House Republicans/Ryan Finally Release ACA Repeal (lol) and Replace (lol) Bill
- Thread starter Black Mamba
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BrokenIcarus
Member
Why do you think the freedom caucus will vote against it?
It's gonna be a fucking circus. I'll be intently watching like this.
We gonna die any minute now.
Arrogant Bastard
Banned
Because it isn't a full repeal, they don't want Obamacare lite, they don't want anything at all.
Goro Majima
Kitty Genovese Member
A 60 year old in Mobile, Ala who earns around $20k about to get a $9k+ tax increase.
Am I crazy or is there a huge savings for the middle class and young professionals?
If this passed, it'd be a pain to remove those credits for people that didn't get anything under the ACA. Republicans could accuse Democrats of a tax hike on the middle class if they tried to revert back to the status quo anyway.
The Technomancer
card-carrying scientician
That's only the tax credit. A tax credit that size isn't going to matter much when you're paying 5 times more instead of 3 times. Not to mention now you need a health savings account. It's only one small part of the whole picture. The new bill doesn't do anything to control costs and in fact will probably have the opposite effect.
In fairness the tax penalty at 2.5% of income was not enough to incentivize young people to enroll, which continues to be one of the main drivers of rising premiums. Not enough young n healthy people to offset the sick and needy.
Never underestimate the ability of Republicans to fall in line. The House whip will get just enough members to vote for it while allowing prominent members of the Freedom Caucus to symbolically vote against it.
While it can be spun that way, at the same time you have far more poor people who would be getting a tax increase when you put it in place to begin with. Look at 60 year olds who are generally die hard Republican voters. Enormous tax increases just to get this passed.
Goro Majima
Kitty Genovese Member
Yeah that makes sense. Controlling costs always kinda seemed like the biggest problem considering how much we spend on healthcare.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Here is the deal about those "middle-class" tax credits: most people in those income brackets won't see them if they have children. They already get most of that back in taxes with EITC and child tax credit.
Mr.Shrugglesã
Banned
Only if you look at the tax credits alone.
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Yep. Are there even subsidies that scale based on family size?
Most of which is entirely absent from this. That's where the focus and biggest impact can come from. But instead of starting with the stuff that buys them goodwill, they start with taxes on old people.
Are you suffering from Rand-Paul-Ryan Confusion Syndrome?
I hope you health plans covers that.
Never trust a man with 2 first names.
How can you improve something when your opposition believes in dissolution as a solution?
You can't improve X if people think X itself is bad and goes in the "wrong direction." Look at how quick the cocksuckers for this bill use words like individual responsibility, access, and free market. They want a system that works as illusion, for actual policies highlight the buzzwords they cling to as hollow when compared to real, lived in circumstances.
bodyofanamerican
Member
Can this be passed fully through Reconciliation, or do they need Dem votes in the Senate?
As the GOP has shown, it's a lot easier (and more profitable) to run on a platform of criticizing anything people don't like about the people who are actually proposing changes.
Maybe Americans should invest in new Representatives instead of these spineless shit for brains assholes. Fuck you Jason Chaffetz, you're lucky you didn't spout that nonsense around someone with the ability to punch your hollow fucking skull. There's a special place in hell for you and your fellow weasel friends like Paul Ryan.
fredrancour
Member
radically improving upon it would require things the republican party would dislike even more than the current bill:
spend more to help low-income people, via subsidies or more medicaid expansions
create downward pressure on prices, whether through regulations on care providers or a public option to compete with for-profit ones.
The current super-centrist version of the bill was passed with 0 R votes. it'll take a lot more prolonged unrest from constituents to shake some reps enough that they rethink their psychotic anti-government crusade.
it's still totally the right thing to do to begin drafting incremental improvements now, but I can see how some defeatism might be slowing down people who'd be writing the hypothetical bill.
Yeah but in this case, they didn't propose full dissolution. They kept the insurance regulations for pre-existing conditions and young adults staying on their parent's plan. There's still a (arguably worse) penalty for not maintaining coverage. There's still tax credits for people to buy insurance on the individual market. Some of the taxes and other pay fors are still there. It's more an amendment than a repeal.
So why don't the Democrats propose their own amendment? It will undoubtedly get a better CBO score and from actual industry experts. It obviously won't pass but at least they'll be taking a position other than "not this".
Castef
Banned
Can't see the issue with this. Most of the people who voted Trump belong to low-income population. This basically means they are fine with this.
I only hope that among them there are not so much of people like this genius.
In any case, well deserved.
I only hope that among them there are not so much of people like this genius.
In any case, well deserved.
LegendofJoe
Member
The Democrats should focus on one thing only to keep things simple - negotiation of drug prices. It's something that pretty much everyone understands, and it cuts across political boundaries. Bernie and Booker have started to push this, but they need to go further. They need to push for Medicare negotiations and publicly rebuke Trump constantly from now until election day for failing to force the inclusion of it.
Netherscourge
Banned
The Tax Credit can only be claimed during tax time right?
So, wouldn't you still have to front all the money at the time of the medical procedures or when you need to get prescriptions?
Or am I missing something?
So, wouldn't you still have to front all the money at the time of the medical procedures or when you need to get prescriptions?
Or am I missing something?
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
No, you put it into a magical HSA right away that will pay for everything!
Can't see the issue? AARP is already telling the elderly to call their reps. Dems obviously aren't happy with this and the GOP don't even agree with this.
Mr.Shrugglesã
Banned
Shocking. People found out having insurance, and that you won't die when you need to use it, is a good thing.
fredrancour
Member
I'm definitely fine with drug prices getting the PR spotlight.
It doesn't matter, GOP has been winning as a minority for a couple year now. They no longer make even a pretense of caring what the majority of the country wants, they just talk about how their voters are the only Real Americans and fuck the rest.
If you haven't noticed, Republicans haven't fallen in line with the "establishment." The Freedom Caucus is the reason for a lot of the obstructionism and populism. It's the other way around, the establishment falls in line with the Tea Party.
So no, this is definitely not getting passed.
UnObtainium17
Member
If that clown chafdetz just responded with "Fuck poor people LOL" it'll have the same message as he said on that show. And probably less offensive too.
LucidMomentum
Member
It's a terrible idea, but not because the surcharge is worse than the penalty
ACA penalty is $695-2085 every year you go uninsured
If you pay $500 a month for insurance (above average) a 30% penalty is $150 for 12 months = $1800
At the minimum ACA penalty, you come out ahead if you can go 3 years without insurance under ryancare and the longer you go uninsured the more you will come out ahead (that's the problem)
Who can go years without insurance? young healthy people that are necessary for the entire insurance scheme to work
Mr.Shrugglesã
Banned
Don't forget that the surcharge goes to the insurance company as opposed to the penalty going to the department of health and human services.
Netherscourge
Banned
Makes you wonder how less expensive all this would be with a Public Option Healthcare plan. You know, the one the Republicans made up 'Death Panel' bullshit about to scare everyone away from.
If we had a Federal alternative, we'd probably be saving a shit-ton of money and could just use standard taxes to pay for it without any of this penalty/surcharge bullshit.
But, you know... Social Healthcare is the devil. Gotta burn it at the stake to keep Satan away.
If we had a Federal alternative, we'd probably be saving a shit-ton of money and could just use standard taxes to pay for it without any of this penalty/surcharge bullshit.
But, you know... Social Healthcare is the devil. Gotta burn it at the stake to keep Satan away.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
Didn't the individual mandate survive the supreme court specifically because it was considered a tax? Wouldn't the 30% surcharge, which is not a tax, be subject to pretty easy judicial scrutiny?
A Human Becoming
More than a Member
Trying to pass some of these measures through would be unprecedented. Unless McConnell invokes the nuclear option, aka killing the filibuster, they need some Democrats on board. I'm not even sure he could get 50 votes, though: some Republicans have already come out opposed to measures in the bill. I don't think Manchin or Heitkamp would vote for it either.
ACHA seems like a bill sent out to die.
LegendofJoe
Member
Unlike single-payer it's hard to spin and deflect why allowing the government to negotiate better rates for pharmaceuticals is a bad thing. Especially when you can factually fire back that it will help your grandparents afford their medication AND save taxpayers money.
Of course that's essentially what single-payer is, but you can't spin negotiations as a government takeover of healthcare. The American people are gullible and ignorant, we need to take baby steps if we ever want single-payer insurance.
Why do you hate America?
paradise_circus
Member
Not if republicans say "they" want to divide the nation and don't want to work united with all parties to find a solution.
Ziltoidia 9
Member
Gotta put it to the GOP tho....they figured out how to make the companies richer, give tax cuts to the 1% and kill more people with one bill.
Mr.Shrugglesã
Banned
I mean, it's not really the gop writing these things.
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