Game of Thrones Season 8 |OT| A Song of Icy and Fiery Fandom

Kadayi said:
Trivial my ass, Headless wights where they at?
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The original point being argued was how stupid it was that the Dothraki get sent off to fight the undead army head-on without dragonglass or fire if the plot hadn't been based around convenience. You're focusing on a point I've already conceded if it were as you say, it would hardly make the charge any less stupid. The very definition of a Trivial objections fallacy.

I'm amazed at how much bad faith you're putting into a discussion of a TV series.
 
Jon Neu said:
Again, the wall is not only a physical barrier, it's also said to be magical. Dragons could fly pass it easily, but they are incapable of doing so. Maybe because of fear, maybe because of magic, that's still unexplained.
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I think one of the most interesting moments in the entire series is when Bran is with the 3-eyed Raven and they watch the actual fight between Ned and the Sword of the Dawn and it doesn't play out as Brans been told. There's a lesson in that. :unsure:

And in the books we don't even know what's the objective of the Others.
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Again with the books, when we are talking about the show. :messenger_dizzy:

Pretty sure a wight is not an Other.
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Pretty sure I watched the white walkers at Winterfell with zero fucks given about any ancient magical barrier stopping them from heading south. Are you honestly running with this idea that the White Walkers couldn't walk through Castle Black gates? Or did undead dragon flre somehow just negate those ancient magics entirely?

Evilore already did it.
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Please, they've had plenty of opportunities to have a few headless wights thrown into the mix. Hell, when Bran spied on the Army of the dead at rest prior to when he got marked by the Night King they could have slipped a few in.

EviLore said:
The original point of contention was regarding why the Dothraki would be prepared to charge directly at the undead army with normal arakhs prior to Melisandre suddenly showing up to light the weapons on fire. There is no good answer for that.
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I think the inherent problem is though with much of the criticism of the episode is fuelled by an over-reliance on 'we didn't see it, therefore it didn't happen' (look Geki-D Geki-D below) . Sure the Dothraki have their traditional swords, but I can't honestly imagine they didn't have Dragonglass on them as well, given everyone and their aunt fucker at Winterfell knows wights are vulnerable to it. Yet because we don't openly see those (or them having Dragon glass arrows either) before the charge there's a preponderance of armchair generals all 'WTF!!!' flipping tables. Doesn't make sense to charge with Dagger drawn versus their curved swords tbh. I mean I'm not sure I saw the unsullied having Dragonglass tipped spears either. Those fucking amateurs. I thought they were organised? *flips table* :messenger_pouting:

I mean everyone here is trying to convince me that headless wights are indeed a thing, yet zero evidence to support that assertion exists in the show. What gives? One rule for thee, another for me?

Geki-D said:
The original point being argued was how stupid it was that the Dothraki get sent off to fight the undead army head-on without dragonglass or fire if the plot hadn't been based around convenience. You're focusing on a point I've already conceded if it were as you say, it would hardly make the charge any less stupid.
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See response above
 
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Musky_Cheese said:
For the plot

Because lazy writing
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This reminds me that I thought Theon should have shouted something like "for Winterfell!" after Bran tells him he is at home and that he is a good man.

That would have been perfect to end his character arc and would have made his death much better.

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One of the best and most human characters of them all, amazing work by Alfie Allen too. Sleep tight, sweet Reek.
 
Jon Neu said:
This reminds me that I thought Theon should have shouted something like "for Winterfell!" after Bran tells him he is at home and that he is a good man.

That would have been perfect to end his character arc and would have made his death much better.

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One of the best and most human characters of them all, amazing work by Alfie Allen too. Sleep tight, sweet Reek.
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That desperation when he starts the fight on through to the end was amazing. I just wish the other characters experienced it and wasn't so hit and miss in the episode.
 
Kadayi said:
I think the inherent problem is though with much of the criticism of the episode is fuelled by an over-reliance on 'we didn't see it, therefore it didn't happen' (look @Geki-D below) . Sure the Dothraki have their traditional swords, but I can't honestly imagine they didn't have Dragonglass on them as well, given everyone and their aunt fucker at Winterfell knows wights are vulnerable to it. Yet because we don't openly see those (or them having Dragon glass arrows either) before the charge there's a preponderance of armchair generals all 'WTF!!!' flipping tables. Doesn't make sense to charge with Dagger drawn versus their curved swords tbh. I mean I'm not sure I saw the unsullied having Dragonglass tipped spears either.
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lol Even if we assume the Dothraki have dragonglass daggers awkwardly stuffed beneath their fur coats whilst they're mounted on horses, already holding weapons they know are ineffective in their hand, it doesn't make the charge any less stupid.

Kadayi said:
One rule for thee, another for me?
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This is pretty funny seeing as you were the one who was playing this whole "If you can't see it it ain't true" game to begin with. Of course the difference is that if we know the Dothraki have dragonglass it would actually be relevant to the topic at hand whilst headless wights blinding wandering around barely affects how valid the Dothraki charge was or wasn't.
 
Kadayi said:
I think one of the most interesting moments in the entire series is when Bran is with the 3-eyed Raven and they watch the actual fight between Ned and the Sword of the Dawn and it doesn't play out as Brans been told. There's a lesson in that. :unsure:
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A lesson we learned time ago in the books.

Kadayi said:
Again with the books, when we are talking about the show. :messenger_dizzy:
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We were actually talking about GRRM and the books there, but ok.

Kadayi said:
Pretty sure I watched the white walkers at Winterfell with zero fucks given about any ancient magical barrier stopping them from heading south. Are you honestly running with this idea that the White Walkers couldn't walk through Castle Black gates? Or did undead dragon flre somehow just negate those ancient magics entirely?
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In the show we don't know anything because they don't care, so we will never know.

In the books there hasn't been any Other past the wall, as far as it's known.

Kadayi said:
Please, they've had plenty of opportunities to have a few headless wights thrown into the mix. Hell, when Bran spied on the Army of the dead at rest prior to when he got marked by the Night King they could have slipped a few in.
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You are literally not making any argument. We have already show you examples of both book and show canon with headless zombies. Sorry if that breaks your headcanon, but facts are facts.

In GRRM works, he loves to write about telepathy and hivemind organisms who manipulate and deceive humans with false dreams. That's probably how the wights work, they aren't alive, they are just being controlled with the power of other entity. I remember a recent interview with Martin and he talked about how he could die, but his physical body still is going to be there and somebody can run electricity through it and was basically telling the idea that the body can be a puppet. You don't need a puppet to be alive, neither to have a head.

When they want to prevent bodies from becoming wights, they don't cut their heads.
 
Geki-D said:
lol Even if we assume the Dothraki have dragonglass daggers awkwardly stuffed beneath their fur coats whilst they're mounted on horses, already holding weapons they know are ineffective in their hand, it doesn't make the charge any less stupid.
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When the dirty dozen went north of the wall only Jorah, Beric, Thoros & Jon had wight killing weapons. You'd have thought they might have been all: -

tenor.gif


to Tormund, the Hound & Gendry when picking up their BS ineffective weapons before heading off no?


This is pretty funny seeing as you were the one who was playing this whole "If you can't see it it ain't true" game to begin with. Of course the difference is that if we know the Dothraki have dragonglass it would actually be relevant to the topic at hand whilst headless wights blinding wandering around barely affects how valid the Dothraki charge was or wasn't.
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I'm simply applying a rule, that's all too common to this thread.
 
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Jon Neu said:
A lesson we learned time ago in the books.
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Again with the books? :messenger_dizzy: 95% of the people watching the series will not read the books, ever. What happened in the books is pretty much irrelevant to the inner workings of the show. Honestly, I don't get why this simple concept is so hard to understand. :unsure:

You are literally not making any argument. We have already shown you examples of both book and show canon with headless zombies.
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Again with the books? :messenger_dizzy: This is not the Book thread this is the show thread. There are no headless wights running around in the show. Sorry if that breaks your headcanon, but facts are facts. :unsure:
 
We don't have separate book reader and show-only watcher threads for this season, so book talk is 100% fine here. Attempting to shut down points sourced from the books or criticism of the series generally with dismissive metacommentary isn't appropriate.
 
The books and the show have diverged quite a bit given the latter is an adaptation rather than a faithful recreation.
 
Team dany on suicide watch.

I don't get why anyone would want dany to sit on the iron throne, she's already shown to be an incompetent ruler.
 
Kadayi said:
Are any of them fit?
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My man Jon, the rightful king of Westeros, the prince that was promised, the song of ice & fire, the king in the north, the auntiefucker that came back from the dead, because he always comes back.

JonGhost.gif


Anything else is HERESY.
 
Jon Neu said:
My man Jon, the rightful king of Westeros, the prince that was promised, the song of ice & fire, the king in the north, the auntiefucker that came back from the dead, because he always comes back.


Anything else is HERESY.
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Nah, jon has no idea how to rule a fucking kingdom either. Dude is more of a fucking general.

I just wanted book Euron :messenger_sad_relieved:
 
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Jon Neu said:
My man Jon, the rightful king of Westeros, the prince that was promised, the song of ice & fire, the king in the north, the auntiefucker that came back from the dead, because he always comes back..
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Married to Sansa for that northern alliance and feisty redhead action right? GRRM...he likes to keep it in the family (it is known) :messenger_grinning_smiling:

RedVIper said:
Nah, jon has no idea how to rule a fucking kingdom either. Dude is more of a fucking general.
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Haven't you guys just been spending the last few pages criticising his tactics though? :unsure:
 
RedVIper said:
Nah, jon has no idea how to rule a fucking kingdom either. Dude is more of a fucking general.

I just wanted book Euron :messenger_sad_relieved:
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The amount of foreshadowing of Jon becoming king is so giant, Tormund can drink from it's tits.

I wanted book Euron too, but this is what we have.

Kadayi said:
Haven't you guys just been spending the last few pages criticising his tactics though? :unsure:
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Jon is also a puppet in the hands of the most cruel puppeteers ever.

8318A2AB1.jpg
 
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Jon Neu said:
The amount of foreshadowing of Jon becoming king is so giant, Tormund can drink from it's tits.
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Well, he is a king, just he's the king in the north.

Personally, I'm expecting Tyrion to end up on the Throne, maybe with Sansa by his side in a marriage of political convenience. That I think would be suitably bittersweet.

I wanted book Euron too, but this is what we have.
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He's a bit Johnny come lately in the books to come sweeping in I feel.
 
Kadayi said:
Well, he is a king, just he's the king in the north.

Personally, I'm expecting Tyrion to end up on the Throne, maybe with Sansa by his side in a marriage of political convenience. That I think would be suitably bittersweet.
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My magic 8 ball says: "Not fucking likely"
 
RedVIper said:
My magic 8 ball says: "Not fucking likely"
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I don't think either Jon or Dany are ending up on the throne, and I'm not seeing Arya stepping up either (I'm pretty sure she will die tbh) so who does that leave out of the original VP characters ? Tyrion and Sansa.
 
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At this stage I'd actually rather see Sansa on the throne over Daenerys. Sansa has arguably been through a lot more to earn the title. I can't see Sansa just sitting back and watching Daenerys sit on the throne either unless the North is completely independent.

If Danareys keeps on showing disdain for Tyrion I wouldn't be that surprised if he betrays her or changes alliance and supports Sansa (he def has a soft spot for her). Jon is the rightful air anyway and I'd rather see him fucking his cousin and sitting on the throne with Sansa. Plus despite Danareys being the dragon Queen, I bet Sansa has a spicier twat.

Sansa, Jon and Arya controlling the throne at the end seems like too much of a happy ending though...
 
Wouldn't a lot of the dead get raised by the NK? Shouldn't all of the bodies that were raised by the NK now be ice following his death?
 
Kill this power hungry bitch, she will be the end of Jon. We've had Battle for the Bastards and looks like we are getting Battle of the Bitches next?
 
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In my dream i hope Dannys dead but Drogon alive

I need Jon to kill Cersei, bond with the last dragon left and rule the seven kingdom
 
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I thought she was down to one dragon after the last episode, so looks like things balanced out.

Great episode, nice tension built up there. Thanks for reminding me how much I hate Cersei.
 
I thought this was the best episode so far.
Danareys is going full on mad Queen after that. Battle of the Bitches next. Jon will die. Sansa will die.
Arya and Gendry for the throne with Hound as Hand.
 
Near the end things feel rushed and the Bronn thing was a little bit weird, but overall the episode was well executed and there was some very good interactions between characters.

Good episode, the best so far along with the second.
 
Child: Mommy, where did all the dragons go

Mother: they died out. The writers didn't know what else to do with them. That and simply shock value. The dragons were too OP. Now go to sleep my child
 
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