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[temroi]

Re. The ram difference;

How Much VRAM Do You Need For Gaming? [2025 Guide]

There are many factors to consider when buying a new graphics card, and one of the most important ones is VRAM. But is VRAM relevant today? Let's find out.

www.gamingscan.com

based on this, 4TF 1080p machine with similar fidelity should be okay to handle next gen games. Probably we will see some effects scaled down as well but it shouldn’t be too demanding on developers. Think about pc games and graphic settings where you can toggle things like draw distance, particles, RT and other effects. Game design will not require 2 separate work streams.

We are talking about 8GB Ram in TOTAL because of that unified memory system.
So you would have a 4GB Graphics Card with 4 GB of RAM. I dont know about one lower bugdet gaming PC with 4 GB Ram. They start at 8GB and have a graphics card with 4-6 GB RAM.
8 GB Unified Memory dont seem fit for anything next gen to me.

 

[fighterman101]

We are talking about 8GB Ram in TOTAL because of that unified memory system.
So you would have a 4GB Graphics Card with 4 GB of RAM. I dont know about one lower bugdet gaming PC with 4 GB Ram. They start at 8GB and have a graphics card with 4-6 GB RAM.
8 GB Unified Memory dont seem fit for anything next gen to me.

You also have to remember consoles aren't like PC. Developers can optimize more for it and there isn't as much hidden tasks/processes running in the background to take up ram.

 

[KAL2006]

I think Microsoft should go with the following

Xbox Series X - $550
Xbox Series X DE - $500
Xbox Series S - $350
Xbox Series S DE - $300
Xbox Series C (fall 2021) - $100

Both Series X and S should have a digital edition. Series C would just be a Xcloud device with a controller. Discontinue One X and One S DE. Then discontinue One S in fall 2021.

 

[Bo_Hazem]

I think Microsoft should go with the following

Xbox Series X - $550
Xbox Series X DE - $500
Xbox Series S - $350
Xbox Series S DE - $300
Xbox Series C (fall 2021) - $100

Both Series X and S should have a digital edition. Series C would just be a Xcloud device with a controller. Discontinue One X and One S DE. Then discontinue One S in fall 2021.

That sounds kinda smart, Sony can easily counter that by making PS Now available on every TV/cellphone they sell going forward and having your existing game purchased in PS5/PS4 accessible on it. Sony still having some cards to show, the festival hasn't finished yet. I can see another strike one week after the xbox event by Santa Monica and other studios.

 

[Fake]

Is it ok that it has less TF than the Xbox one x?

Differents techs. GCN vs RDNA 2.0

 

[geordiemp]

Posted on B3d, so we have rumours, placeholders in dev kits, but no leaks of hardware yet...mmm

 

[Nikana]

He is pretty much THE most reputable source in games journalism.
Still, if you don't like him you can hop over to Resetera and Twitter to see actual devs say they don't like it and think it's hard to optimize for.

So odd devs don't like XSX but we removed everything that makes it good

If you have actual devs that have said they don't like it then enlighten us. You love to claim things with no receipts. And then if you do, it turns out you've twisted their words in some way. So excuse me for not believing you.

And Jason Schreier is not a real source. Do we really need to go over how wishy washy he is on certain topics or how many times he's been wrong about things?

 

[Nikana]

Or even just actually read the thread, its been said and refuted in this thread already.

No one with any sense or understanding of technology has refuted it. Because it's not weaker than the one X. Again, try to do some research.

 

[oldergamer]

Honestly a lower spec, cheaper console aimed squarely at the casual masses either needs/wants a drive or a very cheap price. See the One S SAD below in the UK. It wouldn't even sell at £129.

The digital only version, no wonder.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

The digital only version, no wonder.

Most people and rumours are saying Lockhart won't have a disc drive which is my point. No matter how good the hardware and bundle (this One S has 3 games and a 1TB HDD) is, the low price, casual demographic really like a disc drive and the other benefits it brings. A £299/€299 Lockhart without a disc drive won't go down well in Europe IMO.

 

[Nikana]

Most people and rumours are saying Lockhart won't have a disc drive which is my point. No matter how good the hardware and bundle (this One S has 3 games and a 1TB HDD) is, the low price, casual demographic really like a disc drive and the other benefits it brings. A £299/€299 Lockhart without a disc drive won't go down well in Europe IMO.

Are you from Europe? I'm curious how the digital adoption rate is over there compared to US?

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Are you from Europe? I'm curious how the digital adoption rate is over there compared to US?

I'm in the UK. I'm not sure what the digital adoption rate is but I'd hazard a guess that the vast majority, given the choice, would choose a disc drive console even if they are 100% or majority digital already. Back-up/physical BC/game sharing/used market to name 4 reasons. A digital console works best as an additional bedroom/kids system IMO.

 

[Tulipanzo]

If you have actual devs that have said they don't like it then enlighten us. You love to claim things with no receipts. And then if you do, it turns out you've twisted their words in some way. So excuse me for not believing you.

And Jason Schreier is not a real source. Do we really need to go over how wishy washy he is on certain topics or how many times he's been wrong about things?

He literally was one of the first people to cover the Lockhart, and next-gen in general.
Even in the other thread, I literally broke everything I wrote apart with quotes on the subject, only for you to completely ignore them.
Before you go and make people prove a negative, why don't you find devs who think optimization is easy on this, or any device?

The problems in optimizing for an obviously inferior system are well known to anyone , and if you need receipts it just highlights how painfully ignorant you are of the subject.

 

[Arun1910]

Posted on B3d, so we have rumours, placeholders in dev kits, but no leaks of hardware yet...mmm

As a Software Developer myself, this amount of comments seems so odd.

Also I'm a bit hungover but isn't this code saying:

If consoleType is Dante, push the Anaconda profile into the object array... Why would you do this? Surely you're be wanting to push the Lockhart profile?

The code after the else if makes more sense:

If consoleType is Scorpio, push Scorpio into the Object array.

 

[Nikana]

He literally was one of the first people to cover the Lockhart, and next-gen in general.
Even in the other thread, I literally broke everything I wrote apart with quotes on the subject, only for you to completely ignore them.
Before you go and make people prove a negative, why don't you find devs who think optimization is easy on this, or any device?

The problems in optimizing for an obviously inferior system are well known to anyone , and if you need receipts it just highlights how painfully ignorant you are of the subject.

I'm not claiming its easy to optimize. You are claiming its not. So I need to prove something I am not claiming? Got it.

Kindly back off with the insults em kay.

Edit: Also why does posting things another thread make it my responsibility to hunt it down? How can I ignore what isn't in this thread?

 

[geordiemp]

As a Software Developer myself, this amount of comments seems so odd.

Also I'm a bit hungover but isn't this code saying:

If consoleType is Dante, push the Anaconda profile into the object array... Why would you do this? Surely you're be wanting to push the Lockhart profile?

The code after the else if makes more sense:

If consoleType is Scorpio, push Scorpio into the Object array.

A hundred ifs lol ....I posted it just to give you a sore head

 

[oldergamer]

Most people and rumours are saying Lockhart won't have a disc drive which is my point. No matter how good the hardware and bundle (this One S has 3 games and a 1TB HDD) is, the low price, casual demographic really like a disc drive and the other benefits it brings. A £299/€299 Lockhart without a disc drive won't go down well in Europe IMO.

Yeah i suspect the same for the PS5 digital version. Unless there is something that makes it standout, i don't see either selling overly well.

 

[Tulipanzo]

I'm not claiming its easy to optimize. You are claiming its not. So I need to prove something I am not claiming? Got it.

Kindly back off with the insults em kay.

You're hounding me as to why devs would dislike "XSX but everything is worse", while also pretending one of the most trusted sources in gaming to be unreliable, and providing nothing of substance.
You can easily hop on Era, on the Lockhart thread, and see devs claim porting would be complex. This has been going on through it's reveal, cancellation, uncancellation and MS's refusal to reveal it.

It's evident, contrary to what some claim, that developers dislike Lockhart, which may thus not deliver on "issue-free 1080p gaming". Please provide anything, beside your dislike of Schreier, as to why that's not accurate.

 

[THE:MILKMAN]

Yeah i suspect the same for the PS5 digital version. Unless there is something that makes it standout, i don't see either selling overly well.

Conversely, if Microsoft were to equip Lockhart with a disc drive at that price it would sell like hot cakes if they have a good selection of games (which rumours suggest they will have).

I really feel strongly it needs the disc drive but fear Microsoft won't do it.

 

[Nikana]

You're hounding me as to why devs would dislike "XSX but everything is worse", while also pretending one of the most trusted sources in gaming to be unreliable, and providing nothing of substance.
You can easily hop on Era, on the Lockhart thread, and see devs claim porting would be complex. This has been going on through it's reveal, cancellation, uncancellation and MS's refusal to reveal it.

It's evident, contrary to what some claim, that developers dislike Lockhart, which may thus not deliver on "issue-free 1080p gaming". Please provide anything, beside your dislike of Schreier, as to why that's not accurate.

Lol I am not hounding you in any fashion. Do you think I have some sort of personal vendetta against you or something?

For the record, I wouldn't be shocked in the slightest if devs dont like Lockhart. Contrary to what you obviously think, I don't like the idea of Lockhart in any fashion. You seem to think that because I ask for proof of your claims that I am beating my chest in favor of Lockhart.

But I am not the one dropping into a thread claiming that Devs said this and or that without showing proof and I have not tried to insult your intelligence either like you have with me. Asking for proof does not make me somehow incapable of understanding what you are presenting. In fact, I would bet my understanding of the topic is far greater than yours. And I promise you I have talked to more devs personally than you ever will. ( if mods want to vet me go for it)

Edit: I am not going to turn this into a what Jason got wrong thread either. But there is plenty out there to show what hes gotten wrong just as much as hes gotten right. He is known for stating things in very vague ways about stuff he doesn't have the full story on and then tries to claim he never says certain things. Do we need to bring up how long he said a Diablo 2 Remaster was coming? And I have no beef with him. I even bought his book.

 

[Memorabilia]

This is the ultimate concern trolling thread. Bravo. Lol

 

[Neo_game]

The way is see it. There is nothing good from S version. If it does out sell the X it is not good if it some how also outsells the PS5 then Sony will try to get their gimped version as well to counter it ? There is also a possibility that there will be a mid gen upgrade in some 3-4yrs. Using high quality assets and RT will need compromise in resolution. So the fastest console the Pro version will run at 4K. X and PS5 will be some where in the middle with 1440P and S version will have to be downgraded to 720P. S series will not last long at all. In 3-4yrs it is going to get dated. If they release it later then it is probably even worse.

 

[Tulipanzo]

Lol I am not hounding you in any fashion. Do you think I have some sort of personal vendetta against you or something?

For the record, I wouldn't be shocked in the slightest if devs dont like Lockhart. Contrary to what you obviously think, I don't like the idea of Lockhart in any fashion. You seem to think that because I ask for proof of your claims that I am beating my chest in favor of Lockhart.

But I am not the one dropping into a thread claiming that Devs said this and or that without showing proof and I have not tried to insult your intelligence either like you have with me. Asking for proof does not make me somehow incapable of understanding what you are presenting. In fact, I would bet my understanding of the topic is far greater than yours. And I promise you I have talked to more devs personally than you ever will. ( if mods want to vet me go for it)

Edit: I am not going to turn this into a what Jason got wrong thread either. But there is plenty out there to show what hes gotten wrong just as much as hes gotten right. He is known for stating things in very vague ways about stuff he doesn't have the full story on and then tries to claim he never says certain things. Do we need to bring up how long he said a Diablo 2 Remaster was coming? And I have no beef with him. I even bought his book.

I'll say, asking for receipts, giving no proof of your connections, trying to discredit a reputable source on something he would very easily know, and ignoring the sources I gave you beside him, might come off as combative.
My OG post, I just claim complaints were reported, but apparently that was enough to sound the Jason alarm.

As to your edit, you once again give no receipts as to Jason credibility. Your best try is what reads like a joke tweet, unless you believe he also predicted Warcraft Pokemon GO...

 

[MasterCornholio]

Not really. Sony releasing a digital-only version of the same console? That's most likely because the base PS5 is very expensive - they're offering the same product targeted to the same demographic with a slight change to give themselves the ability to lower the price to undercut their competitor. Offering two versions of the exact same hardware at launch is something you do unless there's a reason for people to not buy one of them. I'm expecting the base PS5 is be very expensive - USD$599 or more. Sony are attempting to outpace PC hardware - that's going to cost them enormously.

Lockheart isn't targeting the same demographic as the Series X, which is the key difference in approaches here. The Series X is a 4k60 machine for the hardcore. Lockheart is a 1080p30 machine for the casual. What Microsoft are trying to do is lower the barrier of entry to front-load the generation - instead of waiting for the mid-gen "Slim" revision to get the cost down and target the casual market, and reap the explosion in sales that follows, they're targeting it now at the beginning. The Series X will likely be USD$499, and Lockheart will likely be USD$199, or lower if its digital only. At those prices, Lockheart will fly off the shelves.

So why would the PS5 be 100$ more expensive than the Series X?

 

[Tulipanzo]

Not really. Sony releasing a digital-only version of the same console? That's most likely because the base PS5 is very expensive - they're offering the same product targeted to the same demographic with a slight change to give themselves the ability to lower the price to undercut their competitor. Offering two versions of the exact same hardware at launch is something you do unless there's a reason for people to not buy one of them. I'm expecting the base PS5 is be very expensive - USD$599 or more. Sony are attempting to outpace PC hardware - that's going to cost them enormously.

Lockheart isn't targeting the same demographic as the Series X, which is the key difference in approaches here. The Series X is a 4k60 machine for the hardcore. Lockheart is a 1080p30 machine for the casual. What Microsoft are trying to do is lower the barrier of entry to front-load the generation - instead of waiting for the mid-gen "Slim" revision to get the cost down and target the casual market, and reap the explosion in sales that follows, they're targeting it now at the beginning. The Series X will likely be USD$499, and Lockheart will likely be USD$199, or lower if its digital only. At those prices, Lockheart will fly off the shelves.

So, Sony making a version that costs $20 less is because their box is very expensive.
But MS putting out a box with less RAM than X1X, worse CPU, much worse GPU AND no disc-drive means it's cheaper.

Sure...

 

[Magik85]

I dont know whats all te fuss about really.....Series S should easily be able play Series X games at 1080p.
Look at current gen :
PS4 -> PS4 Pro = over 2.3x power increase
One S -> One X = 4.3x power increase.
Series S -> Series X = 3x power increase.
Its about in the middle.
SeS as FHD version and SeX as 4k version will work just as good as its working now with current gen hardware.

 

[Tulipanzo]

I dont know whats all te fuss about really.....Series S should easily be able play Series X games at 1080p.
Look at current gen :
PS4 -> PS4 Pro = over 2.3x power increase
One S -> One X = 4.3x power increase.
Series S -> Series X = 3x power increase.
Its about in the middle.
SeS as FHD version and SeX as 4k version will work just as good as its working now with current gen hardware.

It's been mentioned, but certain tech will likely push next-gen below 4K (which is fine with reconstruction), but would push the Lockhart sub-1080p.

It would also require extensive optimization due to its far reduced RAM, and worse CPU, which means results could be very inconsistent (devs reportedly dislike it). That reduced RAM also means it can't play old-gen games at X1X levels.

 

[Deleted member 775630]

As a Software Developer myself, this amount of comments seems so odd.

Also I'm a bit hungover but isn't this code saying:

If consoleType is Dante, push the Anaconda profile into the object array... Why would you do this? Surely you're be wanting to push the Lockhart profile?

The code after the else if makes more sense:

If consoleType is Scorpio, push Scorpio into the Object array.

Aren't they merely grouping next-gen devices (anaconda, lockhart, and in the future xcloud) together, and then separately for current-gen devices? Where Dante is the group name for next-gen consoles? At least that's how I read it.

 

[loktaiextatus]

One X is a 4K console, and has 9 GB of usable ram for games. Lockhart outputting at quarter resolution could do with less than that, especially when Velocity Arch is helping conserve texture memory with sampler feedback and using high speed paged approach.

Machine with slightly lowered CPU clocks (similar to PS5 CPU clocks), 512GB SSD, 4+TF GPU, 10 GB RAM could be around $200-250 while still be able to give a great next gen experience at lower resolutions compared to XSX. And with DLSS 2.0 type upscaling, it could rival or even outperform PS5.

Remember:

I like watching things go from "10.3TF and its not even locked, no way it can compete with 12.15TF, Absolutely will see a huge difference"
to
"4TF will compete. and OUT PERFORM 10.3tf"

To me if its true it almost sounds like Microsoft is planning a game streaming service and wants to use that.... because while I can easily see the
low end 4tf console running games, because we can see that TODAY with the Ps4 pro, I also see it already being called outdated and people
pointing out Red Dead Redemption 2 again and again - because its not as crisp on the Pro.
And suddenly.,... crispness and image quality go RIGHT out with the bath water?

 

[Memorabilia]

I like watching things go from "10.3TF and its not even locked, no way it can compete with 12.15TF, Absolutely will see a huge difference"
to
"4TF will compete. and OUT PERFORM 10.3tf"

To me if its true it almost sounds like Microsoft is planning a game streaming service and wants to use that.... because while I can easily see the
low end 4tf console running games, because we can see that TODAY with the Ps4 pro, I also see it already being called outdated and people
pointing out Red Dead Redemption 2 again and again - because its not as crisp on the Pro.
And suddenly.,... crispness and image quality go RIGHT out with the bath water?

Is anyone actually saying 4tf will outperform 10tf? That's ridiculous if so. But seems to me this is an exaggerated argument.

 

[Balducci30]

Because people who aren't well off exist and giving them options is actually pretty smart and a good thing.
Even people who are Sony fanboys might be interested in one for the sake of exclusives which could potetinally get them hooked and get them to buy the big console later.
Even if they don't it's still money.

Spoken like a person who is well off.

 

[Balducci30]

Is anyone actually saying 4tf will outperform 10tf? That's ridiculous if so. But seems to me this is an exaggerated argument.

but what is the big deal with the 12 teraflops then anyway? We get games in 4K? Literally that’s it? That sounds... lame

 

[Nikana]

I'll say, asking for receipts, giving no proof of your connections, trying to discredit a reputable source on something he would very easily know, and ignoring the sources I gave you beside him, might come off as combative.
My OG post, I just claim complaints were reported, but apparently that was enough to sound the Jason alarm.

As to your edit, you once again give no receipts as to Jason credibility. Your best try is what reads like a joke tweet, unless you believe he also predicted Warcraft Pokemon GO...

My Jason post started out as a joke but you since then tripled down on it for whatever reason. I even said I bought a copy of the guys book. My point was he is not someone to die by the sword on. He is notorious for tweeting things then walking them back and saying "well this is what I actually meant." If you think every word out of his mouth has been factual I suggest doing some research on him.

Im not claiming anything so what do I need to prove? Have them vet me, I don't really care. I can easily prove I have talked to and have friends in this industry. I am not a person who has ever claimed to know anything and I am not going to. But if it will keep you from trying to act high and mighty and try to insult my intelligence then maybe its worth it to get you to chill the eff out.

And I am not ignoring anything. Again, its not my job to hunt down any post you make. If you want to claim these things then source them accordingly in every thread.

I misspoke about it being Diablo 2 remastered, which I believe he did say was coming as still hasn't, the incident I was referring to was Diablo 4.

Jason tired saying that Blizzard was going to announce Dibalo 4 at Blizzcon in 2018 but pulled it. To which Blizzard said “We generally don’t comment on rumors or speculation, but we can say that we didn’t pull any announcements from BlizzCon this year or have plans for other announcements,”

https://www.playstationlifestyle.net/2018/11/05/report-blizzard-diablo-4-blizzcon-2018/

 

[lastmessiah]

but what is the big deal with the 12 teraflops then anyway? We get games in 4K? Literally that’s it? That sounds... lame

High frame rates at high resolutions

 

[thicc_girls_are_teh_best]

We are talking about 8GB Ram in TOTAL because of that unified memory system.
So you would have a 4GB Graphics Card with 4 GB of RAM. I dont know about one lower bugdet gaming PC with 4 GB Ram. They start at 8GB and have a graphics card with 4-6 GB RAM.
8 GB Unified Memory dont seem fit for anything next gen to me.

On PC (generally speaking), any VRAM data for the GPU needs to first go into system RAM (the DRAM), then copied to the VRAM. So a 8 GB DRAM + 6 GB VRAM combo isn't necessarily 14 GB the way you'd think, as at any given time you could be looking at a few GB of the DRAM just holding GPU data to be copied to the GPU's VRAM.

There are a few new innovations to cut down on shadow copying on PC; namely things like AMD's SSG cards (those are for professional video editing and graphics modelling fields however), and nVidia's GPUDirectStorage, both of which have the GPU access data from storage directly to then place into their respective VRAM. By and large though it isn't widely used in the PC space yet, certainly not for games anyway.

I like watching things go from "10.3TF and its not even locked, no way it can compete with 12.15TF, Absolutely will see a huge difference"
to
"4TF will compete. and OUT PERFORM 10.3tf"

To me if its true it almost sounds like Microsoft is planning a game streaming service and wants to use that.... because while I can easily see the
low end 4tf console running games, because we can see that TODAY with the Ps4 pro, I also see it already being called outdated and people
pointing out Red Dead Redemption 2 again and again - because its not as crisp on the Pro.
And suddenly.,... crispness and image quality go RIGHT out with the bath water?

Hopefully no one's making that argument because realistically a 4 TF Lockhart is not going to outperform a 10.275 TF PS5 in any given area.

That said, they could be future-proofing it as a streaming-orientated device hence the 4 TF target. If it's already not going to have a disc drive, I don't see a need for it to have a large SSD either (256 GB or even 128 GB could be enough; it would be a streaming device after all), nor would it need that much RAM (half of XSX's or perhaps even less), smaller memory bandwidth, etc.

So you're still looking at a decent GPU and a CPU same as the XSX, mainly to help with streaming and providing enough oomph for 4K streaming if possible. The amount the BOM could be reduced in that aspect could easily get them to $199, so I've been conflicted a LONG time why native 1080p gaming would be a target for the device when in reality that could just increase the BOM and therefore the MSRP.

 

[01011001]

Is anyone actually saying 4tf will outperform 10tf? That's ridiculous if so. But seems to me this is an exaggerated argument.

it's out of context crap of course.

PC tests show that a 4.2TF RDNA GPU runs games faster at 1080p than a 10.2TF RDNA GPU runs the same game at 4K

anyone who actually thinks that a 4.2TF GPU literally outperforms an objectively more powerful version is an idiot.
just as much as the idiots trying to misconstrue the original data as people saying that it outperforms it

 

[loktaiextatus]

My guess, if I were to make a PC analogy:
Xbox Series X:
4K @ Very High Settings @ 60FPS

Xbox Series S
1440p @ High @ 30FPS |
1080p @ med @ 60fps

Xbox One X
1080p @ Med @ 30FPS

Xbox One S
900p @ low @ 30fps

We know generally speaking from PCs that a system is GPU bound. Even if the 6tf Xbox one X is not as nice of a GPU
per TF as the Xbox one S and lets say even with 4tf it easily equals the 6tf of the one X. - So lets just say they are equal.
you're insinuating with both at Medium settings the Series S will DOUBLE the performance of the One X from 30 to 60fps?

Otherwise I guess what you are saying makes sense from a scaling standpoint.

The issue as anyone will tell you is sometimes, the whole thing that consoles had over PC was not having to design a game
for multiple systems. You could do a TON and work miracles on hardware if you knew for a fact exactly what the software would run on.

Yes that can be done on multiple systems its just a lot of overhead. Im actually interested to see what happens myself. I dont think it will ruin the gen
but it could really be an interesting low cost machine for people who are more casual, kind of like the place the Wii shoveled itself into in 2006
and it flew off the shelves. It too was just about the same power as nintendo's previous console with some enhancements and extra functionality.
and essentially ran the same games (and was backwards compatible). Its almost the same idea.

 

[Uhtred]

On PC (generally speaking), any VRAM data for the GPU needs to first go into system RAM (the DRAM), then copied to the VRAM. So a 8 GB DRAM + 6 GB VRAM combo isn't necessarily 14 GB the way you'd think, as at any given time you could be looking at a few GB of the DRAM just holding GPU data to be copied to the GPU's VRAM.

There are a few new innovations to cut down on shadow copying on PC; namely things like AMD's SSG cards (those are for professional video editing and graphics modelling fields however), and nVidia's GPUDirectStorage, both of which have the GPU access data from storage directly to then place into their respective VRAM. By and large though it isn't widely used in the PC space yet, certainly not for games anyway.



Hopefully no one's making that argument because realistically a 4 TF Lockhart is not going to outperform a 10.275 TF PS5 in any given area.

That said, they could be future-proofing it as a streaming-orientated device hence the 4 TF target. If it's already not going to have a disc drive, I don't see a need for it to have a large SSD either (256 GB or even 128 GB could be enough; it would be a streaming device after all), nor would it need that much RAM (half of XSX's or perhaps even less), smaller memory bandwidth, etc.

So you're still looking at a decent GPU and a CPU same as the XSX, mainly to help with streaming and providing enough oomph for 4K streaming if possible. The amount the BOM could be reduced in that aspect could easily get them to $199, so I've been conflicted a LONG time why native 1080p gaming would be a target for the device when in reality that could just increase the BOM and therefore the MSRP.

Best Avatar on Neogaf!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Tulipanzo]

My Jason post started out as a joke but you since then tripled down on it for whatever reason. I even said I bought a copy of the guys book. My point was he is not someone to die by the sword on. He is notorious for tweeting things then walking them back and saying "well this is what I actually meant." If you think every word out of his mouth has been factual I suggest doing some research on him.

Im not claiming anything so what do I need to prove? Have them vet me, I don't really care. I can easily prove I have talked to and have friends in this industry. I am not a person who has ever claimed to know anything and I am not going to. But if it will keep you from trying to act high and mighty and try to insult my intelligence then maybe its worth it to get you to chill the eff out.

And I am not ignoring anything. Again, its not my job to hunt down any post you make. If you want to claim these things then source them accordingly in every thread.

I misspoke about it being Diablo 2 remastered, which I believe he did say was coming as still hasn't, the incident I was referring to was Diablo 4.

Jason tired saying that Blizzard was going to announce Dibalo 4 at Blizzcon in 2018 but pulled it. To which Blizzard said “We generally don’t comment on rumors or speculation, but we can say that we didn’t pull any announcements from BlizzCon this year or have plans for other announcements,”

https://www.playstationlifestyle.net/2018/11/05/report-blizzard-diablo-4-blizzcon-2018/

What you did was bring Jason up, and continuously post about him, despite me never mentioning him in my original post.

Your claims now are, for some reason:
1) You have industry sources, which is a matter for mods, and OT
2) Jason in untrustworthy

For 2, after misremembering a joke tweet, you then bring up Diablo 4 ( very OT).
That's really dumb.

Diablo 4 and his potential announcement were discussed here

The Past, Present, And Future Of Diablo

On November 2, 2018, Blizzard closed its annual BlizzCon keynote by announcing, to scattered applause, a Diablo game for phones. It was a baffling marketing decision that immediately set off controversy, as fans of Blizzard’s iconic action-role-playing game franchise loudly accused the company...

kotaku.com

While he may have been wrong about the date of reveal (something which Blizzard would very obviously not confirm), this report still shows he has plenty of sources in the development community, because Diablo 4 was real and announced the following year.
So he would, you know, have heard what they may think of Lockhart (which is actually on topic, for once).

Your dev sources may have told you that teasers and announcements may be moved, even fairly last minute.

Edit: maybe read the receipts next time

 

[loktaiextatus]

oh damn a lower powered console! imagine if PC had lower spec PC's and minimum spec requirements... that would hold back any potential high end gaming on PC.


also imagine is these consoles where basically pre packaged pc's

It does. When a game actually tries to push the cutting edge hardware it excludes whatever old hardware it must
and changes the min spec requirements. What you're describing is not having that option to cut off the lower spec
requirement machines. But I guess we can ignore that... Because some games on Steam will run on a Pentium 4 and a Geforce 460
that means it has something to do with games coming out this year? I know the gap isnt as big as that but dont start
acting like it isnt something the dev has to consider - Things like Total game-involved objects on screen or a scene thats
somehow integral to gameplay or plot that has to be worked around isnt out of the question.

 

[loktaiextatus]

Ah, yes. I remember the 32X, Jaguar, PS2 PSX, Net Yaroze, CD-i, 3DO, Virtual Boy, Vita, Pippin etc. being random things thrown at the wall by those trillion-dollar--...

...oh wait, none of those were trillion-dollar companies? Oh, what? SOME of them even engaged in monopolistic market practices themselves that were ruled such a way by the courts (Nintendo, for example)? Whoops....

Why are you bringing up the Net Yaroze? You could say Laseractive or something. The Yaroze was just a niche

Is anyone actually saying 4tf will outperform 10tf? That's ridiculous if so. But seems to me this is an exaggerated argument.

The guy I was replying to actually said that. I was replying directly to him.

He said the system could compete with or outperform the PS5.

 

[Nikana]

What you did was bring Jason up, and continuously post about him, despite me never mentioning him in my original post.

Your claims now are, for some reason:
1) You have industry sources, which is a matter for mods, and OT
2) Jason in untrustworthy

For 2, after misremembering a joke tweet, you then bring up Diablo 4 ( very OT).
That's really dumb.

Diablo 4 and his potential announcement were discussed here

The Past, Present, And Future Of Diablo

On November 2, 2018, Blizzard closed its annual BlizzCon keynote by announcing, to scattered applause, a Diablo game for phones. It was a baffling marketing decision that immediately set off controversy, as fans of Blizzard’s iconic action-role-playing game franchise loudly accused the company...

kotaku.com

While he may have been wrong about the date of reveal (something which Blizzard would very obviously not confirm), this report still shows he has plenty of sources in the development community, because Diablo 4 was real and announced the following year.
So he would, you know, have heard what they may think of Lockhart (which is actually on topic, for once).

Your dev sources may have told you that teasers and announcements may be moved, even fairly last minute.

Lol again my original post about Jason WAS A JOKE. A JOKE. AGAIN, A JOKE. But after you decided to freak out and say hes THE most trustworthy person on the subject of not only Lockhart, but the entire gaming industry was when I expressed my opinion.

You can think about him whatever you want. I do not take his word as gospel. And he is wrong at times. I have shown proof of that. If you want to move the goal posts on dates and junk fine. But his word of Diablo 4 was going to be announced was only not correct. Blizzard felt the need to come out and say...Yeah bro that never happened. Thus proving he was wrong.

I already said I misspoke about diablo 2 and meant diablo 4. I WAS WRONGGGGGGGGGG.

My point about talking about friends and people that I have met in the gaming industry was AFTER YOUR INSULTED MY INTELLIGENCE ON THE MATTER. Which I do not and did not appreciate. You can have a conversation without the need to insult me. And my point of bringing this up was because you decided to insult me and somehow claim that I couldn't comprehend any of this. TO which not only can I comprhend it, I have actual friends in this industry that can explain it to me. Thus making your stupid and petty insult not only dumb but have zero merit.

This conversation is now over.

 

[loktaiextatus]

Hopefully no one's making that argument because realistically a 4 TF Lockhart is not going to outperform a 10.275 TF PS5 in any given area.

The guy I was replying to said exactly that. That with DLSS the 4TF console will outperform the PS5. Citing nvidia specific upscale tech.

 

[pasterpl]

So, Sony making a version that costs $20 less is because their box is very expensive.
But MS putting out a box with less RAM than X1X, worse CPU, much worse GPU AND no disc-drive means it's cheaper.

Sure...

isnt it “confirmed” that cpu is the same between xs and XX and Better that xb1x? Ram speed also will be faster than this gen and same as on xx

what da You get from spreading this fud?

 

[Tulipanzo]

Lol again my original post about Jason WAS A JOKE. A JOKE. AGAIN, A JOKE. But after you decided to freak out and say hes THE most trustworthy person on the subject of not only Lockhart, but the entire gaming industry was when I expressed my opinion.

You can think about him whatever you want. I do not take his word as gospel. And he is wrong at times. I have shown proof of that. If you want to move the goal posts on dates and junk fine. But his word of Diablo 4 was going to be announced was only not correct. Blizzard felt the need to come out and say...Yeah bro that never happened. Thus proving he was wrong.

I already said I misspoke about diablo 2 and meant diablo 4. I WAS WRONGGGGGGGGGG.

My point about talking about friends and people that I have met in the gaming industry was AFTER YOUR INSULTED MY INTELLIGENCE ON THE MATTER. Which I do not and did not appreciate. You can have a conversation without the need to insult me. And my point of bringing this up was because you decided to insult me and somehow claim that I couldn't comprehend any of this. TO which not only can I comprhend it, I have actual friends in this industry that can explain it to me. Thus making your stupid and petty insult not only dumb but have zero merit.

This conversation is now over.

Clearly I'm the one freaking out over here, not the guy whose sum total criticism of Jason is he correctly reported on Diablo IV (but thought it'd be teased earlier!) and is now writing in all caps.

You've literally gotten more things wrong about Jason in replies to me than him about Diablo in any of his reporting.

 

[Tulipanzo]

isnt it “confirmed” that cpu is the same between xs and XX and Better that xb1x? Ram speed also will be faster than this gen and same as on xx

what da You get from spreading this fud?

CPU is same but underclocked (vs XSX). RAM is better indeed, but less than on X1X, meaning software will not naturally scale.
Though architectural improvements over Polaris bring it close, GPU is also weaker than on X1X, though it's more advanced.

I'd be more than happy to see actual info, would MS just reveal the thing already

 

[Nikana]

Clearly I'm the one freaking out over here, not the guy whose sum total criticism of Jason is he correctly reported on Diablo IV (but thought it'd be teased earlier!) and is now writing in all caps.

You've literally gotten more things wrong about Jason in replies to me than him about Diablo in any of his reporting.

 

[Tulipanzo]

By this stage, and with the consistent reports of developers disliking it, I'm really surprised MS hasn't revealed it yet.
Supposedly the reveal in June was delayed to August, but that still leaves July, and most of their line-up, not being shown running on Lockhart until a couple months from launch.

Beside the lackluster specs, it is this seeming lack of confidence that's most bizarre.

 

[pasterpl]

By this stage, and with the consistent reports of developers disliking it, I'm really surprised MS hasn't revealed it yet.
Supposedly the reveal in June was delayed to August, but that still leaves July, and most of their line-up, not being shown running on Lockhart until a couple months from launch.

Beside the lackluster specs, it is this seeming lack of confidence that's most bizarre.

what consistent reports are you referring to?

 

[splattered]

what consistent reports are you referring to?

Not telling you what to do but this person obviously has an agenda to just sit around on a sunday and vomit negativity in Xbox threads... why bother responding?