Xbox Series X Won't Be Competitive With NVIDIA's DLSS Unless There's a MIRACLE ~ Digital Foundry

xStoyax

xStoyax

Banned
Digital Foundry's latest video recapped the NVIDIA 30XX conference.

In regards to the $499 3070 Digital Foundry claims the card will offer Superior GPU Performance compared to the Xbox Series X and that is before you even factor in DLSS.

They say Microsoft is working on image upscaling tech similar to DLSS, but that Xbox Series X doesn't have dedicated hardware and it won't be competitive with what NVIDIA has short of a Miracle

They also point out that we don't know if Sony is working on similar tech yet.

Really disappointing if AMD doesn't have something that comes close to DLSS. I get that they're years behind, but it's such a huge leap that if this is true then it won't be long before we're getting another refresh.

Full Video


Excerpts



 
EricKillMongerz said:
Should also add PS5 to it too.
Click to expand...
FrSvjfQ.png
 
Not sure what they mean it doent have the hardware. It has machine learning hardware. How does df explain ms adding hdr to older games? Same hardware that processes the entire screen can be used for upscaling
 
Why only focus on the Series X when the exact same applies to the PS5?

Silly question I suppose.

That Red Dragon tweet is ridiculous too. They're making the mistake in assuming that people that buy consoles will just buy a PC if it gets all the console games. That's not true, never has been true, and never will be true. The GPU alone that you need for this costs almost as much as the Series X will.

How exactly does DLSS work with the machine learning? Does the machine learning just build like a "profile" and then the hardware uses that profile for the DLSS? Surely it's not running machine learning and applying the results in real time to every frame? If it's the former, what reason is there why MS couldn't run the machine learning on azure and then send the profiles to the game?
 
Last edited:
And Switch 2 will likely have Tensor cores and use DLSS 2.0 (or even the next gen of that). Scenes when a ~3 TF docked console delivers virtually the same visual output as the XSX and PS5.
 
MrFunSocks said:
Why only focus on the Series X when the exact same applies to the PS5?

Silly question I suppose.
Click to expand...
The obvious answer would be that since the Series X can't and is more powerful, the PS5 obviously won't either.

They just chose to compare it to the stronger next gen console.
 
Last edited:
Man reading can be tough. I am excited to see what amd and Sony is cooking up. Some amd upscaling and image sharpening helps get a better looking game with higher fps at a lower resolution already on current gen cards, I imagine they will have something for rdna2 wether the consoles use it I don't know but I do know that checkerboarding on PS4 pro was real nice so they will probably have something similar or better since the hardware is more capable.
 
Last edited:
Wonder what people will say if Intel by some miracle delivers on the idea of a true multi gpu with the potential of dwarfing even the 3090? (Regardless of dlss)

And why does this article say xbox and not ps5? I do think xbox may have something up thier sleeves dlss wise for series s......(and x too)
 
Last edited:
S
Bryank75 said:
XSX is trying to sell itself on graphical performance, that was the pitch.

These cards are more damaging to that IMO.
Click to expand...
Sony introduced dedicated hardware even in PS4 pro with the stencil buffer in relation to checkerboarding. While there are no guarantees, common sense would indicate that their focus on iq enhancement tech will continue and evolve with PS5.
 
Things will balance back out, but at the moment it's feeling a bit like Nvidia offered a product so compelling, they won the console wars as well. I see lots of switchers maybe happening.

It will be fascinating to see how this breaks down into multiplatform performance, especially as the generation goes on. I think it's important to remember that PS5, and one assumes, Series X, are capable of some mind-blowing gorgeousness themselves, though. Just... not as much.
 
I don't understand this . $499 for one video card , vs $499 for the whole Xbox Series X is not really a fair match up. And also , MS is very much happy if you want to game on PC or Console. They still get your money .
 
xiseerht said:
I don't understand this . $499 for one video card , vs $499 for the whole Xbox Series X is not really a fair match up. And also , MS is very much happy if you want to game on PC or Console. They still get your money .
Click to expand...
What if I game on Linux and pirate or pirate windows and pirate?
 
-Arcadia- said:
Things will balance back out, but at the moment it's feeling a bit like Nvidia offered a product so compelling, they won the console wars as well. I see lots of switchers maybe happening.

It will be fascinating to see how this breaks down into multiplatform performance, especially as the generation goes on. I think it's important to remember that PS5, and one assumes, Series X, are capable of some mind-blowing gorgeousness themselves, though. Just... not as much.
Click to expand...
Hopefully it scares the shit out of the bigwigs at PlayStation so the triple down on exclusives.
 
I watched the video, and DF thinks series x will have some ML, quite powerful but not as secret sauce as DLSS.

They also talked about ps5 lack of confirmation for ML upscaling. They give the impression ps5 hardware is the laggard but if you want sony games, then you gotta take its bad with its good. Feels like Sony will be in a Nintendo like position in terms of power v games 🤷‍♀️
 
longdi said:
I watched the video, and DF thinks series x will have some ML, quite powerful but not as secret sauce as DLSS.

They also talked about ps5 lack of confirmation for ML upscaling. They give the impression ps5 hardware is the laggard but if you want sony games, then you gotta take its bad with its good. Feels like Sony will be in a Nintendo like position in terms of power v games 🤷‍♀️
Click to expand...
The predictable outcome is that the best looking games will still be on PS5. Just like the last 2 gens.

People that judge quality via a checklist of deployed hardware effects Vs the application of effects will of course deny this despite what their own eyes are telling them.
 
I don't think Digital Foundry has done the study on ML enough to know this or not. MS has done a lot of work on ML so we should at least wait to see how it comes out.
 
VFXVeteran said:
Yes, the Tensor Cores are definitely a breakthrough. I think it caught AMD off guard. Especially with the consoles.
Click to expand...
They better be giving the console makers discounts now... that is embarrassing to be so outclassed.
Doesn't matter if you have exclusives but if you have no USP, then it's game over.
 
xiseerht said:
I don't understand this . $499 for one video card , vs $499 for the whole Xbox Series X is not really a fair match up. And also , MS is very much happy if you want to game on PC or Console. They still get your money .
Click to expand...
Except PC plays online for free without that annoying monthly fee. Sure, PC is a bit more expensive but you are getting more performance. Honestly, MS is making it harder to choose the Series X over a PC upgrade.
 
Shmunter said:
The predictable outcome is that the best looking games will still be on PS5. Just like the last 2 gens.

People that judge quality via a checklist of deployed hardware effects Vs the application of effects will of course deny this despite what their own eyes are telling them.
Click to expand...
Best looking doesn't mean anything..but it does help.
 
onQ123 said:
I don't think Digital Foundry has done the study on ML enough to know this or not. MS has done a lot of work on ML so we should at least wait to see how it comes out.
Click to expand...
Microsoft's all over machine learning, they offer it to everyone on azure. It just depends if they can leverage that for something like dlss.


reinking said:
Except PC plays online for free without that annoying monthly fee. Sure, PC is a bit more expensive but you are getting more performance. Honestly, MS is making it harder to choose the Series X over a PC upgrade.
Click to expand...
You say that like it's a bad thing. They don't care about converting pc gamers to console, they want pc gamers buying their games on pc. Console gamers aren't switching to pc en masse.
 
Last edited:
Bryank75 said:
I mean that is almost exactly what VFXVeteran VFXVeteran said..... TLOU1.

I added in BB for something nice if they are being nice and I'm being optimistic there.

However I fully expect Sony to think twice about everything after this Nvidia presentation.
Click to expand...
I expect the to ramp up PC gaming. Why wouldn't they? Not day and date, but I could easily see them coming 6-12 months. They got a taste of that Steam money with HZD.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Digital Foundry: Wuchang: Fallen Feathers - Digital Foundry Review - PS5/PS5 Pro/Xbox Series X|S
2
95
2K
Pedro Motta replied
Digital Foundry: Nintendo Switch 2 DLSS Image Quality Analysis: "Tiny" DLSS/Full-Fat DLSS Confirmed
46
73
kevboard replied
Digital Foundry: Helldivers 2 Xbox Series X|S - DF Review - PS5 Comparisons, Performance And More
22
1K
SpokkX replied
Digital Foundry: Black Myth: Wukong Xbox Series X|S - DF Review - A Bizarre Port vs PlayStation 5
2 3
131
2K
Darsxx82 replied
Digital Foundry: Mafia: The Old Country - DF Review - PS5/PS5 Pro/Xbox Series X|S
42
2K
Salz01 replied
Top Bottom