Microsoft / Activision Deal Approval Watch |OT| (MS/ABK close)
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Menzies
Banned
Fascinating isn't it. And aren't they supposed to be breaking up monopolies, not 'accidentally' discovering them and then nonchalantly dismissing them?
I guess we can then just expect absolutely nothing to pan out from this 'Nintendo monopoly' discovery. Meanwhile, in the market where Microsoft is severely challenged with competition, there's a theoretical monopoly concern that the world is standing still on.
Topher
Identifies as young
feynoob
Banned
Ass of Can Whooping
is going to have a hard time with his conquest.Good luck to him, he is going to need Jesus for that.
DarkMage619
$MSFT
We can agree to disagree. Game pass as a motivation to purchase the XSS doesn't make it any less a casual lower performance focused console. It's price point and marketing target it squarely at the same audience as the Switch. There is focus on kid and family friendly titles similar to the Switch as well. The media type and portability are just features. The game library and pricing are far more important when a consumer is making a purchase. I also never use my Switch portably and I think lots of others prefer docked mode too.
The best feature of the FTC is that they don't approve acquisitions in the first place. If this magical hypothetical of MS being a video-game monopoly were to actually happen, the FTC can sue and move to break up the combined entity. They alway reserve that right. They do have to prove the law was broken but they have the power of the federal government to support them make the case. I do hope they move to break up the current Nintendo monopoly though. The consumer is being injured.
How can nobody buy anything on the Wii U? It would still have top sellers regardless of install base size.You said top selling game.
Here is its top sellers.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_Wii_U_video_games
If you think install base size matters look for CoD on the Wii top sellers. CoD released there too. Wasn't a top seller.
feynoob
Banned
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Targeting the same audience not the same console. I thought that was obvious.XSS is not the same thing as switch.
If you honestly believe that, then you seriously need to go see a doctor.
Menzies
Banned
Think we could use less of the personal attacks.XSS is not the same thing as switch.
If you honestly believe that, then you seriously need to go see a doctor.
What's the correct classification for it?
Is it "high performance"? Is it a budget option competing at the same price point of the switch? Is it often marketed with casual and family friendly titles?
Enjoy litigating this mess FTC.
feynoob
Banned
Nope. Xss is targeting people who can't afford expensive consoles, or can't spend a lot of money on video games. It's why it's great deal with gamepass.
Switch is aimed at people who like hand held devices like mobile. It's why it's hybrid of console and handheld. Its not targeting the same people as xss.
Look at switch's games prices. That is not for poor people.
High performance isnt the correct analogy. I don't know why FTC went with that route, as XSS isn't high performance device.
But nevertheless, switch isn't in the same level as Xbox or PS.
The library between them is like day and night.
While some 3rd party exist on switch, it doesn't have the full list of 3rd party games.
This article demonstrates why that is the case.
https://www.vgchartz.com/article/449937/the-switchs-growing-third-party-problem/
The system isn't that profitable for them.
ZehDon
Member
geary
Member
Oh yes… Can wait to play the family friendly Bayoneta 3 game with my little brother…
DarkMage619
$MSFT
Be careful the Switch isn't for serious gaming. The system might not hold up since it's low performance. The FTC is the authority on this.
phil_t98
#SonyToo
Darkmage always goes on about how "it's a high performance next gen console just at a lower res which doesn't hold anything back" in all other threads then turns around and calls it the same as the Switch here. That should tell you everything about what he's always trying to do.
SoloKingRobert
Banned
You can use your phone data as a WiFi.
Nintendo always make attempts to attract an audience/demographic, it's the prudent thing to do. That's why they sign exclusivity deals too in case PunishedMiku was genuinely wondering. Zombie U is an example of this.
Doesn't mean they're successful with it or that the current audience receives it that well. Look at sales of Bayonetta to see how their install base usually reacts to those type of games:
Bayonetta released Oct 28th.
Mario+ Rabbids had greater staying power in comparison. Why do you think that game did so much better? Bayonetta charted 9th on launch month and disappeared. Why do you think Activison themselves released Crash 4 for Switch but not stuff like Sekiro or Destiny?
The 3 companies always make attempts to attract a specific audience. Sony does it the opposite way too with things like Astrobot or Sackboy.
The people who would decide between getting a switch vs PS5/XS to play games like CoD or GTAV is going to be so lopsided that it often doesn't make the port viable, especially if it's some cutting edge game that requires significant work to run on a Switch.
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They are right though. Their main audience is exactly that. Just as Sony's main audience isn't, even though they make games like Sackboy or Astrobot. Their audiences differ. They are always trying to appeal to different demographics, but they have established ones.
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If Nintendo bought some huge publisher that owned something like Roblox then maybe they would have something to say about that too. It would be considered both a vertical and horizontal acquisition since that has to do with supply/service chain in whatever submarket you define. What are you even suggesting should be divested from Nintendo anyway if they were a monopoly?
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Isn't that largely down to Nintendo's popular first party output being exclusive to the Switch? Mario Kart and Smash Bros would still sell gangbusters on Xbox/PS is a port was made. Bayonetta 3 would sell just as well on either of the home consoles. Many JRPGs will sell just as well on PS as on Switch. Monster Hunter series has traditionally been a major seller on Nintendo consoles, and still Monster Hunter World was a smash hit on PlayStation, Xbox and PC.
The wide gulf in technical capability is also a major reason why 3rd party sales struggle on the Switch, but the long term view should be in consideration and a next gen Switch should allow more ambitious ports that will in turn have higher market success. The success of the Steamdeck already shows that power is one of the key constraints…
12Dannu123
Member
All acquisitions regardless of size will be scrutinised, but most people will say that the industry is far too fragmented to allow Nintendo foreclose rivials for Roblox.
The consensus is that the Activision Blizzard acquisition is considered a vertical merger. Microsoft and Activision in general don't compete against each other. Nintendo and Roblox will be considered the same.
There's nothing to suggest that Nintendo should be broken up. This is simply just the logic that the FTC has come up to justify why the acquisition of ABK should be blocked, but the problem with the argument is that it results in market definitions that simply do not make sense.
Since you're often saying that Nintendo aren't competitors, so you're suggesting that Nintendo is a monopoly and should be broken up and that Microsoft can acquire Nintendo?
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That's what I was trying to correct. You define a submarket and then determine whether it's vertical or horizontal. You don't determine that it's not competing to suggest whether it is horizontal or vertical like you seem to be doing. What you are suggesting by buying a completely noncompeting player would be called a conglomerate merger.
The Activision Blizzard acquisition is both a vertical and horizontal acquisition. Vertical because it is at different levels on the supply/service chain.
i.e.
Activision publisher > MS store/subscription> Consumer.
Horizontal because both MS and Activison make games as publishers and compete for sales elsewhere too.
It makes perfect sense but what you're saying doesn't. If the FTC determines that Nintendo has a monopoly on a specific submarket then it can also block any acquisitions related to that submarket. If you are suggesting that they have a current antitrust issue which means they should be broken up what do you think that is which should be divested?
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nikolino840
Member
Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
If we are going to segment the console market by performance and features the FTC need to rewrite gaming history. Clearly the SNES and Mega Drive were not direct competitors, Mario Kart should have been multiplatform. Clearly the N64 and PlayStation were not console competitors either. I mean that audio performance of N64 vs CD-Rom, sheesh.
SoloKingRobert
Banned
That won't happen since the majority of FTC fanbase only owns a PlayStation 5.
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
The deal is dead in the water from the FTC in the US alone surely. But it is my understanding that if the European Commission also challenge it, that would stop it going through as well. Correct me if I am wrong.
Pelta88
Member
If that's the case in the US, then Microsoft is in some deep shit with the CMA and the other EU regulators.
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ToTTenTranz
Banned
I believe I read somewhere that the deal is dead if either of the regulators block it (CMA, FTC and EC).
feynoob
Banned
The deal isn't dead in the US, as MS can challenge it.
However, if CMA says No, then it's dead.
The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Ok
Ass of Can Whooping
,
Banjo64
and the rest of Sonygaf, how much money did you guys put into this lawsuit?
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Banjo64
cumsessed
I've ascended to the rank of Pony?Ok
Banjo64
cumsessed
Mozza
Member
The Steam deck has sold just over 1 million consoles since launch, and can be now purchased pretty easily, I think this is proof of power not making the slightest bit of difference outside of the core market, and like Valve said right from the beginning, this is not a console competing with the Switch, it's going for a totally different demographic. Pretty much like the myriad of other handheld portable P.C devices, ie a P.C owner that want's to play their games on the go, and run emulators.
The next Switch will have more power by default as it's going to be released when the PS5 and Xbox Series X are well into their own lifecycles, and mobile tech is better and more affordable, Nvidia will already be looking at chips for Nintendo to use for their next console, but as the current Switch family can easily shift between 15-20 million consoles a year, I feel that will be early/late 2024 at the earliest.
Mozza
Member
No chance, money always finds a way of talking in the end.
Regurgitating outdated talking points isn't really a good look. Back then when people had no idea who Lina Khan was, it was fashionable to paint the FTC decision as a rubber stamp.
Everyone knows better now. Except you.
Regulators have dragged Meta and NVIDiA over the coals in recent years. You think these industry behemoths don't have money?
The_Mike
I cry about SonyGaf from my chair in Redmond, WA
Nah fam I just like to participate in here when it's possible to make a little fun.
I try to keep up reading this thread but always end up falling asleep because it's the same shit over and over again.
The one time that got me kinda hooked was when someone started tossing car examples in here that was really somethibg else added to the soup.
Unlike many other extremists in here Im just trying to put a smile on your faces
Tiago Rodrigues
Member
This is going through in the end. It may not even be in 2023 but it will.
GHG
Member
Ok
Coulomb_Barrier
Member
Yeah, that's why Nvidia's buyout of ARM went through.
Mozza
Member
We will see.
Mozza
Member
Denial is also not a great look, it may take longer but this will still go through.
Topher
Identifies as young
I'd say so. I think it is a one way street though. Nintendo games would do well on other platforms while games that are popular on other platforms do not do as well on Switch. The annualized sports games are a good example. Mainstays on Xbox and PS top sellers but absent on Switch.
A point the FTC has made to distinguish Switch from Xbox/PS, yes.
I'm guilty of that. I was convinced FTC was going to rubber stamp this deal. I was quite wrong.
ReBurn
Gold Member
The way to retain your sanity with this thread is to stop worrying about how the same handful of local experts have convinced themselves of how the market is segmented and how these companies compete. They'll just tell you to go back a few dozen pages and read how they talked themselves into it and act like it's internet law. Instead just remember two things: they're just sniffing their own farts, and the only thing that matters is what regulators choose to do. No sense in arguing about definitions until someone who actually matters to the outcome makes a binding devision based on one.
Topher
Identifies as young
Farting keeps me sane.
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Safe to say we all know a lot more about these legal processes than we knew before
I too thought the FTC wouldnt be much of an obstacle since MS has been in the clear of all the recent anti-Big tech hearings thatve roped in Meta, Google and Apple. Looks like honeymoon's over.
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Ozzy Onya A2Z
Member
To their credit farts have always been funny. Sniffing your own, not so much.
Two who matter to the outcome have already and are asking for concessions. That's who he's talking about anyway:
Unless you're saying they don't matter to the outcome. It's their definition he has an issue with and is arguing against. Not anybody farting here.
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