Rogue One: A Star Wars Story |OT| They rebel - SPOILERS

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Went to the cinema a couple days ago, but my feelings are pretty much the same as they were then:

-We should never have been shown CG Leia's face. It definitely ruined a significant moment. Just show her hair buns.
-Too much CG Tarkin. If they felt they had to have Tarkin, fine, but that was way too much. I'm more forgiving of it then the completely unnecessary Leia usage, however.
-The original Scariff sequence as it appeared in the Rogue One teaser was a lot more interesting imo. I'm surprised test audience reaction was negative.
-The romance was forced and silly. Cassian should not have come back, period. Should have been Jyn and Jyn alone at the end, accomplishing the mission and making the final sacrifice.
-Cassian jumped around too much on his morals and was not sympathetic to me. Everybody else on the squad seemed less like they'd have killed the injured guy at the beginning just to avoid getting the secret out. The "terrible things" speech didn't solve his serious problem. He was a bit too much.
-The droid was so good. Gave me the most laughs I've had in a Star Wars film ever, for sure. Strange since this is also the darkest.

Edit: how can I forget. The soundtrack is absolutely amazing. Michael Giacchino did an amazing job. "A Long Ride Ahead" and "Rebellions are Built on Hope" are beautiful tracks.
 
I also wanted to add that I thought, "Be careful not to...choke...on your aspirations, director," was a hilarious Vader line. I think people forget the trash talking he used to do. "He is as clumsy as he is stupid." Especially when taunting Luke. Vader was full of sass, dammit!

EDIT:

Branduil said:
The film should have ended with the heroes, all surviving, boarding the alliance ship, and all seems peaceful. Then, halfway through the end credits scroll, Vader literally RIPS through the screen with his lightsaber. He walks up to Chirrut and says "the force is IN YOU now" as he runs him through with his blade, before spinning into a decapitation of Bodhi, mocking him with "looks like our imperial traitor got a little aHEAD of himself." He crumples K2SO with a force fist, calling out "This is the droid I'm looking for," and then tosses his saber into the air, kicks Cassian and Baze to the ground on top of each other, and watches as the saber falls through both of them. "Let rebel dogs lie" quips Vader. Finally, he approaches Jyn, and says "I'll be your daddy now... just kidding" and blasts her out of the airlock. Fuck yeah, now that's an ending.
Click to expand...

See? This is what I'm talking about! This is the Vader we should have gotten. Fuck this movie sucks now.
 
Kyrios said:
Man that hallway Vader scene just had me like:

UQcSNoL.jpg
Click to expand...

Agreed, that gave me chills. Vader is a badass.
 
So Chirrut was definitely one with the force right? I mean he walked through that gun fire and all that.

EDIT: And I liked that the main cast was all female + minorities, for some reason. Good to see that for a change.

Kyrios said:
Man that hallway Vader scene just had me like:

UQcSNoL.jpg
Click to expand...

I'm not a lifelong Star Wars fan, just started getting into it last year because of the hype of TFA. And I was as a happy, giddy nerd when that scene happened. And again when I watched it a 2nd time. I can only imagine how long time fans of the series felt.
 
Veelk said:
You know, after sitting back and thinking on the film for a really damn long time, I have to realize one main thing.

Why in the fuck is Tarkin in this?

Here's the deal: Krennic is a wannabe villain. It's not that he's weak as in he's uncompelling (though you could argue that he is, but I think he's alright). This is in the same manner as Loki or Kylo Ren, where they are the archtype of Smug Snake, the kind of villain who can certainly be dangerous, but he vastly overstates the value of his power. Loki is ultimately a middleman that is only a threat because of Thanos backing him that virtually every avenger bitchslaps in some way at one point in the film, while Kylo Ren is indeed depicted as a discount, Vader wanna-be. Similarly, Krennic is introduced into the film that talking down and condescendingly to Galen, only for his wife to shoot him when he grew overconfident in the idea that she wouldn't pull the trigger. After that, he literally doesn't have any scene wherein he's not beaten and humiliated.

And it all comes down to the fact that Tarkin is in this movie. Other than the fact that he's clad in continuity armor (he has to be in charge of the death star as of The New Hope), his only purpose in the film seems to be to belittle Krennic. And while this is a narrative that could have certainly worked, it has no significant end point. The key difference is that Loki's character arc ends with him being knocked down from on high by the heroes he thought himself above, culminating in the scene where he tries to hold on to one last scrap of dignity only to be literally pounded into the ground by the big green rage machine. Similarly, Kylo Ren looks down on Finn and Rey, believing in the inherent superiority of the dark side, only for both Finn and Rey to take him down by fighting using the light side of the force. It's thematic, their arrogance and false sense of superiority are refuted by the protagonists of the film themselves. In both cases, the idea isn't that the villains aren't a threat...they totally are. Loki still has his alien army and scepter and Kylo Ren still has the force. But their threat is because of some kind of external force not inherent to them, and by tying their self esteem to those external forces, they are not empowered by their own strength, which the heroes, by contrast, are. The Avengers didn't win because of external forces backing them, but because they were the avengers. Rey only starts winning once she accepts her inherent connection to the force that has nothing to do with her wanting to be like Luke, while Kylo Ren identity is based around trying to recreate Vader's image in himself.

Using this archtype up against Tarkin makes very little sense, atleast the way they did it. Tarkin is antagonistic to Krennic from scene one and since Tarkin both outranks him and Krennic doesn't have any superior attributes (being smarter than him in how to manage the Death Star, just as a potential example) to him, Krennic just kind of has to take it. As a result, the narrative breaks away from the typical set up and Krennic doesn't have even the illusion of power provided by external forces. He's just outpowered, which makes his arrogance not simply wrong, but foolish. I mean, The Avengers kept that scene that Loki has with Thanos henchmen (who is a colleague of Loki, rather than superior) short for a reason, because running it too long would overemphasize how little power Loki actually has.

Yet here, Krennic has more scenes with Tarkin and Vader knocking him down than he does being successful at...anything. You could argue that he throws his power around with Galen, who is tricking him with the death star plans. Only problem is that Galen isn't the protagonist. Which circles back around to my complaint that Jyn only exists as a surrogate for Galen, but in just simple terms, usually a significant point of catharsis of the movie is that the villains false sense of confidence is shattered by the protagonist, rather than the side character. So when you get it set up the way it is, it's got too many barriers of separation here to be truly satisfying. Jyn gets to tell Krennic on behalf of her father that there is a flaw in the death star that he will only be able to imagine will be exploited in the next movie which Tarkin and the rest of the empire suffer for because he is going to die there on the orders of a superior that he hated for being superior to him. When you look at the film, Krennic's motivations and goals seem to revolve around appeasing his superiors than the enemy he is actually fighting.

And this could basically be solved by removing Tarkin. Make it so the challenge to his power and authority come from the protagonist, not a secondary antagonist. The most significant relationship Krennic ought to have is with Jyn, not Tarkin or even Galen. It's Jyn that should be pulling the rug from underneath his feet as he tries to maintain his dignity. There is actual uncertainty to whether Jyn can successfully undermine him because of the backing he has and her being the protagonist and having backstory intertwined with him personally, undermining him has some actual significance. Like, in comparison, I doubt that Tarkin and Vader even remember Krennic's name by the time ANH starts. I would only include Vader as is because I do think that, the same way Jyn is just a rando who shouldn't be remembered, Vader can be there to remind the audience that Krennic is fundamentally an Imperial Redshirt. But that's fine because Vader has one scene with Krennic in a tangential plot point. It's significant to giving Krennic's place in the broad scheme, but as a film that's about the small and intimate relationships, his relationship with Jyn should be the forefront of his character. Instead, Krennic literally does know who Jyn is until the very last second of the film, while Jyn's attacks and interactions with the empire have no regard for Krennic being there.

It's highly unsatisfying because false arrogance has nowhere to go when the people who challenge it are explicitly his superiors. It's the perceived inferiors, like a random girl on the other side fighting with no resources to her name in enemy territory, that'd make breaking his illusion of superiority cathartic.
Click to expand...

Spoiler tag alert: Unrelated AAA 2016 game is spoiled in these tags!

Tarkin is there because that's how the film connects to the original Star Wars. He's there so we find out how he got to be in charge of the Death Star in the original film.

I mean they basically do exactly the same thing that was done in
Kingsglaive
, in order to make sure they didn't affect the story of the original trilogy, they introduced characters and killed them all by the end of the film. This is exactly what happened in
Kingsglaive
to make sure the main story of
Final Fantasy XV
wasn't affected.
 
Took my nephew to go see it today. I think it was a pretty solid movie, and I will likely take my wife to go see it this weekend. The hallway scene was fantastic.
 
BrettWeir said:
Am I the only one that thought the movie was "Meh"?
Click to expand...

No. I enjoy it much like I enjoy all the Star Wars films. It was better than the prequels, but it failed at making me really care for the characters for their sacrifice. I can't wait to see Rey, Finn, Poe,Kylo Ren, and old man Skywalker for Episode 8.
 
Original Vadar never says anything as corny as "don't choke on your ambition" from what I remember.

I was impressed the ugly dude and his baboon friemd who Obi-wan kills in a new hopes canteena got off the planet within a couple of hours from their cameo, then to Tatooine in like a week.

Is Empire Strikes Back the only movie to not feature Tatooine or a "definitely not Tatooine" desert planet?
 
f0rk said:
Original Vadar never says anything as corny as "don't choke on your ambition" from what I remember.
Click to expand...

People are acting like Vader making one pun somehow is different from all the shit he has said in the OT. He's the biggest drama queen in the entire galaxy.
 
Just got back, overall I really liked it.



Better than TFA solely for not being a new hope reskin.

I liked that Mads was used in 3 scenes, still wish he was in more but it was better than I was expecting


Loved the star destroyers crashing in to each other


Loved Vader, the second appearance especially holy shit

Thought the soundtrack fell a bit flat

Thought krennic, even though he was a director never got a chance to really shine

Loved k-whatever, like someone else said it was basically a less murderous HK-47

Loved the visuals of scarif and jedah

Loved the final shot of jyn and Cassian


Loved all the character designs/costumes especially the heavy dude whose name I can't remember

Loved how the at-ats were imposing as hell although they went down a bit easily to the x-wings

Loved the completely random and unexpected c-3P0 and r2-d2 appearance, sure you could write it off as fanservice wankery but it was 2 seconds and they were with the rebellion


I think I want the next spinoff to deal with the fall of the Republic and what happened in between rots and the opening of this movie
 
f0rk said:
I was impressed the ugly dude and his baboon friemd who Obi-wan kills in a new hopes canteena got off the planet within a couple of hours from their cameo, then to Tatooine in like a week.
Click to expand...

They probably went to the Mos Eisley cantina to recover.

"Dude, just park at the nearest planet, I need a drink. We almost fucking DIED!"
 
I enjoyed my second viewing more.

Mads en Riz did excellent with what little they were given.

solid 7/10.

I think it replaces ROTJ for me as the 4th best SW movie.

Empire
ANH
TFA
RO
ROTJ
ROTS

--
--

TPM
AoTC
 
f0rk said:
Original Vadar never says anything as corny as "don't choke on your ambition" from what I remember.

I was impressed the ugly dude and his baboon friemd who Obi-wan kills in a new hopes canteena got off the planet within a couple of hours from their cameo, then to Tatooine in like a week.

Is Empire Strikes Back the only movie to not feature Tatooine or a "definitely not Tatooine" desert planet?
Click to expand...

"He is as clumsy as he is stupid."
"I find your lack of faith disturbing."

Vader is full of corny one liners and sass in the OT.
 
Gareth Edwards is not good at main characters. Jyn and the male lead are just nonexistant meat sacks that say lines that move the story forward, they are the worst part of the movie. As for the rest of it:

- Giacchinno is The One. If anyone has to take Williams' place, it has to be him. As soon as the title card came out, and he did that thing with starting with the Star Wars theme but effortlessly transitioning into the Rogue One theme was majestic. He even had the singsong quality that Williams gives to his scores, with small character movements on screen getting a small instrumental flourish in the soundtrack. There weren't as many themes in the movie as usual (only two or three), but imagine what he could do if he had more than a few weeks....

- All the set pieces in this movie are unused ones from the development of The Force Awakens. The Hammerhead, Darth Vader's castle, the planet shield; I was hoping they'd save those for Episode 8. However, considering Darth Vaders castle was added in the reshoots (and served no purpose whatsoever), I'm guessing it will play a part in either Episode 8 or 9.

- Darth Vader's costume was terrible. They got his helmet placed incorrectly, the bottom of it is supposed to go under the cape, not over it. Anytime he moved, his helmet came loose, and looked like Halloween costume. Can't believe they let that stay in the movie.

- Tarkin was overanimated. It was bold having him be a main character considering his actor is dead, but the animators were way too afraid of him looking like a dead CG guy and made his face too animated and bouncy, he looked like a cartoon character. His part in the story was great though, although the movie did more to build his character as a villain than it did for Krennic.

- Fan service was great. Loved Bail Organa, loved the Battle of Yavin pilots, loved Saw Gerrera's inclusion (despite his demise being more pointless than Leo in Titanic), the Whills being introduced, and the ending scene was really well done (but it pretty much stole the show).

However, as nice as it was, I still feel making a new Star Wars movie every year is a mistake. This should have been an episode of a TV show, not a major motion picture. It competes with the Episodes and dilutes their impact.
 
Finally saw Rogue One. It was very solid. The action and last act was the best part, but there were a lot of good scenes in general. While I felt Jyn was an underdeveloped protagonist, and most of the other characters could have been development better as well, I found the overall story very solid. Plus extra points for seeing Vader be a bad-ass again. 

Giacchino's score was also very good, though perhaps a bit too epic, and leaning too much on previous themes. 

Also the Tarkin and Leia CGI recreations didn't bother me that much. 
 
WillyFive said:
Gareth Edwards is not good at main characters. Jyn and the male lead are just nonexistant meat sacks that say lines that move the story forward, they are the worst part of the movie. As for the rest of it:

- Giacchinno is The One. If anyone has to take Williams' place, it has to be him. As soon as the title card came out, and he did that thing with starting with the Star Wars theme but effortlessly transitioning into the Rogue One theme was majestic. He even had the singsong quality that Williams gives to his scores, with small character movements on screen getting a small instrumental flourish in the soundtrack. There weren't as many themes in the movie as usual (only two or three), but imagine what he could do if he had more than a few weeks....
Click to expand...

To be fair Gareth Edwards doesn't really write his scripts, and he strikes more as a visual director anyway. Also maybe they didn't want to give the characters too much development, considering what happens to them at the end of the film.

Also just to correct you a bit, but Giacchino's score has four new themes to be exact, in addition to the preexisting ones. It's a fairly good score overall, though.
 
Fancyarcher said:
To be fair Gareth Edwards doesn't really write his scripts, and he strikes more as a visual director anyway. Also maybe they didn't want to give the characters too much development, considering what happens to them at the end of the film.

Also just to correct you a bit, but Giacchino's score has four new themes to be exact, in addition to the preexisting ones. It's a fairly good score overall, though.
Click to expand...

It doesn't matter whether a director writes the scripts or not. Being a "visual director" is also not an excuse, but an explanation for his shortcomings. It's one way of saying a director is only good at certain things and not very well rounded. If a director has a good handle on characterization and knowing what they want to best serve the film, they give those instructions to the script writers to help them. Films aren't made in a vacuum with each person doing their individual jobs and everyone else being stuck with that.

So yeah I think saying Edwards sucks at characters and human drama is a valid critique of his weakness as a director. Maybe this weakness can be covered if he is paired with a very strong screenwriter who has both the understanding of how to compensate for this and who can articulately explain and convince him that there are better ways to do things. But that doesn't mean the fault of having weak characters doesn't rest with the director in the end.
 
GaimeGuy said:
"He is as clumsy as he is stupid."
"I find your lack of faith disturbing."

Vader is full of corny one liners and sass in the OT.
Click to expand...

You can imagine the shit-eating grin he must've had when Lando opened the door to the dining room in Empire.

"We would be honored if you would join us."
 
Remember when Darth Vader was AFI's best villian in all of cinema? Now he makes dad jokes...

Best part of this movie was Dunkirk.
 
GaimeGuy said:
"He is as clumsy as he is stupid."
"I find your lack of faith disturbing."

Vader is full of corny one liners and sass in the OT.
Click to expand...

Its just the actual pun that makes Vader's line in Rogue One slightly jarring. When a character has existed for so many decades and is iconic and so quotable, it's hard for any writer to convincingly capture that character's voice. I found pretty much all his dialogue in Rogue One slightly off and I mean his lines not his voice. I had the same issue with Star Wars Rebels, especially when the writers give Vader lines that are too long.

Vader has always had a cruel and sadistic sense of humor in the OT but I don't recall any actual word play, and the choke line stands out to me because of it. The Rogue One portrayal of Vader is much more convincing when he's not talking like in the end scene. Even though we've never actually seen Vader do that before, it felt completely in-character and believable because they got his movement right and really sold his raw power that he had mostly only glimpsed before.

To me there's a jarring difference between the 2 Vader scenes.
 
WillyFive said:
- Darth Vader's costume was terrible. They got his helmet placed incorrectly, the bottom of it is supposed to go under the cape, not over it. Anytime he moved, his helmet came loose, and looked like Halloween costume. Can't believe they let that stay in the movie.
Click to expand...

The first thing I noticed about Vader was when he was walking down the corridor, his torso was compressing and moving back and forth like a normal person wearing a T-shirt walking. His torso never moves back and forth in the PT and OT and watching him walking along in R1 felt completely wrong. Look at Vader's costume in the PT and OT, the way it's designed, his torso is like a big hunk of machinery (which it is) and doesn't have the flexibility to permit him to walk normally.
 
Branduil said:
The film should have ended with the heroes, all surviving, boarding the alliance ship, and all seems peaceful. Then, halfway through the end credits scroll, Vader literally RIPS through the screen with his lightsaber. He walks up to Chirrut and says "the force is IN YOU now" as he runs him through with his blade, before spinning into a decapitation of Bodhi, mocking him with "looks like our imperial traitor got a little aHEAD of himself." He crumples K2SO with a force fist, calling out "This is the droid I'm looking for," and then tosses his saber into the air, kicks Cassian and Baze to the ground on top of each other, and watches as the saber falls through both of them. "Let rebel dogs lie" quips Vader. Finally, he approaches Jyn, and says "I'll be your daddy now... just kidding" and blasts her out of the airlock. Fuck yeah, now that's an ending.
Click to expand...

Totally fits with the attitude of new canon Vader.

FG2Qrzu.jpg
 
BrettWeir said:
Am I the only one that thought the movie was "Meh"?
Click to expand...

Nah, a few people have expressed that, including myself. My buddy is funny. He's gonna pay for me to watch it with him a second time because he couldn't believe that I found it only ok and had no desires to see it again haha. Maybe something will click with me next time, I dunno.
 
Just saw the movie for the first time today. The first 2/3s of the movie where meh, I honestly felt bored, the characters were super bland and some of them were just pointless.

The last third of the film was good, but I don't think it makes up for all we had to endure to get there. I do appreciate that they tried something new tone wise, this is a pretty grim movie. It just needed better characters that you could care more about for it to have a bigger impact.

Overall, I liked it more than any of the prequels, but I would not put it even close to the original trilogy and TFA.

My updated rankings for SW movies:

1. ESB
2. TFA
3. ANH
4. RoTJ

5. R1

6. RoTS
7. TPM
8. AotC
 
So I just saw the movie, and I liked it, but I thought Jyn was a boring character. It seems like most here liked her though?

I should probably see it again.
 
I saw this a few days ago but didn't have time to write anything up.

I think it's really good. It's nowhere near as polished or structurally airtight as The Force Awakens. The first act (outside of the cold open on the farm, which I thought was fantastic) is way too disjointed, but I think everything during/after the guerilla battle on Jedha is where it really comes together. I know this is an extremely narrow way of judging a movie, but I was extremely happy about all the ways this felt like a Star Wars movie for me. I've wanted a prole's-eye-view of this world for ages, which is previously something you could only get from some books of wildly varying quality. It was awesome to see what armed resistance looks like in the streets. It was awesome to see politics a little bit murkier than "rebels vs imperials" (the attempt at gulf/iraq war commentary in episodes I, II, and III notwithstanding) with the division between the street-level resistance, the rebel alliance, and even infighting within the alliance itself. I commented to a friend that it was hilarious to see a Star Wars movie about leftist factionalism, but that's really only a half joke. I do find that sort of worldbuilding fascinating.

I really didn't have trouble with the characters and motivations either, at least not as much as a lot of folks here. The only thing that felt poorly introduced was Jyn's apolitical stance - we open with a scene basically showing an explicit reason for her to be radicalized, only to cut to her in imperial prison as... a non-political prisoner, I guess? I was very confused when she started beating on the rebels who were breaking her out. It feels like there's a huge chunk missing in her character setup.

Aside from that wobbly introduction of Jyn, though, I had no trouble recognizing and rooting for everyone elses' cause. Nobody really got much screen time and no, none of them were individually that deep, but that's really not the point and I'm confused as to why so many people feel like it should be. For one thing, Star Wars has always leaned on charmingly presented archetypes rather than rich character development. Secondly, this was very much an ensemble movie, where the group dynamic is the focus rather than any individual. Sure, this leads to slightly flat characters if examined one by one, but that feels a bit like missing the forest for the trees in a film like this. In Ocean's 11, for example, we never really get much insight into Rusty outside of "he worked with Danny before" "he's good at counting cards" and "he likes snack food" - vague as hell traits by themselves, but the point is to watch him bounce off of all of the other vaguely defined broad personalities, not drill down into his personal feelings. Rogue One is full of overlapping, basic, small character arcs: political apathy turned to activism! Extremist firebrand has crisis of faith but realizes what he's really fighting for! Asshole robot is mean at first but is loyal when the chips are down! Nervous pilot musters the courage to make the ultimate sacrifice!

Yeah, none of these are complex, but they're woven into a bigger story about The Struggle™, and I think the characters serve that story just fine. I even really liked Krennic, who got the kind of attention I wish more blockbusters would give their villains - the fact that his rage boiled down to workplace jealousy both provides a compelling motivation for him as well as revealing just how pathetic he really is. There's also the fairly base fact that, yeah, I really appreciated seeing a Star Wars movie that was just hours of the cool brutalist looking industrial designs from the 70s blowing shit up. That was fun.

Honestly, if I have one major complaint besides the first act, it'd be the soundtrack. It really just felt like Giacchino doing a John Williams impersonation and leaning on his worst habits - particularly the overuse of dissonance to signal that you should think whatever is happening is scary and bad. It also sounded like a lot of the music was using sound libraries, which, yech, really didn't sound good in a score like this. I really feel like this movie should have broken from tradition with the score and gone for something more unique - and frankly, if Giacchino is the one tipped to take the reigns from Williams eventually, I dunno how I feel about it after hearing this. It's so on the nose.
 
Every time I come back to this thread it's the fucking pun that's always being discussed.

Can't we talk about, like...

Hasn't everything been covered already?

I just want to see the Blu-Ray special features at this point.
 
Branduil said:
The film should have ended with the heroes, all surviving, boarding the alliance ship, and all seems peaceful. Then, halfway through the end credits scroll, Vader literally RIPS through the screen with his lightsaber. He walks up to Chirrut and says "the force is IN YOU now" as he runs him through with his blade, before spinning into a decapitation of Bodhi, mocking him with "looks like our imperial traitor got a little aHEAD of himself." He crumples K2SO with a force fist, calling out "This is the droid I'm looking for," and then tosses his saber into the air, kicks Cassian and Baze to the ground on top of each other, and watches as the saber falls through both of them. "Let rebel dogs lie" quips Vader. Finally, he approaches Jyn, and says "I'll be your daddy now... just kidding" and blasts her out of the airlock. Fuck yeah, now that's an ending.
Click to expand...

Post of the thread.
 
XANDER CAGE said:
I saw this a few days ago but didn't have time to write anything up.

Aside from that wobbly introduction of Jyn, though, I had no trouble recognizing and rooting for everyone elses' cause. Nobody really got much screen time and no, none of them were individually that deep, but that's really not the point and I'm confused as to why so many people feel like it should be. For one thing, Star Wars has always leaned on charmingly presented archetypes rather than rich character development. Secondly, this was very much an ensemble movie, where the group dynamic is the focus rather than any individual. Sure, this leads to slightly flat characters if examined one by one, but that feels a bit like missing the forest for the trees in a film like this. In Ocean's 11, for example, we never really get much insight into Rusty outside of "he worked with Danny before" "he's good at counting cards" and "he likes snack food" - vague as hell traits by themselves, but the point is to watch him bounce off of all of the other vaguely defined broad personalities, not drill down into his personal feelings. Rogue One is full of overlapping, basic, small character arcs: political apathy turned to activism! Extremist firebrand has crisis of faith but realizes what he's really fighting for! Asshole robot is mean at first but is loyal when the chips are down! Nervous pilot musters the courage to make the ultimate sacrifice!
Click to expand...

I generally agree that in an ensemble the individual characters don't necessarily need that much depth, but still felt that the group dynamic in this movie was a bit flat. The characters didn't really interact as a group or butt heads in interesting ways.

The ensemble isn't as bad as the Suicide Squad, but it's not quite as strong as the Guardians of the Galaxy. Obviously the tone of these movies are very different though.
 
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