then. I'm guessing most people watch trailers that way.

WadiumArcadium said:
I was thinking of the first bit here.

f7pEsCp.gif
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What's wrong with that? Obviously the longer take didn't work for the pacing in the actual movie, but did work in the trailer. Don't think there is any real secret (and definitely not a con) there.
 
SCULLIBUNDO said:
This is my biggest problem with the film. It's not that in the scale of things, these guys are nobodies. It's that these are laughably underdeveloped, nobody characters that have no sense of personality that makes me give a single shit when they die.

There is nothing commendable about having the balls to kill off your characters if you haven't done the legwork to make us care when it happens.

I remember yawning a whole lot through this film and it was because I simply wasn't invested in anything going on. Give me a way in. Not these wet mops and forced Vader scenes.
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This, 100%.
 
SCULLIBUNDO said:
It's not that in the scale of things, these guys are nobodies.
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But that's pretty obviously how I'm referring to them—in reference to their place in the scale of things.

I feel they did the legwork. They could have done it better, but I don't think they didn't do it at all. As someone very familiar with Edwards' inability to do it at all, this is very much not that.
 
SillyNonsense said:
The walkers on Hoth were AT-ATs, which are heavily armored and meant for battle. It stands for All Terrain Armored Transport.

The walkers on Scarif were AT-ACTs, which stands for All Terrain Armored Cargo Transport. They're larger and meant for...cargo transport. They're less well armed and probably not as fortified as their Hoth counterparts.

X-wing/U-wing weaponry is probably a lot better than speeders, too.

Not that it's directly related to your question but here is a rough size comparison:
c1FZiOK.jpg
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I didn't realize it was like a different model of vehicle, thanks.
 
SargerusBR said:
That was on the movie too IIRC just in a different scene.
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You may be right, I can't remember it.

Boem said:
What's wrong with that? Obviously the longer take didn't work for the pacing in the actual movie, but did work in the trailer. Don't think there is any real secret (and definitely not a con) there.
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I wasn't saying there was anything wrong with it. We were discussing what parts of the trailers didn't make the film
 
Levito said:
I didn't realize it was like a different model of vehicle, thanks.
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I do wish they made them a little more distinct if they are a different model.

They both look like they could have come from the same concept art interpreted differently by different model shops.
 
CosmicQueso said:
I think that's exactly what made the film so great. Too often, the Star Wars universe is just so perfectly aligned in the ways you mention. Everything happening in very specific ways that fit like puzzle pieces. But here, we get a sense that the universe is still a messy place where people get killed in ways that are tragic or seem chaotic and even wasteful. It makes these characters easier to relate to. These characters, no matter how skilled or talented or strong, are still just fodder to feed the meat grinder of the war that's taking place.
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But that didn't happen at all, they did a heist and typically for heist movies is that everything is going perfect until it doesn't when suddenly there'll be one new hurdle after the other but just so conveniently that it's supposed to feel like a struggle.

The last sequence on the tower was utterly predictable to the extent of severe eye rolling.
 
Metalingus5150 said:
Can we all agree that Rogue One is the best Star Wars prequel?
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I'd say it's the least offensively bonkers Star Wars prequel. I'd also say it's the most forgettable and bland Star Wars prequel.

It's like Alien 3. It's not as fucking stupid and looney tunes as Resurrection, but I'd rather watch Resurrection because whilst completely garbage, it has some interesting ideas/visuals.
 
SCULLIBUNDO said:
I'd say it's the least offensively bonkers Star Wars prequel. I'd also say it's the most forgettable and bland Star Wars prequel.

It's like Alien 3. It's not as fucking stupid and looney tunes as Resurrection, but I'd rather watch Resurrection because whilst completely garbage, it has some interesting ideas/visuals.
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I agree that the prequels' art direction is more conceptually interesting but they are hamstrung by the fact that Episodes 2 and 3 just look like shit. Flat, garish, badly composited shit. Jesus Christ they're so ugly. Rogue One gets a little gray and dreary in parts but overall is pretty gorgeous to look at.
 
GhaleonEB said:
did anyone come out thinking how great it was that the pilot got to....plug in that cord before he died?
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I honestly did. If that doesn't happen, everything fails. I thought it shows a great sense of how something so seemingly trivial on a battlefield can be completely critical.

Familienoberhauptvogel said:
But that didn't happen at all, they did a heist and typically for heist movies is that everything is going perfect until it doesn't when suddenly there'll be one new hurdle after the other but just so conveniently that it's supposed to feel like a struggle.

The last sequence on the tower was utterly predictable to the extent of severe eye rolling.
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But they didn't all steal a ship and fly away into the sunset. They were all killed, in some big ways and in some ways that looked like a waste of that character's life. But that's what made it interesting. The plan had to succeed, however. Wouldn't have been much of a movie if the plan failed and the plans never made it off the planet now, would it?
 
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