Forsete
Member
I could see this coming. America is gone for a while....
Invest in Europe defence stonks.
SAAB, Thales, Rheinmetall, Hensoldt, Leonardo, BAE etc.
For the foreseeable future at least.
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Stock-Age: Stocks, Options and Dividends oh my!
- Thread starter koam
- Start date
I could see this coming. America is gone for a while....
Invest in Europe defence stonks.
SAAB, Thales, Rheinmetall, Hensoldt, Leonardo, BAE etc.
For the foreseeable future at least.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
We had incredibly low unemployment rate a couple of years ago to the point many economists thought it was unhealthy (for complicated reasons.)
What's happening now is going to create a bunch of hardship, poor unemployed Americans out of their middle class jobs.
Neat! This shit is idiotic and depressing. Rest of the world is banding together to trade amongst themselves and avoid America due to how we are also threatening invasion of former close allies.
Wake the fuck up. We are headed in a terrible direction.
What's not gonna happen is the creation of a bunch of factory jobs either: in fact a bunch of factories just laid off people overnight…. They can't afford to build anything because raw materials just shot up; and the economy is going to crash so they expect to have less people with wealthy people to sell to.
And after millions of Americans have to foreclose on their homes, and many businesses go under, the wealthiest people will be there owning a higher percentage of our country.
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Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
how? with literally zero investment capital left? selling my 50% red-US stocks to buy EU stocks is not a wise idea for me in my current state
Kenneth Haight
Gold Member
Forsete
Member
Sorry.
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
My man ♥ All good. I did a big mistake thinking economy would flourish with the POTUS, alas...
I'm learning from my mistakes though. We'll see if it'll be a life changing mistake though.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
This is absolutely insanity.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
Meanwhile a bunch of people hoping to retire soon just had much of their retirement plans wiped out and will remain in the job market as loads of middle class jobs are lost at the same time.
But trade deficits! (never mind the largest economy in the world was built on top of trade deficits.)
But trade deficits! (never mind the largest economy in the world was built on top of trade deficits.)
AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
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freefornow
Member
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
$5 trillion dollars removed from the market, but it will be Ok because $4.7 billion was spent buying the dip? By individuals mind you, not institutional investors who know far better what to do and are all predicting a recession.
Celcius
°Temp. member
Oh it's definitely going to go lower. Europe, Japan, and Korea are still cooking up their retaliation plans most likely...
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crazepharmacist
Member
When Thomas sowell, one of the greatest economists history has ever known, is speaking out against this, you know you fucked up.
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I bet if I looked I could find videos of Uncle Milton saying the same thing. (Not the ant guy, the economist)
Gp1
Member
Just this week
Saab - just (yesterday) won the Colombian new fighter bidding with the Gripen E/F
Rheinmetall and Thales - revealed some new info on the new common EU/D/Fr MBT
Leonardo - a bunch of new info ranging for their trainer's bidding on a bunch of countries, a new deal in nuclear energy, involvement in a deal where Italy is buying maritime patrol aircrafts from Japan, and recently (at the end of 2024) they announced a partnership with Rheinmetall to develop a new armored vehicle for Italy.
It's a hot market right now.
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MaestroMike
Gold Member
$7 trillion dollars wiped out in two days this sh!ts gotta be illegal someone needs to go to jail
Rocking up to a Checkers tournament and playing Chess won't getting you past round 1.This is absolutely insanity.
crazepharmacist
Member
He's got what? Best case scenario? 2 years before democrats demolish him in midterms and pass a bill to take his tariff powers away.
Worst case? 4 years until his term ends.
I'm a buyer here. This won't last forever.
Worst case? 4 years until his term ends.
I'm a buyer here. This won't last forever.
IntentionalPun
Ask me about my wife's perfect butthole
You think the rest of the world will suddenly trust the US as a trade partner or any sort of ally so soon?
I have serious fears they won't.
MaestroMike
Gold Member
MaestroMike
Gold Member
rm082e
Member
StreetsofBeige
Gold Member
Thats the thing. When it comes to gov and society, what's the greater good?
Doing protectionist kind of policies to purposely keep jobs propping up prices the general public has to absorb?
Or is it better for people to just go with the flow of free markets. And if it means lower prices due to foreign efficiencies at the expense of domestic workers being crowded out by cheaper people overseas, that's better for the country?
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Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
The greater good, in my opinion, is to maximize the wealth, health, happiness, and freedoms of the citizens while upholding the Constitution. If those are the goals, we can ask ourselves if these goals are being fulfilled by these policies.
It seems like history tends to show that principles of free trade tend to perform better than bureaucrats in Washington picking and choosing to put their thumbs on the scale according to the whims of whoever is in charge. While I'm not saying that there's never a place for strategic tariffs, I do question the sensibility of blanket tariffs that are calculated very broadly and are far too overreaching. Actions have consequences, and today's globally interconnected world is the result, for better or worse, of 100+ years of trade and economic/industrial progress that has made us more reliant on each other than ever before. Attempting to burn it all down in an attempt to make us great again by thinking we can revert back to the good ol' days is not going to go well because our leaders and capital owners have already systematically dismantled that system all the way to the bank over the last 60 years. It ain't coming back overnight.
Yes, the working class is right to be pissed that their jobs have been being shipped out and outsourced over many decades, but then, those same middle class workers expecting the very same politicians under the very same political ideologies to try to get them their jobs back is insane. It should be painfully obvious that the people who outsourced their jobs did so because they prioritized rich people more than the American people in general. It's not quite so obvious to them that the solutions that our current politicians are implementing to "save" the working class somehow is also still fucking them in the ass while setting up the rich people for another round of wealth creation and power consolidation. It should be a red flag that all of these painful corrections or needed medicines always seem to affect the lower and middle class first.
Go_Ly_Dow
Member
Looks like tarrif negotiations underway with Vietnam, Japan, South Korea and Argentina.
You'd think China as well given the CCP really really doesn't want them.
How many of you think there's going to be rollbacks over the coming days and weeks? That's been my suspicion anyway.
My portfolio is all in microcap UK stocks which were already at veeeery depressed prices, in stark contrast to so many US stocks trending around record highs. So overall they've held up well thus far given many investors already saw the prices as bargains before the tarrif turmoil really kicked in.
Ultimately, I could stomache about a another 20%'ish drop from here on my portfolio, so I have some leeway and I'm making some money on the sides doing bounce trades.
I expect Mon to be volatile (without a change in stance on some tarrifs this weekend), but hopefully we see small relief and rally days as the coming new week progresses and then by the week after a change in tune from the administration.
You'd think China as well given the CCP really really doesn't want them.
How many of you think there's going to be rollbacks over the coming days and weeks? That's been my suspicion anyway.
My portfolio is all in microcap UK stocks which were already at veeeery depressed prices, in stark contrast to so many US stocks trending around record highs. So overall they've held up well thus far given many investors already saw the prices as bargains before the tarrif turmoil really kicked in.
Ultimately, I could stomache about a another 20%'ish drop from here on my portfolio, so I have some leeway and I'm making some money on the sides doing bounce trades.
I expect Mon to be volatile (without a change in stance on some tarrifs this weekend), but hopefully we see small relief and rally days as the coming new week progresses and then by the week after a change in tune from the administration.
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Nocty
Gold Member
I think Trumps plan has been to try and force Powell's hand in cutting rates by causing a huge volatility spike in the market, effectively reducing the 10 year bond yields.
Unfortunately, Powell seems privy to this and essentially gave Trump the finger yesterday. Trump even literally said in a statement yesterday that 'now would be a good time' to cut rates, lol
So I guess we are now in a game of chicken between Powell and DJT. Who will buckle first? time will tell. My money is on Trump. Powell knows he cant risk long term stagflation...
Unfortunately, Powell seems privy to this and essentially gave Trump the finger yesterday. Trump even literally said in a statement yesterday that 'now would be a good time' to cut rates, lol
So I guess we are now in a game of chicken between Powell and DJT. Who will buckle first? time will tell. My money is on Trump. Powell knows he cant risk long term stagflation...
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
There will probably be some, but the repercussions of this action will still linger around.
Haint
Member
The Nasdaq's price to earnings ratio during the dot.com crash was 200 (two hundred), meaning many of the individual companies dwarfed that. At present pretty much all the major tech and semi-conductor stocks sit at forward P/E's around the mid teens, most were low to mid 20's before this tariff crash. Not even close to an "AI bubble" in the sense you're referring to. If there's a prolonged crash it'll be because of larger economic or political issues, not an AI bubble. Costco (yes Costco the bulk warehouse store) is presently valued 3x higher than Nvidia based on their earnings and financials. Walmart (as in the peopleofwalmart.com discount retailer) is currently valued 2x higher than Nvidia.
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Gp1
Member
Sure?
You have to consider the economic activity on the equation... and Buffett recent position on cash and bonds may say otherwise too. Buffett holds more capital in bonds than the Federal Reserve itself, now imagine what a "unexpected" rate cut would do here.
It's basically a win-win situation for someone who has a position on bonds, has liquidity available and historically make money on equities.
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natjjohn
Member
That's a bad sign for immediate future most likely. The rubes buying up to take it on the chin which is what happened. Probably more to come when Monday kicks off.
Great Auk
Member
I agree that tariffs are usually bad for everyone. But Friedman made these statements before China was even part of the WTO and their percentage of global manufacturing was in the low single digits.
Today they are pushing almost 40(!)% of global manufacturing output!
How do we get countries around the world not to impose tariffs? How do we get them to not shoot a hole in the boat to begin with? Because even with one shot and the US not retaliating, we're still going down, just more slowly.
Great Auk
Member
I do think it's too early to buy. I would wait a couple weeks to see how things shake out unless something major is announced.
The actual average tariffs, and not the trade deficits being presented as tariffs as per the current administration's charts, should help to clarify the situation.
Great Auk
Member
The actual average tariffs, and not the trade deficits being presented as tariffs as per the current administration's charts, should help to clarify the situation.
Wouldn't a trade weighted tariff chart diminish the severity of tariffs implemented by various countries on certain economic sectors?
High tariffs on key markets reduce the size of that importation market, therefore diminishing its influence on the overall trade weighted tariff chart.
Or am I misunderstanding the chart you posted?
Sure, there's greater nuance if diving deeper into the data. As we're currently taking a sledgehammer approach by implementing massive across-the-board tariffs, it is useful to know where those across the board tariffs currently stand.
Dr.Guru of Peru
played the long game
It's also important to note that these rates represent the MFN (most favored nation) weighted tariff rates, but that the USA has separate free trade agreements with many of the countries on this list that supersede this and effectively reduce the tariff rate to zero for most items that come in. For example, the South Korean average tariff rate if you include items imported under KORUS FTA is estimated to be between 0.26 to 3.6 percent.The actual average tariffs, and not the trade deficits being presented as tariffs as per the current administration's charts, should help to clarify the situation.
The way for the USA to "stop other countries from charging tariffs" is to negotiate. For example, CUSMA (which Trump negotiated in the first place) was set to be renegotiated in 2026. Trump has effectively ripped up his own deal, completely destroying his credibility at the negotiation table.
Kittehkraken
Member
Its impossible on something things.
China would be the sole supplier of steel around the world if it wasn't for tariffs protecting local steel production.
Agriculture is another area that will always have tariffs of some kind to protect local farmers. Dairy for example between Canada and the US is trade free unless you try and saturate the market which triggers a tariff penalty. Trump loves going around saying Canada has a 300% tariff on dairy but he always leaves out the part that its a penalty that nobody has ever paid.
Great Auk
Member
I get that the dairy tariff doesn't get triggered, but isn't that the reason why the Canadian market isn't flooded with American dairy to begin with? You don't flood the Canadian market because you'd trigger the tariff. Therefore, the tariff is doing its job.
No tariff to trigger means Canadian dairies go out of business. Sometimes having tariffs not trigger was the whole point of the tariff to begin with.
Kittehkraken
Member
Exactly, the tariff is protecting the Canadian diary industry but it also allows the American industry to share the market with free trade. Trump has been spreading lies and misinformation by saying were screwing them because he wants the penalty gone so American companies can saturate the market and profit.
Great Auk
Member
It's still protectionist on the part of the Canadians though. They say Americans can sell a bit of milk and cheese in Canada but not too much because then we're going to make it cost quadruple the price of local Canadian dairy products.
It's literally a barrier to free trade.
UnravelKatharsis
Member
Just patently untrue. The BMW plant in Spartanburg South Carolina has a starting wage just north of 16 dollars an hour last I knew and they employ around 10,000 people.
Kittehkraken
Member
America comes nowhere close to triggering the penalty especially with milk where they don't even hit half of the allowed free trade volume. Canadians for the most part prefer Canadian milk because its higher quality and better tasting.
Is it a perfect system? Probably not, but nothing ever is. Even something that is completely free trade without barriers will have problems and consequences.
America uses the same system. And Trump negotiated the allowed volumes and penalties during his last term.
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Great Auk
Member
I don't think the vast majority of the tariffs will be in place come two or three months time anyway. We'll see how it shakes out!
Elog
Member
This is literary a negative market sentiment sign. When retail buy more than institutions you should go for the life jacket. You can look at every market cycle since the 80's and find the same pattern. Institutions enter the market before retail on the upswing and retail buys for a longer time than institutions on the downswing.
Edit: Will be a very interesting Monday. How many smaller hedge funds will have margin calls made for them over the weekend? It looked as if the derivative brake was used up towards the end on Friday - was that so? Will the investment outflow continue from USD denominated assets to other currencies? Will the treasury interest rate hold still/go up (i.e., sell pressure), or go down? Key questions. We will see.
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SmokedMeat
Gamer™
Worst case he tries to become President for life, or flat out steals the election - which I'm starting to believe Elon helped him steal this one.
We're not dealing with a sane person, and he's got media well under control with right wing personalities and channels to pass his lies along.
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