orthodoxy1095
Banned
That's why I said maybe. I'm not sure how any choice in that game will work out. Otherwise, it has hallmarks of an RPG, ability growth, character customization, and role/style playing.
Horizon Zero Dawn - Preview Thread [Up: All Previews Live]
- Thread starter Kenzodielocke
- Start date
I think it is very clear.
1)Games that allow you to build your character in various ways to handle encounters in numerous ways (ranging from stealth to combat to diplomacy etc) are RPGs
2)Games where encounters are always dealt with combat but allow you to build a character who can handle combat in specific ways (ranged, melee, magic, fast and offensive or slow and defensive) are Action RPGs
3)Games where your character can use all their tools and weapons without needing to build your character in a specific way (with a progression tree that makes those tools/weapons more effective) are action games with a progression system.
From what I have seen and read in previews, Horizon fills the third category. Which by itself does not make it a bad game, in fact I think this game will be huge success. However there is clear fatigue for some people when it comes to these types of games and these types of progressions systems since they are simply not as interesting to interact with as in the other two cases.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
You can trade for weapons and armor. Not sure if you can just find complete weapons lying around as I think killing machines only rewards parts. Maybe From killing humans though? I would not be surprised if those dungeons have ultra rare gear as rewards.
StrongBlackVine
Banned
OK I am done with side topic. Interesting to see that some people don't consider FF and KH to be RPGs though.
isaacnukem
Member
If the game isn't an RPG then that's great news for Guerrilla, because it would rake in millions from the action loving RPG hating crowd
Callibretto
Member
Haven't heard of nioh having character choices that effect the world, but by that definition a lot of linear jrpg like Final Fantasy that don't have branching narrative is not rpg either.
I think it's just something that a rpg could have but not necessarily need to have 1 imo
isaacnukem
Member
So basically, most JRPGs are not RPGs? But I digress. This is about Horizon. I hope it'll turn out to be a wonderful game whatever genre it is in, whatever game it's supposedly aping, and whatever brightness setting the nighttime is.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Well yeah. I don't consider most JRPGs to actually be RPGs. That falls under the Erickson argument:
In the case of the more menu-based JRPGs, they're probably more of strategy adventure games, and in the action-based ones they're more of story-adventure games. But this is neither here nor there, and a topic more suited for the "Controversial Opinions Thread."
I think I could live with the animations if the voice-work didn't have such a chasm in quality across characters. I'm interested to see if that's a recurring thing throughout the game.
zkorejo
Member
Yeah I am hoping for all parts, rewards, human loots and dungeon chests. Thats what makes RPG's exciting for me.
isaacnukem
Member
I just want to add one more thing and then I'll show myself out: even if JRPGs are not RPGs, I love them all the same.
BlackBuzzard
Banned
Well there was some footage in the Playstation access preview where they went in a cave and there was some hightech armor locked behind a door where you had to solve some puzzle to get it.
Camp Freddie
Member
Wow, It's looking really good with lots of positive previews. It's good to see that the different combat options seem useful.
Apologies for backseat modding, but can people please take the "What is an RPG?" bullshit to another thread.
It's obvious that this game has elements of both RPG and action games and sits in a grey area between them. The pantomime "Oh yes is is!", "Oh no it isn't!" debate adds absolutely fuck all to anyone's understanding of the game.
In an ironically similar point, I have to laugh at the robo-giraffes. They look cool and I like the idea, but I can't shake the feeling that the design team is like, "You can't call it an an open world game unless you climb towers to reveal map icons!", "No, that's a horrible Ubisoft trope that everyone hates!", "OK, so how can we have climbable towers that aren't actually towers?"
Apologies for backseat modding, but can people please take the "What is an RPG?" bullshit to another thread.
It's obvious that this game has elements of both RPG and action games and sits in a grey area between them. The pantomime "Oh yes is is!", "Oh no it isn't!" debate adds absolutely fuck all to anyone's understanding of the game.
In an ironically similar point, I have to laugh at the robo-giraffes. They look cool and I like the idea, but I can't shake the feeling that the design team is like, "You can't call it an an open world game unless you climb towers to reveal map icons!", "No, that's a horrible Ubisoft trope that everyone hates!", "OK, so how can we have climbable towers that aren't actually towers?"
Agreed, this looks like the action-adventure gameplay we'd expect from something like Deus Ex or MGSV. There's scouting and marking, to give you an idea of how to approach a combat scenario and place traps and take advantage of environmental objects. There's stealth, which opens up a lot of hit and run options. There's different components to shoot off which you can prioritise to gain combat advantages. And there's real-time shooting mechanics which rewards good aim.
The best "Ubisoft towers" are the ones that aren't just towers, but have the puzzle of "how do I get there?" attached to them. Watch Dogs did this best, with each CTOS server being its own mini-mission. It seems like GG has taken this into account as well, with the player needing to figure out how to get to the right point to scale the creature.
Nioh has more gear customization than 90% of RPGs in the market. Some Final Fantasy games like 6 and 10 give a ridiculous amount of options and customizability. Soulsborne games give the best role playing opportunities out there. Bioware style RPGs give you a lot of control over the character and the narrative (with the exception of ME3).
Narrowing down the RPG genre to shallow definitions is counter productive and not accurate at all.
There are no role playing opportunities in far cry, and the comparison is shallow at best.
Narrowing down the RPG genre to shallow definitions is counter productive and not accurate at all.
There are no role playing opportunities in far cry, and the comparison is shallow at best.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Didn't totally confirm it. I could see that stuff being pushed back the further you get into the game.
Endorphineforeverybody
Member
Could be only if she does new things for the first time?
Combat system.
Magic Mushroom
Member
It's more of an RPG. It has dialogue choices, dungeons, lore; that kind of stuff.
And it being a third person game, it also has a different approach to movement and combat.
So mainly deeper mechanics and systems.
The preview got my interest..........looks good.
GinoFelino
Member
Oh definitely. But The Witcher was a great game regardless, and there's many aspects of it (the aspects that people most appreciated) that will likely not be equalled by Horizon: Zero Dawn.
Horizon, on the other hand, looks to have the better combat system by a mile.
MegaSackman
Member
Well, at least the downgrade discussion is gone, right?
Horizon will have better graphics and combat system but Witcher 3 story was amazing also some great side quests.
One of my favorite games of all time, too bad it came in the same year as Bloodborne because Bloodborne is just too damn good.
Either way I hope Horizon is even better.
gustave154
Member
After watching ghostrobo videos on the game, the game's combat is miles better than any other open world combat before it. The animations are really well done.
Yup, Disappointed , was looking forward to the downgrade thread, well okay i guess.
GinoFelino
Member
Too bad? You mean, so you couldn't call it your GOTY?
You still got to play two amazing games, which is cause for celebration, right?
I really hope Guerilla was able to take it to the next level with Horizon. It'd be a small miracle coming from Killzone: Shadow Fall.
ShemhazaiX
Member
Actually it's the second case. You can build for stealth, straight up combat or utility. About as much build variety as the Witcher 3. You pick gear to better suit your build, with some offering better stealth abilities, some offering better resistances.
Nothing in the game is specific to Far Cry. Everything people have used to compare it to Far Cry has existed in games for ages. Has bandit camps, which you know, Skyrim had. Towers for revealing the map, happened in Assassin's Creed LOOOONG before that. Crafting tools and equipment like in Witcher 3. Far Cry Primal is just the choice they used, probably because everyone keeps saying "Oh, that looks a bit like from Far Cry Primal" and the press isn't immune to confirmation bias.
And it took nearly 8-10 patches after launch for the Witcher 3 to really shine...
Caipirinha
Member
Gameplay, third person perspective, setting, themes, premise, characterisation..
So yeah just about everything.
17 Seconds
Banned
just can't shake the open world checklist vibe i get from this game
Imp the Dimp
Member
As a pro owner, I'm looking forward to this. The reviews seem to be favourable but I hope there actual substance to this game because that's where I find Guerilla traditionally lacking. The wow effect of cool graphics fades rather quickly in my case.
GinoFelino
Member
It's 2017 and people will compare a game that comes out in 2017 with games that have already come out in 2017. A game isn't better or worse because it's a developer's third or fifteenth game.
amstradcpc
Member
No videos of melee combat in the "kill the bandits" mission?. I have only seen stealth and I wonder if melee is similar to Witcher 3 or what...
Nightengale
Member
Of course.
And by all accounts so far Horizon looks to be a good game by 2017 standards.
Too bad? You mean, so you couldn't call it your GOTY?
You still got to play two amazing games, which is cause for celebration, right?
I really hope Guerilla was able to take it to the next level with Horizon. It'd be a small miracle coming from Killzone: Shadow Fall.
Yup loved both!
GinoFelino
Member
Oh sure. I wasn't referencing Horizon's quality in any way, because I don't have a clue how good a game it is. Just the notion that it matters if it's Guerilla's first crack at an RPG.
Dialogue animations look like 2017 Bioware standards. Combat looks to be significantly better than any WRPG we have seen yet.
I expected better than Bioware levels of dialogue animations to be honest, so I can't deny my disappointment there, but everything else looks ace.
Nightengale
Member
Agreed. It doesn't matter at the end of it.
Of course it's natural to expect that a new dev's foray into a new IP won't be as deep or rich as devs experienced in that space.
But it's the job of the dev to make up for those shortfalls with other things they're better at... or do something different. Things like combat, enemy design, art, etc.
If Horizon had generic Tomb Raider combat with bland human enemies no one would give a shit about Horizon. The combat and MH-ish encounters are what elevates it despite being just "passable" in many others aspects of Open World Game Design 101.
GinoFelino
Member
It's quite something.
I'm still half expecting the game to be terrible despite previews looking good, but that's just the shadow (no pun intended) cast by Killzone Shadow Fall.
Definitely, that looks to be the case here. Every good developer has their specialties and weaknesses and Horizon is looking promising!
Nightengale
Member
Still hard to believe that andromeda animation looks so... dated.
Blackquill
Member
Finally a western AAA open world game that doesn't look too shitty on the combat department
but man i'm tempted to cut all the cutscenes
but man i'm tempted to cut all the cutscenes