Ahsoka |OT| Ezra's out there somewhere, and it's time to bring him home.

NotMyProblemAnymoreCunt said:
Something we both agree on :p

That show is such a delightful surprise

It's gonna to be sad to see his story done in Season 2 since we all know what happens in the movie. That's actually gonna be quite depressing lol
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There's an easy solution.

Give this man control of another star wars show. Something that doesn't have such a short timed end point. Particularly anything involving empire bureaucracy. Those were some of the best scenes in Andor. Much better writing than anything before that didn't involve Tarkin.
 
Yerd said:
There's an easy solution.

Give this man control of another star wars show. Something that doesn't have such a short timed end point. Particularly anything involving empire bureaucracy. Those were some of the best scenes in Andor. Much better writing than anything before that didn't involve Tarkin.
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Andor is set over 5 years. Season 1 was five years before RO/ANH. Season 2 is years 4, 3, 2, 1 and each is a three-episode arc. The show ends with Andor going to the Ring of Kafrene at the beginning of Rogue One.
 
ManaByte said:
Andor is set over 5 years. Season 1 was five years before RO/ANH. Season 2 is years 4, 3, 2, 1 and each is a three-episode arc. The show ends with Andor going to the Ring of Kafrene at the beginning of Rogue One.
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I understand the time frame. The shortness I'm referring to is the 2 season length. Give him a different show that isn't so close ended. That way we can have more star wars that hopefully doesn't suck.

And enough with the bullshit rehashing old characters. Invent new shit for once.
 
Yerd said:
Invent new shit for once.
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Oh they have, but people are raging over that already.

Hell James Mangold is writing and directing a Star Wars movie set something like 10,000 years before the Prequels and you'll have people cursing it before they even see a photo from it.
 
ManaByte said:
Oh they have, but people are raging over that already.

Hell James Mangold is writing and directing a Star Wars movie set something like 10,000 years before the Prequels and you'll have people cursing it before they even see a photo from it.
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Well, after Dial of Destiny the Mangold name is a bit tarnished.

Though to be fair, who COULD they attach that would get me excited?

Faverau and Robert Downey? Tom Cruise? Cameron? Most of my go to names are deep into their 60s to 80s at this point.
 
ManaByte said:
Oh they have, but people are raging over that already.

Hell James Mangold is writing and directing a Star Wars movie set something like 10,000 years before the Prequels and you'll have people cursing it before they even see a photo from it.
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I'm not raging, but that's something I'm not immediately excited about. I'm sure 10,000 years prior is still going to involve lasers and robots and space faring ships. I know we're talking about science fiction, but I don't want a historical drama. They've laid the groundwork for the current time period, I know what that's like. Give us another character along the lines of Andor or Mando. Everything doesn't need to be jedi and sith, we don't need more of the same old characters.

The best new products from Star Wars have been new characters. Yes Andor was in the one movie, but no one really knows who he is. Andor could have been about Poindexter the thief and it would have been good. The particular story we have from the Andor show, so far, could be anyone. It's not in any way definitively tied into the guy that stole the death star plans. The only real tie is Mothma. But they could have modified that to make this some entirely new side of the galaxy.
 
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Given how badly the viewing figures for this have dropped off, has it occurred to anyone at Disney that leaning so hard on the Filloni stuff may not have been such a good idea, as it's only popular with a small amount of people?
 
FunkMiller said:
Given how badly the viewing figures for this have dropped off, has it occurred to anyone at Disney that leaning so hard on the Filloni stuff may not have been such a good idea, as it's only popular with a small amount of people?
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I don't think there's a problem with the subject material. The product isn't that great.
 
The fundamental problem of this show is that, at the end of the day, no one cares about Ashoka Tano. The vast majority of people have no idea who she is; she wasn't in the original trilogy, she wasn't in the sequels, she wasn't in the prequels, and she wasn't in Solo or Rogue One either. She wasn't in anything that the wider public is familiar with, she didn't even get so much as a name drop. Her very character is a living, walking retcon, that has no connection to any of the important events in the Star Wars saga. Not to mention that it's hard to take her seriously as a character when her make-up and those rubber tentacles on her head look fake as fuck (that's a problem for Hera as well, and for aliens in Star Wars in general; they all look like dorky cosplayers).

This should've been Luke's story, like it was in the EU novels. They should've cast Sebastian Stan to play the Luke in his prime that people have always wanted to see.
 
Elysion said:
The fundamental problem of this show is that, at the end of the day, no one cares about Ashoka Tano. The vast majority of people have no idea who she is; she wasn't in the original trilogy, she wasn't in the sequels, she wasn't in the prequels, and she wasn't in Solo or Rogue One either. She wasn't in anything that the wider public is familiar with, she didn't even get so much as a name drop. Her very character is a living, walking retcon, that has no connection to any of the important events in the Star Wars saga. Not to mention that it's hard to take her seriously as a character when her make-up and those rubber tentacles on her head look fake as fuck (that's a problem for Hera as well, and for aliens in Star Wars in general; they all look like dorky cosplayers).

This should've been Luke's story, like it was in the EU novels. They should've cast Sebastian Stan to play the Luke in his prime that people have always wanted to see.
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We also didn't care about Andor, until we did. They just didn't know how to write Ahsoka, and the people around her, to make us care about her journey. Not Sabin, or Ezra, none of them really have any emotional arc. Let's say they found Ezra, and he's dying, and on his death bed he gives Sabin's his lightsaber. That's something. But we have lucky people.

I'm also maybe missing something, but from the PT I don't remember Anakin being master to anyone.
 
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ADiTAR said:
They just didn't know how to write Ahsoka
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The creator of the character doesn't know how to write her? Wow that's certainly a take.

ADiTAR said:
but from the PT I don't remember Anakin being master to anyone.
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Anakin having a Padawan in the Clone Wars was a Lucas idea.

Filoni created Ahsoka for the cartoon as the main character. George liked her and said she'd be Anakin's Padawan. Filoni said "But Anakin doesn't have a Padawan", George just replied "Anakin has a Padawan".
 
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ADiTAR said:
We also didn't care about Andor, until we did. They just didn't know how to write Ahsoka, and the people around her, to make us care about her journey. Not Sabin, or Ezra, none of them really have any emotional arc. Let's say they found Ezra, and he's dying, and on his death bed he gives Sabin's his lightsaber. That's something. But we have lucky people.

I'm also maybe missing something, but from the PT I don't remember Anakin being master to anyone.
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The character of Anakin that was portrayed in the prequels shouldn't have been anyone's master. I would also never consider that character the best jedi that ever lived.
 
ManaByte said:
The creator of the character doesn't know how to write her? Wow that's certainly a take.



Anakin having a Padawan in the Clone Wars was a Lucas idea.

Filoni created Ahsoka for the cartoon as the main character. George liked her and said she'd be Anakin's Padawan. Filoni said "But Anakin doesn't have a Padawan", George just replied "Anakin has a Padawan".
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It's not exactly a hot take. The show isn't that compelling. That is largely the fault of the writing. He's proven he can't match a show as compelling as Andor. Get a better writer for the show, to punch up his ideas.
 
Yerd said:
It's not exactly a hot take. The show isn't that compelling. That is largely the fault of the writing. He's proven he can't match a show as compelling as Andor. Get a better writer for the show, to punch up his ideas.
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Ahsoka is the sequel series to a cartoon, it was never going to be a dark and gritty espionage show.

 
We are almost done with the show, right? Ugh, so LITTLE has actually happened. This shows main failing is just that it is so plodding, they hold it up like a masterpiece of somber, grave, EPIC, storytelling but it's really just a fetch quest wrapped into a race surrounded by a rescue (of a guy who seems pretty chill hanging with not-ewoks instead of trying to undermine the residual Empire elements, rally any defectors disillusioned after what, 10+ YEARS of living on a marooned ship?, or trying to get home on his own).

There are wonderful visual elements and the SFX team has perfected their "look" after all those seasons of Mando and Andor, but there is little excitement, wonder, adventure, ENERGY, or humor. This was my fear of Filoni's directing, he just can't elicit a real strong performance and is more interested in the visuals and dialogue serving the story in his head. Maybe the use of the Volume, while better here than in previous shows, still makes every scene feel like it takes place in a small room, compare it to Andor where you FEEL the open air or tight spaces.

Hard to say where the actors fall in this. The two most experienced are buried under heavy headpieces, does this make them act stiff (literally?). Other than Stevenson, most of the rest of the cast seem fairly new, the Sabine actress is trying but she can't inject enough energy into the scenes by herself. It's really up to the two DROIDS to carry the good guy side of things and thats a big problem. The show lacks a singular charismatic dynamic leader, they just sorta split that role between Ahsoka and Hera and a bit for Sabine and the end result is none of them really get to shine because the focus is all over the place. It's like Firefly without Mal, sure the rest of the cast can do the job but Mal made you CARE.
 
The show has brought compelling new Force lore to live action.

Midichlorians didn't go over well when introduced in the Prequels.

Sequels had a bit on force ghosts, but unremarkable.

The first Star Wars was mocked relentlessly by older generations when I was a kid. They didn't get it at all as an imaginative experience. It was just to sell space themed Barbie toys as far as they were concerned. The Force was new to everyone, vague and mysterious. A second movie having grounding with a first helped the older generations that couldn't deal with unestablished and chaotic concepts that didn't follow known story patterns without expressing frustration.

After mentioning how Ahsoka's opening crawl sounded like a Hammer film, I noticed the end credits storyboard can appear like Midsommar except with alignments between various celestial systems coming together. That string motif is strong with the Force.

It's got to be pretty cool being the generation on deck to follow the Sequels and putting all these threads together into imaginative fabric as the story appears to expand in ways it hasn't since inception.
 
ManaByte said:
It's a shame George didn't make his Sequel Trilogy. The internet would've burned to the ground over the focus on the midichorlians he planned.
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I dunno, the idea that sentient races are just puppets in a war between microscopic force parasites could be cool :p

One of the problems I think we are having with "the force" as a concept these days is it has been largely stripped of religious overtones. It has lost most "good vs evil" aspects and is now more of a skill anyone can learn versus an inborn characteristic enhanced by religious teachings. The current writers are not able to map it over philosophical themes. George at least had them in the background under all the rope swinging, Taunton riding shenanigans.

Filoni at least has a strong mystical slant, he just needs more fun.
 
Elysion said:
The fundamental problem of this show is that, at the end of the day, no one cares about Ashoka Tano. The vast majority of people have no idea who she is; she wasn't in the original trilogy, she wasn't in the sequels, she wasn't in the prequels, and she wasn't in Solo or Rogue One either. She wasn't in anything that the wider public is familiar with, she didn't even get so much as a name drop. Her very character is a living, walking retcon, that has no connection to any of the important events in the Star Wars saga. Not to mention that it's hard to take her seriously as a character when her make-up and those rubber tentacles on her head look fake as fuck (that's a problem for Hera as well, and for aliens in Star Wars in general; they all look like dorky cosplayers).

This should've been Luke's story, like it was in the EU novels. They should've cast Sebastian Stan to play the Luke in his prime that people have always wanted to see.
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That's absolutely not it for me. I love new characters, if you can make me care about them and want to watch them.

I've never seen Rebels or whatever cartoons you kids watched, so these are all new characters for me other than Morgan or whatever that witchass witch's name is.

I couldn't care any less about any of these characters other than the antagonists, and the season is almost over. They are so cookie-cutter and boring as shit. Ahsoka the wise monk-like jedi with a chip on her shoulder because of Anakin, Sabine the rebellious brat, yet another know-it-all droid and Hera who is just kind of there. All incredibly bad versions of cliches with the most obvious heavy handed character "development" (if you want to call it that.

And oh yeah, Ezra, who as far as I can tell plays the worst actor in the universe.

Bad characters and almost no plot are what are killing this show.
 
ManaByte said:
Ahsoka is the sequel series to a cartoon, it was never going to be a dark and gritty espionage show.

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I'm not saying make the show with the same style. Just write it better.

RAÏSanÏa said:
The first Star Wars was mocked relentlessly by older generations when I was a kid. They didn't get it at all as an imaginative experience. It was just to sell space themed Barbie toys as far as they were concerned. The Force was new to everyone, vague and mysterious. A second movie having grounding with a first helped the older generations that couldn't deal with unestablished and chaotic concepts that didn't follow known story patterns without expressing frustration.
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I can't remember how I saw the first movie. I was too young when the first one released and I'm not sure how I would have seen it. I'll have to ask my dad if he remembers. I was about the right age for Return of the Jedi in theaters. I'm pretty sure that's the only one I saw in a theater.

ManaByte said:
It's still hilarious that people think Lucas' movies would magically be better when their most hated movie was what his Episode VII was going to be.
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I always like to criticize Luca's work. I think he had some good ideas and then proves time and again, most of his ideas are garbage. It's not just his badly directed prequels. It's the edits to the original movies that were also not good. He's not the be-all, end-all in movies. He had a couple of hits and then a bunch of duds.

Lot's of people like to point out, Lucas said this Lucas said that. Who cares. Lucas doesn't own it anymore. I'd like to know the current audience make up. Is it more kids or the kids of the past that are now adults, still clinging to this bullshit. Like us.

The best thing to come from Star Wars in a long time, Andor, was not for kids. Make more of it.

I'm a grown ass man and I watched and enjoyed both the Clone Wars and Rebels. They aren't great, but they were still enjoyable. I think they would have had a larger audience if they spent more time with the animation, or mo-cap. The hand animated movements are horrible and the biggest detractor of those cartoons.
This show hasn't matched even those. It's just dull. Padawan Filoni is following his masters wishes and making more Lucas shit. I don't know why he was able to make Rebels better than this show. It's probably the areas of focus. Hera and Chopper could have been better stars for his first live action show.
 
So I guess the Nightsisters are the canon replacement for C'boath. Assuming Thrawn resurrects a Nightsister army on Dathomir in Season 2 and then the Heir movie is him with that army + the Imperial Remnant vs the New Republic.
 
I really liked that finale

The closing scene was sweet and hopeful.

The fight choreography between Ahsoka and Elsbeth was very WuShu inspired instead of Samurai. Diana Lee Inosanto definitely brought her choreography to that fight scene. Her dad taught her well.
 
DeafTourette said:
I really liked that finale

The closing scene was sweet and hopeful.

The fight choreography between Ahsoka and Elsbeth was very WuShu inspired instead of Samurai. Diana Lee Inosanto definitely brought her choreography to that fight scene. Her dad taught her well.
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Oh expect to see essays of manufactured rage. Aside from the cliffhanger, which most everyone knew about due to the second season and movie plan, Filoni used one of the most-hated "George Lucas raped my childhood" changes to the OT in the final shot.
 
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Can someone explain to me how Ezra stole a fighter and Trawn not know and instantly send out TIE fighters to bring him down? Who writes this shit?
 
I think there were a couple of decent episodes but the finale and follow up were awful. It felt like the writers just gave up.
 
I thought the fight sequences in the finale looked way off. Like something out of a low budget CW show. The way they swung the light sabers looked like pedestrians swinging them around awkwardly instead of trained warriors. Not sure what was up with that. It was much better in previous episodes.
 
DragoonKain said:
I thought the fight sequences in the finale looked way off. Like something out of a low budget CW show. The way they swung the light sabers looked like pedestrians swinging them around awkwardly instead of trained warriors. Not sure what was up with that. It was much better in previous episodes.
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They had a stroke of genius with the Marrok samurai style fight. They either got lucky with one idea or had limited time with a good choreographer and then he ninja-vanished never to help them again. That was the only fight using that style, and it was the best display of sword fighting Star Wars has ever had.

All the scenes with light saber laser deflecting were bad. Even the scene with Baylan in the hall. His was too robotic looking. The others looked too bland and stiff or maybe not rehearsed enough to look natural. The style they were going with the twirly crap Ahsoka was doing in the final episode could have worked if they had increased the speed.

The highlight for me was the force pull into Ahsoka's blades.
 
Yerd said:
They had a stroke of genius with the Marrok samurai style fight. They either got lucky with one idea or had limited time with a good choreographer and then he ninja-vanished never to help them again. That was the only fight using that style, and it was the best display of sword fighting Star Wars has ever had.

All the scenes with light saber laser deflecting were bad. Even the scene with Baylan in the hall. His was too robotic looking. The others looked too bland and stiff or maybe not rehearsed enough to look natural. The style they were going with the twirly crap Ahsoka was doing in the final episode could have worked if they had increased the speed.

The highlight for me was the force pull into Ahsoka's blades.
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I'm pretty sure Morgan Elsbeth (Diana Lee Inosanto) choreographed that sword/lightsaber scene with Ahsoka. It was WuShu/Shaolin inspired. She's the daughter of a martial arts legend and goddaughter of Bruce Lee.
 
Elysion said:
The fundamental problem of this show is that, at the end of the day, no one cares about Ashoka Tano.
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Well thats just objectively false.

Its becoming more apparent a lot of the detractors of modern star wars simply consider star wars as something that should only ever be about OT characters. That isnt what Lucas or anyone else intended.

Luke had his story already. We saw it. His was the first. Other characters can shine too. And further, Luke wss the character some of YOU grew up with. Others grew up with characters like ahsoka and anakin... and even rey.

This franchise is multigennerational. Calling everything that doesnt pander to the folks who were kids when the OT came out, saying that "no one" cares about any other characters than the ones YOU grew up watching is silly. And its false.

A lot of the reaction to star wars these days echoes to me like the refusal to accept the passing of time, that you are no longer the target demographic. I see this a lot with franchises that have existed back then. But not everything has to be like it was for you in the 80s. Even George Lucas understood this.

Anyways, great finale. Really phenomenal shots, the long take during the fight with Morgan was very cool. The finale montages was gorgeous. It really sucjs we lost Stevenson but I hope they find someone who can do his character well

Im glad they didn't have ahsoka and Sabine win everything. Theres a lot to like here. I may actually rewatch at some point and I rarely do that for any show.
 
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Really looking forward for the finale next week .. oh wait, this was it?

Surviving full fire out of a "STAR destroyer" while riding on a free field - presented to you by "Plot armor".
 
Pretty unremarkable series tbh.
I'll take my member berry episode but that's about it.

Trawns plan to stop the Jedi from getting on bored was just a mini orbital bombardment and to have a closed door!?
Curses those pesky Jedi got around my plan.

Did you even think about blowing up the door or even the destroying the top platform like you did right as the Jedi were on top beforehand?
Your in a hovering ship. It's fine. Just some good old fashioned dynamite would have stopped them.
He sacrificed two EX-jedi/sith? and a night sister witch to amount to nothing.

Certainly not Trawn from the books or even the cartoon.

No real character development.
We all knew how it was going to end aside from them two getting stranded. I'm sure space whales can fix that.
Trawn was a huge let down.
Nightsisters is a welcome addition but I prefer them more as the mysterious, witch assassins. Less I know the better. I don't think their really going to evolve their race or bring anything new to the table with them.
Sabine probably didn't even need to be in this series. Her character learned how to use the force. That's all.

I was hoping this was the series that developed into something new/bold/different.
It didn't.
 
Toons said:
Luke had his story already. We saw it. His was the first. Other characters can shine too. And further, Luke wss the character some of YOU grew up with. Others grew up with characters like ahsoka and anakin... and even rey.
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I would be happy if we got genuinely new characters with new stories, but that's not what's going on here. Ahsoka isn't really a 'new' character, and everything she does is still connected to the story of the movies: there are still Stromtroopers around, Luke and Leia are still alive and get mentioned, Anakin appears as a force ghost etc; this show (like all other Star Wars shows) is filled with 'member berries' left and right. And the show is technically a prequel, since it takes place prior to the sequel trilogy, which means the stakes can never be as high as in a genuine new story.

If they wanted to tell new stories, they should've gone all the way: have the story take place centuries after the movies, with entirely new characters, new antagonists and new factions. Instead these shows all still take place in between the movies, and we're still seeing people fighting Stromtroopers and Imperials – except without showing us the characters from that time period that people actually care about: Luke, Leia, Han etc.
 
Elysion said:
If they wanted to tell new stories, they should've gone all the way: have the story take place centuries after the movies, with entirely new characters, new antagonists and new factions. Instead these shows all still take place in between the movies, and we're still seeing people fighting Stromtroopers and Imperials – except without showing us the characters from that time period that people actually care about: Luke, Leia, Han etc.
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Again they're making a movie set 10,000 years before the movies but there are already people here pretending they'll put Count Dooku in it for reasons.
 
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