Covid 19 Thread: [no bitching about masks of Fauci edition]

ManaByte said:
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I fear that this country is too divided to unite on anything anymore, even something as simple as getting a vaccine to save our lives and the economy. Divided we will fall. I'm fucking glad we nuked the politics page now. I won't ever engage in any political back and forth anymore, nor will I watch grifters of either side.

This perfectly sums up what is happening to this country and it makes me sad.

 
Halo is Dead said:
I fear that this country is too divided to unite on anything anymore, even something as simple as getting a vaccine to save our lives and the economy. Divided we will fall. I'm fucking glad we nuked the politics page now. I won't ever engage in any political back and forth anymore, nor will I watch grifters of either side.

This perfectly sums up what is happening to this country and it makes me sad.

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Yeah I think people start to see things as a zero sum game. Like people refusing to acknowledge China's faults in the outbreak because it might give Trump ammunition or Trump throwing a tantrum over infrastructure stuff he himself tried and failed to pass because it might give Biden political points.
 
As expected the US Pediatrics idea of making children age 2 wear masks was massacred by the French paediatrics community:

www.lci.fr

Porter le masque dès l'âge de 2 ans ? "Absolument loufoque" selon des pédiatres français | TF1 INFO

ÉCLAIRAGE - Aux États-Unis, les Centres de lutte et de prévention des maladies plaident désormais pour le port du masque dès l'âge de 2 ans dans des lieux publics fermés, dont les écoles. Une recommandation jugée "absolument loufoque" par la communauté médicale pédiatrique en France. - Porter le...
www.lci.fr www.lci.fr



Oh No What GIF by Identity
 
If this whole covid thing has taught us anything, it's really shown us the people who you don't want to be around if shit really went down.
 
ManaByte said:
u0id9Ae.jpg
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Whole family is fully vaccinated , I got the vaccine pass. So far it's been quite nice with everywhere having less people than usual :)

I think if the pass sanitaire will not work France we go straight to obligatory vaccination in the Fall.
 
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Cyberpunkd said:
Whole family is fully vaccinated , I got the vaccine pass. So far it's been quite nice with everywhere having less people than usual :)

I think if the pass sanitaire will not work France we go straight to obligatory vaccination in the Fall.
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You should be fine. I think we're at the stage where sensible countries are going to start getting up to 70% fully vaccinated before long, which should hopefully mark the point where we can live long term with the virus, and the pandemic status comes to an end. I don't think we'll need obligatory vaccinations, if voluntary rates get that high. I'm pretty sure the UK will get to 80% without much trouble eventually, and I'd be very surprised to see cases and serious illness at anything like high enough levels to require any restrictions again. It's going to be countries with higher anti-vax problems, or with vaccine procurement issues that will be still suffering.
 
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FunkMiller said:
You should be fine. I think we're at the stage where sensible countries are going to start getting up to 70% fully vaccinated before long, which should hopefully mark the point where we can live long term with the virus, and the pandemic status comes to an end. I don't think we'll need obligatory vaccinations, if voluntary rates get that high. I'm pretty sure the UK will get to 80% without much trouble eventually, and I'd be very surprised to see cases and serious illness at anything like high enough levels to require any restrictions again. It's going to be countries with higher anti-vax problems, or with vaccine procurement issues that will be still suffering.
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True, you are most likely right. We should be getting to 70% soon. I'm waiting for the decisions for Guadeloupe, Antilles and Martinique - situation over there is so bad (contamination rate 1800 per 100 000) we might see obligatory vaccination there.
 
What's happening in Canada is that many provinces tell people to learn to live with Covid, a few ended all restrictions. Quebec, cases are increasing, vaccine passport and new measures! And Ontario we have no clue what the strategy is. A big mess in all.
 
FunkMiller said:
You should be fine. I think we're at the stage where sensible countries are going to start getting up to 70% fully vaccinated before long, which should hopefully mark the point where we can live long term with the virus, and the pandemic status comes to an end. I don't think we'll need obligatory vaccinations, if voluntary rates get that high. I'm pretty sure the UK will get to 80% without much trouble eventually, and I'd be very surprised to see cases and serious illness at anything like high enough levels to require any restrictions again. It's going to be countries with higher anti-vax problems, or with vaccine procurement issues that will be still suffering.
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I thought France was one of the countries with the highest rate of distrust for vaccines, hopefully won't come to forced inoculations.
 
p_xavier said:
What's happening in Canada is that many provinces tell people to learn to live with Covid, a few ended all restrictions. Quebec, cases are increasing, vaccine passport and new measures! And Ontario we have no clue what the strategy is. A big mess in all.
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Hospitals in BC are starting to cancel elective due to diverting resources like nursing.

Health said in a statement. "Some elective surgeries have been rescheduled to manage capacity at the hospital. Affected patients are being notified directly to reschedule their procedure."
"The majority of people in hospital with COVID-19 are young adults who are not fully immunized."

This is where the vaccinated locals start to get really pissed off. Not at the restrictions, at the carelessness that requires them. It's always some fucking yahoos that rules have to be made for.
BC CMOH doesn't favour restrictions and especially against lockdowns, but will recommend the government use them in a targeted way and it's worked when followed. When advice isn't followed by people, things go bad. Give people enough rope to prove if the health crisis is possible to manage at certain levels or not. Now there's a calculus measuring suffering for managers. How bad are these young adults, are these electives chronic pain and people that don't deserve to suffer, should scales changed. To put people in that position to make those decisions and by extension all the taxpayers and electorate. Besides that and the strain on health there's the economy, jobs, education...these with normal stresses for people to deal with at pace requires much centering and routine. Be kind, be calm, be safe.

About the strongest advocacy the regular resident finds acceptable in BC


Not that all those will be addressed, some is regional(ie, low tax base) it's tight buckshot advocacy across a number of on the ground issues but gets the point across.
 
Can I ask this question. Is it not fair to say that vaccination of the entire world's population is not going to work?

Is it even possible to vaccinate our world's population before new variants emerge?

How long would it take to vaccinate the entire world?

What is the end goal here? Heard immunity?

When is it safe to say, no more lock downs and now you can live as you were pre covid?

Surely the smart people predicted that not everyone would get vaccinated. Due to health reasons, access, availability, choice or stubbornness or misinformation. So does that mean you begin force vaccinating people?

Would it have made sense to possible tackle this with a 2 prong approach? I raise this as are outpatient treatments not on the table for discussion?

I have so many questions to this approach. What are people's thoughts?
 
KiNeMz said:
Can I ask this question. Is it not fair to say that vaccination of the entire world's population is not going to work?

Is it even possible to vaccinate our world's population before new variants emerge?

How long would it take to vaccinate the entire world?

What is the end goal here? Heard immunity?

When is it safe to say, no more lock downs and now you can live as you were pre covid?

Surely the smart people predicted that not everyone would get vaccinated. Due to health reasons, access, availability, choice or stubbornness or misinformation. So does that mean you begin force vaccinating people?

Would it have made sense to possible tackle this with a 2 prong approach? I raise this as are outpatient treatments not on the table for discussion?

I have so many questions to this approach. What are people's thoughts?
Click to expand...
Not something that can be easily answered, hard to predict the tail risk of a communicable disease that has found reservoir in wild animals and keeps mutating in unpredictable ways.
 
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KiNeMz said:
Can I ask this question. Is it not fair to say that vaccination of the entire world's population is not going to work?

Is it even possible to vaccinate our world's population before new variants emerge?

How long would it take to vaccinate the entire world?

What is the end goal here? Heard immunity?

When is it safe to say, no more lock downs and now you can live as you were pre covid?

Surely the smart people predicted that not everyone would get vaccinated. Due to health reasons, access, availability, choice or stubbornness or misinformation. So does that mean you begin force vaccinating people?

Would it have made sense to possible tackle this with a 2 prong approach? I raise this as are outpatient treatments not on the table for discussion?

I have so many questions to this approach. What are people's thoughts?
Click to expand...

The end goal is for the populace to understand we truly live in a clown world. In almost 2 years of very strange events, no other was stranger than WHO bizarrely changing the definition of herd immunity. With Iceland showcasing how delta really doesn't care for WHO shenanigans and with Andrew Pollard coming forward with an harsh truth:

www.theguardian.com

Delta variant renders herd immunity from Covid ‘mythical’

Head of Oxford Vaccine Group rules out overall immunity, but also questions need for booster jabs
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

I think it's time to accept reality. We will have to move on, protect the elderly and vaccinate as many people as we can. Unvaccinated are not a bigger risk to others than vaccinated (rendering covid passes as useless). Even if they were, it's not logistically feasible to vaccinate everyone at the same time, mutations will always occur and there's very little we can do besides protecting against the severity of the disease and move on. Something we should have done many months ago.
 
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thefool said:
I think it's time to accept reality. We will have to move on, protect the elderly and vaccinate as many people as we can. Unvaccinated are not a bigger risk to others than vaccinated (rendering covid passes as useless). Even if they were, it's not logistically feasible to vaccinate everyone at the same time, mutations will always occur and there's very little we can do besides protecting against the severity of the disease and move on. Something we should have done many months ago.
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Covid passes are very good to make sure the unvaccinated do not get infected too quickly and overwhelm hospitals. Lots of people have been waiting for treatment which keeps being delayed as some dumb fuck who wanted to wait a little longer to get vaccinated now needs to be on a ventilator for 3 weeks.
 
Cyberpunkd said:
Wrong, real life data disagrees with you. Right now in France more than 8 out of 10 people admitted to ICU are unvaccinated. Coincidence?
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To shed virus to others.

MisterFalcon said:
Covid passes are very good to make sure the unvaccinated do not get infected too quickly and overwhelm hospitals. Lots of people have been waiting for treatment which keeps being delayed as some dumb fuck who wanted to wait a little longer to get vaccinated now needs to be on a ventilator for 3 weeks.
Click to expand...

Flatten the curve was a funny narrative like 16 months ago.
 
Cyberpunkd said:
Wrong, real life data disagrees with you. Right now in France more than 8 out of 10 people admitted to ICU are unvaccinated. Coincidence?
Click to expand...
I think you misread what he's saying. He's not saying the unvaccinated are not at higher risk themselves. He's saying they're not at higher to others. Whether you agree with that is an open question.

What really bothers me are articles like this:

www.cnn.com

From increased hospitalizations to long Covid, children can get hit hard by Covid-19. Here’s why doctors say kids should be protected | CNN

Covid-19 hospitalizations among children are rising. Doctors say keeping kids Covid-free is critical to ensure in-person learning, prevent long-term complications and help stave off more aggressive variants for everyone.
www.cnn.com www.cnn.com
The number of Covid-19 deaths among children is more than twice the number of pediatric flu deaths reported by the CDC between 2019-2020.
Click to expand...

That is just such a completely misleading way of framing that comparison. It's meant solely to scare parents about to send their kids to school.

Let's refer to the CDC themselves:

2019-20 Season’s Pediatric Flu Deaths Tie High Mark Set During 2017-18 Season | CDC

Everything you need to know about the flu illness, including symptoms, treatment and prevention.
www.cdc.gov www.cdc.gov
While any death in a child from a vaccine preventable illness is a tragedy, the number of pediatric flu deaths reported to CDC each season is likely an undercount. For example, even though the reported number of deaths during the 2017-2018 flu season was 188, CDC estimates the actual number was closer to 600. It is likely the actual number of children who died from flu during the 2019-2020 season is higher as well.
Click to expand...
 
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Ellery said:
What exactly do you think they are trying to do with that vaccine? With they I mean all gonverments of this world (weird how they all can agree that the virus is real and vaccines help with keeping people alive).
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I think it's genetic engineering with the nanotechnologies involved as they are. And if that's too far out then just look at Elon Musk talking about implanting computerchips into people's brains sometime next year. They're very fond of crossing people over with computers. Of cutting people off from their natural self and natural blueprint.

It's all about control in the end. They are just seeing how far they can take it and the answer seems to be pretty damn far with the crazy rules that are now in place and that some people seem to be okay with.

Make people WANT this vaccine by manipulation. Take it so you can have your freedom back! Take it so you don't die! Take it so nobody else dies! Take it because we say so! Take it because you'll get free stuff in return.

And whoever dies or whatsoever side effects it may have, make them believe it's better than the virus. Skew the numbers in favor of whatever you want to achieve and then silence all other voices and opinions and warning.

It's a sad state of things but people make their own choices. Just be sure to make a choice that is completely yours and not manipulated or influenced. You can't just blindly trust anything or anyone. No matter how well they dress it up. They've got ages of experience with psychological manipulation and control of the masses. We just sleepin'

The top is united that's why they all agree. Underneath that is the theater and underneath that is us underground, hearing the music and believing the guy who comes down to tell us what's really going on above. But he's been bought and is feeding us whatever they tell him.
 
L0la H4vana said:
I think it's genetic engineering with the nanotechnologies involved as they are. And if that's too far out then just look at Elon Musk talking about implanting computerchips into people's brains sometime next year. They're very fond of crossing people over with computers. Of cutting people off from their natural self and natural blueprint.

It's all about control in the end. They are just seeing how far they can take it and the answer seems to be pretty damn far with the crazy rules that are now in place and that some people seem to be okay with.

Make people WANT this vaccine by manipulation. Take it so you can have your freedom back! Take it so you don't die! Take it so nobody else dies! Take it because we say so! Take it because you'll get free stuff in return.

And whoever dies or whatsoever side effects it may have, make them believe it's better than the virus. Skew the numbers in favor of whatever you want to achieve and then silence all other voices and opinions and warning.

It's a sad state of things but people make their own choices. Just be sure to make a choice that is completely yours and not manipulated or influenced. You can't just blindly trust anything or anyone. No matter how well they dress it up. They've got ages of experience with psychological manipulation and control of the masses. We just sleepin'

The top is united that's why they all agree. Underneath that is the theater and underneath that is us underground, hearing the music and believing the guy who comes down to tell us what's really going on above. But he's been bought and is feeding us whatever they tell him.
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Get off Facebook before it's too late.
 
L0la H4vana said:
I think it's genetic engineering with the nanotechnologies involved as they are. And if that's too far out then just look at Elon Musk talking about implanting computerchips into people's brains sometime next year. They're very fond of crossing people over with computers. Of cutting people off from their natural self and natural blueprint.

It's all about control in the end. They are just seeing how far they can take it and the answer seems to be pretty damn far with the crazy rules that are now in place and that some people seem to be okay with.

Make people WANT this vaccine by manipulation. Take it so you can have your freedom back! Take it so you don't die! Take it so nobody else dies! Take it because we say so! Take it because you'll get free stuff in return.

And whoever dies or whatsoever side effects it may have, make them believe it's better than the virus. Skew the numbers in favor of whatever you want to achieve and then silence all other voices and opinions and warning.

It's a sad state of things but people make their own choices. Just be sure to make a choice that is completely yours and not manipulated or influenced. You can't just blindly trust anything or anyone. No matter how well they dress it up. They've got ages of experience with psychological manipulation and control of the masses. We just sleepin'

The top is united that's why they all agree. Underneath that is the theater and underneath that is us underground, hearing the music and believing the guy who comes down to tell us what's really going on above. But he's been bought and is feeding us whatever they tell him.
Click to expand...

fuck off
 
KiNeMz said:
Can I ask this question. Is it not fair to say that vaccination of the entire world's population is not going to work?

Is it even possible to vaccinate our world's population before new variants emerge?
Click to expand...
If we actually vaxed everyone? At worst it would reduce the death toll by like 99% and sharply reduce hospitalizations.

Variants thus far have only managed to get more successful at causing mild to moderate covid in vaccinated patients, the protection against severe covid remains.

But it also reduces spread, reduces the rate at which variants appear, and if we had a decent pipeline for update boosters that would be even moreso.
 
SF Kosmo said:
If we actually vaxed everyone? At worst it would reduce the death toll by like 99% and sharply reduce hospitalizations.

Variants thus far have only managed to get more successful at causing mild to moderate covid in vaccinated patients, the protection against severe covid remains.

But it also reduces spread, reduces the rate at which variants appear, and if we had a decent pipeline for update boosters that would be even moreso.
Click to expand...
Is viral load factor?
 
Rentahamster said:
Some of our own states would have a travel advisory if they were a foreign country. It's embarrassing.
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I get to participate in a medical tele-conference for a multi-state healthcare company every day this week. Let me just say that reading the zoom chat from nurses in Florida has been deeply, deeply, deeply embarrassing. Like, shocking - to a level I didn't expect.
 
L0la H4vana said:
I think it's genetic engineering with the nanotechnologies involved as they are. And if that's too far out then just look at Elon Musk talking about implanting computerchips into people's brains sometime next year. They're very fond of crossing people over with computers. Of cutting people off from their natural self and natural blueprint.

It's all about control in the end. They are just seeing how far they can take it and the answer seems to be pretty damn far with the crazy rules that are now in place and that some people seem to be okay with.

Make people WANT this vaccine by manipulation. Take it so you can have your freedom back! Take it so you don't die! Take it so nobody else dies! Take it because we say so! Take it because you'll get free stuff in return.

And whoever dies or whatsoever side effects it may have, make them believe it's better than the virus. Skew the numbers in favor of whatever you want to achieve and then silence all other voices and opinions and warning.

It's a sad state of things but people make their own choices. Just be sure to make a choice that is completely yours and not manipulated or influenced. You can't just blindly trust anything or anyone. No matter how well they dress it up. They've got ages of experience with psychological manipulation and control of the masses. We just sleepin'

The top is united that's why they all agree. Underneath that is the theater and underneath that is us underground, hearing the music and believing the guy who comes down to tell us what's really going on above. But he's been bought and is feeding us whatever they tell him.
Click to expand...

Are you getting paid to spread this harmful and completely idiotic bullshit?
 
L0la H4vana said:
I think it's genetic engineering with the nanotechnologies involved as they are. And if that's too far out then just look at Elon Musk talking about implanting computerchips into people's brains sometime next year. They're very fond of crossing people over with computers. Of cutting people off from their natural self and natural blueprint.

It's all about control in the end. They are just seeing how far they can take it and the answer seems to be pretty damn far with the crazy rules that are now in place and that some people seem to be okay with.

Make people WANT this vaccine by manipulation. Take it so you can have your freedom back! Take it so you don't die! Take it so nobody else dies! Take it because we say so! Take it because you'll get free stuff in return.

And whoever dies or whatsoever side effects it may have, make them believe it's better than the virus. Skew the numbers in favor of whatever you want to achieve and then silence all other voices and opinions and warning.

It's a sad state of things but people make their own choices. Just be sure to make a choice that is completely yours and not manipulated or influenced. You can't just blindly trust anything or anyone. No matter how well they dress it up. They've got ages of experience with psychological manipulation and control of the masses. We just sleepin'

The top is united that's why they all agree. Underneath that is the theater and underneath that is us underground, hearing the music and believing the guy who comes down to tell us what's really going on above. But he's been bought and is feeding us whatever they tell him.
Click to expand...
Exhibit A. This is the biggest reason why China is on track to outperform democratic countries.

A democracy requires an informed public to function. When 30% of your population wants to drive backwards in MarioKart, the end result is not going to be 1st place.
 
L0la H4vana said:
I think it's genetic engineering with the nanotechnologies involved as they are. And if that's too far out then just look at Elon Musk talking about implanting computerchips into people's brains sometime next year. They're very fond of crossing people over with computers. Of cutting people off from their natural self and natural blueprint.

It's all about control in the end. They are just seeing how far they can take it and the answer seems to be pretty damn far with the crazy rules that are now in place and that some people seem to be okay with.

Make people WANT this vaccine by manipulation. Take it so you can have your freedom back! Take it so you don't die! Take it so nobody else dies! Take it because we say so! Take it because you'll get free stuff in return.

And whoever dies or whatsoever side effects it may have, make them believe it's better than the virus. Skew the numbers in favor of whatever you want to achieve and then silence all other voices and opinions and warning.

It's a sad state of things but people make their own choices. Just be sure to make a choice that is completely yours and not manipulated or influenced. You can't just blindly trust anything or anyone. No matter how well they dress it up. They've got ages of experience with psychological manipulation and control of the masses. We just sleepin'

The top is united that's why they all agree. Underneath that is the theater and underneath that is us underground, hearing the music and believing the guy who comes down to tell us what's really going on above. But he's been bought and is feeding us whatever they tell him.
Click to expand...
we are adults here bro. probably take your little kid theories somewhere else
 
L0la H4vana said:
I think it's genetic engineering with the nanotechnologies involved as they are. And if that's too far out then just look at Elon Musk talking about implanting computerchips into people's brains sometime next year. They're very fond of crossing people over with computers. Of cutting people off from their natural self and natural blueprint.

It's all about control in the end. They are just seeing how far they can take it and the answer seems to be pretty damn far with the crazy rules that are now in place and that some people seem to be okay with.

Make people WANT this vaccine by manipulation. Take it so you can have your freedom back! Take it so you don't die! Take it so nobody else dies! Take it because we say so! Take it because you'll get free stuff in return.

And whoever dies or whatsoever side effects it may have, make them believe it's better than the virus. Skew the numbers in favor of whatever you want to achieve and then silence all other voices and opinions and warning.

It's a sad state of things but people make their own choices. Just be sure to make a choice that is completely yours and not manipulated or influenced. You can't just blindly trust anything or anyone. No matter how well they dress it up. They've got ages of experience with psychological manipulation and control of the masses. We just sleepin'

The top is united that's why they all agree. Underneath that is the theater and underneath that is us underground, hearing the music and believing the guy who comes down to tell us what's really going on above. But he's been bought and is feeding us whatever they tell him.
Click to expand...

Some scary stuff right here. I hope this person can get some help at some point. This kind of paranoid and delusional mindset can't be healthy for them, or anyone around them. To think that there's any psychological manipulation or covert control methods going on with the Covid vaccine speaks to a view of the world that is hopelessly devoid of logic or reason.
 
Chankoras said:
I thought France was one of the countries with the highest rate of distrust for vaccines, hopefully won't come to forced inoculations.
Click to expand...
A newborn is required 11 obligatory vaccines. You can skim by not putting the child in childcare but school starting age 3 is obligatory and since you need vaccines in school…

As of today 65.1% of population above 12 are completely vaccinated which is 11 percentage points higher than Germany. France gets a lot of shit but when we put our mind to something we do it.
 
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KiNeMz said:
I don't think that's what he saying. I think vaccinated can still carry so can still transmit. So that's the risk.
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someone in the thread a couple of pages back quoted why the vaccine affects the transmission rates, take the time and look for it if you care.
 
Bernd Lauert said:
They're the best at what they're doing, yes. But they're also extremely corrupt and thus not trustworthy.
Click to expand...

How are they corrupt? Colleges and Universities in the states (and here in the U.K. for that matter) are suffering from over politicisation, but corrupt? Where's the evidence of that? I've worked in the past for universities, and some of the lecturers make my fucking teeth itch, but corruption is not something I'd associate with them.
 
FunkMiller said:
How are they corrupt? Colleges and Universities in the states (and here in the U.K. for that matter) are suffering from over politicisation, but corrupt? Where's the evidence of that? I've worked in the past for universities, and some of the lecturers make my fucking teeth itch, but corruption is not something I'd associate with them.
Click to expand...
Whenever you have rigid hierarchies and literally everything depends on money, you have corruption. It's the reason why politics are bad too.
 
Bernd Lauert said:
They're the best at what they're doing, yes. But they're also extremely corrupt and thus not trustworthy.
Click to expand...
The trouble is that it's always going to require more and more nuance from people. If you throw out the entire institution because you don't trust anything, then you end up at lizardpeople running congress.

People are going to have to put more time into getting info and opinions from multiple places and put more effort into being informed. Example, if you got burned in the past by a fake news story - it doesn't mean it's smart to think everything on the news is fake. It doesn't mean that the youtuber that agrees with people on a few major points is vetting everything much better than traditional institutions. This nuance is going to be more and more difficult as disinformation increases, and larger parts of the population wont be able to rise to the challenge.

We're basically bound to these institutions to know most important things. So no one who wishes to really be informed can completely divorce themselves from major institutions. The best they can do is review them and stay informed, and compare with other sources and other governments and multiple media sources. There's never going to be a simple answer.
 
Bernd Lauert said:
Whenever you have rigid hierarchies and literally everything depends on money, you have corruption. It's the reason why politics are bad too.
Click to expand...

See, that's not good enough. You can't just make a claim like that, without having evidence to back it up. Are you in the educational field? Can you point to examples of the things you're intimating?

This thread could do with a lot less of these empty assertions.
 
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Punished Miku said:
The trouble is that it's always going to require more and more nuance from people. If you throw out the entire institution because you don't trust anything, then you end up at lizardpeople running congress.

People are going to have to put more time into getting info and opinions from multiple places and put more effort into being informed. Example, if you got burned in the past by a fake news story - it doesn't mean it's smart to think everything on the news is fake. It doesn't mean that the youtuber that agrees with people on a few major points is vetting everything much better than traditional institutions. This nuance is going to be more and more difficult as disinformation increases, and larger parts of the population wont be able to rise to the challenge.

We're basically bound to these institutions to know most important things. So no one who wishes to really be informed can completely divorce themselves from major institutions. The best they can do is review them and stay informed, and compare with other sources and other governments and multiple media sources. There's never going to be a simple answer.
Click to expand...
You're right, and the bolded is exactly what I'm doing. I'm gonna wait for more long-term information to come out before taking the xeen. Until then, I'm going to stick with my current heuristic (young, healthy? don't take it. old, fat, any lung and/or heart conditions? take it).
 
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